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Dangerous Driving!


Joonya

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I always wonder though slightly off topic how men are portrayed with driving. The headlines for that case seemed to be soft etc however, if the driving situation was reversed would they have been so kind?

I think with driving men and women should not be grouped, either sex can be dangerous behind the wheel.

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The two persons in the car had been friends for many years and were both, I'm led to believe, grieving the loss of the boyfriend. Has it crossed anyone elses mind that this may not have been an accident and that no laws would have prevented it.

Whilst I can see where you're going and also the reasoning behind it, I think we have to be careful about speculating too much. I'm not saying you're wrong but as there has been nothing released to point toward this theory, I just don't know if we should be going there. Either way it is a sad waste of life.

The point I'm trying to make is that, with two or three people getting their knickers in a twist about whether or not the lass was legally driving, legality was the last thing to cross my mind. My statement was not one of speculating. It was a sharing of a thought that had crossed my mind.

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  • 4 weeks later...

I will say that if you find the roads frightening in a car, try communting every day by push bike. It's utterly terrifying. It gives you a real appreciation for the lack of skill that some drivers display, as well as lack of manners and an unhealthy aggression towards other legitimate road users. I've had drivers spit at me, drive their cars at me, shout, bawl & swear at me. Mention the highway code and they go ballistic. I have no doubt that many of them are sane and rational people who undergo an incredible transformation of personality when they get in a car. Scary.

I've been whacked of my bike by someone jumping out at lights and threatened more times than I can remember. It genuinely annoys people if your cycling on the road. However, they HATE it if your on the pavements as well.

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There's plenty of cyclists out there who are totally oblivious to the rules of the road and/or choose to ignore them and get themselves into bother as well.

I would go so far as saying that I see more cyclists ignoring traffic lights (especially at crossings) than I see adhering to them...how more of them don't get flattened coming off the bridge and heading up Bridge St (and vice versa) is beyond me. Also worth noting that they totally ignore the cycle lane areas marked out for them in these locations.

You then get the ones who pass parked cars on their side of the road and give you the finger because you dared follow your right of way coming in the other direction.

Whilst I do have some sympathy for those on bicycles, they don't do themselves too many favours and, in my experience, bring a lot of the hassle they get upon themselves.

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I most definitely go through more Red lights than don't, it's just so much quicker. I put it on the same level as people crossing the road when the green man isn't there.

Well sorry to disappoint you but it is not the same as crossing on a red man as what you are doing is against the law, and therefore you have every right to be stopped and fined.

Cyclists who do as they please is one thing that really ticks me off big style. These people moan about drivers not giving them space or attempting to knock them over but they seem to forget when it is them in the wrong. If you decide to cycle on the road then try adhering to the rules of the road.

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I will say that if you find the roads frightening in a car, try communting every day by push bike. It's utterly terrifying. It gives you a real appreciation for the lack of skill that some drivers display, as well as lack of manners and an unhealthy aggression towards other legitimate road users. I've had drivers spit at me, drive their cars at me, shout, bawl & swear at me. Mention the highway code and they go ballistic. I have no doubt that many of them are sane and rational people who undergo an incredible transformation of personality when they get in a car. Scary.

I've been whacked of my bike by someone jumping out at lights and threatened more times than I can remember. It genuinely annoys people if your cycling on the road. However, they HATE it if your on the pavements as well.

It is an offence to cycle on the pavement punishable by a fine of up to ?500. Bicycles are classed as carriages according to law (Taylor vs Goodwin 1879) and are subject to the same rules when using the road.

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Until they have to pay road tax and hold insurance they shouldn't be allowed on the road.

The insurance part I agree with but when you have certain classes of car which are exempt from an excise license I hardly see that a cyclist should be forced to pay, seeing as how bicycles are among the most energy efficient forms of mechanical transport.

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Bicycles are classed as carriages according to law (Taylor vs Goodwin 1879) and are subject to the same rules when using the road.

Except that their owners don't have to pay any taxes and are hence heavily subsidised by owners of motorised vehicles whose taxes pay for the likes of cycle paths which seem almost permanently empty.

We seem to have miles and miles of them which are barely used and indeed, one of the emptiest and least used cycle paths I have ever seen is the one that runs along Stadium Road past the Caledonian Stadium which was largely paid for by ICT since the provision of same was a condition of receiving planning permission for the Stadium.

In their own defence, cyclists usually play the self righteous CO2 card.

Edited by Charles Bannerman
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Bicycles are classed as carriages according to law (Taylor vs Goodwin 1879) and are subject to the same rules when using the road.

Except that their owners don't have to pay any taxes and are hence heavily subsidised by owners of motorised vehicles whose taxes pay for the likes of cycle paths which seem almost permanently empty.

We seem to have miles and miles of them which are barely used and indeed, one of the emptiest and least used cycle paths I have ever seen is the one that runs along Stadium Road past the Caledonian Stadium which was largely paid for by ICT since the provision of same was a condition of receiving planning permission for the Stadium.

In their own defence, cyclists usually play the self righteous CO2 card.

I believe that VAT is still levied when purchasing a bicycle.

Pedestrians do not pay taxes to use footpaths or pavements, yet these are still maintained using the same pool of money as the excise licence goes into. I am not a cyclist but I do find your, and others', arguments bizarre when it comes to cyclists using the road.

EDIT- Motorised vehicles in "Band 'A'" are also exempt from excise licence fees, should they too be banned from the road?

Edited by Revbirdog
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Bicycles are classed as carriages according to law (Taylor vs Goodwin 1879) and are subject to the same rules when using the road.

Except that their owners don't have to pay any taxes and are hence heavily subsidised by owners of motorised vehicles whose taxes pay for the likes of cycle paths which seem almost permanently empty.

We seem to have miles and miles of them which are barely used and indeed, one of the emptiest and least used cycle paths I have ever seen is the one that runs along Stadium Road past the Caledonian Stadium which was largely paid for by ICT since the provision of same was a condition of receiving planning permission for the Stadium.

In their own defence, cyclists usually play the self righteous CO2 card.

I believe that VAT is still levied when purchasing a bicycle.

Pedestrians do not pay taxes to use footpaths or pavements, yet these are still maintained using the same pool of money as the excise licence goes into. I am not a cyclist but I do find your, and others', arguments bizarre when it comes to cyclists using the road.

VAT is still levied when purchasing most things. Pedestrians use footpaths in far greater numbers than cyclists (or even motorists) use roads, to the extent that being a pedestrian is a universal activity and therefore effectively paid for from general taxation. Being a cyclist is an optional and minority use of the much more expensive facility of roads. (But they seem to use pavements with impunity as well - how often have innocent pedestrians found themselves in danger of being mown down by some some crazy eyed, dayglo clad zealot on two wheels? :clapping04: ). Cyclists also enjoy free use of roads and in a manner which often inconveniences and holds up those who pay lavishly for their provision.

They are therefore the ultimate subsidy junkies, aren't they?

PS - I now expect to be the subject of a Fatwah from the Evangelical wing of the Two Wheeled Brotherhood. They may even incorporate this into the plot of their latest movie... Mad Max 13 - the Pedal Cycle Sequel. :D :D

Edited by Charles Bannerman
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Bicycles are classed as carriages according to law (Taylor vs Goodwin 1879) and are subject to the same rules when using the road.

Except that their owners don't have to pay any taxes and are hence heavily subsidised by owners of motorised vehicles whose taxes pay for the likes of cycle paths which seem almost permanently empty.

We seem to have miles and miles of them which are barely used and indeed, one of the emptiest and least used cycle paths I have ever seen is the one that runs along Stadium Road past the Caledonian Stadium which was largely paid for by ICT since the provision of same was a condition of receiving planning permission for the Stadium.

In their own defence, cyclists usually play the self righteous CO2 card.

I believe that VAT is still levied when purchasing a bicycle.

Pedestrians do not pay taxes to use footpaths or pavements, yet these are still maintained using the same pool of money as the excise licence goes into. I am not a cyclist but I do find your, and others', arguments bizarre when it comes to cyclists using the road.

VAT is still levied when purchasing most things. Pedestrians use footpaths in far greater numbers than cyclists (or even motorists) use roads, to the extent that being a pedestrian is a universal activity and therefore effectively paid for from general taxation. Being a cyclist is an optional and minority use of the much more expensive facility of roads. (But they seem to use pavements with impunity as well - how often have innocent pedestrians found themselves in danger of being mown down by some some crazy eyed, dayglo clad zealot on two wheels? :clapping04: ). Cyclists also enjoy free use of roads and in a manner which often inconveniences and holds up those who pay lavishly for their provision.

They are therefore the ultimate subsidy junkies, aren't they?

PS - I now expect to be the subject of a Fatwah from the Evangelical wing of the Two Wheeled Brotherhood. They may even incorporate this into the plot of their latest movie... Mad Max 13 - the Pedal Cycle Sequel. :D :D

You obviously missed my edit that motorised vehicles in the Band 'A' of the excise licence system also enjoy free use of our roads as well. I am very much against cyclists using pavements and I happily obstruct their path when I see one doing so, in fact I go out of my way to do so. I also firmly believe that cyclists should be barred from the road until a cycling proficiency test is passed, this would give some of them a bit more savvy when using the highways. It may well be a universal activity to be a pedestrian but no-one is excluded from owning or operating a bicycle so I think that cycling quite rightly falls into the same category as walking and horse riding as far as taxation is concerned.

EDIT- I quite like your posts very well considered and thought out, the only thing that lets you down and makes you look quite childish is the way you have to put insults such as " Fatwah from the Evangelical wing of the Two Wheeled Brotherhood" and "subsidy junkies"

Edited by Revbirdog
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EDIT- I quite like your posts very well considered and thought out, the only thing that lets you down and makes you look quite childish is the way you have to put insults such as " Fatwah from the Evangelical wing of the Two Wheeled Brotherhood" and "subsidy junkies"

:015:

Have you ever experienced the sheer fanatical intensity of some of these two wheeled Mullahs whose biggest running cost is a wee dab of 3 in 1? :ph34r:

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I passed my Cycling proficiency test in primary 6 and I don't think I was in the right mental space at that age to cycle the roads. I cycled from the bottom of this country to the top and only came across cycle lanes in Lancashire, which were choked up with parked cars. Cyclist can't pay tax because it would mean that every kid in town would need to pay. Tractors hold everyone up, as do buses, as do accidents, TAX THE BARSTEWARDS!!! Going 41 in a 40 MPH zone is illegal, but EVERYONE has done it. Same as a bike going through a red light, difference being, the cyclist is the only one to lose out if the situation is ill-judged . I reckon i've gone through every red light in Glasgow (even Anderston :ph34r: ) about 10 times. That means that all car drivers (except class A) should give me no quarter when overtaking.

Also, I don't think i've ever seen a pedestrian mowed down by a bike in my life.

I got flipped over a door and I looked really stupid. I went to over take a bus and pushed so hard my chain snapped and I crushed my fun bag of my cross bar, and looked really stupid. I've paid my tax.

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EDIT- I quite like your posts very well considered and thought out, the only thing that lets you down and makes you look quite childish is the way you have to put insults such as " Fatwah from the Evangelical wing of the Two Wheeled Brotherhood" and "subsidy junkies"

:015:

Have you ever experienced the sheer fanatical intensity of some of these two wheeled Mullahs whose biggest running cost is a wee dab of 3 in 1? :ph34r:

Yes some, but the majority are just trying to get from A to B using a mode of transport which has a history far longer than that of motorised transportation. It must be hard being a cyclist trying to use the roads today, there are a multitude of inept drivers especially in the Highlands and in Inverness there seems to be a problem that drivers from outlying rural areas have got absolutely no idea of how to drive in built up areas come in for their weekly shopping trip and forget how to use their indicators and mirrors whilst thinking they own the whole road.

I can also sense a transference of anger on your part, from those who set the taxes which you have to pay for the privilege of not expending your body's energy whilst travelling to the cyclists, who are really doing you a favour by keeping one less car off the road and freeing up the city of congestion. A big part of road taxation goes towards repairing and maintaining roads, how much damage does a 100kg bike and rider do to a carriageway in comparison to a vehicle which weighs between half and 2 tonnes?

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I can also sense a transference of anger on your part, from those who set the taxes which you have to pay for the privilege of not expending your body's energy whilst travelling to the cyclists, who are really doing you a favour by keeping one less car off the road and freeing up the city of congestion. A big part of road taxation goes towards repairing and maintaining roads, how much damage does a 100kg bike and rider do to a carriageway in comparison to a vehicle which weighs between half and 2 tonnes?

Word.

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Don't get me wrong Knowledge, I believe there to be two sides to the argument and cyclist who blatantly break the rules are one of the main reasons there are rifts between drivers and cyclists. Cyclists who "get the finger" or are spat on by drivers are probably bearing the brunt of drivers who have been cut up by a cyclist at traffic lights or forced out of the way whilst walking down a pedestrian area. It is wrong way to behave, I know. I do think there are a group of cyclists who are similar to the Mullah which Charles describes but I believe them to be in the minority, the same with inconsiderate motorists who don't think about cyclists and the dangers they face using today's roads are in the minority. The thing is that every single road user has a duty to make the road as safe as possible for every other user they encounter. Roads are for everyone to use, whether they qualify to pay tax or not.

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The "Band A" free tax (and varying levels beyond that) is nothing more than the government pandering to the enviro maniacs to make it look like they are actually doing something to combat pollution.

If it wasn't for the revenue from oil and road user related taxation then cyclists would be getting flung off their bikes from wheels stuck in cobbles instead of the odd, sometimes self inflicted, brush with the motor vehicle.

As for the "Cyclists are only going to harm themselves" argument....not true. What about the damage done to the cars? Why should the motorist have to pay that from their insurance and lose their no claims bonus because of the stupidity of others? What about the unsuspecting motorist who mows down a cyclist through no fault on his part and has to live with the consequences of severely injuring or killing someone?

My "tax and insurance" comment was a little tongue in cheek, but at the very least bikes should have to be registered and marked in the same way as all other road vehicles....at least then they would have a means of tracking down those who choose to flaunt the rules that other road users get hauled over the coals for breaking.

I personally have nothing against bikes using roads, it's the "us cyclists can do no wrong and everyone should get/stay out of our way" attitude that gets on my goat. Well that and cycle lanes which are the most pointless thing on earth when added to roads which simply aren't built to cater for them. The ones going through Clachnaharry are a joke, the ones on Culcabock Rd are completely pointless and the one on Culloden Rd is seldom used by cyclists who seem to prefer to use the road instead!!!

I can assure you, having worked as a bus driver, chauffeur driver and limo driver and doing lots of "town" miles, it's the good cyclists who are very much in the minority.

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To move on from cyclists, and if this has been covered in this topic already please forgive me but I can't be bothered going through nearly 100 posts to find out, but one thing on the roads which annoys me are charity drives between Land's End and John O' Groats. I don't mind the folk walking as they keep clear of the road and don't cause an obstruction, they are also accomplishing a feat of physical endurance but I have been stuck behind four or five tractors, six quad bikes and I am sure there has been a Sinclair C5 too and they all have their support vehicles none of which want to do more than about 20 miles per hour. The whole one end of the country to another thing has been done to death, these folk should find something original to do to raise cash. Like walk from their team's penultimate match to the last one, or something.

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I can also sense a transference of anger on your part,

No - honest, Dr. Freud... some cyclists just very simply p*ss me off!! :004:

Really sounds to me that an inconsiderate cyclist has had the audacity to scrape the near side wing of yer nice shiny Jaguar Charles.. awful bitter :004:

I cycle to work when the weather is fair and enjoy it, most car users are considerate and thus i am considerate to them, i'll use the pavement when their are no pedestrians about and let Cars past easier, but i have seen people out - usually the racer bike speed merchants going along two abreast which gets drivers upset.

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I can also sense a transference of anger on your part,

No - honest, Dr. Freud... some cyclists just very simply p*ss me off!! :004:

So why focus your argument so heavily on the fact that they pay no tax? Surely if it was merely the fact that some are inconsiderate, they will most probably be inconsiderate in all walks of life as well as their cycling habits, if the lack of taxation was not an issue then you would be concentrating your posts on their social and riding skills rather than the fact that they use our roads tax free!

The "Band A" free tax (and varying levels beyond that) is nothing more than the government pandering to the enviro maniacs to make it look like they are actually doing something to combat pollution.

That is very true but your post does not account for the classic motor being tax free, there is a whole group of motor vehicle users who pay no excise duty on some of the most carbon inefficient vehicles on the road.

Edited by Revbirdog
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