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RiG

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Is there anything more soul destroying than hunting for a new job? I have been searching since the end of 2007 and have sent in applications for numerous posts and gotten nowhere with them. Signed up to several recruitment agencies and been put forward for interviews but am either too good a candidate for the role or not enough experience for other positions.

Obviously it isn't the greatest time to be searching for jobs and I am grateful I have money coming in but it's not enough to allow me to get on the property ladder and everything else people my age were doing or had done ~ 20 years ago.

How long did it take you to get the job you are in now? Are you looking for a new role and finding it hard or have you found it easy and want to pass on any tips? *hint hint* :rotflmao:

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Here's a perspective from over here .........

arrived in Canada (2003) with decent qualifications. Wanted a job in the IT field but my qualifications were not recognised and my hands-on experience was not taken into account. As a result, I had to go back to full time education for a year and get myself certified (A+, Network+ as well as various Technical diplomas).

During my courses, the tutor recommended getting our CVs out on a site like Workopolis and 3 weeks after graduation I was offered a position doing tech support for the Globe and Mail newspaper website (which also produces the Workopolis site !!!). Did that for just under a year before an employment agency phoned me up out of the blue and asked if I would be interested in interviewing for a position as a Software Administrator with a global engineering consulting company ..... got the job and enjoy it immensely - will have been in it for 4 years come February.

Funnily enough, the thing the company were most interested in when I interviewed with them was not my technical qualifications or my Canadian employment history, but the fact that I had been involved in producing CAD designs when working as a Kitchen Designer in the UK and that the term CAD was one of the keywords the agency used on the Workopolis site when looking for potential candidates !!!

Like everywhere else, Canada is suffering from a lot of job losses all across the country. In Ontario manufacturing is grinding to a halt, mainly because a lot of it is car related and the big three - Ford/GM/Chrysler - are teetering on the brink which affects lots of other ancillary businesses. In Calgary, the economy is stuttering too as oil prices drop and various Tar Sands projects get put on hold or cancelled because it is now more expensive to extract and process it than they make per barrel, and in Vancouver, where house prices rocketed over the last few years, they are seeing the biggest decrease in Canada of around 5-10% per year .......

I am sure we will come out of it, but it is worrying for all those still in employment and as you say, soul destroying for those looking for it .... A year ago I could make (sensible) demands of my employer, now I am just happy to keep my head down and plough on with my work as I know not all my colleagues and friends have been as lucky as me.

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What's the matter RIG, is the moderator's salary not enough for you? :rotflmao:

When I recruit people, a couple of things get their application filed straight in the shredder :

1) CV with errors, typos etc. No excuse for it

2) An unprofessional email address like "FTP1872@hotmail.com" You wouldn't believe what some people come up with.

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When i came out of the forces i quickly realised the most important factor in getting any job was not your qaulifications or experiance (although they help) but contacts. Don't be afraid to put yourself about and whilst i hate buzzwords ,"networking" is all important depending on what you want to get in to.That said, i ended up self employed so what do eh know about getting a joab !

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What's the matter RIG, is the moderator's salary not enough for you? :rotflmao:

When I recruit people, a couple of things get their application filed straight in the shredder :

1) CV with errors, typos etc. No excuse for it

2) An unprofessional email address like "FTP1872@hotmail.com" You wouldn't believe what some people come up with.

Time for RiG to ditch the Pat Sharpe e.mail address I think!!!

:thumb04:

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For me, ive always been a fan of the classy C.V and cover letter, in an envelope with a printed address. If they say post or e-mail, send it by e-mail, otherwise you look like you have problems with e-mailing.

I think the part which seals it is a mission statement or personal statement. Throw in words such as "hard working" "enthusiastic" "driven" "motivated" "personable" and wont go far wrong. There are a host of free online cv designs.

I also agree with the fullname@...........co.uk email, anything else just looks shady.

At interviews i always make sure to be very nice or friendly to the staff at the company, obviously the interviewers but also the others i.e receptionist etc, as they all have a say in who is hired in a round about way. I turn up 10 mins early and make sure i am uber polite, say something like "lovely building" or "nice staff" and always very politely decline any offer of tea etc. as its a pleasantry they dont actually mean.

I always ask a question, well worked out beforehand, and have a good long look at their website, know the company etc beforehand, and find something, a report, website design, advertising, company aim etc to compliment them on, something a little unusual.

I always wait 3 seconds after a question, look down then up, and then reply. Gives me the air of a thinking man.

In the Art of War, Sun Tzu said, "You have to believe in yourself" which i take to mean no negativity at all in an interview, but remaining modest at all times.

Anyway, thats what I do.

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One thing that ought to go without saying is to do your research on the company. Not only does it impress the employer that you've made an effort (and don't be shy about dropping in how much you know about them), but you learn things that will help tailor your responses to what the employer is looking for.

The interweb makes it so easy to find info and press articles etc, but some people still don't do it. I interviewed someone a few weeks ago and they didn't even know what the company does. Interview over.

It's also possible to find out things about the person interviewing you, but you don't want to seem like a stalker.

Internet research works both ways though - more and more interviewers will see what they can find about you. I once changed my mind about a decent candidate after seeing their Friends Reunited entry.

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A friend of mine went for her first job interview:

"so what do you know about the company?"

"nothing"

"why do you want this job?"

"to get my foot in the door"

Needless to say she didn't get it!

CVs - absolute maximum of two pages but the second page should be supplemental info. The first should get the attention. Also, if it's not going to get you the interview, don't put it in (you played volleyball at school, so what?). Don't have unnecessary titles like Name: John Smith, Address: 2 Glebe Street etc. It's pretty obvious what these are. Also, CVs are only there to get you an interview NOT the job. It should be enough info to tempt, not necessarily the whole story. Say what you did, not what you didn't, e.g.

"Hmmm, he worked as a senior technician, might get him in for an interview. Oh no, hang on, it says he didn't work on construction projects. What's the next CV say?"

"Says she's worked on WordPerfect but not we use MS Word." Word processor will do - packages are pretty much the same.

On my CV, I have my contact info large and in bold at the top of the first page. Separate sections entitled 'Key Skills' 'Qualifications' 'Employment History' 'Publications' - my second page is a list of projects (divided into sections) that I have been involved with. Make use of bold and italics to emphasis at a glance.

Interviews - bluff confidence. Look at people directly when you talk to them. Don't lie, you'll only get caught out, but don't do yourself down.

"So have you worked on construction projects?" "no, but the technical skills I've got are used in construction, so I can easily adapt them"

And do your homework obviously. What is the company like? If you've never done the job before, try to find out what exactly is involved by reading the job description and googling for a similar job description.

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What's the matter RIG, is the moderator's salary not enough for you? :rotflmao:

When I recruit people, a couple of things get their application filed straight in the shredder :

1) CV with errors, typos etc. No excuse for it

2) An unprofessional email address like "FTP1872@hotmail.com" You wouldn't believe what some people come up with.

I am always trying to fine tune my CV for each position I apply for. A little tweak to certain parts of it to suit the post I am going for can do wonders. No unprofessional email addresses either! I did see someone use *persons name here*babez@yahoo.co.uk which I near enough wet myself at.

Broaden your horizons RiG. Aberdeen's not all its cracked up to be anyway.

What are you looking for anyway?

Looking further afield than Aberdeen Alex. Environmental work mainly. I had a very productive meeting with someone from one of the big oil firms here who gave me loads of good advice but the way the world is just now most oil companies are not looking for staff just now. He gave me some other options to try that might lead into a career in environmental oil & gas but we shall see how that goes. One route was through environmental consultants so having a look there.

Time for RiG to ditch the Pat Sharpe e.mail address I think!!!

:thumb04:

:018:

I forgot I even had that address! I don't think I use it for here do I? *checks profile*

A friend of mine went for her first job interview:

"so what do you know about the company?"

"nothing"

"why do you want this job?"

"to get my foot in the door"

Needless to say she didn't get it!

CVs - absolute maximum of two pages but the second page should be supplemental info. The first should get the attention. Also, if it's not going to get you the interview, don't put it in (you played volleyball at school, so what?). Don't have unnecessary titles like Name: John Smith, Address: 2 Glebe Street etc. It's pretty obvious what these are. Also, CVs are only there to get you an interview NOT the job. It should be enough info to tempt, not necessarily the whole story. Say what you did, not what you didn't, e.g.

"Hmmm, he worked as a senior technician, might get him in for an interview. Oh no, hang on, it says he didn't work on construction projects. What's the next CV say?"

"Says she's worked on WordPerfect but not we use MS Word." Word processor will do - packages are pretty much the same.

On my CV, I have my contact info large and in bold at the top of the first page. Separate sections entitled 'Key Skills' 'Qualifications' 'Employment History' 'Publications' - my second page is a list of projects (divided into sections) that I have been involved with. Make use of bold and italics to emphasis at a glance.

Interviews - bluff confidence. Look at people directly when you talk to them. Don't lie, you'll only get caught out, but don't do yourself down.

"So have you worked on construction projects?" "no, but the technical skills I've got are used in construction, so I can easily adapt them"

And do your homework obviously. What is the company like? If you've never done the job before, try to find out what exactly is involved by reading the job description and googling for a similar job description.

As mentioned earlier I fine tune my CV with each post I apply for. It was given the thumbs up by the Senior Environmental Scientist at Conoco Phillips so I am taking that as a good thing! ;)

A good covering letter helps as well I have found and gives you a chance to sell yourself a bit more which, according to the guy I met from CP, is something I should do (oo - er!)

I found an environmental post in Edinburgh I could go for within the same organisation I currently work for but I am excluded from applying not because of lack of skills or experience but because of the pay grade I am on which is not high enough to be considered for this post I am interested in.

*sigh*

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Are you applying directly to the organisations ??

I work as a contractor in the oil and gas industry (currently with Shell in Holland) many larger organisations prefer to employ contractors as they are cheaper than staff and more flexible.

Have you posted your CV on any websites ... Every job I have had over the past 6 years has come through via 1 website << oilandgasjobsearch.com >> they seem to always have jobs on the environmental side of things - there are many other websites you can use (monster - S1jobs etc).

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Has anyone got any tips for writing covering letters? I often just put that i would like to apply for the blah blah position and think that maybe what is letting me down

I will send you a copy of one of mine that I used. While it's not gotten me a job it got me some interviews and "informal" interviews with people to get advice and they all said the letter was good.

Are you applying directly to the organisations ??

I work as a contractor in the oil and gas industry (currently with Shell in Holland) many larger organisations prefer to employ contractors as they are cheaper than staff and more flexible.

Have you posted your CV on any websites ... Every job I have had over the past 6 years has come through via 1 website << oilandgasjobsearch.com >> they seem to always have jobs on the environmental side of things - there are many other websites you can use (monster - S1jobs etc).

My flat mate works as a contractor through Orion for Conoco but I have been writing / emailing to the oil companies direct. not to their HR department but to the actual environmental department and a named person. That way it won't get lost in the generic HR department where no one will touch it.

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Environmental work mainly. I had a very productive meeting with someone from one of the big oil firms here who gave me loads of good advice but the way the world is just now most oil companies are not looking for staff just now. He gave me some other options to try that might lead into a career in environmental oil & gas but we shall see how that goes. One route was through environmental consultants so having a look there.

Hey, that's my main job! Got a bit of advice and a few environmental job sites at my website, http://EnvironmentalConsultancy.co.uk (snappy huh?) - for agencies I'd recommend BBT, Allen & York or Sentinel Engineering.

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I read a lot of people get into these posts through agencies now as opposed to the actual company themselves?

I have a list of ~ 30 Environmental Consultancies that I will be "bugging" to see if I can get anything with them.

Following on from my wee rant about being rejected from a post in Edinburgh due to my pay grade I now find the moron across from me has been successful in achieving a promotion despite not meeting the entry requirements for the post :rotflmao:

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Some great advice on this thread, a lot I didnt know. I think things are already looking up for you.

Morale is so important. If nothing comes in your line, then maybe work outside it while looking - you may get a pleasant surprise. Believe that you have something to offer, and always network at all times. The man at the bus stop may be looking for someone.

Cold call, and follow up with your CV. If no today, then they may have something tomorrow, and whose name is going to be first in their mind? Keep them posted email then with your new skills jobs completed, even a bit of news about their field of endeavour, but dont be a pest. Fine line.

Think transferable skills.

Many employers no longer want staff, they just want jobs done, contracts fufilled, projects ulfilled. Do a one week spec study and you could be doing the main three year project!

Be prepared to retrain.

Also more directly, the manny on the radio says UK is moving towards manufacturing,and more particularly ship building, and there is a RN contract worth billions coming to Scotland, for which there is no skilled personel. Thay have a special website, shipshape or something. Have a google, and dont just think rivets.

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Has anyone got any tips for writing covering letters? I often just put that i would like to apply for the blah blah position and think that maybe what is letting me down

I will send you a copy of one of mine that I used. While it's not gotten me a job it got me some interviews and "informal" interviews with people to get advice and they all said the letter was good.

Are you applying directly to the organisations ??

I work as a contractor in the oil and gas industry (currently with Shell in Holland) many larger organisations prefer to employ contractors as they are cheaper than staff and more flexible.

Have you posted your CV on any websites ... Every job I have had over the past 6 years has come through via 1 website << oilandgasjobsearch.com >> they seem to always have jobs on the environmental side of things - there are many other websites you can use (monster - S1jobs etc).

My flat mate works as a contractor through Orion for Conoco but I have been writing / emailing to the oil companies direct. not to their HR department but to the actual environmental department and a named person. That way it won't get lost in the generic HR department where no one will touch it.

Rig, I have worked in Recruitment for a long time, including Orion. What you say is true CVs do sometimes get lost in the HR Department system, what I would say is yes contiue to send your CV to the actual department but at the same time sent it to the HR department as with some companies unless you send it to there first you will not get put on their companies system.

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