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Bronson

Ups and downs

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Bronson    55

Doesn't look like this season will have a happy ending. A hugely disappointing campaign and one which leaves lots of unanswered questions and finger pointing. However it is also got me to thinking that maybe it's just our time. We are real football fans who experience the highs and the lows. Apart from Celtic, every team in the split have either been relegated or flirted with it. The cup win and Romania tasted so sweet as we had already tasted the bitterness of relegation and look likely to again. I have enjoyed our journey and will continue to regardless of what division we end up in. Apart from Romania and the cup final, all my favourite away days have been in the lower leagues. Regardless of whether we go down or not I look forward to the next chapter.

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PerfICT    1,137

...begs the question: would you swap the cup win for avoiding relegation this season. I'm sure the answer will be a resounding "no", but it might depend on where the journey takes us now. Maybe even if we end up in part-time mediocrity it would still be worth the cup win to be honest. Living the dream....but like all dreams, it's come to an end.

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+jagster    368
10 minutes ago, PerfICT said:

...begs the question: would you swap the cup win for avoiding relegation this season. I'm sure the answer will be a resounding "no", but it might depend on where the journey takes us now. Maybe even if we end up in part-time mediocrity it would still be worth the cup win to be honest. Living the dream....but like all dreams, it's come to an end.

 

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Kingsmills    3,284
11 minutes ago, PerfICT said:

...begs the question: would you swap the cup win for avoiding relegation this season. I'm sure the answer will be a resounding "no", but it might depend on where the journey takes us now. Maybe even if we end up in part-time mediocrity it would still be worth the cup win to be honest. Living the dream....but like all dreams, it's come to an end.

Even a single year out of the top division will cost us over twice as much as we made from the cup win so logically you would swap that for Premiership survival. However, football has very little to do with logic and personally I wouldn't swap that wonderful euphoric afternoon in Glasgow for anything.

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At the time I thought the Scottish Cup win would probably be the pinnacle, in my lifetime, of being an ICT fan. I expected that we'd decline slightly from there, but what I didn't expect is the complete collapse and capitulation of the side within the space of just two years since. It's incredible! :wtf:

Edited by RednBlackComeback
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10 hours ago, PerfICT said:

... Maybe even if we end up in part-time mediocrity it would still be worth the cup win to be honest.

The guy next to me in the Gents at the end of the Cup Final put it "perfictly": "Whatever happens now, we are in the history books forever!". 

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Yngwie    3,259
44 minutes ago, snorbens_caleyman said:

The guy next to me in the Gents at the end of the Cup Final put it "perfictly": "Whatever happens now, we are in the history books forever!". 

Why, what on earth were the two of you doing?

Oh wait, I see what you mean!

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TopSix    586
13 hours ago, Bronson said:

Apart from Romania and the cup final, all my favourite away days have been in the lower leagues. Regardless of whether we go down or not I look forward to the next chapter.

Have you made it to many away matches this season? I thought Motherwell yesterday was a cracking awayday. The stewards were great, the home fans good banter and the catering was decent too. 

The thought of going to Livingston  next season instead of Easter Road and Tynecastle doesn't exactly fill me with excitement, but each to their own, I suppose. Part time football (probably) beckons and I can see us plummeting down the leagues. 

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Well I am Brosnon. The good away days in the top flight are to the old favourites such as Well and Killie. I will miss those two as well as the Jam Tarts but there are minuses elsewhere, especially the Old Filth. My gave away game this season was at Elgin and in recent years, apart from Hampden and Bucharest, it was Stranraer. It has also down to the crew that you travel with and the ambiance of the local hostelries, the absence of the Ultras and the old style ground environments and facilities (Ayr). ALL my best away days have been in the lower leagues and we have made links with groups of supporters from those types of teams. I can't wait to walk into the bars like Dumfries,Dunfermline and Morton and The stadium at the Rock I have never been to. I also love Livi as I can take the Mississippi shopping. Just gutted that it may not include Psisley and Ayr. Don't get me wrong I want us to stay up. I will be glued to the telly for the next two games and I am going to Killie and Dens. I will be gutted if we go down but no tears. 

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Kingsmills    3,284
29 minutes ago, TopSix said:

Have you made it to many away matches this season? I thought Motherwell yesterday was a cracking awayday. The stewards were great, the home fans good banter and the catering was decent too. 

The thought of going to Livingston  next season instead of Easter Road and Tynecastle doesn't exactly fill me with excitement, but each to their own, I suppose. Part time football (probably) beckons and I can see us plummeting down the leagues. 

We have had a terrible season, we will almost certainly be relegated, we currently have a manager who looks even less capable than he did when he started and looks to lack the ability to guide us back to the Premiership.

Not good, to say the least but even I as a general pessimist, don't think we will be turning part time anytime soon or plummeting further down the leagues. Cheer up, it's definitely not the finest time to be an ICT fan but it's not quite as bad as all that.

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forresjags    232
1 hour ago, TopSix said:

Have you made it to many away matches this season? I thought Motherwell yesterday was a cracking awayday. The stewards were great, the home fans good banter and the catering was decent too. 

The thought of going to Livingston  next season instead of Easter Road and Tynecastle doesn't exactly fill me with excitement, but each to their own, I suppose. Part time football (probably) beckons and I can see us plummeting down the leagues. 

Really , but have to disagree with that.

Thought the atmosphere was one of resignation of a team that were doomed.

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old caley girl    1,141
30 minutes ago, forresjags said:

Really , but have to disagree with that.

Thought the atmosphere was one of resignation of a team that were doomed.

Should have come to upper teer then? Caleyaway doing their best to support/lift the team 

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RiG    2,208
22 minutes ago, forresjags said:

How many was in the upper tier just out of interest, wasn't aware it was open.   

At least 200.

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forresjags    232
On 16/04/2017 at 11:58 AM, old caley girl said:

Should have come to upper teer then? Caleyaway doing their best to support/lift the team 

Ok I stand corrected, amongst the other 150 away supporters in the lower tier there  was an atmosphere of inevitability on Saturday.  

 

 

 

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gingerjaggy    232

Relegation is not good and of course I want to see the club remain in the top division but a side from the financial it may just be something to kick start a revival for the club. People will lose there jobs and that is deverstating but maybe this will be the making of the club. More chance of winning silverware, cheaper admission may just increase the crowds up a little. I remember 2009, my first year at uni and I had an exam on a Saturday (yes what is that all about) and missed Falkirk. My mum took my season ticket but I watched in the union and I cried when the whistle went. I won't be this time but what followed was great fun visiting old stadiums with terraces and the last day when the ground was almost packed. My first game was Ayr in Inverness with just over 1,000 fans and then a dunfermiline semi at hampden before watching the first promotion on the bridge. The club has had way more highs than lows but the size of the club we have to accept this will happen from time to time. We certainly ain't a yo-yo club but maybe this will get people back and enjoying the club. We won't suddenly get flocks of fans but maybe we can back over that 3,000 mark. Even if we don't win with the play offs now we need to finish top 4 to be part of a play off so coming back won't be as difficult than in the past with just one going up. Hope we stay up but if the inevitable happens then let's embrace it, sort this mess out and come back stronger

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PerfICT    1,137
10 minutes ago, gingerjaggy said:

Hope we stay up but if the inevitable happens then let's embrace it, sort this mess out and come back stronger

...with new leadership on and off the park and a sound strategy for long-term sustainability.

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Scarlet Pimple    751

This reflective article on the "Up and Down" of Hibernian F.C. might fit into this thread neatly.

http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/39614199

It's a commentary, basically, by Neil Lennon on the vagaries and benefits of demotion and promotion as it relates to Hibernian F.C. It's very interesting and instructive how this seasoned player and Manager assesses the ups and downs of Hibs downfall and resurgence. Especially the last paragraph which is sobering indeed and could depress some fans but might help gird the loins of really faithful and true fans of ICT to tighten their belts and  grin and bear it with hope in their hearts if push comes to shove.

My view? In an attempt to put a positive spin on relegation it should serve as a salutary lesson in how to do things completely differently in order to offset unusual and very challenging circumstances. I enjoyed it because Neil Lennon is no dummy and he has a good dentist.:ictscarf:

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8 hours ago, forresjags said:

Ok I stand corrected, amongst the other 150 away supporters in the lower tier there  was an atmosphere of inevitability on Saturday.  

 

 

 

There was a lot more spirit in the upper echelons. :drinking06:

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Scotty    1,778

35 seconds into the video sums it up for me ..... 'if we go down, then we go down together !' . I have (purposely) stayed pretty silent on this topic and watched from the sidelines as posts have varied in almost every degree from one extreme to the other. Relegated or not, just like last year, I will be there on the last day of the season showing my support to team and club. 

Personally, I believe MM is a last throw of the dice as it's too late to replace RF now and have any chance of staying up. If we were going to do that we should have done it months ago, but I think the board - like most of us - really, REALLY wanted to RF to succeed (and still do) and most of us, the board included, were hesitant to pull the plug or ask for him to go. There is possibly also the issue of compensation if he was sacked but none of us know the terms of the contract so that aspect is hard to say. 

We may still go down with RF/MM combo but if we do then we have to pull together to try and bounce back (again). The gulf in the parachute payment and league money was reduced between divisions when the SPL/SFL became the SPFL but its still significant. If we are all bickering amongst ourselves then the extremely difficult task of trying to bounce back in a year or two might become impossible.     

If its any consolation, I do see parallels with Toronto FC !!! TFC were absolute s*** under manager Aron Winter and after he was sacked we were just as bad with his former #2 Paul Mariner who also ended up sacked and then Ryan Nelson who got the same treatment .... but then the club gave the job to managerial newbie Greg Vanney. His first season in charge - with high profile signings like Michael Bradley, Jermain Defoe, Julio Cesar (loan), and Gilberto - ended in turmoil after failing to make the playoffs, Defoe basically walking out, and many calling for Vanney's head due to tactical naivety  .... but after all that, he quietly got through the off season, swapped Defoe for Altidore at Sunderland, brought in Sebastian Giovinco and a few other decent if unspectacular signings and TFC reached the playoffs for the first time in their short history before going out to Didier Drogba's Montreal. Last year it all clicked for Vanney and TFC reached the MLS Final eventually losing out to Seattle ... this year no-one is questioning Vanney's abilities despite starting the season slowly (1 win, 4 draws, 1 defeat). He has grown from being a 'rookie' manager thrown in at the deep end into the one with the best managerial record for TFC  ever !!!

I also find it quite strange that last year, on the final day of the season, Kenny was getting plaudits from the fans in the stadium for having a laugh and a joke with David Raven on the park, clearly to Yogi's chagrin ... yet here we are less than a year later and he seems to be the devil incarnate. As Jimmy Greaves used to say ... "Its a funny old game!" . Many believe the appointment of RF to be a mistake, and the length of contract to be silly, and perhaps it is with the benefit of hindsight ... but how many of the folk saying that have ever mentioned RF as a possible manager when going through rough spells under Butcher or Hughes ? Quite a few I would wager !  I know Kenny, I class him as a friend as well as chairman of our club and I know how much work he has done for our club over the 15+ years he has been involved either as a board member or as chairman. He will be hurting just as much as the rest of us, and he will be more than aware of mistakes that have been made, but equally I have no doubt he will look for solutions too whether that is to stop the slide or to have a plan in place to regain our top flight status if we are relegated. We accomplish nothing with all the in-fighting and back-biting .... If ICT do go down then we do it together, and we come back up together !

Following ICT has always been a roller-coaster ride ... and it always will be ... enjoy it ! 

  

 

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wynthank15    24

Scotty, whilst I admire your upbeat outlook and like you I have enjoyed the highs and suffered the big low( relegation at the hands of Falkirk) I really hope KC is hurting at the moment because the ICT board have created this situation all by themselves. The sacking of JH which was needless in my opinion and the appointment of a complete rookie manager at any level of football shows the lack of football knowledge within the board. What made it even worse was the hour plus interview at the start of the season with RF and KC which smacked of unwarranted Hubris in both of them. I am convinced KC played to a large part of the ICT support who wanted JH out and RF in, much of the aforementioned interview referred to the club's current football style and how it would change under RF (for the worse as it turned out).The employment of Malpas is an acknowledgement that RF is just not up to the job. I am in little doubt that if RF remains in place we could be facing relegation next season too, the guy is out of his depth, I'm afraid I do not share your optimistic outlook..

 

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