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Moogthurso

The Ian Vigurs enigma

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+Moogthurso    44

Just caught my eye how different the opinions of Iain Vigurs can be when at the games. 

In the spirit of trying to be positive and educate my potentially limited football vision could we discuss and celebrate what he does well and what I should be looking for and praising at the next game as i had a very negative impression yesterday with lots of missed passes and blaming   teammates. 

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+IBM    557

He is good at shouting and moaning at the referee :smile: who is usually poor and yesterday was a typical example 

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ictchris    816

Some stats on Vigurs compared to Draper and Tansey last season courtesy of @TheSPFLRadar on Twitter.

Vigurs

C4kCeP4XAAI6aJF.jpg

Tansey

C4kCjQ1WQAAveB7.jpg

 

Draper

C4kClWYW8AEjhDP.jpg

 

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ictchris    816

There's a really interesting account on Twitter @TheBackpassRule on Scottish football stats.

The guy who runs that has produced charts on expected goals per 90 mapped against actual goals per 90 for SPFL premiership midfielders. Vigurs significantly under performs in that chart, as do all our midfielders.

https://public.tableau.com/profile/thebackpassrule#!/vizhome/xGper90Midfielders/Dashboard1

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ictchris    816

And finally in the Iain Vigurs stat attack, he had the tenth most successful forward passes per ninety minutes of any player in the Premiership last season

 

IMG_0407.PNG

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Robert    145
2 hours ago, ictchris said:

Some stats on Vigurs compared to Draper and Tansey last season courtesy of @TheSPFLRadar on Twitter.

Vigurs

C4kCeP4XAAI6aJF.jpg

Tansey

C4kCjQ1WQAAveB7.jpg

 

Draper

C4kClWYW8AEjhDP.jpg

 

Other than in the air, he compares quite favourably on these stats.

Must admit, in the deeper role he played towards the end of last season and yesterday, he has impressed. I thought he pulled the strings in midfield against Brechin. May just be where I sit, as pretty close to the middle of the park, so I am close to the area he tends to be in.

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ictchris    816

The game at Dens was the best I've seen him play, he was superb in that game, used the ball so well. If he played like that every week he'd be one of our key players.

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bigman    45

Vigurs is a good footballer but seems to lose interest  after about 60 mins. The game seems to pass him by. Maybe not fit but as I said earlier seems to lose interest.

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Kingsmills    3,134
28 minutes ago, ictchris said:

The game at Dens was the best I've seen him play, he was superb in that game, used the ball so well. If he played like that every week he'd be one of our key players.

If he played like that every week he would be playing at a higher level. These glimpses of great ability that appear much less frequently than they should are the most frustrating aspect of his play. What a player he would be if he applied himself more diligently x

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Bronson    52

It was summed up perfectly by someone sitting close to me yesterday.  He's simply here to pick up a wage 

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Huisdean    365

Nonsense, he is undoubtedly one of our better players and has the ability to "make things happen" which was sadly lacking last season. Time will tell if he does the same this season as well. Sure he can appear lazy at times and his passes don't always come off but at least he sees these passes unlike Polworth. Much rather Vigur's attitude than Polworth's.

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old caley girl    1,085
55 minutes ago, Huisdean said:

Nonsense, he is undoubtedly one of our better players and has the ability to "make things happen" which was sadly lacking last season. Time will tell if he does the same this season as well. Sure he can appear lazy at times and his passes don't always come off but at least he sees these passes unlike Polworth. Much rather Vigur's attitude than Polworth's.

Totally agree! 

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rocky1    120

On his day vigurs has the ability to be a game winner and he is more likely and more often Able  to perform that role in the championship than in the SPL.

Polworth has even more ability but regretfully hasnt the strength of footballing mind to dig deep and deliver which is a shame as he could be a Stuart Armstrong .

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+Moogthurso    44

Thanks for all the data chris and all the positive comments. 

Based on all the discussion i dont really value his more languid style and percevied lack of effort.  He is though much more efficient than Ross D.

Ross has powerful runs great physical presence and very effective tackles and the effort he shows impresses me more. But ross needs to work harder as he is less efficient ?

I will try not to be overcritical of Iain in the future. Would be interesting to do the same sort of discussion in a few weeks on Polworth. 

 

 

 

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The Long Man    297

I would wait and see. Robbo seems much more pro-active, and may get more out of players by finding their best positions and playing to their strengths - qualities sadly lacking for the last couple of years.

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Council Juice    347

He's probably the best we have at spreading the ball around and finding a pass. He's got great vision. I think he'd do best as a deep lying playmaker with a defensive minded grafter and a box to box dynamic player alongside. One to do the dirty work and one to carry the ball.

Just think, in time we could be calling him the Pirlo of the North. But if that's to happen Vigurs needs others to be his legs and help create space. Just as the Italian maestro had Ambrosini, Gattuso and Seedorf at Milan and Vidal, Marchisio and Pogba at Juve. Ok so maybe I'm slightly exaggerating but humour the idea rather than a literal comparison.

 

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Scotty    1,745

We do have a Seedorf :wink:

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ictchris    816
7 hours ago, Council Juice said:

He's probably the best we have at spreading the ball around and finding a pass. He's got great vision. I think he'd do best as a deep lying playmaker with a defensive minded grafter and a box to box dynamic player alongside. One to do the dirty work and one to carry the ball.

Just think, in time we could be calling him the Pirlo of the North. But if that's to happen Vigurs needs others to be his legs and help create space. Just as the Italian maestro had Ambrosini, Gattuso and Seedorf at Milan and Vidal, Marchisio and Pogba at Juve. Ok so maybe I'm slightly exaggerating but humour the idea rather than a literal comparison.

 

The idea of Vigurs as a Prilo-style regista is maybe better than the reality.

I think he needs to be more consistent and work harder but he's certainly got the talent to succeed in the Championship - he's done so before.  He's become an easy target for some of our fans and is the first to be criticised when players alongside him have been just as poor, if not worse.  

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PerfICT    1,099

Vigurs is every manager's nightmare: Packed with ability (vision, passing, sweet left foot), but infuriatingly lacking in consistent application and difficult to find his perfect position. Added to that a poor disciplinary record and you give managers a real headache.

Last season, Vigurs was really poor for most of the season despite the faith shown in him throughout. Playing him wide left and in a slow midfield trio was partly to blame, but so was his lack of effort, particularly in tracking back. Too late, Foran finally found an effective position on his own immediately in front of the back 4 with a duty of taking the ball off defenders and using it well. From being a central figure in our demise, he very nearly became our saviour, with some excellent performances after the split.

So, played in a very distinct role that doesn't require too much effort, he can be a match winner on his day, but when he's not at it or played in more dynamic position he has the potential to be a passenger.

Enigma indeed.

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+jingsmonty    127
11 hours ago, The Long Man said:

I would wait and see. Robbo seems much more pro-active, and may get more out of players by finding their best positions and playing to their strengths - qualities sadly lacking for the last couple of years.

That's my big hope for both Vigurs & Polworth - a manager with tactical nous who can get the best out of the players. Both Polly & Vigurs are match winners on their day - unfortunately, that day doesn't seem to come around very often!!

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CableGuy    120

I always feel with vigurs he acts like a big name player, who almost feels he's better than the club he's at. Not just on the pitch but any meet and greets I've been to, more often than not he's never there and if he is, he vanishes like a puff of smoke as soon as he can. On the pitch I've always thought he performs well on the big games, but again on the smaller games and I'm talking the killies the particks etc no longer smaller games, he would look largely disinterested. I find it amazing that a player like him with his obvious talent and potential that he would be looking to really stand out and make a name for himself as it could be his last year and he could be back to Highland league level. His attitude and temperament does him zero favours. 

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old caley girl    1,085
3 minutes ago, CableGuy said:

I always feel with vigurs he acts like a big name player, who almost feels he's better than the club he's at. Not just on the pitch but any meet and greets I've been to, more often than not he's never there and if he is, he vanishes like a puff of smoke as soon as he can. On the pitch I've always thought he performs well on the big games, but again on the smaller games and I'm talking the killies the particks etc no longer smaller games, he would look largely disinterested. I find it amazing that a player like him with his obvious talent and potential that he would be looking to really stand out and make a name for himself as it could be his last year and he could be back to Highland league level. His attitude and temperament does him zero favours. 

I sponsor Iain and can catagorically state this is nonsence. I think he is a quiet unassuming guy and maybe not as ourgoing as some. He is very polite and chatty and certainly not one of first to leave. 

Some real keyboard warrior personal opinions going on in this thread and its not nice. 

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Council Juice    347

I always remember Vigurs in his first spell with us as being so one that if he could be any more laid back he'd be asleep. Was that not part of TBs Issue? 

Iain has abilities that other players don't and, especially with the loss of Tansey now as well, the management need to find the best way to allow him to utilise these tools, his vision and passing range. Whilst also finding ways of masking his weaknesses. We know he's not going to cover every blade.

It did seem that he appeared to find his role in the team towards the end of last season as a type of footballing quarter back. The "regista" role as mentioned above. 

I think Draper is well suited to play alongside that type. He is more dynamic, physical and combative. This year has to be make or break with Polworth. He can develop into a team star this season, in a central role, if he really applies himself and has a positive attitude. There's no doubt he's got ability. Anything that's holding him back now is all on the mental side. I also think that if he thrives it will be hugely beneficial to Vigurs role in the team. No pressure then.

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The stats above make for intersting reading better all round player then tansey or draper is my interpratation but one stat missing would be km covered. However if you have the ball and can pass it to a teammate, why do you have to run aboot? Think sometimes he is singled out because we have all seen the range of clever touches/passes he can produce and expect it all the time. If we can keep him, I'm expecting this will be a big season for Iain at ICTFC. 

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ictchris    816

Vigurs got two assists last season, both in the last three games, both straight passes from central midfield to Alex Fisher.  Maybe if he has good targets he can be more productive in terms of attacking this season

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