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Kingsmills

Hillsborough Verdict

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A verdict of unlawful killing and also a finding that the conduct of the fans did not contribute to the disaster. A disgraceful conspiracy from the cabinet office down to deflect responsibility from the police onto the innocent victims as last debunked and justice served almost three decades on.

Time now for those truly responsible to face the criminal consequences and for the Sun 'newspaper' to print a proper apology for running a story they knew to be inaccurate at the time.

Edited by Kingsmills
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Starry, starry night.
Paint your palette red and white,
Look out on a summer's night,
With eyes that know the darkness in your soul.
Shadows on the hills,
Sketch the trees and the daffodils,
Catch the breeze and the April chills,
In colours on the snowy linen land.
Now I understand what you tried to say to me

how you suffered for your sanity
how you tried to set them free.
They would not listen
they did not know how

perhaps they'll listen now.

 

LOL - Courtesy of the SUN newspaper :redcard:

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Disgusting its taken so long for justice to be partially served that those who should be held accountable are now at the wrong end of the age spectrum and given the British courts system, I would expect that many will die before being put in the dock.  

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I remember very long time ago I had a Norton motor bike. I stopped riding it before 1963. The reason I mentioned that it helps me place the date of a Burnley v Liverpool cup game at Turf Moor. I know I went to the game on my bike. . When I got there all the tickets were sold , so I stood outside listening to the transistor radios , of the game. The Liverpool fans were discussing a tactic they had used before of f getting the police to open the gates. However they thought there was not enough of them to create the havoc needed to influence the Police, I always think of that day when this topic comes to light.

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I travelled down to Edinburgh by bus yesterday and back today.  I took the opportunity to read the latest report in some detail.  I think perhaps you should too, Lawrence.

There has now been a massive amount of evidence collected and there is absolutely no evidence of any coordinated tactic of the sort you imply.  Released CCTV footage from outside the ground shows no such coordinated attack on the gate. Of course there were some fans with no tickets and of course there were people who had too much to drink but there always are on these big match occasions.  There is no evidence that the level of this was any different from usual and in any case the police have a responsibility to deal with such people and prevent them causing danger to others.

The difference at Hillsborough was that there were not enough turnstiles open and there were insufficient police to cordon the fans into proper queues.  The police also failed to delay the kick off time when they became aware of significant congestion outside the ground.  It was a combination of these factors that led to the fateful decision to open the exit gates and nothing to do with a tactic of ticketless hordes.    

Laurence, I appreciate that you do not specifically allege that ticketless fans were responsible for this tragedy, but the implication in your post is quite clear.  You should be ashamed of yourself

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4 hours ago, Laurence said:

I remember very long time ago I had a Norton motor bike. I stopped riding it before 1963. The reason I mentioned that it helps me place the date of a Burnley v Liverpool cup game at Turf Moor. I know I went to the game on my bike. . When I got there all the tickets were sold , so I stood outside listening to the transistor radios , of the game. The Liverpool fans were discussing a tactic they had used before of f getting the police to open the gates. However they thought there was not enough of them to create the havoc needed to influence the Police, I always think of that day when this topic comes to light.

Hang on Laurence. You're saying you were at a game involving Liverpool... you haven't got a clue when, except you reckon it was before 1963 on the strength of having sold a motor bike... but you still seem to remember Liverpool fans discussing how to get in through a gate without tickets.

It's maybe at this stage that we need the question.....”and your point is?”, because you don't actually say what your point is.

However it would be reasonable to infer that, because you think you heard Liverpool fans discussing a ruse to get a gate open on some date before 1963 which you can't even remember, you appear to be suggesting that this is evidence that Liverpool fans in 1989 attempted a similar ruse.

The inquest jury listened to two years of evidence before coming to 14 considered verdicts.... but you seem to think you know better because you went to a football match that you can only remember because you sold a bloody motorbike in1963!!!

It's like Corporal Jones ranting on about the fuzzywuzzies in the bloody Sudan!

 

Or have you just started a new job as a PR man for the Sun?

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On ‎26‎/‎04‎/‎2016 at 11:18 AM, Kingsmills said:

A verdict of unlawful killing and also a finding that the conduct of the fans did not contribute to the disaster.

The very clear inference in Laurence's post is as distasteful as it is untimely. I am not a big fan of red dots but that is just the type of ill informed and malicious content worthy of exception.

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On 4/27/2016 at 8:26 PM, Laurence said:

I remember very long time ago I had a Norton motor bike. I stopped riding it before 1963. The reason I mentioned that it helps me place the date of a Burnley v Liverpool cup game at Turf Moor. I know I went to the game on my bike. . When I got there all the tickets were sold , so I stood outside listening to the transistor radios , of the game. The Liverpool fans were discussing a tactic they had used before of f getting the police to open the gates. However they thought there was not enough of them to create the havoc needed to influence the Police, I always think of that day when this topic comes to light.

"Before 1963", so at least 27 years before Hillsborough; so longer before then, than since then.  I remember 15 April 1989 well (at least from about noon on) - do you?  Do you remember where you were when you first heard about it?  Because you don't remember twice as long ago awfully well!  That shouldn't be a surprise to any of us, so in the circumstances, maybe you should just STFU about it.  We're aware that you used to be a fireman: that doesn't mean you have to pretend to believe the lies of others who served with the emergency services.

 

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6 hours ago, ilpadrino said:

"Before 1963", so at least 27 years before Hillsborough; so longer before then, than since then.  I remember 15 April 1989 well (at least from about noon on) - do you?  Do you remember where you were when you first heard about it?  Because you don't remember twice as long ago awfully well!  That shouldn't be a surprise to any of us, so in the circumstances, maybe you should just STFU about it.  We're aware that you used to be a fireman: that doesn't mean you have to pretend to believe the lies of others who served with the emergency services.

 

Actually I remember 15th April 1989 very well. Was watching Inverness Thistle away at Fraserburgh. In the days before social media or mobile 'phones we knew nothing about events unfolding in Sheffield until we got back to the car and switched the radio on. We listened in horror at the developing news. What Ialso remember very clearly is that long before we got back to Inverness the 'news' through the BBC was that the tragedy was caused by late arriving fans charging and breaking open a gate. I am not being critical of the BBC journalists at the ground who were merely broadcasting 'information' from sources they ought absolutely to have been able to trust.

The fact of the matter, at long last judicially determined, is that those who ought to have been saving lives were more interested even as men, women and children for whom they had a duty of care, were lying dying on the pitch and the terraces, in saving their own reputations.

We know you too were a member of the emergency services Luarence, you have told us as much often enough, but shame on you for by inference perpetuating that lie even now....

Edited by Kingsmills

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16 hours ago, Kingsmills said:

Actually I remember 15th April 1989 very well. Was watching Inverness Thistle away at Fraserburgh. In the days before social media or mobile 'phones we knew nothing about events unfolding in Sheffield until we got back to the car and switched the radio on. We listened in horror at the developing news. What Ialso remember very clearly is that long before we got back to Inverness the 'news' through the BBC was that the tragedy was caused by late arriving fans charging and breaking open a gate. I am not being critical of the BBC journalists at the ground who were merely broadcasting 'information' from sources they ought absolutely to have been able to trust.

The fact of the matter, at long last judicially determined, is that those who ought to have been saving lives were more interested even as men, women and children for whom they had a duty of care, were lying dying on the pitch and the terraces, in saving their own reputations.

We know you too were a member of the emergency services Luarence, you have told us as much often enough, but shame on you for by inference perpetuating that lie even now....

I was at Dens Park (where John Robertson came on as a sub for Hearts).  All we got at half-time was that the Liverpool v Nottingham Forrest game had been abandoned after kick-off, and got nothing more until we were back in the car.

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