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Inverness councillors and planners


Alex MacLeod

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In light of the recent refusal to grant expansion of Glen Mhor hotel, which included a micro-brewery, do the local councillors have the future vibrancy and modernisation of the city at heart or are they happy being stuck in a city with no atmosphere and no attraction to the visitor.

 

http://www.inverness-courier.co.uk/News/Glen-Mhor-hotelier-to-appeal-against-biased-Ness-Bank-brewery-refusal-24102014.htm

 

I have visited many cities in UK and around the world and they all have a vibrancy. They all strive to give the visitor plenty of options be it shopping, site-seeing, variety of nightlife or just chilling in the open with a beer or a coffee. Inverness, just like its neighbour Perth has none of that. Indeed I sometimes feel that those running both highland cities have their heads still stuck in the sands of the fifties. Go to Glasgow, Edinburgh, Stirling or Aberdeen and experience what a city is really like. Go to Inverness or Perth and live the dark ages. Mind you, perhaps we're getting all the highlander wants. A city of grimy pubs, bookies and charity shops.

 

Perhaps its time the old fogies running our councils got their marching orders and made way for young thinking visionaries. The sort of people who can take short term ideas and turn them into long term benefits for the highland cities.

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Aberdeen is a worse city than Inverness, there may be oil money, but none of its invested in the infrastructure. The streets are lined with bookies, charity shops and just tat, the whole place needs a massive cash injection and rejuvination. The streets are dark and dimly lit and any wknd night the number of fights and aggressive atmosphere is disturbing.

 

For all the cash there is nowhere to spend it, there is a lack of high quality shops, resturants or entertainment outlets. You may suggest Inverness is in the dark ages, but as someone who has been resident in both places the quality of life and facilities in the Highland capital are better than Aberdeen - a city without even a pedestrianised area of main street and a traffic infrastructure to be ashamed of.

Edited by bdu98196
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Agree with some of your comments about Aberdeen but to say there's a lack of high quality restuarants suggests you haven't been looking too hard. Try some places like Lahore Karahi for authentic Pakistan, Carmine's for good priced Italian, Las Iguano's for Mexican, Rustico another Italian, Manchurian for Chinese. There's also Yatia if your feeling rich. Add to that the Amicus Apple, Ashvale Fish Restuarant or Bistro Verde if you like seafood. Viva Brazil is one for meat lovers. Aberdeen has an abundance of excellent restuarants that suit every taste and budget. Something that cannot be said for Inverness or, indeed, Perth.

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I'm just at a loss to understand what Highland Council is about at the moment. They have two opposing groups - a ruling one which is a coalition of political parties SNP/Lab/LibDem) which hate each other's guts and an "opposition" of people who stood for the Council as "Independents" and then apparently forgot what the word means because they formed a political grouping which is effectively that ultimate contradiction in terms - "The Independent Party".

This is basically politicians being politicians - telling you anything they think you want to hear in order to get your vote and then, once elected, casting you aside in favour of their own pursuit of power by way of party loyalty.

So for whom do I vote in a Council election? Labour or LibDem so they can enter a coalition which sustains the influence of the SNP which is anathema to me, or for an "Independent" so his/her independence (which I expect the canadidate to exercise in my and other electors' interests) can be totally compromised by the poitical requirements of an "Independent" group?

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Agree with some of your comments about Aberdeen but to say there's a lack of high quality restuarants suggests you haven't been looking too hard. Try some places like Lahore Karahi for authentic Pakistan, Carmine's for good priced Italian, Las Iguano's for Mexican, Rustico another Italian, Manchurian for Chinese. There's also Yatia if your feeling rich. Add to that the Amicus Apple, Ashvale Fish Restuarant or Bistro Verde if you like seafood. Viva Brazil is one for meat lovers. Aberdeen has an abundance of excellent restuarants that suit every taste and budget. Something that cannot be said for Inverness or, indeed, Perth.

Is Gerard... the "Torry Frenchman" still on the go?

This was the guy many years ago who did his own voiceovers for his Grampian TV ads in a French accent proclaiming "Zis is Gerard in ze keetchen of Gerard....Ebbardeen's favourite restaurant."

The restaurant was said to be very good indeed.

Edited by Charles Bannerman
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Before my time Charles.

 

The one thing that really bugs me about local councillors is that they apply much of their time trying to score political points of each other rather than do a job to the benefit of all. In planning for example they have a national guideline to follow but choose to interpret that to meet their own ends. No micro-brewery because it could effect the flood defenses. C'mon!! That one to me smacks of temperance thinking.

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Alex, the refusal of the brewery was quite right, ask one or two of the people that live close by their opinions of the proposed development and the way that the Glen Mhor has treated the immediate area over the last few years and you'll get a quite different view to that of the owner

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Aberdeen is a worse city than Inverness, there may be oil money, but none of its invested in the infrastructure. The streets are lined with bookies, charity shops and just tat, the whole place needs a massive cash injection and rejuvination. The streets are dark and dimly lit and any wknd night the number of fights and aggressive atmosphere is disturbing.

 

For all the cash there is nowhere to spend it, there is a lack of high quality shops, resturants or entertainment outlets. You may suggest Inverness is in the dark ages, but as someone who has been resident in both places the quality of life and facilities in the Highland capital are better than Aberdeen - a city without even a pedestrianised area of main street and a traffic infrastructure to be ashamed of.

 

Aberdeen City Council get next to nothing from all the oil money so they can't exactly invest in the infrastructure of the city. It's down to the private companies to do that if they so wish and more often than not they will invest in improving their own buildings or infrastructure for their own benefit rather than for the good of the city (although some improvements may bring knock on improvements or benefits for the city).

 

As for the micro brewery I can't claim to have followed the story too closely however I would, in most cases, trust the word of a public authority / planner far more than that coming from a business / individual with private interests. 

Edited by RiG
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I dont know if the refusal was right or wrong. The reasons debated by the planning committee were pathetic all the same. Not just what the hotel owner says but what was portrayed on the councils own video of the decision meeting. As to the people objecting, do they know anything about micro-brewing? Modern equipment is designed to be environmentally friendly and should have no impact on the area. I also doubt very much that vehicular access to the hotel area will be any greater than is already required to run the hotel and bar. As for the effect on flood defenses, whats that all about? The brewing process uses water. It doesn't create it.

It is also known that on-premises micro breweries that produce good beers for sale mainly on their own premises bring in more custom than average brewery controlled pubs thus creating jobs and boosting local economy.

On the great big picture micro-brewing is far more environmentally and economically friendly than mass production units that use chemical means to speed up the fermentation process. It uses organic locally produced products, reduces transportation and packaging costs and is not such a drain on energy.

On-premises micro-brewing is very successful in many of the cities of the UK. Should Inverness miss out?

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I think the micro-brewery concept is great but the site is wrong.  I think Erasmus shoots himself in the foot when he cites "The Kitchen" as the sort of venture which has gone ahead, because that very modern and different design with,as he says, no parking, demonstrates that the Planning Committee will approve rather more innovative projects.  The problem with this type of planning refusal is that they tend to give too many reasons for the refusal and then end up giving some reasons that are not good reasons at all and which are then siezed on to criticise the decision.  Same building the other side of the High Street would be brilliant.

 

Tend to agree with the general comments on Councillors but given the shameful turnout we have for local elections it could be argued we get what we deserve.  I stand by my views  expressed in another thread that the work of politicians at all levels is onerous if they are to do it well and therefore they should be remunerated better.  That would encourage people to go into politics rather than other jobs and we would get more able people in post.  Far too many at local level do it for their own egos or self interest and they tend to hold sway over those that get involved through a sense of doing good for the community.

 

Disagree with comments about lack of decent restaurants in Inverness.  There must be 30 restaurants in Inverness better than anything in Dingwall.  No - that's a bit harsh - make it 50.

 

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Aberdeen is a worse city than Inverness, there may be oil money, but none of its invested in the infrastructure. The streets are lined with bookies, charity shops and just tat, the whole place needs a massive cash injection and rejuvination. The streets are dark and dimly lit and any wknd night the number of fights and aggressive atmosphere is disturbing.

 

For all the cash there is nowhere to spend it, there is a lack of high quality shops, resturants or entertainment outlets. You may suggest Inverness is in the dark ages, but as someone who has been resident in both places the quality of life and facilities in the Highland capital are better than Aberdeen - a city without even a pedestrianised area of main street and a traffic infrastructure to be ashamed of.

 

Aberdeen City Council get next to nothing from all the oil money so they can't exactly invest in the infrastructure of the city. It's down to the private companies to do that if they so wish and more often than not they will invest in improving their own buildings or infrastructure for their own benefit rather than for the good of the city (although some improvements may bring knock on improvements or benefits for the city).

 

As for the micro brewery I can't claim to have followed the story too closely however I would, in most cases, trust the word of a public authority / planner far more than that coming from a business / individual with private interests. 

 

That is not strictly true RiG. All the players in the industry, who have offices, factories etc have to pay local council taxes and property rentals. They pay local people who live and spend in the area. People who have homes and pay local taxes. Every supply vessel in and out of Aberdeen harbour has to pay for that privilege. A lot of money has gone into Aberdeen from oil over the years. Sadly many of those in control squandered the funds on ideas of no benefit to the city.

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The one thing that really bugs me about local councillors is that they apply much of their time trying to score political points of each other rather than do a job to the benefit of all. In planning for example they have a national guideline to follow but choose to interpret that to meet their own ends.

That is exactly it! They are there for the benefit of their parties and not for the benefit of the electorate, and that even applies to the "Independents".

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The one thing that really bugs me about local councillors is that they apply much of their time trying to score political points of each other rather than do a job to the benefit of all. In planning for example they have a national guideline to follow but choose to interpret that to meet their own ends.

That is exactly it! They are there for the benefit of their parties and not for the benefit of the electorate, and that even applies to the "Independents".

 

 

Now something on which we can agree, Charles. I don't know about Inverness, but in Moray, the most amusing part of the transition from the district/regional councils of the mid-seventies to the unitary ones in the 1990s which replaced them, for those of us watching,  was the sudden interest in being "Independent" Moray council members by nearly all of those previously proclaimed Tories representing us in Grampian Region. In Moray, Independent = Tory. We have only one councillor who was elected under the Tory banner...and one Independent who was, afaik, of the Labour persuasion (though I don't know if Nu or Old).and the rest are assumed to be Tories.  All "Independent"  means is that they paid for their own campaign and no political party did. It doesn't mean they do independent thinking.because nobody really does......not even me.....and not you!  :wink:  We are all influenced by something/someone.

 

I always think that political parties and religion are both cults, and the adherents/members of political parties are even more willfully blinkered than those who are religious, because religions rarely, if ever change their basic principles..and never their manifesto promises.....but political parties appear to do both as often as I change my knickers....and their blinkered members/voters seem to just not really notice, and assume that deep-down...they are still the party they joined/voted for in the first place. People who join/vote today for the Tory/NuLabour/LibDem Parties are not joining/voting for the same kind of party as those of us who were joining/voting for them in the 1960s or even the 1970s....just for parties with the same name, but not the same principles.

 

Doing some blue sky. out of the box thinking here.......but

The problem is, imo, the political party system, which, also imo, has no place in local government, particularly the whipping element.  I do, however think that we should be aware of the political bias of local council candidates.....so ideally, I'd like to see changes in the local Government election set-up, which currently does not allow independent candidates to declare their political bent, even if they would be inclined to do so....(and I'm sorry, but I don't believe that anyone without a political bone in their body would want to become a local councillor above the community council level..I really don't)...so I'd like to see the local council/government setting strict  limits on election expenses and paying them, but candidates standing as Independent NuLabour/Tory/SNP/LibDem or whatever and all council positions from the leader down being voted for by the whole council, and not chosen by the biggest group....because there wouldn't be a biggest group if they were all independents. So no obligation or allowances made, as now, to ensure that "the party" has direct input into the deliberations of "their" councillors and maybe less confrontation and more sensible consensus. The blurb delineating the duties/ obligations etc of local councillors actually say  they have an obligation to their party, if elected under a party banner...which makes every local council just a little Westminster and, to an extent, Holyrood, under the crap electoral systems both of them use. And surely, by now, we have realised that confrontational politics doesn't work.

 

(If it could be afforded, I'd like to see the Governments funding election campaigns to Westminster as well, with very strict spending limits......as that would remove the need for donations from vested interests with less likelihood that those vested interests would benefit from policies produced..and it would save us a lot of boring TV and media hype  into the bargain. :smile: )

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I think "independent" councillors are part of the problem rather than the solution.  Let me say first that there are some independent councillors who do the job for the right reasons and who do a great job - but they are very much in the minority.  Others get involved for less honourable reasons whilst plenty others do it for the right reason but are simply not up to the job.  In addition, we never really know what they stand for and how they vote on various issues.  We end up voting for them because they are not affiliated to a political party rather than because of their own personal credentials.

 

There is a lot wrong with political parties at local level but at least there is a party take on local issues and an expectation of local action being consistent with their wide manifesto and political agenda.  Generally speaking you know what you are getting and if the councillor strays from that then they fall foul of the party and are not supported by the party as a candidate next time round.  In addition, the party machinery can provide a lot of support in dealing with constituents' problems and in providing advice to councillors on issues they are expected to make decisions about.  "Independents" don't have access to that level of support.

 

With PR at local level confrontational politics is less likely than at higher levels of Government.  Party based local government is more open as well because one of the problems with the so-called independents is that they form their own little groups and alliances behind the scenes with agreements that one will support someone else's pet project if the other reciprocates etc.  Better in my view would be to say that you had to stand on a party ticket.  What that would do is encourage the creation of new parties which could be focused on issues within the remit of the local councils.  If that was done in conjunction with legislation which facilitated the creation of new parties but with appropriate constraints to prevent very small groups of 2 or 3 locals calling themselves a party e.g. publication of manifesto, minimum number of paid up members etc, then we could have real informed choice and more effective local government.

 

It is a timely debate, as it is reported today that COSLA has written to William Hague arguing that more powers need to be devolved to local Government.  There may well be a case for that in theory, but if power is devolved to local level we really do need people in local Government who are competent to make decisions.

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Now something on which we can agree, Charles. I don't know about Inverness, but in Moray, the most amusing part of the transition from the district/regional councils of the mid-seventies to the unitary ones in the 1990s which replaced them, for those of us watching,  was the sudden interest in being "Independent" Moray council members by nearly all of those previously proclaimed Tories representing us in Grampian Region. In Moray, Independent = Tory. We have only one councillor who was elected under the Tory banner...and one Independent who was, afaik, of the Labour persuasion (though I don't know if Nu or Old).and the rest are assumed to be Tories.  All "Independent"  means is that they paid for their own campaign and no political party did. It doesn't mean they do independent thinking.because nobody really does......not even me.....and not you!  :wink:  We are all influenced by something/someone.

 

I always think that political parties and religion are both cults, and the adherents/members of political parties are even more willfully blinkered than those who are religious, because religions rarely, if ever change their basic principles..and never their manifesto promises.....but political parties appear to do both as often as I change my knickers....and their blinkered members/voters seem to just not really notice, and assume that deep-down...they are still the party they joined/voted for in the first place. People who join/vote today for the Tory/NuLabour/LibDem Parties are not joining/voting for the same kind of party as those of us who were joining/voting for them in the 1960s or even the 1970s....just for parties with the same name, but not the same principles.

 

 

Oddquine... for the first time in my life I have placed a "like" against one of your posts. :clapoverhead:  :clapoverhead:  :clapoverhead:

 

I am not a fan of political parties, or to misquote George Orwell "All parties are objectionable, but some parties are more objectionable than others :lol: " I certainly don't like their presence in Local Government which is meant to be a local arrangement to provide and facilitate local services so the philosophies of Karl Marx, Adam Smith, Hugh McDiarmid etc etc have no relevant place. Councils should be run for the benefit of the public and not for the benefit of political parties and the same really applies to national government.

Independents should be truly independent, taking each issue as it comes. Inevitbaly Independents will have their own political views be that right/ left, unionist/ nationalist etc but if they are operating truly independently these should not be in evidence.

As for Oddquine's knickers.... I am sure she is a extremely hygienic individual but still changes same less frequently that parties change policies or even their fundamental views!

The best recent example is Labour who used to be all about the public ownership of the means of production and distribution and Tetley Teafolk with big bunnets and Oop North accents proposing "hit composyte" to the brothers. But when an extreme version of that became unelectable, they suddenly reached out for the prawn sandwiches and canapes on the entrance of Tony Blair who the Queen apparently later observed was "in the wrong Party" :lol: Since then Labour have turned pinching Tory policies into an artform, and their expendient political U turn is one of the root causes of the recent rise of Nationalism in Scotland. Labour's chicken atre well and truly coming home to roost now following their Faustian lurch to the right in search of electability. There is a well established precedent for this mind you when Ramsay MacDonald in the 20s threw his lot with the Establishment. Most hilarious hypocrisy of all, however, has been "New" Labour luminaries, advocated of nicked Tory policies, on the stage at party conferences singing their hearts out to The Red Flag :laugh:  :laugh:  :laugh:

Then you have the SNP who have been pretty consistent about separation being all they are interested in, but have been prepared to "believe" anything on the political spectrum, currently the vacant far left agenda, in order to get people to vote for that.

The Lib Dems? Well say on more about the former "Bloody Nice Blokes" who became barefaced political chameleons in an effort to grasp some kind of power.

Next up, the Lentil Munchers. Well I suppose the Green Party have been pretty consistent in their espousal of eveything from itchy woollen jumpers and beards (and that's just the women!) to cycling and self sufficiency, but I'm not sure what the link is between saving the planet and separation.

That leaves the Tories who have actually been quite consistent throughout but just can't agree internally on their level of Euroscepticism.

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Aberdeen is a worse city than Inverness, there may be oil money, but none of its invested in the infrastructure. The streets are lined with bookies, charity shops and just tat, the whole place needs a massive cash injection and rejuvination. The streets are dark and dimly lit and any wknd night the number of fights and aggressive atmosphere is disturbing.

 

For all the cash there is nowhere to spend it, there is a lack of high quality shops, resturants or entertainment outlets. You may suggest Inverness is in the dark ages, but as someone who has been resident in both places the quality of life and facilities in the Highland capital are better than Aberdeen - a city without even a pedestrianised area of main street and a traffic infrastructure to be ashamed of.

 

Aberdeen City Council get next to nothing from all the oil money so they can't exactly invest in the infrastructure of the city. It's down to the private companies to do that if they so wish and more often than not they will invest in improving their own buildings or infrastructure for their own benefit rather than for the good of the city (although some improvements may bring knock on improvements or benefits for the city).

 

As for the micro brewery I can't claim to have followed the story too closely however I would, in most cases, trust the word of a public authority / planner far more than that coming from a business / individual with private interests. 

 

That is not strictly true RiG. All the players in the industry, who have offices, factories etc have to pay local council taxes and property rentals. They pay local people who live and spend in the area. People who have homes and pay local taxes. Every supply vessel in and out of Aberdeen harbour has to pay for that privilege. A lot of money has gone into Aberdeen from oil over the years. Sadly many of those in control squandered the funds on ideas of no benefit to the city.

 

 

Fair point. There is some indirect benefit but for all the investment in Aberdeen direct returns are pretty minimal. 

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Next up, the Lentil Munchers. Well I suppose the Green Party have been pretty consistent in their espousal of eveything from itchy woollen jumpers and beards (and that's just the women!) to cycling and self sufficiency, but I'm not sure what the link is between saving the planet and separation.

 

Sometimes it's a bummer being admin. We don't have access to an 'ignore' button...

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Next up, the Lentil Munchers. Well I suppose the Green Party have been pretty consistent in their espousal of eveything from itchy woollen jumpers and beards (and that's just the women!) to cycling and self sufficiency, but I'm not sure what the link is between saving the planet and separation.

 

Sometimes it's a bummer being admin. We don't have access to an 'ignore' button...

 

 

:rotflmao:   but the ignore button only works if you have will power........and I don't, as is evidenced by the times I reply to Charles when I am bored.

 

To be fair, I was thinking as I was reading the post, part of which you quoted, that I might even give it a like, as for once, Charles seemed to be dissing everyone indiscriminately for a change.........until I came to the last paragraph.....then I changed my mind.

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