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I would agree discipline is a big problem of Caley at the moment to me if they can sort that out and get a real striker who can score goals often to me Caley could possibly make the play-off stages.

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Don’t really know what to make of that. The guys were really comfortable in the first half  - playing some decent football without creating much. Doran was a breath of fresh air. Then the red card - first one for Vigurs was either for trying to trip the boy who Polworth eventually nailed (also for a yellow) or for dissent. The second was for a high boot, which was harsh. 2nd half was a bit backs to the wall without Livi really producing much. Austin was excellent when he came on and created a couple of good chances. Oakley worked hard, but was persistently fouled and got nothing from the ref at all. Glad that Raven got his moment with the fans at the end, but two points wasted because of a combination of shabby reffing and Vigurs’ indiscipline. 

Still in touch and, if that’s the standard, we can definitely get to the play-offs....but we need to keep 11 on the pitch!

Edited by PerfICT

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Ian Vigurs should hang his head in shame and learn to keep his mouth shut. Instead of talking about some sublime touches we are once again taking about his immature behaviour. He cost us two points today

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Have we set a club record for consecutive games (3) with one of our players being  sent off?

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Another terrible display from the officials. We were well in control of the game until the sending off. I thought it was harsh, but Vigures needs to control his mouth, picking up bookings for descent costs us big time. I thought we might hold on to the lead but not to be. I thought Doran, Donaldson, Warren played well and Austin had some good touches when he came on. If we can finish games with 11 men from now on, we might just make the play offs.

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I’m not sure what Vigurs first yellow was for. At the time I thought it was for an attempted tackle which the Livvi player skipped over. If so, it was hardly a reckless challenge - unlike Polworth’s and to me it seems he has been harshly treated. Prior to that incident there had been a couple of reckless tackles against us which went unpunished. There is just no consistency.

vigurs was superb before his dismissal and with him on the park I think we would have won comfortably.  

Nice to see Raven get a good send off, but TBH he was mince today.  Ridgers very solid again.  A sound performance from Warren.  Mulraney showed Polworth how to tackle.  Doran was excellent.  Austin looks like a great signing.

 

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Ten out of ten for commitment to all 14 players on the park today.

I've no idea what Vigurs was booked for. I think it was an attempted rash challenge which the ref played advantage to. The card was waved straight after Polworth s challenge, so he had no time to mouth off. Neither protested the bookings at the time which was medicated they were both deserved. The second booking was harsh as it was a fair ball to go for.

Until the sending off, we were on top, playing decent stuff and quite comfortable. After the goal, the defence did well, especially Mckay, Donaldson (who was carrying an injury for most of the game) and Warren. 

Mulraney was sacrificed at half time, with Calder slotting in at left back, then moved forward after Chalmers was injured and Raven came on. Trafford, Polworth and Calder all worked very hard to protect the defence, and the tactic of leaving two up eased the pressure also. Oakley worked hard, but never got any real breaks for the tough treatment he was getting. Doran took his goal well and also chased hard. Austin looked good when he came on.

Despite being down to 10, we had a couple of decent chances. A point blank attempt would have gone in if it had not been a clean contact, and Polworth came very close with a shot. Doran also hit the top of the bar in the first half, although it may have been a cross.

But for Vigurs harsh dismissal, I am confident we would have won. After the dismissal we did very well to nearly close the game out.

It was good that Raven could take a bow, albeit quite modestly, at full time too, and he was the sponsor's man of the match. I'd have picked Mckay myself, closely followed by Donaldson and Warren.

But as I said at the outset, all the players deserve plaudits for their work rate and commitment. We'd have lost that one earlier in the season.

Edited by Robert

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Vigurs is a frustrating character indeed. He is old enough to know that he has to keep himself squeaky clean when on a yellow. He cost us three points which pees me off as the two above us also drew today. :redcard:

At half time I said I would take a draw. A few months ago we would have caved in and got humped. Progress. 

Austin looked promising with a few neat touches. Baird has found his best position, ball boy, placing the ball at the corner flag for Polworth. 

Happier New Year. Getting somewhere - Rome wasn't built in a day. 

David Raven - Fair well and all the best. :ictscarf:

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So long as weak officials allow players and crowds to influence their decisions they will continue to be abused. You see it week in week out. The squeeky wheel gets the grease. As such, it wouldn't make any sense for a team to unilaterally desist from applying pressure to the referees. Your opponents would gain an edge over you. It's a prisoners dilema. In an ideal world 'sportsmanship' would actually matter, but sadly almost every manager in the country would rather lie, cheat and steal their way to 3 points than play 'the right way'. Vigurs needs to be more measured and streetwise in his choice of words, but 'keep his mouth shut'? Absolutely not. Both yellows were soft, perhaps even a little vindictive if you were being cynical.

Another good performance and decent point today (circumstances considered) against a bogey team. Man for man Livi are barely even a Championship level team but they're well organized and a tough nut to crack. We haven't had the rub of the green against them and should have taken 9 rather than 2 points from our 3 meetings. By the business end of the season I'd be very disappointed to be below them in the table. 
 
It's early doors but Austin looks like another excellent signing. Haven't looked at the stats but surely our first 11 must be one of the youngest in the 2 top leagues? To be challenging for the play offs with so many players in the early stages of their development bodes well. Certainly a group of players on the rise rather than in decline. If we can keep this team together they'll be challenging for Top 6 SPL and later stages of Cups within a few years.

Edited by AlexJones
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A thoroughly enjoyable game. As my first look at this team, I came away very impressed. Our league position is false. I was expecting a tough game from Livvy, but not in the way they planned it. That is to say, I expected a good test from the 3rd placed team in terms of football, but all we got from them was physical challenges, fouls, obstruction and blocks. They didn't offer any convincing goal threats, and were set up to park the bus and try to pick up some breaks. For the first twenty minutes we completely outclassed them, bursting forward with waves of attacks, intelligent passing and movement. Doran was at the heart of many of those, and was very unlucky not to make it two with a lovely chip over the keeper which came off the bar. With the dominance we had it was a shame we couldn't get the second we merited. Oakley deserved his place, but was constantly harried and obstructed in a very frustrating way, which was clearly part of their game plan, and so found it very difficult.

The turning point was obviously the sending off, and it was the first utterly needless yellow which led to it. The second was hard to tell with the stramash in the box, but the Livvy defender went down like he had been poleaxed, so another bit of cunning play from them. But even though we expected a second half blitz, they couldn't even manage that, and in fact we had the better chances to make it two, some neat interplay again, a fizzing header cleared off the line. Their goal was always on the cards with an extra man, but the altercation which led to the free kick from which they scored looked like an absurd piece of amateur dramatics. So, even though they spurned a great chance at the death, they were fortunate to get a point, such was the lack of ideas they had, and we very nearly got three points with ten men once again.

The highlight was seeing our new boy, Austin, who was fantastic as soon as he came on. Wanting the ball all the time, when he got it, he wriggled through two or three defenders more than once, and curled a lovely shot saved by the keeper. If he can keep this up, he and Doran will score goals, absolutely no doubt. Very exciting to see we might have a real prospect on our hands.

Overall there was no doubt whatsoever who was the better team. As I said to my mates, this was the best football I have seen us play in a long time, and in particular is a long way better than anything Foran ever served up. Instead of that disjointed, jumbled mess, we had a team who passed the ball creatively and intelligently, ran into spaces, were compact, organised and positionally sound. We can take loads of positives from today, not least as good as two new players, Doran and Austin, who will have lots to contribute this half of the season. There is no reason we can't be in the playoffs, and although I wasn't expecting anything from St Mirren on Saturday, we can go there and give them a real game on this evidence.

The only fly in the ointment was Neil McCann being at the game, who was clearly there not for a day off, but to run the rule on any players he can poach off us. So get lost, Neil.

We are on the way back. But best of all, playing the kind of football we have always played at our best. Well done, Robbo.

Edited by The Long Man
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I assumed McCann was there to see us in action before the cup tie on the 20th.

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24 minutes ago, The Long Man said:

A thoroughly enjoyable game. As my first look at this team, I came away very impressed. Our league position is false. I was expecting a tough game from Livvy, but not in the way they planned it. That is to say, I expected a good test from the 3rd placed team in terms of football, but all we got from them was physical challenges, fouls, obstruction and blocks. They didn't offer any convincing goal threats, and were set up to park the bus and try to pick up some breaks. For the first twenty minutes we completely outclassed them, bursting forward with waves of attacks, intelligent passing and movement. Doran was at the heart of many of those, and was very unlucky not to make it two with a lovely chip over the keeper which came off the bar. With the dominance we had it was a shame we couldn't get the second we merited. Oakley deserved his place, but was constantly harried and obstructed in a very frustrating way, which was clearly part of their game plan, and so found it very difficult.

The turning point was obviously the sending off, and it was the first utterly needless yellow which led to it. The second was hard to tell with the stramash in the box, but the Livvy defender went down like he had been poleaxed, so another bit of cunning play from them. But even though we expected a second half blitz, they couldn't even manage that, and in fact we had the better chances to make it two, some neat interplay again, a fizzing header cleared off the line. Their goal was always on the cards with an extra man, but the altercation which led to the free kick from which they scored looked like an absurd piece of amateur dramatics. So, even though they spurned a great chance at the death, they were fortunate to get a point, such was the lack of ideas they had, and we very nearly got three points with ten men once again.

The highlight was seeing our new boy, Austin, who was fantastic as soon as he came on. Wanting the ball all the time, when he got it, he wriggled through two or three defenders more than once, and curled a lovely shot saved by the keeper. If he can keep this up, he and Doran will score goals, absolutely no doubt. Very exciting to see we might have a real prospect on our hands.

Overall there was no doubt whatsoever who was the better team. As I said to my mates, this was the best football I have seen us play in a long time, and in particular is a long way better than anything Foran ever served up. Instead of that disjointed, jumbled mess, we had a team who passed the ball creatively and intelligently, ran into spaces, were compact, organised and positionally sound. We can take loads of positives from today, not least as good as two new players, Doran and Austin, who will have lots to contribute this half of the season. There is no reason we can't be in the playoffs, and although I wasn't expecting anything from St Mirren on Saturday, we can go there and give them a real game on this evidence.

The only fly in the ointment was Neil McCann being at the game, who was clearly there not for a day off, but to run the rule on any players he can poach off us. So get lost, Neil.

We are on the way back. But best of all, playing the kind of football we have always played at our best. Well done, Robbo.

Well said Long Man, we should have won the game and as others have said on the thread the one that let the team down today was Ian Vigers who should be setting and example to the youngsters in the team!

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16 minutes ago, IBM said:

Well said Long Man, we should have won the game and as others have said on the thread the one that let the team down today was Ian Vigers who should be setting and example to the youngsters in the team!

I think posters are split on this. I didn't think he deserved two yellows and the ref took the easy option. I want to see the first one again, as it was right in front of me and, as I said earlier, I think it could only have been for a challenge which the ref played advantage at. I followed the ball and saw Polly's tackle, immediately followed by the two bookings.

I know he picks up too many bookings, but I'm not blaming him today.

We play better when he is in the side.

Edited by Robert
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45 minutes ago, The Long Man said:

A thoroughly enjoyable game......etc

A really enjoyable read, a very fair assessment filled with hope and positivity,

No place for that kind of talk on this forum. :redcard::crazy:  

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Tremarco at half time said he got the second yellow as the ref was waiting for him to mess up after mouthing off at him at his first yellow card.  I would have given Donaldson man of the match today he was everywhere in defence midfield and up front. The ref showed no consistency and when the livi player dived in his own box after a non challenge from Doran and that was a 10 put of 10 dive the ref have a foul against us whereas on Saturday Bell gets taken put by two players and is booked for diving. Raven was picked by the sponsors 6 year old son for man of the match and afterwards apologised to everyone in the press and journal lounge for giving away the goal.  A constant professional to us even after the way he was treated. You will be missed Mr Raven 

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7 minutes ago, MorayJaggie said:

 A constant professional to us even after the way he was treated. You will be missed Mr Raven 

That's very true. I wish him all the best. I hope he gets a decent package at a club close to home so he can settle with his family.

Thanks for the commitment and, especially, the memories Dave! I will never forget the winner in the cup semi and the sheer look of delight and astonishment on his face in the celebration.

 

Edited by Robert

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I've just looked at the BBC sport website and the match stats for today' game 57% to Livingston seriously what game were they watching. But it gets better Livingston held us to a one one draw since we played the majority of the match with ten men. The reporter must have been watching the same match as the officials. 

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Just read the ICTFC Twitter feed, it says Vigurs' first yellow was for a jersey pull and the ref played advantage. They also say there are photos showing Vigurs made no contact at the second yellow.

 

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36 minutes ago, Robert said:

I think posters are split on this. I didn't think he deserved two yellows and the ref took the easy option. I want to see the first one again, as it was right in front of me and, as I said earlier, I think it could only have been for a challenge which the ref played advantage at. I followed the ball and saw Polly's tackle, immediately followed by the two bookings.

I know he picks up too many bookings, but I'm not blaming him today.

We play better when he is in the side.

It was not me who gave you a red arrow Robert although I disagree on that point.  Vigers is a very good player but he needs to know what NOT to say to the ref as he will not win against them.

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1 minute ago, Robert said:

Just read the ICTFC Twitter feed, it says Vigurs' first yellow was for a jersey pull and the ref played advantage. They also say there are photos showing Vigurs made no contact at the second yellow.

 

I hope we can see it when they show the highlights.

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2 hours ago, AlexJones said:

To be challenging for the play offs with so many players in the early stages of their development bodes well. Certainly a group of players on the rise rather than in decline. If we can keep this team together they'll be challenging for Top 6 SPL and later stages of Cups within a few years.

I wouldn't disagree with you there Alex - seems like we have the makings of good, solid and well balanced squad who could take us back to where we were. Here's hoping...

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Can't appeal two yellow cards. Amazing how vigurs got a yellow yet Oakley was getting undressed by the whole livi defence every time a ball was played to him. The referee was poor that's basically the game in a nutshell.

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21 minutes ago, IBM said:

It was not me who gave you a red arrow Robert although I disagree on that point.  Vigers is a very good player but he needs to know what NOT to say to the ref as he will not win against them.

Red arrows don't worry me: we are all entitled to our views.

I agree with you: talking your way to a booking is unacceptable, but I really don't believe he did that today, and if the twitter feed is right that backs up my initial view.

I just hope the highlights are extensive enough to let us see the incidents again.

But we would have caved in if that game was early in the season, so it shows how the ship is steadied. Hopefully the play offs are a realistic target.

Tongue in cheek, we might start flying when we keep 11 on the park for 90 minutes!

Is that seven red cards now? Seedorf, Warren, Trafford, Vigurs, Raven, Tremarco and now Vigurs again?

Edited by Robert

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It was for a shirt pull his first yellow not dissent. Seriously a shirt pull after the livi defence used Oakleys shirt like a handrail on a set of stairs.

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