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Seems Yogi was disappointed by the defending.  How did that unit suddenly become so leaky?  Well, if Yogi can't figure out, I'll tell him.  Previously, we played counter-attack, with one, usually two, defensive midlfielders. Draper and Foran aren't great passers but they can attack when flinging the ball out to speedy wide men.  Does Hughes, with all his years of experience, not know this?  And, if he does, why does he think his system will work under players that revel in a different one?

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Fatigue definitely setting in after our recent fixture congestion. It'd be madness to play a full team on Wednesday. Give Polworth, Williams, Christie, Greenhaugh, Pepper, Cooper etc a run out. Our first teamers will be freshened up, our fringe players get the boost from a run out. Win win. The cup final is 1,000 times more important than a regular league fixture.

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There was something that didn't seem quite right today.  The players were not playing as a team as they have been in past weeks, there was no drive and no passion whatsoever.  Now, has there been a bust up?  I don't if many people saw, but when Foran went off, Hughes went to pat him on the back.  Foran seemed to just blank him and barge past.  Now I was quite far away, but that's what it looked like to me.  I wonder if there's been a falling out, which partly led to today's disaster.

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The thing is I like hughes going 4-4-2 more often than Butcher as it gives a plan B but that is what it is plan B. We built so much of our success with the 4-2-3-1 and yes on occasions it has failed to work but that is where 4-4-2 could be used if we need but not as a starting tactic. The thing is we got to next Sunday's final and beat Aberdeen at Pittordrie using this system under Hughes so he knows it works. I am English and have seen my country play 4-4-2 for the last 10 years when other nations have adapted and play more fluid systems, we have been left behind. 4-4-2 is an outdated formation that can be used if we need to go more direct to try and score goals but it offers no fluidity and teams play in straight lines and become very predictable. The one thing i would say though is that system should make it very hard for teams to break down the opposition as it is very rigid so why we have conceded so many has to come down to our defence im afraid  

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I could not make the game today as I had other arrangements before the game was changed to Sunday for TV and I am sure it was the same for many other regular supporters who would have been there.  Just because you are in a bad mood don't have a pop at the supporters!

I couldn't go today either (thank goodness) but Which ever way you paint it a home crowd of 1,500 outnumbered by away supporters when admission was only a tenner is a very poor show indeed and worthy of comment.

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The pitch is doing us no favours at all.  Similar to last season, when the pitches got bad we couldn't play football.  But we in general just seemed so lacking in ideas that it was laughable.  Something that was hysterical was our defending and trying to control the ball, Mckay all of a sudden seems to have to touch of a pinball machine.  Hopefully things can't get much worse and we battle away for a draw or something on Wednesday to give us something to hold onto for Sunday.  Aberdeen fans will give them the same backing the Utd fans did today so we're going to have to grow a pair and start battling, that wasn't a Caley Thistle performance today.

 

Being sh1te today isn't enough for some people, obviously theres some backround conspiracy going on.  Don't understand what people get from constantly whenever things aren't going right suggesting it. Laughable

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An awful lot of things went wrong today, but that aside, Utd just looked like they wanted it more. Perhaps that shouldn't be a surprise as it was the biggest game of their season, but seemed a bit of an unwelcome distraction for us.

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An awful lot of things went wrong today, but that aside, Utd just looked like they wanted it more. Perhaps that shouldn't be a surprise as it was the biggest game of their season, but seemed a bit of an unwelcome distraction for us.

 

Bit like last week then. Becoming an unfortunate habit.

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There was something that didn't seem quite right today.  The players were not playing as a team as they have been in past weeks, there was no drive and no passion whatsoever.  Now, has there been a bust up?  I don't if many people saw, but when Foran went off, Hughes went to pat him on the back.  Foran seemed to just blank him and barge past.  Now I was quite far away, but that's what it looked like to me.  I wonder if there's been a falling out, which partly led to today's disaster.

 

I wouldn't read anything into the Foran substitution.  The game was lost by then and I think it was wise not to risk both Foran and Doran further.  With the game gone and Foran's performance not up to the standard he demands of himself he was hardly likely to be Mr Chatty we he came off. 

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Im gutted about the scoreline for sure but i now feel devastated we are out the cup. Fact is we are to far behind to catch 2nd/3rd place in the league. And if it all goes peetong next week then what do we have left to play for? Really really wanted a run in the Scots cup aswell, especially since celtic are out and we have such a good side to compete with.

Il be honest and say ive been a Yogi supporter since day 1 because he deserves a chance, but frankly im not happy with him. Tactics were all wrong today sure but what i find worrying is every single home performance under yogi has been a disaster. And whats with the pitch? We've always prided ourselves on having a cracking pitch.

Before today I would have echoed what someone said before that we really need to let the youngsters have a start on weds. However i dont think thats possible now because of the general morale of the side. Devine needs to start, again really surprised he hasnt got on before now! Get back to 4231!!

Cant be bothered writing anymore. Just deeply depressed

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Today was well and truly awful - no excuses. Why have we changed from our favoured 4-2-3-1 to a 4-4-2 which have seen us conceed 10 goals in 2 games FFS. John Hughes as a player was a CB if he played the way Meekings did today he wouldn't have got anywhere near the Celtic team. We had a good chance of another big day out at Ibrox and today we got what we deserved - a hammering.

There was no direction from the touchline today which was especially disappointing. I really like John Hughes as a person but his managerial career at ICT is starting to get a bit concerning. IF and a big IF we come away with no wins in the last 2 games this time next week then I would be sorry to do this but questions would need to be asked on the management team. If Terry Butcher was the manager today firstly I am sure our defending wouldn't be as shoddy and if the same result happend he would have got torn into the players. I haven't seen Yogi's post match interview with BBC but what has been posted online doesn't make good reading.

Don't get me wrong, the players tried today and I thought Graeme Shinnie was the best out of a bad lot today but there was too many disappointing factors. The communication in the second goal for Dundee United between Dean Brill and Josh Meekings was pathetic and Cifti couldn't of had an easier goal if he tried. Up front today was poor and Billy Mckay's lack of goals is starting to get worrying. Ross County must be really poor if we can beat them in the style that we did and just makes me wonder why we can't keep the consistency? Yogi identified vs Celtic what when wrong, did they correct that mistakes - no.

The referee had a really poor game and I just thought he couldn't get the red card out quick enough for the Greg Tansey tackle. Both Watkins and Tansey's red card was a yellow card at best. In saying that regardless of the referee's performance, 11 vs 11 would still got hammered.

Credit to Dundee United fans today, absolute superb crowd for a half 12 on a Sunday!

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Just back home in Aberdeen and absolutely gutted by that performance today. First time ever we left early, shortly after the fifth goal went in. Can't believe we persisted with the 4-4-2 set up after last week's doing and it was obvious after only about 10 minutes we weren't comfortable with it.

There seems to be something amiss with the squad and whatever's behind it action needs to taken quickly or our season's over.

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Today was well and truly awful - no excuses. Why have we changed from our favoured 4-2-3-1 to a 4-4-2 which have seen us conceed 10 goals in 2 games FFS. John Hughes as a player was a CB if he played the way Meekings did today he wouldn't have got anywhere near the Celtic team. We had a good chance of another big day out at Ibrox and today we got what we deserved - a hammering.

There was no direction from the touchline today which was especially disappointing. I really like John Hughes as a person but his managerial career at ICT is starting to get a bit concerning. IF and a big IF we come away with no wins in the last 2 games this time next week then I would be sorry to do this but questions would need to be asked on the management team. If Terry Butcher was the manager today firstly I am sure our defending wouldn't be as shoddy and if the same result happend he would have got torn into the players. I haven't seen Yogi's post match interview with BBC but what has been posted online doesn't make good reading.

Don't get me wrong, the players tried today and I thought Graeme Shinnie was the best out of a bad lot today but there was too many disappointing factors. The communication in the second goal for Dundee United between Dean Brill and Josh Meekings was pathetic and Cifti couldn't of had an easier goal if he tried. Up front today was poor and Billy Mckay's lack of goals is starting to get worrying. Ross County must be really poor if we can beat them in the style that we did and just makes me wonder why we can't keep the consistency? Yogi identified vs Celtic what when wrong, did they correct that mistakes - no.

The referee had a really poor game and I just thought he couldn't get the red card out quick enough for the Greg Tansey tackle. Both Watkins and Tansey's red card was a yellow card at best. In saying that regardless of the referee's performance, 11 vs 11 would still got hammered.

Credit to Dundee United fans today, absolute superb crowd for a half 12 on a Sunday!

 

 

I too like Yogi as a man. He's approachable and affable even if he does speak almost entirely in cliches but it's not just his developing record here that's a concern but his managerial record in general. There's nothing on his CV that suggested he was the man to take us forward.

 

If you look at the 'New Manager Thread' despite over 100 names being suggested he was not touted once until he was produced out of thin air by the board.

 

Whatever happens, having been appointed, he deserves to be given next season to prove us sceptics wrong but I am seeing very little to indicate that that might be the case. Quite the reverse. We have a very good squad of players who have not become poor overnight but I am not convinced that they are being well coached and manage.

 

Being a nice guy who makes time to interact with the fans and attend supporters meetings will only take you so far. 

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Oh dear, oh dear. Never have I been so glad to have been running 5k instead of watching that shambles.

As others have indicated: 4-4-2 wasn't for Celtic or today. The players were clearly somewhere else and lacked fight. Foran needs to go back to holding midfield. The ref had a mare and the pitch was appalling. The worst of it all is that I think we need to play our A team on Wednesday night now - we can't go into Sunday with 3 defeats on the spin or we'll have no chance. Don't know what the suspension score is, but looks like we'll be without a few now.

Could it have turned out worse? No.

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It's disappointing but I wouldn't read too much into today's result or the fact that it came on the back of a similar scoreline against  Celtic.  Against Celtic we got the backlash of them having lost their unbeaten run and today I think the fans' focus on the final next week was also reflected in some of the players who didn't seem to have the usual drive and determination.

 

But despite that in most aspects of the game we matched Utd in the first half and were 3 down because of uncharacteristic blunders from players who are usually among are most dependable.  We were down to 10 men for all the 2nd half and then down to 9 for the last 20 minutes and yet were never over-run.  Utd never looked particularly threatening except when they scored.  First half blunders aside, I've seen us play worse and win.  The scoreline was highly flattering to Utd and it was just a day when nothing went right for us.

 

Folk seem to have very short memories.  Just a couple of weeks ago we absolutely blew County apart with a performance that had everyone drooling and which, despite the scorelines, was way more dominant than Utd were over us today.  These were the same players and the same manager. Fact is, we have a decent team which is capable of playing very well but which maybe lacks the extra dimension to adapt when the game plan goes to pot.  We'll bounce back and have further excellent victories this season.

 

I do, however share concerns about the 4-4-2.  I think it stifles the fluidity of the team and there seems to be a bit of uncertainty about who should be doing what.  At times today, Vincent in particular was often in the same place as Foran,Watkins or Tansey and I lost count of the times someone behind me shouted "one of you!".  Apart from getting in each others' way, the converging on each other reduced the outlets for passing the ball.

 

This makes Wednesday's match against Hibernian particularly important.  It, more than Sunday's final, will show what the players and the management team are made of.  We are still in with a very good opportunity to clinch 3rd or even 2nd in the league and that should be our priority.  Given respective league positions and Hibs current form, we should beat them.  And if we beat them, we confirm our top 6 place which for me, would represent the target of making this a decent season.  A win would keep us very much in the league race as well as give us a confidence boost for the final.  A dismal performance in front of a dismal crowd could well be the signal to a bit of an anticlimax to the season.  Wednesday is almost a "must win" game and just as we need the team to play well, the team needs the support behind them.  TBH I am expecting a crowd well below 3,000 for Wednesday night but hopefully I will be proved wrong.  Come on ICT fans, get behind your team and come out in force to support the lads on Wednesday!  Sending Terry Butcher down the road to Edinburgh in no mood for fish and chips en route would be a nice little bonus.

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Some interesting posts and some not so interesting. The 4 4 2 formation does not seem to be working but that was not what cost us the first 3 goals. First two were poor defending, third soft and debateable penalty. Fourth a breakaway goal that Raven and Brill could/should have done better with.

 

Poor performance from many players but is this down to John Hughes?. I don't think so but that is just my opinion. Until the first goal, game fairly even but losing two poor goals then the penalty, then the sending off just killed the game. I actually thought we played better in the second half as Warren and Meekings seemed to improve but that could not be hard after the first half.

 

Some serious choices need to be made for the final now. I would seriously consider playing Esson against Hibs to see how he plays as I think Brill has gone off the boil. Hard as it may be, I think we seriously have to consider playing Esson. Vincent poor as well today, didn't look fit and don't think he has justified a place in the starting 11. While Raven generally going going forward, he was shown up defensively today but what cover have we got for him?. Foran also poor and showed little influence today so maybe a hard decision to take with him as well.

 

While we did not deserve to win today, giving United 2 goals of a start and a dodgy penalty basically took the game out of our reach against a United team who did not have to work hard for their victory and were by no means 5 goals better than us as some posters would appear to believe.

 

Finally onto the referee. I actually said to someone, jokingly, before the game when I discovered Collum was the ref that we would be playing against 12 men today. Well while he did not cost us the game, he certainly spoilt it as a spectacle. Both red cards were ridiculous, Tansey's at best was a yellow and Watkins was a foul only at best. Collum just could not wait to get the red cards out and if this continues, most games will end up with less than 11 men each week. What really irks me about Collum is his inconsistency where he will award fouls for certain tackles then let exactly the same thing go. Today, none of these went in our favour. We have been on the bad end of some refereeing performances but todays was one of the worst. The stand side linesman was just as bad getting decisions wrong or simply having the ref make the decion for him.

 

Roll on next Sunday where I am sure we will get a better performance. Aberdeen are by no means unbeatable so here's hoping the right ICT team turn up!

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We can't shrug this off - 10 goals in 2 games FFS !!!  And we were lucky to get away with 5-0 both times. Any manager in another league would be facing the sack.  Yogi's tactics have been dire these past two games - once again Richie is completely ineffective up front, and the opposition sweep through the midfield.  Having said that, Yogi can't be blamed for the first two goals.

And the ground staff - how can they produce a pitch like that, when they've had plenty of time to prepare a decent surface?  It's all very well saying everyone pitches in, everyone gets along, we're all great guys etc. - but we've produced a surface we can't play on...

And the referee! He wasn't fit to ref a park game - that second red was laughable. The Scottish FA have really got to take a look at themselves if they are producing refs of that standard for the top flight.

Let's get back to the tight 451 passing football that has got us so far - with an organised defence, solid midfield, pacy wings, and Billy up front.

Tamping....!!!!

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Some interesting posts and some not so interesting. The 4 4 2 formation does not seem to be working but that was not what cost us the first 3 goals. First two were poor defending, third soft and debateable penalty. Fourth a breakaway goal that Raven and Brill could/should have done better with.

 

Poor performance from many players but is this down to John Hughes?. I don't think so but that is just my opinion. Until the first goal, game fairly even but losing two poor goals then the penalty, then the sending off just killed the game. I actually thought we played better in the second half as Warren and Meekings seemed to improve but that could not be hard after the first half.

 

Some serious choices need to be made for the final now. I would seriously consider playing Esson against Hibs to see how he plays as I think Brill has gone off the boil. Hard as it may be, I think we seriously have to consider playing Esson. Vincent poor as well today, didn't look fit and don't think he has justified a place in the starting 11. While Raven generally going going forward, he was shown up defensively today but what cover have we got for him?. Foran also poor and showed little influence today so maybe a hard decision to take with him as well.

 

While we did not deserve to win today, giving United 2 goals of a start and a dodgy penalty basically took the game out of our reach against a United team who did not have to work hard for their victory and were by no means 5 goals better than us as some posters would appear to believe.

 

Finally onto the referee. I actually said to someone, jokingly, before the game when I discovered Collum was the ref that we would be playing against 12 men today. Well while he did not cost us the game, he certainly spoilt it as a spectacle. Both red cards were ridiculous, Tansey's at best was a yellow and Watkins was a foul only at best. Collum just could not wait to get the red cards out and if this continues, most games will end up with less than 11 men each week. What really irks me about Collum is his inconsistency where he will award fouls for certain tackles then let exactly the same thing go. Today, none of these went in our favour. We have been on the bad end of some refereeing performances but todays was one of the worst. The stand side linesman was just as bad getting decisions wrong or simply having the ref make the decion for him.

 

Roll on next Sunday where I am sure we will get a better performance. Aberdeen are by no means unbeatable so here's hoping the right ICT team turn up!

 

Well yes, he has to share the blame as much as the players. Tactically we got this game wrong today and we got punished and made Dundee United looked much better than they were. As I said in my previous post Yogi pin pointed what was wrong with the Celtic game and in the manner of that game you can take it on the chin but this game you can't and it's inexcusable how poor we were defensively today. It makes you question what the lads do in training each week to concede 10 goals in 2 games. 

 

I really want Yogi to succeed in this job but as a leader he was poor as much as the lads today and unfortunately as a fan I am struggling to take this one on the chin. 

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Agree with everything that has been said in the previous posts. I hope that Hughes has all the staff back in Tonight for a crisis meeting. That' s what would happen in any other business. These guys earn huge money compared to most, not much compared to some, but they showed very little today.

Well done to all of us who paid a tenner today to suffer that.

Esson, christie, polworth must start on Wednesday, after all they are part of the squad so there should be no fears about playing them. You never know one of them could put in a great performance and become part of the Final starting line up.

Finally, why was the pitch not watered today, the poor bounces were the same for both teams but we just couldn't cope.

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We'll laugh about this one day :cry:

 

 

I think it is more likely that one day we'll find out that the team was on the pay of an Asian betting syndicate!

 

I'm not being serious, but if ever there was an ICT game that we tried to lose, it was this one.  Defender & keeper contrive to give away 2 early goals, unnecessary penalty next, then 2 players get themselves sent off.  :blink:

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We'll laugh about this one day :cry:

 

 

I think it is more likely that one day we'll find out that the team was on the pay of an Asian betting syndicate!

 

I'm not being serious, but if ever there was an ICT game that we tried to lose, it was this one.  Defender & keeper contrive to give away 2 early goals, unnecessary penalty next, then 2 players get themselves sent off.  :blink:

 

Neither of those tackles was a red - Tansey pulled out and dropped his foot, and Watkins didn't touch the player, only the ball.  That clown of a referee bought the dives.  I hope Hughes brings in a ballet teacher to train the players in tragic, twisting aerial dives for the final....

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