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Sneckboy

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21 minutes ago, caleyboy said:

As you are so keen to get rid of the manager maybe you could tell us all where we get the money to pay him off?

Find a single post of mine where I suggest sacking the manager. He has been given a new two year contract and, barring the unforeseeable, we are stuck with him. However, I am far from alone in fearing where we will at the end of that time. Should that be the championship then finding a hundred grand to come to an arrangement with John Hughes might, with the benefit of hindsight, seem cheap at the price.

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4 minutes ago, RiG said:

'Amicable decision to part ways' perhaps?

It's another dose of telt from the board to Hughes. Can't recall the last time we had this if indeed we ever did.

I think you will find that the answer is never before....interesting times.

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The digs at Yogi really aren't that subtle.  It has been disappointing to see the manager having digs at the Board in the media but I would have thought Cameron would be above responding in kind.  It really isn't good for the club to see this in print.  What I find surprising in all of this is that the Board did not give Yogi permission to speak with Dundee Utd a while ago.  Had Utd opted to make an offer to Hughes at that point then compensation could have been negotiated and there would have been plenty cash for a replacement. (Hughes salary + compensation)  There now seems less and less chance that Hughes will be seen as a front runner in any job he may be interested in.  Hughes will be due compensation if he is sacked and that would hit the player budget.  I think Kingsmills has it right when he says Hughes will likely be here a while yet.   I rather think Cameron will be regretting his own bloody mindedness in denying Hughes the chance to speak with Utd.

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59 minutes ago, Sneckboy said:

Cameron said: “It’s been a very challenging season. We’ve had horrendous injuries from day one, but that’s not an excuse. We took more players in and backed the manager on that front, but things just haven’t clicked this season. We usually operate with a squad of 18. This season it was 25 or 26, so the manager has obviously had a fair bit more money. But these things happen. All in all it’s been a reasonable season, so if we can finish seventh we’ll be happy. We’re looking forward to next season and getting back into the top six. We’ll always look to be in the top six, so we’ll go from there and see where it takes us.”

Woaft !! That's a pretty stinging criticism of the manager from the chairman, along with delivering a demanding expectation of no worse than a 7th place finish this season and top six next!

Awaiting developments.:ponder:

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5 minutes ago, DoofersDad said:

The digs at Yogi really aren't that subtle.  It has been disappointing to see the manager having digs at the Board in the media but I would have thought Cameron would be above responding in kind.  It really isn't good for the club to see this in print.  What I find surprising in all of this is that the Board did not give Yogi permission to speak with Dundee Utd a while ago.  Had Utd opted to make an offer to Hughes at that point then compensation could have been negotiated and there would have been plenty cash for a replacement. (Hughes salary + compensation)  There now seems less and less chance that Hughes will be seen as a front runner in any job he may be interested in.  Hughes will be due compensation if he is sacked and that would hit the player budget.  I think Kingsmills has it right when he says Hughes will likely be here a while yet.   I rather think Cameron will be regretting his own bloody mindedness in denying Hughes the chance to speak with Utd.

....and, given that scenario, there is a fair chance that we and not United would have the very promising Ray Mackinnon who has done wonders on a restricted budget and Kirkaldy and before that with even more limited funds at Brechin.

I actually think that Yogi has some decent qualities as a coach but the negatives are increasingly coming to the fore just as they did after promising spells at Falkirk and Hibs. The trouble with JH is that he seems incapable of learning from his mistakes.

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The board are quite right to apply a modicum of pressure on the manager when results are sub par. Yogi has been taking a leaf out of the CC10 playbook with his expectation lowering, standard reducing, club downtalking shtick every time he loses. He's trying to move the goalposts on what constitutes success and failure to make it look like he's doing a great job at a mickey mouse club. The board are rightly pushing back against this narrative. 

Edited by AlexJones
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37 minutes ago, bdu98196 said:

If Hibs loose to Falkirk or Killie and Hibs it in the cup I cant see them staying with Stubbs - a 3rd year in the 2nd tier. Maybe then we wouldn't need to find money which would make some fans happy.

Haven't Hibs just given Stubbs an extension?

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21 minutes ago, Alex MacLeod said:

Haven't Hibs just given Stubbs an extension?

Interweb suggests he extended his 2 year deal which would have expired around now to have an extra year last summer, so he's under contract til end of nest season. With a year left I guess it depends on whether that board see another year in the Championship under the same stewardship with the gamble with there no longer being a Rangers as being worth it if they don't go up this time.

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3 hours ago, Kingsmills said:

Find a single post of mine where I suggest sacking the manager. He has been given a new two year contract and, barring the unforeseeable, we are stuck with him. However, I am far from alone in fearing where we will at the end of that time. Should that be the championship then finding a hundred grand to come to an arrangement with John Hughes might, with the benefit of hindsight, seem cheap at the price.

Oh don't split hairs. You are Yogi's biggest critic on this board and the sooner you give him a break the better - for us all!

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3 hours ago, Kingsmills said:

....and, given that scenario, there is a fair chance that we and not United would have the very promising Ray Mackinnon who has done wonders on a restricted budget and Kirkaldy and before that with even more limited funds at Brechin.

I actually think that Yogi has some decent qualities as a coach but the negatives are increasingly coming to the fore just as they did after promising spells at Falkirk and Hibs. The trouble with JH is that he seems incapable of learning from his mistakes.

Worked wonders??? Hardly..... He made the playoffs which is what should be expected of a club of Raith's size.

JH kept us in the league which is what is expected of him, you do realise that even with an increased budget it is still the smallest in the league. yes it's been a topsy turvy season but he has done what was expected.... of course we want more, but hey, we weren't far away from top 6.... at the time of the split we were only 4 points off 4th and a potential European place (While Celtic were still in the cup) I mean its hardly the apocalyptic season everyone is making out.

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Boards in general tend to be reluctant to reveal player budgets. The operating costs are in the accounts but there's no indication of what % of this is player budget.

However the bottom line is - you can't spend money you don't have  and there's a limit to what you earn from crowds of around 3000. I would also suggest that for a long time now what has been achieved relative to budget has been remarkable.

What I would really like to see are long term "cost per point" figures for all the clubs.

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I see it as a smidge of disappoint due to money invested but mainly as a 'where next' message, we are a top six club with top six aspirations and that's the plan for next season.

 

We had a smooth flowing team last season and you could see it was all coming undone from the first match with a new striker who couldn't run and a winger whos main aim was to dribble past every player until he lost the ball, the fuidity was lost.

Plenty of injuries on top and even more new players who don't have that inbuilt knowledge of our players abilities.

I'm investing in a season ticket again.

 

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2 hours ago, RiG said:

Is this Hughes responding to those comments from Cameron?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36255908

Same old same old from him I think?

i think he's building in some excuses too-tansy is vital-so if we lose him he has an excuse to pull out of the drawer...

frustrating to hear him bemoan funds yet again, even after the board have told him he's getting the same as last year! :frustrated01:

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2 hours ago, RiG said:

Is this Hughes responding to those comments from Cameron?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36255908

I would rather have a young player on the way up or someone who has potential but hasn't been given a chance than a 'quality' player on the way down who doesn't want to be here.

Stokesy didn't even want to come up and watch ICT v Celtic from the stand.

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Quote

"The fans deserve for us to go and get one or two quality players for them"

You've already got a quality player and one who has an affinity with the fans in David Raven and yet you're driven to freezing him out...

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11 minutes ago, Renegade said:

You've already got a quality player and one who has an affinity with the fans in David Raven and yet you're driven to freezing him out...

Also, go get them then.....?!?!!?!? Still no word of tying up th quality players we DO have. No word of Roberts getting an extension...nothing said about trying to keep Storey...

is he expecting the board to source the new players as well as bank roll them? 

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Quote

 

"There's an understanding from me that we're not flush with cash. We have to be stringent about the way we do it."

Clearly Hughes and the board have had discussions on cash flow/budget and he is well aware... no issue here.

"I want to keep driving the club forward and keep getting into cup finals, into the top six. For the first time in our history, we took the club into Europe.

"Why do it once and sit back and rest on your laurels? No, we want to do it every year."

That's good.... same ambitions as the board but in line with what cash is available given above statement.

"That's the standard that we set, but to do that, we need to start bringing a better quality of player to the club."

Why don't we look at this as JH admitting that some of the players he brought in weren't of the quality, he made mistakes, but why come out and individually say Lopez wasn't good enough or whomever..... you're just slandering people and where's the need for that.... I think this is well said by JH without individually saying players haven't performed or been up to standard. This to me states that he has done what he maybe didn't have time to before the season and been identifying and scouting potential targets and then leaving it to the board to see if a deal could be done for the players he feels would fit the mould.

 

People are reading far too much into things.... the press will always twist stories to make them sound more fantastical or controversial. I think Hughes knows this season has been poor in comparison to last but I think, much like Mr Ranieri south of the border wants to cool down expectations of a club that has overachieved.... at the end of the day, what do you think the aim will be for Leicester next season? I would guarantee you it would be to stay in the league and anything else a bonus.

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20 minutes ago, ThorburnGolf said:

"There's an understanding from me that we're not flush with cash. We have to be stringent about the way we do it."

Clearly Hughes and the board have had discussions on cash flow/budget and he is well aware... no issue here.

"I want to keep driving the club forward and keep getting into cup finals, into the top six. For the first time in our history, we took the club into Europe.

"Why do it once and sit back and rest on your laurels? No, we want to do it every year."

That's good.... same ambitions as the board but in line with what cash is available given above statement.

"That's the standard that we set, but to do that, we need to start bringing a better quality of player to the club."

Why don't we look at this as JH admitting that some of the players he brought in weren't of the quality, he made mistakes, but why come out and individually say Lopez wasn't good enough or whomever..... you're just slandering people and where's the need for that.... I think this is well said by JH without individually saying players haven't performed or been up to standard. This to me states that he has done what he maybe didn't have time to before the season and been identifying and scouting potential targets and then leaving it to the board to see if a deal could be done for the players he feels would fit the mould.

 

People are reading far too much into things.... the press will always twist stories to make them sound more fantastical or controversial. I think Hughes knows this season has been poor in comparison to last but I think, much like Mr Ranieri south of the border wants to cool down expectations of a club that has overachieved.... at the end of the day, what do you think the aim will be for Leicester next season? I would guarantee you it would be to stay in the league and anything else a bonus.

Good interpretation, well said.

It also strikes me as if when J H went to the board to ask for money to buy cover he was given inadequate allowance to achieve his selection and had to settle with what he would get at the price.

So much anti Hughes speculation on this thread, disgusting, after what he has achieved, no other manager has done this for us.

I think it is time some people should think a bit deeper, analyse thoroughly why we haven't achieved their expectations and set realistic targets for the future. That includes the Board and some so called supporters.

Must say I laughed at some comment about John not showing the fans enough respect !!!!!!

 

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1 hour ago, bughtmaster said:

Good interpretation, well said.

It also strikes me as if when J H went to the board to ask for money to buy cover he was given inadequate allowance to achieve his selection and had to settle with what he would get at the price.

So much anti Hughes speculation on this thread, disgusting, after what he has achieved, no other manager has done this for us.

I think it is time some people should think a bit deeper, analyse thoroughly why we haven't achieved their expectations and set realistic targets for the future. That includes the Board and some so called supporters.

Must say I laughed at some comment about John not showing the fans enough respect !!!!!!

 

Well said guys - agree entirely:clapping:

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1 hour ago, bughtmaster said:

Good interpretation, well said.

It also strikes me as if when J H went to the board to ask for money to buy cover he was given inadequate allowance to achieve his selection and had to settle with what he would get at the price.

So much anti Hughes speculation on this thread, disgusting, after what he has achieved, no other manager has done this for us.

I think it is time some people should think a bit deeper, analyse thoroughly why we haven't achieved their expectations and set realistic targets for the future. That includes the Board and some so called supporters.

Must say I laughed at some comment about John not showing the fans enough respect !!!!!!

 

Or perhaps he was given more than adequate allowance and he squandered it.

As I said earlier in the discussion.

On 29 April 2016 at 2:52 PM, Shorty said:

JH has signed 16 players in 2 seasons and only 4 of those have made any real impact (Ofere, Vigurs, Storey & Fon Williams).  If rumours are right, none of those 4 were scouted or found by the manager.

A couple of others have had long term injuries which is out of his control, but there's players fit who are not being utilised and ones being utilised who are a waste of space.  We would have done as well, if not better, by using more of the U20's over the season instead of blowing a barrowload of money on duffers.  No need to scratch heads over where the money has gone, you can see it right there, wasted.

 

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Oh come on people, it's easy for posters on here to lay blame but at the end of the day I very much doubt if there is one of us with either the experience or ability to do a better job than JH. let's put all this to bed and back the manager who has taken us to levels we could only dream about.

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4 minutes ago, caleyboy said:

Oh come on people, it's easy for posters on here to lay blame but at the end of the day I very much doubt if there is one of us with either the experience or ability to do a better job than JH. let's put all this to bed and back the manager who has taken us to levels we could only dream about.

But none of us are football managers who are expected to at least have some nous in the transfer market. That is part of John Hughes's job and it is not something which he has excelled at since he came to the club. Hughes has been backed by the board better than any ICT manager in history and yet his dealings in the transfer market can be described as, at best, poor. It doesn't exactly inspire you to believe that he can replace someone like Raven if / when he leaves in the summer.

It's puzzling that you seem so willing to overlook this without even a second thought.

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