Roy McBain

[Alex MacLeod]

At 36, not involved in coaching and usually, at best, an unused substitute, do you think McBain's got a future at ICT under Butcher, Alex?

It is in the Rumour Mill but it seems a pretty decent shout to me.

Personally, no I dont think he has a future at ICT under Butcher or anyone else. As you say he's 36. I doubt very much that he can be kept in a coaching role. The club couldn't afford it. The bit that always annoys me is that its always the club that get the blame. It was ICT's fault when Blackie went for 3 times what we could pay him. It was ICT's fault when Cowie went, when Rankin went and when many others went through the years to try and better their career's. Many people harp on about how the club failed to cash in by not giving those players longer deals. Nobody ever stopped to think that maybe the players themselves wanted short deals because they intended to move anyway and didn't want to run the risk of being held back by contracts.

Footballers move on. They get too old. They fail to fit in to particular styles and systems. They fall out with managers. Thats the nature of the game and the way of every club. Surviving in the football league means being ruthless about how you go about your business. Every club needs to have that streak. There's no room for sentiment.

[stevico1]

At 36, not involved in coaching and usually, at best, an unused substitute, do you think McBain's got a future at ICT under Butcher, Alex?

It is in the Rumour Mill but it seems a pretty decent shout to me.

Personally, no I dont think he has a future at ICT under Butcher or anyone else. As you say he's 36. I doubt very much that he can be kept in a coaching role. The club couldn't afford it. The bit that always annoys me is that its always the club that get the blame. It was ICT's fault when Blackie went for 3 times what we could pay him. It was ICT's fault when Cowie went, when Rankin went and when many others went through the years to try and better their career's. Many people harp on about how the club failed to cash in by not giving those players longer deals. Nobody ever stopped to think that maybe the players themselves wanted short deals because they intended to move anyway and didn't want to run the risk of being held back by contracts.

Footballers move on. They get too old. They fail to fit in to particular styles and systems. They fall out with managers. Thats the nature of the game and the way of every club. Surviving in the football league means being ruthless about how you go about your business. Every club needs to have that streak. There's no room for sentiment.

Alex I am sorry but I have to totally disagree with you the club never even bothered to speak to Blackie about a new contract until it was to late, the club pushed out Rankin, the club pushed out Ritchie Hart, Barry Wilson the list goes on. How come we are the only club that never sells a player for what his is worth, because they are never on long enough contracts thats why.

After a month or so into Cowies career at ICT was it not obvious he was a player, why wasn't he offered a long term deal then?

The only time we have managed to sell a player for a decent amount of cash they have mucked up as well

Edited January 14, 2010 by stevico1

[Sorted]

At 36, not involved in coaching and usually, at best, an unused substitute, do you think McBain's got a future at ICT under Butcher, Alex?

It is in the Rumour Mill but it seems a pretty decent shout to me.

Personally, no I dont think he has a future at ICT under Butcher or anyone else. As you say he's 36. I doubt very much that he can be kept in a coaching role. The club couldn't afford it. The bit that always annoys me is that its always the club that get the blame. It was ICT's fault when Blackie went for 3 times what we could pay him. It was ICT's fault when Cowie went, when Rankin went and when many others went through the years to try and better their career's. Many people harp on about how the club failed to cash in by not giving those players longer deals. Nobody ever stopped to think that maybe the players themselves wanted short deals because they intended to move anyway and didn't want to run the risk of being held back by contracts.

Footballers move on. They get too old. They fail to fit in to particular styles and systems. They fall out with managers. Thats the nature of the game and the way of every club. Surviving in the football league means being ruthless about how you go about your business. Every club needs to have that streak. There's no room for sentiment.

Alex, it's pretty clear to me that your above post answers the question you pose me in your previous post and makes it clear that you agree with me despite doing your best to disagree.

[Alex MacLeod]

At 36, not involved in coaching and usually, at best, an unused substitute, do you think McBain's got a future at ICT under Butcher, Alex?

It is in the Rumour Mill but it seems a pretty decent shout to me.

Personally, no I dont think he has a future at ICT under Butcher or anyone else. As you say he's 36. I doubt very much that he can be kept in a coaching role. The club couldn't afford it. The bit that always annoys me is that its always the club that get the blame. It was ICT's fault when Blackie went for 3 times what we could pay him. It was ICT's fault when Cowie went, when Rankin went and when many others went through the years to try and better their career's. Many people harp on about how the club failed to cash in by not giving those players longer deals. Nobody ever stopped to think that maybe the players themselves wanted short deals because they intended to move anyway and didn't want to run the risk of being held back by contracts.

Footballers move on. They get too old. They fail to fit in to particular styles and systems. They fall out with managers. Thats the nature of the game and the way of every club. Surviving in the football league means being ruthless about how you go about your business. Every club needs to have that streak. There's no room for sentiment.

Alex I am sorry but I have to totally disagree with you the club never even bothered to speak to Blackie about a new contract until it was to late, the club pushed out Rankin, the club pushed out Ritchie Hart, Barry Wilson the list goes on. How come we are the only club that never sells a player for what his is worth, because they are never on long enough contracts thats why.

After a month or so into Cowies career at ICT was it not obvious he was a player, why wasn't he offered a long term deal then?

The only time we have managed to sell a player for a decent amount of cash they have mucked up as well

I think it could be said that fans with high and mighty moral standings were the ones who pushed Hart out.

[Scotty]

Personally, no I dont think he has a future at ICT under Butcher or anyone else. As you say he's 36. I doubt very much that he can be kept in a coaching role. The club couldn't afford it.

The bit that always annoys me is that its always the club that get the blame. It was ICT's fault when Blackie went for 3 times what we could pay him. It was ICT's fault when Cowie went, when Rankin went and when many others went through the years to try and better their career's. Many people harp on about how the club failed to cash in by not giving those players longer deals. Nobody ever stopped to think that maybe the players themselves wanted short deals because they intended to move anyway and didn't want to run the risk of being held back by contracts.

Footballers move on. They get too old. They fail to fit in to particular styles and systems. They fall out with managers. Thats the nature of the game and the way of every club. Surviving in the football league means being ruthless about how you go about your business. Every club needs to have that streak. There's no room for sentiment.

Alex I am sorry but I have to totally disagree with you the club never even bothered to speak to Blackie about a new contract until it was to late, the club pushed out Rankin, the club pushed out Ritchie Hart, Barry Wilson the list goes on. How come we are the only club that never sells a player for what his is worth, because they are never on long enough contracts thats why.

After a month or so into Cowies career at ICT was it not obvious he was a player, why wasn't he offered a long term deal then?

The only time we have managed to sell a player for a decent amount of cash they have mucked up as well

I tend to agree more with Stevico than Alex on this one. At the risk of dragging this thread off-topic as my comment is not only about McBain but others too, I will just say that when it comes to contracts I think ICT have got more wrong than right over recent years and many decisions have been based on egos or revenge for perceived slights rather than footballing skill or contribution.

First the good - I commented to someone in a PM the other day that I was pleasantly surprised that ICT had been sensible enough to build in a sell-on clause when agreeing Robson's transfer to Dundee Utd. That was a good bit of business.

Now the rest ..... There have been a few players "pushed out" over the years and two prime examples were Mike Teasdale and Bobby Mann.

Mike was coming to the end of his playing career - much like Roy - but still had a season or two left in him IMHO, the club basically let his contract expire and didnt offer him anything. I remember talking with him in something like February or March of his last season and he had heard nothing from the club whatsoever. Very classy behaviour from the suits when you are trying to support your family, pay a mortgage and all the other stuff that we all rely on our wages to get done. I also think the club missed the boat with Mike too as he could easily have lasted another season or two and could even have combined his playing role with an off-field fan liaison / PR kind of gig. He was always the one trotted out for the media or to fan events as he was personable and had a rapport with them/us. The club PR has always been abysmal, mainly because no-one has ever done it seriously. Bill trots out a press release here and there when asked to but no-one is there day to day promoting what the club does or issuing 'feelgood' stories when required. Mike could easily have done that.

In the case of Bobby, he was enjoying ICT and his biggest issue was not money (as it has been made out to be) but being able to organise his family time. He had just become a father and it was not practical for his wife to transfer jobs to Inverness because as a policewoman she could be posted anywhere within Northern Constabulary and end up further away from him than before. He just wanted a bit of a better deal and some leeway to have a bit more family time .... the club werent interested (allegedly) so he played his heart out to the end of the season, thoroughly enjoyed our championship win and then left the club with his head held high. We filled that void with Dods but since Dods went too, I think we can safely say that no-one else has come close to filling Bobby's boots !

If you look at more recent times, Black is a good example. He may well have gone to Hearts in the end anyway but on more than one occasion he said he was happy to talk about a contract but nothing happened. Perhaps he was too friendly with certain people and therefore persona non grata? Rankin was pushed out. The guy had just bought a house and then told he was surplus to requirements! Barry Wilson is another. He falls into the same category as Roy, an aging player who may or may not have something to give the club, he was unceremoniously dumped. I know football is a game with very little sentiment but in the case of players like Roy or Barry, there is a way to do things and a way not to do it ! Lets not even go into any details about Marius as we have done that one a million times !

I would disagree slightly regarding Hart. He was indeed pushed out the door but that was more to do with his criminal conviction than anything else. This one was a no win situation. A good player but in this one the club is damned if they do and damned if they dont with supporters wanting to get rid of him or keep him in equal measure. In the end, the "family club" ethos that the club still likes to think they have, but lost many years ago won out and we know he is doing well at Dens. I dont like what he did but it wasnt exactly mass murder so good luck to the guy, I enjoyed his style of play.

One thing that constantly frustrates and annoys me though - and this is not about any particular player - is that when it comes to contracts and extensions we just dont seem to get it, and whats more, we never have.

In early December there were press stories every few days about County getting their first teamers signed up on new or extended contracts. Not sure how many they have out of contract at the end of the season but by the time the window opened I think they had 5 or 6 of them tied up on new deals. In LongmanLand however, we cant even offer players a deal "because we dont know what division we will be in" ??? what utter rollocks !!! You offer them a deal that is commensurate with what they are worth in the division we are in now and build in a promotion wage rise or some kind of arrangement that allows the player to renegotiate if we get promoted. Sure, the players might reject that offer and look elsewhere but in this day and age where many teams are skint and a lucrative transfer is not assured, quite a few might be happy to settle for a decent deal and job security (until they are pushed out or discarded). If you manage to re-sign a few then each signing is a good news story and if certain players reject a decent offer (rather than a derisory one) you can either offer a little more or quite legitimately respond to fan criticism by saying that it was the player who rejected the deal ... either way, the club dont look like the ones who are the inept ones.

[DALNEIGHCALEY]

Got to disagree with you scotty re the way our " family " club treated Richie , a family would support one of their own in such a situation not throw them out .

[staggy4life]

In early December there were press stories every few days about County getting their first teamers signed up on new or extended contracts. Not sure how many they have out of contract at the end of the season but by the time the window opened I think they had 5 or 6 of them tied up on new deals. In LongmanLand however, we cant even offer players a deal "because we dont know what division we will be in" ??? what utter rollocks !!! You offer them a deal that is commensurate with what they are worth in the division we are in now and build in a promotion wage rise or some kind of arrangement that allows the player to renegotiate if we get promoted. Sure, the players might reject that offer and look elsewhere but in this day and age where many teams are skint and a lucrative transfer is not assured, quite a few might be happy to settle for a decent deal and job security (until they are pushed out or discarded). If you manage to re-sign a few then each signing is a good news story and if certain players reject a decent offer (rather than a derisory one) you can either offer a little more or quite legitimately respond to fan criticism by saying that it was the player who rejected the deal ... either way, the club dont look like the ones who are the inept ones.

We have signed 8 to new 2-year deals with one, Michael McGovern still thinking about it as a few SPL clubs are interested.

[Scotty]

Got to disagree with you scotty re the way our " family " club treated Richie , a family would support one of their own in such a situation not throw them out .

you misunderstand me ..... I was meaning that the whole ethos of ICT as a "family club" and therefore his position as a "role model" for kids etc was used to substantiate the zero tolerance attitude that pushed him out. It has nothing to do with what a "family" could or should do.

Quite honestly I am still undecided on this one. Ask me one day and I would say I would like him still to be at ICT (getting support from his family as you say), but ask me on another and I would say he made a mistake and this was the consequence of it because the club, being a "family club" has a zero tolerance policy. As you can see, on either point I could use the "family" tag to make my argument.

On a purely footballing basis, I would prefer him to still be at ICT but I dont think he is a good example to use if we are talking about this player or that player being pushed out as his case is more complicated.

[Georgeios]

scotty the "What Div we'd be playing in" We dont want to be paying 1St Div Wages in the 3rd..(I cant find it but tounge in cheek face)

[stevico1]

Got to disagree with you scotty re the way our " family " club treated Richie , a family would support one of their own in such a situation not throw them out .

you misunderstand me ..... I was meaning that the whole ethos of ICT as a "family club" and therefore his position as a "role model" for kids etc was used to substantiate the zero tolerance attitude that pushed him out. It has nothing to do with what a "family" could or should do.

Quite honestly I am still undecided on this one. Ask me one day and I would say I would like him still to be at ICT (getting support from his family as you say), but ask me on another and I would say he made a mistake and this was the consequence of it because the club, being a "family club" has a zero tolerance policy. As you can see, on either point I could use the "family" tag to make my argument.

On a purely footballing basis, I would prefer him to still be at ICT but I dont think he is a good example to use if we are talking about this player or that player being pushed out as his case is more complicated.

I agree Hart was probably a bad example and probably a whole different discussion,

[Hearach]

If Roy has signed contract with Stenhousemuir will he be eligible to play for them in the cup? :angry:

[Council Juice]

It seems crazy to have given a 35 year old a new contract and then barely use him over the course of the season (thus far) He is exactly the experienced cool head we need in midfield.

Then when you had the likes of a promising player in Vigurs not being offered a deal it's even more baffling.

Then we have the likes of previous long term servants such as Wyness, offered a contract then having it taken away. Wilson- completely ignored by a manager who had previously discredited him in his previous spell.

Ian Black - given no encouragement by the manager that he was wanted and made to train with under 19s without any real explanation

John Rankin- Told he could leave the when he pretty much secured Brewster his manager of the month begged to stay. Had aparrently just bought a house in Inverness so was wanting to stay.

I'd hate to think how the club are going to treat Munro and Tokely.

[caleyboy]

And I wonder who's to blame for all this?

[tm4tj]

pele is god............well he started the thread.

[TopSix]

I rate McBain. I think that he if he had a part to play in our season so far we would be sitting higher in the league. I would love to know why TB doesn't even have him on the bench.

[Scotty]

Roy - like Denzil - is another one of these "confidence" players and when he has it, he can be excellent. Sadly, he is not getting a chance so I would guess his confidence is (quite understandably) shot. Agree with the posters that say his experience is something we may be overlooking in terms of having an impact to our season. Like Barry before him, he is likely not a 90 minute player any more but he does, or could, have a role to play for us if given his chance

[L_G]

I have to say that the little I have seen of Roy this season has been impressive. He seems to have kept himself really fit and covers almost every inch of the park. He clearly doesn't fit into Terry Butchers game plan and I know that Roy (like Dennis and others before him) is absolutely devastated at not even making the bench most weeks.

My concern about letting him go is that I'm as certain as I can be that we will have Robbo and Barry on board in the managerial role in the not too distant future. (end of the season at the latest) It's a shame if they come in and we have no team. Bearing in mind most of our players are out of contract at the end of the season and may not wait until then before committing their future elsewhere.

Like others I am quite concerned for the future of our club.

[AJS]

I have to say that the little I have seen of Roy this season has been impressive. He seems to have kept himself really fit and covers almost every inch of the park. He clearly doesn't fit into Terry Butchers game plan and I know that Roy (like Dennis and others before him) is absolutely devastated at not even making the bench most weeks.

My concern about letting him go is that I'm as certain as I can be that we will have Robbo and Barry on board in the managerial role in the not too distant future. (end of the season at the latest) It's a shame if they come in and we have no team. Bearing in mind most of our players are out of contract at the end of the season and may not wait until then before committing their future elsewhere.

Like others I am quite concerned for the future of our club.

I could not agree more. As a fan i do worry where we will be next season as well as which players we will have. I do wonder if all the uncertainty has affected some of the players at all.

I also have a feeling that Robbo and Bazza will be our next managerial team.

[Stevie]

As I've mentioned before, I am both staggered and annoyed that McBain isn't in the team.

He is a proven player, a player who can easily hold his own in the PREMIER LEAGUE.

Okay, managers have plans and want to do their own thing. No offence intended but

I think Roy must be desperately disappointed that he's getting overlooked for the likes of

Stratford and Eagle.

[Georgeios]

L_G, To be honest the prospect of losing some names and getting in a new management team to be honest exsites me more than getting back in the the SPL and prolonging the agony that is "fighting for a top six" finish and out constant money money money, when if at the end of the season we only really have players willing to sick around and then starting to build for me sounds fantastic!!

on topic with Roy on board for this would be priceless with his exsperiance and basic love for our club... its a shame the club dont feel the same way by showing the old school boys some respect......

[Renegade]

My concern about letting him go is that I'm as certain as I can be that we will have Robbo and Barry on board in the managerial role in the not too distant future. (end of the season at the latest) It's a shame if they come in and we have no team. Bearing in mind most of our players are out of contract at the end of the season and may not wait until then before committing their future elsewhere.

What makes you so sure of that? From what I can tell, he'd be the one of the least likely of the inevitable main candidates, mainly because his supposed dislike of by Sutherland.

[Guest Mahonio]

I have to say that the little I have seen of Roy this season has been impressive. He seems to have kept himself really fit and covers almost every inch of the park. He clearly doesn't fit into Terry Butchers game plan and I know that Roy (like Dennis and others before him) is absolutely devastated at not even making the bench most weeks.

My concern about letting him go is that I'm as certain as I can be that we will have Robbo and Barry on board in the managerial role in the not too distant future. (end of the season at the latest) It's a shame if they come in and we have no team. Bearing in mind most of our players are out of contract at the end of the season and may not wait until then before committing their future elsewhere.

Like others I am quite concerned for the future of our club.

I could not agree more. As a fan i do worry where we will be next season as well as which players we will have. I do wonder if all the uncertainty has affected some of the players at all.

I also have a feeling that Robbo and Bazza will be our next managerial team.

If this was our new management team, would you be happy because i cannot tell if you would be happy or not because i know i would be DELIGHTED if it was but i am not sure if it will happen though?

[AJS]

I have to say that the little I have seen of Roy this season has been impressive. He seems to have kept himself really fit and covers almost every inch of the park. He clearly doesn't fit into Terry Butchers game plan and I know that Roy (like Dennis and others before him) is absolutely devastated at not even making the bench most weeks.

My concern about letting him go is that I'm as certain as I can be that we will have Robbo and Barry on board in the managerial role in the not too distant future. (end of the season at the latest) It's a shame if they come in and we have no team. Bearing in mind most of our players are out of contract at the end of the season and may not wait until then before committing their future elsewhere.

Like others I am quite concerned for the future of our club.

I could not agree more. As a fan i do worry where we will be next season as well as which players we will have. I do wonder if all the uncertainty has affected some of the players at all.

I also have a feeling that Robbo and Bazza will be our next managerial team.

If this was our new management team, would you be happy because i cannot tell if you would be happy or not because i know i would be DELIGHTED if it was but i am not sure if it will happen though?

I certainly wouldn't object to it. In the two of them we have 2 guys who love the club, love the city and know the lower leagues and im sure would relish the challenge of getting us back to the promised land. Don't get me wrong i think TB is a good guy and has done the best he can but i really don't see him staying on after the season.

[Guest Mahonio]

I have to say that the little I have seen of Roy this season has been impressive. He seems to have kept himself really fit and covers almost every inch of the park. He clearly doesn't fit into Terry Butchers game plan and I know that Roy (like Dennis and others before him) is absolutely devastated at not even making the bench most weeks.

My concern about letting him go is that I'm as certain as I can be that we will have Robbo and Barry on board in the managerial role in the not too distant future. (end of the season at the latest) It's a shame if they come in and we have no team. Bearing in mind most of our players are out of contract at the end of the season and may not wait until then before committing their future elsewhere.

Like others I am quite concerned for the future of our club.

I could not agree more. As a fan i do worry where we will be next season as well as which players we will have. I do wonder if all the uncertainty has affected some of the players at all.

I also have a feeling that Robbo and Bazza will be our next managerial team.

If this was our new management team, would you be happy because i cannot tell if you would be happy or not because i know i would be DELIGHTED if it was but i am not sure if it will happen though?

I certainly wouldn't object to it. In the two of them we have 2 guys who love the club, love the city and know the lower leagues and im sure would relish the challenge of getting us back to the promised land. Don't get me wrong i think TB is a good guy and has done the best he can but i really don't see him staying on after the season.

I agree with you on the bit i put in bold but to be honest do you think our board will employ Robbo or even consider him and wouldn't Robbo want Shearer (not sure if he was Robbo's assistant) as his right hand man?

[AJS]

I have to say that the little I have seen of Roy this season has been impressive. He seems to have kept himself really fit and covers almost every inch of the park. He clearly doesn't fit into Terry Butchers game plan and I know that Roy (like Dennis and others before him) is absolutely devastated at not even making the bench most weeks.

My concern about letting him go is that I'm as certain as I can be that we will have Robbo and Barry on board in the managerial role in the not too distant future. (end of the season at the latest) It's a shame if they come in and we have no team. Bearing in mind most of our players are out of contract at the end of the season and may not wait until then before committing their future elsewhere.

Like others I am quite concerned for the future of our club.

I could not agree more. As a fan i do worry where we will be next season as well as which players we will have. I do wonder if all the uncertainty has affected some of the players at all.

I also have a feeling that Robbo and Bazza will be our next managerial team.

If this was our new management team, would you be happy because i cannot tell if you would be happy or not because i know i would be DELIGHTED if it was but i am not sure if it will happen though?

I certainly wouldn't object to it. In the two of them we have 2 guys who love the club, love the city and know the lower leagues and im sure would relish the challenge of getting us back to the promised land. Don't get me wrong i think TB is a good guy and has done the best he can but i really don't see him staying on after the season.

I agree with you on the bit i put in bold but to be honest do you think our board will employ Robbo or even consider him and wouldn't Robbo want Shearer (not sure if he was Robbo's assistant) as his right hand man?

Financial limitations may make it a comprimise to go for him. And no i think Barry will be his number 2. Just a hunch.