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dougal

Unhealthy diets/poor fitness levels

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1 hour ago, AlexJones said:

What about Fartlek running? Doesn't that improve both power and endurance? Can't recall ever seeing any road runners in the sneck actually doing it, but supposedly much better for you than 'jogging'.

You are absolutely right Alex... apart from the bit about local roadrunners not doing it. :smile: There's fartlek running and also interval training which has largely the same effects which are too complex to bother about here. Both involve alternating periods of faster and slower running and the main difference is that interval running is more controlled in terms the durations of the efforts and recoveries while Fartlek is a bit more flexible and variable. Both these closely related formats also much more closely reproduce the kind of thing you would find in a football match compared with steady running. Around 30-40 minutes of fartlek or intervals on a couple of afternoons a week after morning technical work would certainly develop the kind of specific endurance you need for ball sports (well, maybe not bowls or cricket :lol:).

As far as road runners are concerned, a well balanced schedule will most certainly include a blend of steady running and variable pace stuff as described. Dozens of club runners do this - often in groups of up to 20 - so you may just not have been in the right places at the right times!

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Can anyone confirm the players had their DW membership revoked in favour of an Aquadome membership? It's surely a mistake if true, who would ever want to train there as a "professional"?

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1 hour ago, Northern_jaggie said:

Can anyone confirm the players had their DW membership revoked in favour of an Aquadome membership? It's surely a mistake if true, who would ever want to train there as a "professional"?

Do I detect a touch of snobbery there? Does it matter where you do your fitness training?

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10 hours ago, Northern_jaggie said:

Can anyone confirm the players had their DW membership revoked in favour of an Aquadome membership? It's surely a mistake if true, who would ever want to train there as a "professional"?

It's strange, then, that the Highland Institute Of Sport, which caters for the area's top performers, has its Strength and Conditioning suite at the Aquadome. Strange also that a number of international athletes of my acquaintance, possibly high fliers from other sports as well, use the Aquadome gym.

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As a former player well into my 30s I think it is a given that you have to be fit enough to be able to play for a full 90 minutes and more including being able to sprint in the last few minutes of a match. If you are blessed with fast twitch muscle it is a great advantage but that starts to go when you are in your early 30s though I know a number of former players who can still shift in their 40s. The other aspect is to react quickly to developing situations and not be lazy in that reaction as this can give you a second advantage, Dalgleish who was never quick and Durrant after his injury exemplified this ability to think more quickly than the top class players around them. I used to be a supporter of Vigurs and thought he provided much needed guile to a pedestrian team under Brewster. In those days he was a very mobile midfielder trying to impress. Today he is a luxury player who doesn't put in nearly enough work for the team and relies on his few inspirational moments to get picked, that is not what a team struggling in the championship needs, we need 11 workers including a midfield general a good winger a good finisher and a commanding centre back, think back to the Patterson years for what a decent championship team should look like.

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Imagine taking a potential player to Inverness to then show him the Aquadome as our training facility, he would struggle to see past the semi-amateur joggers! 

This is yet another example of lack of ambition here which highlights that our facilities are woeful and don't match that of an SPL club. This is not a dig at having "posher" gyms, for flips sake. 💁🏻‍♂️

Inverness does deserve a better centre of excellence for sport generally.  

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As far as I am aware, only Celtic, Rangers, Hibs and Hearts have dedicated training facilities which, I think, include gym facilities so we are not alone in this?. If the club arrange gym memberships for players then fine but doubt the players go as a squad to gym facilities. Far better to tailor gym requirements to the individual players and monitor performance thereafter.

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Aren't we supposed to be a community club?  If any players for our club think they shouldn't be working out along side those folk who pay their wages then they are a little too big for their boots IMHO.

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2 hours ago, Northern_jaggie said:

Imagine taking a potential player to Inverness to then show him the Aquadome as our training facility, he would struggle to see past the semi-amateur joggers! 

This is yet another example of lack of ambition here which highlights that our facilities are woeful and don't match that of an SPL club. This is not a dig at having "posher" gyms, for flips sake. 💁🏻‍♂️

Inverness does deserve a better centre of excellence for sport generally.  

A "potential player" at ICT would actually very likely be an inferior sporting species to a lot of individuals who train for a large number of sports at Inverness Sports Centre. It is way off the mark to assume that people who get paid for their sporting efforts are in some strange respect more talented than those who do not. It's just that, anomalously, football pays people way above their market value while most other sports do not.

I also think you are over estimating what a lot of leading Scottish clubs have as training facilities. Take for example Aberdeen who use an open public field beside Pittodrie which they can't always get due to school bookings etc. You also have to take into account that, apart from the Highland Institute strength and conditioning suite and a well equipped gym, compared with a private facility, Inverness Sports Centre also has more extensive pool facilities plus a running track and large areas of grass right on its doorstep.

And all of that is before you consider cost. The better equipped all-purpose Sports Centre is around £15 per month per person less expensive than a private facility.

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36 minutes ago, DoofersDad said:

Aren't we supposed to be a community club?  If any players for our club think they shouldn't be working out along side those folk who pay their wages then they are a little too big for their boots IMHO.

Good point well made. It could also be said that if Inverness Sports Centre is good enough for people training for Commonwealth Games, World Championships etc, it's certainly good enough for guys playing second tier Scottish football. Football sometimes needs a reality check with respect to the real world of sport which it often fails to understand is out there.

Edited by Charles Bannerman
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A fitness coach would be no bad thing - In times gone by I think the fittest teams we ever had was under Brewster who had them in for double sessions - what do they do now ?? I have no idea as I am not close enough to the action.

But reading reports and comments we seem to be running out of steam on more than one occasion, a fit team would probably get us better results

 

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37 minutes ago, Biggin said:

In times gone by I think the fittest teams we ever had was under Brewster who had them in for double sessions

I think you're right, Biggin. Brewster was extremely fitness conscious and set high standards for his players. If you don't have a day job alongside your sport, there is no reason why at least some of the days can't be used for double sessions, given the capacity for recovery that these requirements would still offer. Also, how many days a week, including game days, are full time footballers active? Six days a week is normal in many sports and some individuals even do seven, although the need for a recovery day can also be strongly argued for. As far as strength and conditioning in the gym is concerned, if this is not done a minimum of twice a week, the benefits are minimal.

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On 10 September 2017 at 6:33 AM, dougal said:

Reports all be it from Pie and Bovril that a well known Pizza company delivered en masse to the ICT coach before it departed on the long road north after the game

Ive also heard Ross County were quite shocked how bad Ross Drapers fitness levels when he arrived 

Could there be something in this? Hence the terrible start to the season and also it may explain the serious decline since the Scottish Cup Win

Ok most will blame Ridgers or Vigurs as they seem to be the scapegoats for yesterday but maybe the real problem is a lot deeper than that 

Dougal

 

 

Let's remind ourselves of the derided initial opening post

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I am not so sure that food is so important with a sportspersons performance

Some cricketers where notorious  for unhealthy lifestyles  , Ian Botham comes to mind , and we now have Stokes and Hales - not to forget George Best

Booze has always been a problem with sports people , the lure of nightclubs, The highlife , living it up.  Lots of sports personalities have , not really looked after their bodies, yet been supreme at what they do.

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It is important to take carbs or protein before and after a physical workout.Porridge or brose is a great slow release carb for endurance work which many of the everest climbers used. I can't see that a few beers and pasta or fish and chips after a game can hurt provided the leg and gym work has been done during the week.

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28 minutes ago, Laurence said:

I am not so sure that food is so important with a sportspersons performance

Some cricketers where notorious  for unhealthy lifestyles 

Laurence.... you have just signed up for the sporting equivalent of the Flat Earth Society! Then you have compounded the heresy by supporting your contention with the example of CRICKET! :crazy:

Once again, wynthank is pretty well on the case with the carbs and protein reference, although climbers are probably right at the far end of the endurance spectrum, given the very long duration and relatively low intensity (not these Olympic guys we've been seeing!) of what they do. For shorter endurance, in which I would include football, 10K running etc, I would still like to see stuff with smaller carbohydrate molecules - ie more sugary material.

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If that is all true perhaps we should sign up Usain Bolt and Mo Farah. Cant remember who pointed out but tactically Robbo is responsible for running the legs off Polly and Trafford, gave a headless chicken role to Baird, linked him up with the clumsy, pedestrian Oakley, whilst saving Tremarco and excusing Vigurs. Am I also wrong in saying that Brad McKay and Chalmers did minimal attacking at Dumbarton. It is a combination of fitness, skill level and tactics.

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On ‎28‎/‎09‎/‎2017 at 8:43 PM, Charles Bannerman said:

Laurence.... you have just signed up for the sporting equivalent of the Flat Earth Society! Then you have compounded the heresy by supporting your contention with the example of CRICKET! :crazy:

Once again, wynthank is pretty well on the case with the carbs and protein reference, although climbers are probably right at the far end of the endurance spectrum, given the very long duration and relatively low intensity (not these Olympic guys we've been seeing!) of what they do. For shorter endurance, in which I would include football, 10K running etc, I would still like to see stuff with smaller carbohydrate molecules - ie more sugary material.

I also mentioned George Best, who according to Harry Rednap had been out all night on the beer and scored a hat trick against West Ham having arrived late at the Old Trafford Ground.  Whether I am a philistine or a member of the flat earth society is irrelevant.  Another non trainer was said to be Gascoigne. Jimmy Greaves  also trained on beer  as did  many of the players of the time. Bobby Charlton once admitted he couldn't wait to have a fag at half time. 

There is no team apparently trained as much as Spurs. It is said that Spurs start losing in March and April every year  because the players are Knackered.   Paul McGrath Aston Villar Centre half  never trained  at all he had badaged knees all week then played on Saturday.  I know Charles I have been told you where a superb athlete in your University days , you are to be commended for that and I always read with interest your comments on fitness.  Do you have a down on cricket by any chance ,?

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13 minutes ago, Laurence said:

I also mentioned George Best, who according to Harry Rednap had been out all night on the beer and scored a hat trick against West Ham having arrived late at the Old Trafford Ground.  Whether I am a philistine or a member of the flat earth society is irrelevant.  Another non trainer was said to be Gascoigne. Jimmy Greaves  also trained on beer  as did  many of the players of the time. Bobby Charlton once admitted he couldn't wait to have a fag at half time. 

There is no team apparently trained as much as Spurs. It is said that Spurs start losing in March and April every year  because the players are Knackered.   Paul McGrath Aston Villar Centre half  never trained  at all he had badaged knees all week then played on Saturday.  I know Charles I have been told you where a superb athlete in your University days , you are to be commended for that and I always read with interest your comments on fitness.  Do you have a down on cricket by any chance ,?

You omitted to cite Alf Tupper in support of your argument.

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1 hour ago, Laurence said:

I know Charles I have been told you where a superb athlete in your University days, you are to be commended for that and I always read with interest your comments on fitness.  Do you have a down on cricket by any chance ?

Honestly, Laurence, I was never really all that good at all..... you are over-estimating me. I certainly went further in coaching athletics than as an athlete myself. Cricket? Twenty20 is hugely entertaining. One day cricket is fairly exciting as well. As for test cricket, George Bernard Shaw's comment that the game was invented by the English whilst in search of a concept of eternity applies. The "test" is to keep awake.

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Harping back to the football old days means nothing nowadays. The game was played at a snail's pace when George Best was at the height of his peak with Man United. Would these players drinking and smoking make it to the top level of today's game? I doubt it. 

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This may be a bit of a mad idea but...could the club develop the West area of the stadium & make it into a fitness centre for the players? Then open it up to the public (maybe just evenings/weekends when the team don't need it)? Discount for season ticket holders maybe!

Would be easier for the coaches to work with the players(1st team/youth team, whoever) more closely: eg, if they've specific things they need to work on? Could allow other local amateur teams to use it, of there's space)?

Wouldn't be a moneyspinner & perhaps overly ambitious, but would be a statement of intent on the ambition of the club.

Lots of issues re h & s (for example, would they need to employ a full-time coach to be present whenever the facilities were open)..but just an idea.

Also would fill in the west side of the stadium too...

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Brilliant idea in principle JM, but I could unfortunately foresee difficulties ranging from capital cost (especially after the ambitious shop project) to staffing (as you predict) and from location to ability to compete with Bannatynes, High Life, DW etc. But from a team point of view, I would have thought that a routine of: morning training - refuel with lunch - in-house strength and conditioning - snack to refuel - away home to lie down and rest.... would be ideal.

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4 hours ago, Charles Bannerman said:

Brilliant idea in principle JM, but I could unfortunately foresee difficulties ranging from capital cost (especially after the ambitious shop project) to staffing (as you predict) and from location to ability to compete with Bannatynes, High Life, DW etc. But from a team point of view, I would have thought that a routine of: morning training - refuel with lunch - in-house strength and conditioning - snack to refuel - away home to lie down and rest.... would be ideal.

I could see exactly those difficulties arising myself - just floating an idea. Not sure if it would ever make money, but like you say CB, it would be a great routine for the players.

Price-wise, it wouldn't be able to compete with HighLife (which is great value) or the likes of Bannantynes on facilities. 

Maybe it might work as a partnership with someone-even make it part of HighLife, in conjunction with Inverness Leisure - would fit in with the ethos of returning us to being a community club.

Just a thought....

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