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and again we play the old firm and everyones saying 'aw we are ****'!

anything we get from the old firm is a bonus administration or not.

i thought we started the game quite brightly getting the ball to johny and tade getting balls in the box. then in typical old firm fashion they scored with their first and second attempts on goal after that we seemed to lose confidence.

tade didnt seem to want to take perry on and hayes never seemed to get the ball

billy mckay stood out for me ran the channels better than i ever seen him do and put in a shift

after that its time to regroup prepare for next monday and give dundee utd a thrashing!

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Very poor today. Rangers didn't even look that good, only our defensive errors made them good. For a player like Kerkar to rag-doll Meekings like he did today, questions need to be asked of that defence. We're missing a proper leader in the back four. Williams is good but needs a stronger partner and I literally cannot wait for Golobart to return. Why isn't Thomas Piermayr getting a game ?

Owain Tudor Jones. The last 20 mins against Dunfermline, He completely changed the game. He should of got longer game time in my opinion. I don't think Gregory Tade was fully fit today, I think we rushed him back way too soon.

Another game goes by and I still asking myself the same question. Why is Sam Winnall getting overlooked, He's turning into Aiden Chippendale Mark II. I'm pretty sure Winnall is a better option than Gnapka. I'm sorry, but I don't see the point. Gnakpa doesn't bring anything productive to the game. He can dribble the ball but then gets tackled and he's pretty slow too.

Long Balls need to stop and fast, they don't work.

Anyway, just have to write it off. Bring on Dundee united and hopefully a well earned 3 points

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We can write it off Luke, but I don't see that anything will improve given the same options when we play United, I fear another 4 goal hammering. Butcher needs new options and Tokely back at the heart of the defence if Golobart is still out. If not, we could be in for a tense end to the season.

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Can't argue with any of the critical comment here today, totally hapless performance and the management team need to take a long hard look as themselves as well as the players.

Like a lot of regular diehards I'm at the stage where boredom and frustration are pushing me away from TCS. That coupled to rumours of another rift involving Tokely this time, it seems the last of the old guard is on his way out. If that is the case I just hope Butcher has thought this one through, none of his cheap imports will ever match Rosscoe's achievements or the respect in which he is held by the faithful. "Live by the sword, die by the sword".

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I struggle to believe people are crediting Hayes and Ross with a better game than Tansey. I don't think Tansey played well, not at all. But he was way better than the missing-most-of-the-game Ross and couldn't-cross-the-road Hayes. Those were the two worst players on the park for me.

Stop protecting Tansey, he has been useless practically all season. Came here with a reputation for banging home spectacular free kicks and long range efforts, and well, I'm still waiting. 99% of his free kicks have been atrocious. His corners more often hit the first defender, ( not alone there) and very little exciting happens when he is on the ball. He has had maybe two games where he was better than average and other than that, not worth staying here for another season.

agree with mr jobby re tansey free kicks. i think he hit the post with one v motherwell first game of season and thought he was true to his reputation. i have gone from "go on tansey" to " ffs let someone else have a go".

maybe we could use the bobby samora song that the spurs fans sang to the tune "thats amore'"

IF THE BALL HITS YOUR HEAD

AND YOU SIT IN ROW Z

ITS SAMORA

IF THE BALL HITS YOUR HEAD

AND YOU SIT IN ROW Z

IT'SA TANSEY

may pass this onto chick young i believe he is looking for a song for us

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What did he do for the first goal? He had two players on him and it looked to me like Williams let his man go, charges towards the ball and then both Rangers players run into the box and were ball side of Gillet who was left marking the two of them whilst Williams tries to track back. I don't think Gillet did much wrong there to be honest.

Sorry, second goal from Aluko.

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That coupled to rumours of another rift involving Tokely this time, it seems the last of the old guard is on his way out. If that is the case I just hope Butcher has thought this one through, none of his cheap imports will ever match Rosscoe's achievements or the respect in which he is held by the faithful. "Live by the sword, die by the sword".

Butcher's wanted rid of Tokely for over a year I believe. Had it not been for the funny contractual agreement added in Tokely's contract (he was guaranteed another year if he played over X amount of games - 15 I think it was), he would've followed Munro and Duncan out the door. This season will be his last, I'm 99% sure of that.

I think what we've got to remember here, is that Terry Butcher has an ego the size of Wembley Stadium and at times some of his team selections and decisions seem to be nothing more than to massage it - anyone who disagrees is out the door no matter how good they are.

Edited by Renegade
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FFS, we lost to Rangers - not Dunfermline. Reading this thread it's like the end of the world is nigh and the R word is being used again. Had we won today it would all be about top 6 and even Europe and Terry would be a God. Several players did not play well and tactically we were very poor - but this is just one game. We are 8 points ahead of the pars with 2 games in hand. Get a grip, folk!

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What a load of pis*. If there's a rift then it's because Tokely is upset at not being played...understandable with any footballer with a desire to play.

Butcher is the manager, he picks the team...some people agree with his choices, some people don't.

Saying that any disagreement is the reason he is on the bench as oppose to any disagreement resulting from him being on the bench is putting the cart before the horse.

Amazing how all this crap only ever crops up after a loss!!!

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Saying that any disagreement is the reason he is on the bench as oppose to any disagreement resulting from him being on the bench is putting the cart before the horse.

Am i missing something here?? Can you explain the above.......................and who mentioned the bench having anything to do with Tokely's rift.

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FFS, we lost to Rangers - not Dunfermline. Reading this thread it's like the end of the world is nigh and the R word is being used again. Had we won today it would all be about top 6 and even Europe and Terry would be a God. Several players did not play well and tactically we were very poor - but this is just one game. We are 8 points ahead of the pars with 2 games in hand. Get a grip, folk!

I thought we`d be safe like most but it just struck me that if we gain 0 from our 2 games in hand

and Dunfermline say pick up a winning 3 pts - that makes it just a worrying 5 point difference

think I better fill up my half full glass again before anyone else tells me to!

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That coupled to rumours of another rift involving Tokely this time, it seems the last of the old guard is on his way out. If that is the case I just hope Butcher has thought this one through, none of his cheap imports will ever match Rosscoe's achievements or the respect in which he is held by the faithful. "Live by the sword, die by the sword".

Butcher's wanted rid of Tokely for over a year I believe. Had it not been for the funny contractual agreement added in Tokely's contract (he was guaranteed another year if he played over X amount of games - 15 I think it was), he would've followed Munro and Duncan out the door. This season will be his last, I'm 99% sure of that.

I think what we've got to remember here, is that Terry Butcher has an ego the size of Wembley Stadium and at times some of his team selections and decisions seem to be nothing more than to massage it - anyone who disagrees is out the door no matter how good they are.

who gave him that clause on his contract? butcher did. if he wanted rid of him he wouldnt of gave him that in the first place.

people make to much of rumours before tokely got injured he played virtually every game, now hes just coming back from injury he hasnt been able to establish himself in the side. its not down to butcher its down to tokely, he needs to put in the performances to earn a place in the team just like everyone else does. when tokely was out we had our the best defensive run of the season. thats why tokelys not playing right now.

Edited by lukemackay
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DD, the manner and regularity with which we are capitulating this season is disturbing. It must rank as our poorest defensive statistical performances yet. Am I concerned, yes. Our goal difference is not good and it took a hammering today.

Knee jerk............not from me, this has been coming all season and I don't see an end to it. We should stay up though because Dunfermline are pathetic.

Top-Six. We can forget that for a long time at this rate.

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Saying that any disagreement is the reason he is on the bench as oppose to any disagreement resulting from him being on the bench is putting the cart before the horse.

Am i missing something here?? Can you explain the above.......................and who mentioned the bench having anything to do with Tokely's rift.

e.g. Tokely and Butcher fall out because Tokely ate the last biscuit and Butcher wanted it....as opposed to Tokely and Butcher fell out because Tokely doesn't think he should be on the bench.

One shows that a disagreement resulted in him being benched...the other shows that the disagreement is the result of him being benched.

One would be Ego on the part of Butcher, the other would be Ego on the part of Tokely....both perfectly plausible (well, not the biscuit thing, but the scenario).

As Tokely is a fans favourite then it's automatically assumed that he can do no wrong.

For what it's worth...and Tokely is my favourite all time ICT Player...I don't think we miss him on the park, or that he should be a show-in for a start, as he has been just as culpable as anyone else in defence this season.

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We got beat.....in fact we got torn to shreds. That was nothing to do with Butcher having once played for Rangers. Indeed it really riles me that some folk can think that way. Terry took their wages for three years. Why should that make him a Rangers man any more than anyone else who's ever played for them. He done a job at the time and thats it.

We got beat because we didn't go out there and play football. In fact we didn't go out there and play anything. Whether thats to do with tactics, poor quality players or the choice of players on the field I dont know. What I do know is that we have a squad of very good players. Players who can turn it on and play as a team. Yet for some strange reason it aint happening. Is there some underlying reason akin to to demise of Brewster. I hope not and I hope they will all give each other a kick up the ass and come out fighting in the next game.

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As usual some over the top reactions after todays game> Sure we didn't play well and too many players had a bad day. Rangers won this game without over exerting themselves and down to our poor defending. However many of those slagging off Meekings have been saying that he has been good on other games and let's not forget he is only 19 and still learning.Again, I am getting a bit fed up with many posters continually slagging off team and performances but oblivious to the fact that we have rarely been able to field the same team two weeks running due to injuries. You will only get consistent performances when you can get a consistent team playing week in week out.

Having said that, the substitutions today, apart from Proctor, who played well when he came on, were baffling. I am getting less impressed by Gnapka, who is to attacking what Djebi Zadi was to defending. We needed someone to play alongside Mackay but Gnapka isn't the one. Tudor Jones, if fully fit should have been on sooner as well.

All in all, a bad day at the office but some of the postings on here really mae me question if some posters actaully want to be supporters of ICT or simply want to look for the latest excuse to slag off the management and team.

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I am stunned, not so much by the loss!!! as by the depth and harshness of critcism given by many of the posters in this forum!

All the hype and expectancy pre match must have gone to their heads or else the number of bevvies outnumbered the brain cells.

ICT were up against a highly paid, highly skilled bunch of guys playing for their own futures, they showcased themselves at our expense, the initial shock of recent defeats and entering administration has sunk in and manifested itself in giving us a hiding. They soon 'sussed' out our weaknesses and made us pay, after that first goal the win resolve was there and they gave of their best. Aluko for example played better than he ever played before. unfortunately It needed more than heart (which we can normally muster against the O.F.) to beat that team today, it needed higher skilled players which we cannot afford.

Have a rethink lads and lasses and get your support back behind the team and management.!!!!!!!!!!!

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Utter pish would be the words to sum up that performance today I don't recall seeing a poorer defensive performance ever from an ICT back four

Possibly the worst ever Orc team to set foot in TCS and to be played off the park like the way we did was a total embarrassment

Can't believe no one has mentioned this but did anyone at the game or watching it on Sky see the sickening scenes I saw as our management team waited for McCoist/Durrant/McDowell and co emerge from the tunnel before the game?

A simple hand shake should have been sufficient but what we got was basically a cringeworthy hugfest which I found quite insulting to the ICT fans who had the misfortune to witness it

Rangers were fragile today and all this pandering niceties should have happened within the stand if they even had to happen at all and not in full view of the paying punter

The fact that Tokely never made it off the bench certainly backs up this alleged rift anyone got more info?

Dougal

Edited by dougal
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Okay, plenty of difference of opinion here! Let's face it, we are all incredibly disappointed by today's result - if we weren't upset, we wouldn't be fans.

But let's not start slagging each other off over this. We all want the same thing - for the team to score goals and win games. Let's focus on that, huh?

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Utter pish would be the words to sum up that performance today I don't recall ever seeing a poorer defensive performance ever from an ICT back four

Possibly the worst ever Orc team ever to set foot in TCS and to be played off the park like the way we did was a total embarrassment

Can't believe no one has mentioned this but did anyone at the game or watching it on Sky see the sickening scenes I saw as our management team waited for McCoist/Durrant/McDowell and co emerge from the tunnel before the game?

A simple hand shake should have been sufficient but what we got was basically a cringeworthy hugfest which I found quite insulting to the ICT fans who had the misfortune to witness it

Rangers were fragile today and all this pandering niceties should have happened within the stand if they even had to happen at all and not in full view of the paying punter

The fact that Tokely never made it off the bench certainly backs up this alleged rift anyone got more info?

Dougal

butcher:''oryt ally''

ally:''oryt terry''

butcher:''you know what ive not seen you in months but im not gonna give you a warm welcome cause it might offend 'dougal'"

ally: "who?"

butcher walks off to his perch in the main stand

**** sake get a grip

Edited by lukemackay
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I would accept that we are not playing particularly attractive football and we got well beaten today. But in the recent form league (last 6 matches) we are 6th. If, after 6 matches at the start of the season we were lying 6th having played and lost to both Rangers and Celtic I think we would be pretty exited at the prospects for the rest of the season.

Whilst I am critical of the manager today, I think his outburst at the players is because he knows we actually are good enough for a top 6 finish and the facts bear that out. Given all the injuries we have had and the inconsistency this has forced on starting line ups, a top 6 finish would be an absolutely wonderful acheivement. Crisis? What crisis?

Dougal, you have made some half decent post in recent weeks. Your contribution above is not one of them.

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