Match Day thread ICT v Kilmarnock

[bishbashbosh]

first look at our new team for me.

like the centre back pair. warren looks like he can be a big player for us. no confidence in either full back on show today though

midfield i thought jones was having a good game and draper has presence.

up front oh dear

mackay cant hold the ball up, too light. means a team like killie the get possesion easily and keep for long spells

pick of the bunch for me were sutherland and doran

doran always comes sideways or turn and goes back. does not have the pace to take the opponent on or does not have the confidence to do so. head went down i thought after he should have made it 2-0 jonny hayes he is not

shane -- i will never be convinced this guy can can be a spl player.

he runs with the ball until he loses it, which is not very far. or he passes to an opponent.

had one great run though only to finish with a weak shot straight at the goalkeeper.

we should have put this game to bed after 20 mins. draper should have scored from close range, doran played in by jones i think and hits it straight at bell when it looked easier to score. rabbit in headlights comes to mind.

after that killie passed us to death without creating much, how they miss dene shiels.

should have stolen the points at the end with nick ross header.

are we so bad in front of goal or is cammy bell the best goalkeeper on the planet.

sorry to say i came away wishing i had kept my 500 quid in my pocket and not bothered buying 3 season tickets

[lukemackay]

owain with his history of knee injuries i think it played on his mind, for me that seems totally out of carachter.

[+Fraz]

first look at our new team for me.

like the centre back pair. warren looks like he can be a big player for us. no confidence in either full back on show today though

midfield i thought jones was having a good game and draper has presence.

up front oh dear

mackay cant hold the ball up, too light. means a team like killie the get possesion easily and keep for long spells

pick of the bunch for me were sutherland and doran

doran always comes sideways or turn and goes back. does not have the pace to take the opponent on or does not have the confidence to do so. head went down i thought after he should have made it 2-0 jonny hayes he is not

shane -- i will never be convinced this guy can can be a spl player.

he runs with the ball until he loses it, which is not very far. or he passes to an opponent.

had one great run though only to finish with a weak shot straight at the goalkeeper.

we should have put this game to bed after 20 mins. draper should have scored from close range, doran played in by jones i think and hits it straight at bell when it looked easier to score. rabbit in headlights comes to mind.

after that killie passed us to death without creating much, how they miss dene shiels.

should have stolen the points at the end with nick ross header.

are we so bad in front of goal or is cammy bell the best goalkeeper on the planet.

sorry to say i came away wishing i had kept my 500 quid in my pocket and not bothered buying 3 season tickets

I understand your frustration but ultimately it was one game, give it time. Fingers crossed and your decision will be proven worthwhile.

[CaleyD]

I doubt we'll be allowed to include the incident in any highlights, and I'm not defending his reaction, but there was no raised hand, attempt to head butt or grabbing/holding of the player. Every time I heard mention of it after the game it grew worse and worse. Entirely right to have been red carded for acting in an aggressive manner, but it was little more than charging and getting right into the face of the guy.

No need for it, stupid thing to have done....but the guy had been niggling him the entire match...and that on top of the fact that OTJ has had near career ending injuries from such cynical challenges and you can perhaps understand his reaction a little more.

[+Fraz]

owain with his history of knee injuries i think it played on his mind, for me that seems totally out of carachter.

You would think with the time he has spent on the sidelines already he'd not want to end up straight back there by his own doing.

[+Fraz]

I doubt we'll be allowed to include the incident in any highlights, and I'm not defending his reaction, but there was no raised hand, attempt to head butt or grabbing/holding of the player. Every time I heard mention of it after the game it grew worse and worse. Entirely right to have been red carded for acting in an aggressive manner, but it was little more than charging and getting right into the face of the guy.

No need for it, stupid thing to have done....but the guy had been niggling him the entire match...and that on top of the fact that OTJ has had near career ending injuries from such cynical challenges and you can perhaps understand his reaction a little more.

Don, no question from what I saw that it looked like he went to nut the guy. No idea about how much actual contact was made but the intention was there. If tv proves me wrong so be it.

[bigman]

we were all over Killie for ten minutes then normal service resumed. I came to the game hoping to justify buying season ticket but no started were we left off will give it

one more go.

[lukemackay]

owain with his history of knee injuries i think it played on his mind, for me that seems totally out of carachter.

You would think with the time he has spent on the sidelines already he'd not want to end up straight back there by his own doing.

true. and im not defending it but, seems out of carachter and i think fans booing him off the pitch was wrong aswell, give the guy a chance or petes sake, he was excellent last week and up until the incident was great today, dont judge owain by what he done under 20+ degrees, in a high pressure situation.

again it was totally out of carachter.

[Renegade]

but there was no raised hand, attempt to head butt or grabbing/holding of the player.

Incorrect. Where were you sitting? Perhaps Main Stand folk wouldn't have seen it quite so well due to that angle and bodies in the way and what not, but I was in the North Stand had a great side on view of the incident. He did attempt to head butt him - or at least the motion that he intended to. Everyone in my area saw it, so much so there's was a big groan from everyone as soon as he did it.

I find quite hard to believe some people seem to be quietly or indirectly justifying and condoning what he did!

Edited August 11, 2012 by Renegade

[AJS]

Given we had no points at this time last season i'll take another point.

The first 20 minutes was superb, we attacked in numbers, we exchanged some lovely passes and after getting an early goal could have rapped the game up.

Kilmarnock began to grow in confidence. Esson made a great triple save from the penalty but he should have been in better control with Pascalis goal. Raven's head wound should have been spotted well before it happened though. Cant help but think it wouldve made a difference.

Not much to say about the 2nd half. Neither side improved on their 2nd half display but Nick nearly grabbed it with his header, great save from Cammy Bell.

Owain deserved to go, he didnt head butt Kelly but he did grab him. It was a petty tackle but the reaction cannot be defended.

However 2 games unbeaten into the season and a young squad that is showing promise. Warren was my pick of the bunch today, though he defended brilliantly, could be an important player for us. Shane looked lost in the first half but put in a great shift up front in the 2nd. Please Terry, for the sake of all of us just play him there.

[lukemackay]

im gonna do my bit here.

on the bright side at least we know where forans gonna fit in next week.

[CaleyD]

but there was no raised hand, attempt to head butt or grabbing/holding of the player.

Incorrect. Where were you sitting? Perhaps Main Stand folk wouldn't have seen it quite so well due to that angle and bodies in the way and what not, but I was in the North Stand had a great side on view of the incident. He did attempt to head butt him - or at least the motion that he intended to. Everyone in my area saw it, so much so there's was a big groan from everyone as soon as he did it.

I find quite hard to believe some people seem to be quietly or indirectly justifying and condoning what he did!

Stadium Announcers Box...but video was taken from the other side, so two different angles.

Which part of my post suggested that I was condoning his actions?

[caleydawson]

in the 1st half we produced so many chances yet we never put them away we need a proper striker one who is taller the 5 foot 7 billy cant do anything he has no muscle no height and no ability to shoot like most of our team. in the 2nd half i want to know how the mackenzie guy never got a red card when jones did 1. he kicked at him 2. he made sure jones fought with him and 3. he continued the fight so thats 3 bookable offensives. then at the end of the game what is terry doing taking Oswell for Sutherland on the very last minute then he just slowly walks of as if we are winning 5-0

[Renegade]

Stadium Announcers Box...but video was taken from the other side, so two different angles.

Which part of my post suggested that I was condoning his actions?

I see. Again though, both those angles are from in-front and behind the incident. The side on/North Stand view was the best to see it I reckon, cause I had a completely clear view.

On the second part it's not just your post, but the reasons given by others as well - "injury history" (true, but no excuse), "out of character", "high pressure situation", deflecting it towards fans who were quite rightly annoyed at a stupid action that could've cost the game......one even blaming the heat! (I hope he never goes to Dubai or Hong Kong or somewhere, he's have someone's head off!) Seems to me like some people are trying to belittle what was violent conduct and undoubtedly a red card offence.

Edited August 11, 2012 by Renegade

[old caley girl]

Sorry Don not disbelieving what you say but I clearly saw OTJ throw a right hook! Coulnt believe what I was seeing to be honest.

[gordieict]

I am not defending him stupid thing to do but to say that you never want him to play for the club is a bit extreme. Not quite sure why it's relevant that he is an internationalist... Remember Zidane, the best sometimes have a lapse hopefully it will be his last

[caleydawson]

i support jones with what he did mackenzie kicked out at him so im sure if he had a chance to change what happened im sure he would do it again

[+Fraz]

owain with his history of knee injuries i think it played on his mind, for me that seems totally out of carachter.

You would think with the time he has spent on the sidelines already he'd not want to end up straight back there by his own doing.

true. and im not defending it but, seems out of carachter and i think fans booing him off the pitch was wrong aswell, give the guy a chance or petes sake, he was excellent last week and up until the incident was great today, dont judge owain by what he done under 20+ degrees, in a high pressure situation.

again it was totally out of carachter.

Dunno what the temperature has to do with it and if it was a high pressure situation already then how did is actions affect his teammates once they were down to 10 men? Perhaps you know him well but TBH I don't know OTJ's character too well was I've seen very little of him in the past year. As for the booing of him, that was pathetic, there's little I hate more than fans booing their own players.

[davie]

Good to see the rancour and pessimism return after one game. One game in which we had the best of the first half, Killie shaded the second half and even when we were down to 10 men we could have won it. We passed the ball on the deck for the majority of the game, something that the people on these boards have shouted long and hard for. I did't see us battering the long ball up to McKay as has been alleged. If we are to play a passing game, we have to make the passes stick better and I think it might be reasonable to expect that this will happen as the team plays more than it's first SPL home game together. I, like some others can be rustrated with Sutherland, but he was direct and forceful today and to expect more might be asking too much. I respect some aspects of TB persisting with him in the position he is in, after the lambasting he took last season for chopping and changing things. As a highland lad, what reaction would there be to his being dropped after all that we have heard about the highland spirit being lacking in the side. BTW, did anyone else notice the entire defence high fiving and supporting each other when they defended well today? As spirit, that'll do for me. OTJ deserved to go. No ifs, no buts. You could see a man who's history of injury flashed before his eyes after a naughty wee tackle where the boy left his foot in. No excuse though, and I think he'll know that tonight, but does it really merit hanging him out to dry? Cammie Bell had at least three game saving stops that I saw, the one from Nick Ross topping the lot. Ross was in utter disbelief that he could have stopped that one. It's the start of the season, the quality of football is better than last year, the potential is far greater and we have a couple of points from games that we may well have lost back then. What will the reaction be if we lose to Hearts next week?

I think what I found the most depressing today was the total lack of crowd and the pretty muted support. This is a club that has put a lot of effort into involving fans more, getting kids involved and making it's self more accessible for a public that by and large appears not to care less. It's a club that acted honourably in the close season at the behest of the fans and got less season tickets sold for it's troubles. What do we do about that? That's the subject that we really need to address.

Edited August 11, 2012 by davie

[lukemackay]

owain with his history of knee injuries i think it played on his mind, for me that seems totally out of carachter.

You would think with the time he has spent on the sidelines already he'd not want to end up straight back there by his own doing.

true. and im not defending it but, seems out of carachter and i think fans booing him off the pitch was wrong aswell, give the guy a chance or petes sake, he was excellent last week and up until the incident was great today, dont judge owain by what he done under 20+ degrees, in a high pressure situation.

again it was totally out of carachter.

Dunno what the temperature has to do with it and if it was a high pressure situation already then how did is actions affect his teammates once they were down to 10 men? Perhaps you know him well but TBH I don't know OTJ's character too well was I've seen very little of him in the past year. As for the booing of him, that was pathetic, there's little I hate more than fans booing their own players.

playing in heat is alot harder, so it can be more frustrating, hence he takes out his frustration on the lad he did.

[WYNESS101]

owain with his history of knee injuries i think it played on his mind, for me that seems totally out of carachter.

You would think with the time he has spent on the sidelines already he'd not want to end up straight back there by his own doing.

true. and im not defending it but, seems out of carachter and i think fans booing him off the pitch was wrong aswell, give the guy a chance or petes sake, he was excellent last week and up until the incident was great today, dont judge owain by what he done under 20+ degrees, in a high pressure situation.

again it was totally out of carachter.

Dunno what the temperature has to do with it and if it was a high pressure situation already then how did is actions affect his teammates once they were down to 10 men? Perhaps you know him well but TBH I don't know OTJ's character too well was I've seen very little of him in the past year. As for the booing of him, that was pathetic, there's little I hate more than fans booing their own players.

playing in heat is alot harder, so it can be more frustrating, hence he takes out his frustration on the lad he did.

Playing on a cold december day is alot harder with the cold wind coming in off the sea than a hot day.

The temperature had no part on what OTJ did the day. Its a sad day in football when theres sun out the players find it hard to play in

[gordieict]

Sorry Luke but the heat is a ridiculous defence.

[starchief]

Luke's obviously just trying to defend one of his own. This is the first red card OTJ has ever picked up so it obviously is out of character. Yeah, he did something wrong but he's nowhere near the record of Roy Keane or Zidane, so let's not overblow the situation.

The 4-2-3-1 has never really worked at home. Trouble is, it works so well away, it's tough to change it. Although Doran and Sutherland aren't really supposed to track back in that formation.

Hopefully, Ross will come in and Foran's place is assured. We're good at counter-attacking, not dominating. It's probably time to think of an away and a home preferred formation.

[Ten4]

but there was no raised hand, attempt to head butt or grabbing/holding of the player.

Incorrect. Where were you sitting? Perhaps Main Stand folk wouldn't have seen it quite so well due to that angle and bodies in the way and what not, but I was in the North Stand had a great side on view of the incident. He did attempt to head butt him - or at least the motion that he intended to. Everyone in my area saw it, so much so there's was a big groan from everyone as soon as he did it.

I find quite hard to believe some people seem to be quietly or indirectly justifying and condoning what he did!

Stadium Announcers Box...but video was taken from the other side, so two different angles.

Which part of my post suggested that I was condoning his actions?

From where i was in the North stand I would say the killie player was also confrontational & moved towards OTJ who gave him an aggressive

2 handed push away & not what you`d call a head butt - the killie player of course almost back fipped onto the floor clutching his face !

It was quite a mild mannered game maybe the ref would have even only booked OTJ if it wasnt for the melee of players getting involved.

After all it was a bad bookable tackle that couldve led to a good opportunity, did the killie player actually get booked or it?

Dont condemn Owain for this one not an incident high up on the richter scale IMO will see a lot worse.

Quite impressed with our team tho & how we played all the newcomers probably are better than expected , their penalty was soft & their goal a bit of a loopy fluke!

fr

[PaderbornCaley]

Great first 20 mins and then poor. We had plenty of chances though. Three tough games coming up. Play like we did in the first quarter all the time and we will do well. We need the consistency.