Should Hughes be SACKED?

[Doofer 104]

I never wanted Hughes as manager in the first place but was always prepared to back whoever the board appointed but the honeymoon period is well and truly over. Hughes' tactics are woeful to say the least and is not utilising the players in the positions and ways in which they excel in. I agree that waiting too long for change is never good (as we all know from the Brewster fiasco). In the next 3 matches, if there is not a marked difference in tactics, with players allowed to play to their strengths and do what they do best, then I think the board need to cut their loses and let Hughes go.

Edited April 2, 2014 by Doofer

[+jagster 509]

And to clarify my last post I've had 2 huge glasses of wine a box of 12 cobra beers and onto carling now it's $hit watching shalamar singing I can make you feel good and even that's not enough to make me feel happyaboutthe daftest beAr in town yabadabadoo yogi a fecking clown. Feel free to delete this admin but totally saying what I feel When we beat Arbroath 5-2! And herchie scored his hat trick being an ex jaggie i stood beside that crappy pie shop in the HE and said id support the team forever and I always will but yogi feck off and give Ict back to us please

[12th Man 1,193]

We were the best, or I should say a close 2nd best to Celtic.

The best defence, the best leagues goal scorer, the most entertaining team to watch. We knew how to play football and win.

 

Butcher selected all of our players as he saw something special in them.

Butcher, larger than life character and international player.

 

Enter Yogi.

 

Play through the middle?

Play fecking everywhere,  what ever it takes. long balls, diagonals, down the channels, down the middle, keep them guessing.

 

Yogi may or may not have the dressing room who knows, bar giving the youngsters a chance he hasn't scouted for a single player and they may not have heard of John Hughes.

 

Butchers style of play was boring and we lost fans because of it and they didn't want to come back, sadly they have missed out on 2 great seasons. Thankfully Butcher changed the style of play 2 seasons ago and we haven't looked back, it was nowhere near what it is now.

 

Yogi has to educate himself as to what his best options are, whats best for him, whats best for the players and the club.

 

When Strachan took on the Scotland job he quite openly said he didn't have the pool of players to suit his style of play so instead  played to the players strengths.

 

Do I want Yogi sacked ?  No, not yet. I actually think he is doing a good enough job of trying to sack himself.

 

See what you have in front of you, see what works and what doesn't, Butcher changed his tactics too.

 

Aberdeen have been crying out for pacey wingers for years, problem now resolved on both wings.

Aberdeen struggled to score from open play enter Rooney problem resolved.

Aberdeen go from being under achievers to cup winners, in another semi and on course for Europe.

 

We aren't Aberdeen but see what you have and play them to their strengths before its too late.

[+jagster 509]

I bet even Rick Astley would give up on Hughes

[Macduffer 108]

I bet even Rick Astley would give up on Hughes

Who does he play for?

[Guest Mahonio]

Just read BBC Teletexts Thursday gossip column and saw this piece of gossip "Fulham are preparing to sack boss Felix Magath just 6 weeks after appointing him because he has alienated the players with his training methods (Daily Star) so if he is close to sack after only 6 weeks for alienating his players with his training methods, then Hughes should be sacked for alienating our players with his tactics, no?

Edited April 2, 2014 by Mahonio

[+jagster 509]

I bet even Rick Astley would give up on Hughes

Who does he play for?[/quote

He plays for the one hit wonders. One more than Hughes wil achieve

[clacher_holiday2 219]

Just read BBC Teletexts Thursday gossip column and saw this piece of gossip "Fulham are preparing to sack boss Felix Magath just 6 weeks after appointing him because he has alienated the players with his training methods (Daily Star) so if he is close to sack after only 6 weeks for alienating his players with his training methods, then Hughes should be sacked for alienating our players with his tactics, no?

 

Bit different here.lol

Edited April 2, 2014 by clacher_holiday2

[ICTRoughi 639]

Just read BBC Teletexts Thursday gossip column and saw this piece of gossip "Fulham are preparing to sack boss Felix Magath just 6 weeks after appointing him because he has alienated the players with his training methods (Daily Star) so if he is close to sack after only 6 weeks for alienating his players with his training methods, then Hughes should be sacked for alienating our players with his tactics, no?

Teams in the premier league have money to throw about, we don't.

[Renegade 2,602]

That was also from the Daily Star!

[Macduffer 108]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2010/sep/24/john-hughes-hibernian-manager

 

sound familiar?

[+jagster 509]

4 wins in 25 we should be so lucky

Edited April 2, 2014 by jagster

[The Long Man 489]

Sums it up:

 

http://nareystoepoker.blogspot.co.uk/2014/04/hughes-and-ict-are-terrible-match.html

[Sneckboy 1,215]

El Crapico on Friday is a must win in my eyes.

 

Yeah, I'd agree. Particularly with a two week break afterwards - it would at least see us entering the post-split fixtures on a better note.

Momentum and fortunes can change quickly in football and with Dundee United playing Celtic at the weekend, who knows, we might be going into the final 5 fixtures 'just' 2 points behind the Taysiders.

 

I'm maybe sounding a bit 'happy clappy' with the following scenario but it could be something to emphasise how our season may just have one final twist!

 

The week-off for the Cup Semi-finals could realistically result in a Scottish Cup Final of Aberdeen v. Dundee United, with a Dons win ensuring that 4th place in the league qualifies for Europe.

 

Then we kick-off the resumption of the league with a home game on the Friday - with a win potentially seeing us leapfrog United into 4th place.

Could the dynamic then change? Would their forthcoming Cup Final take some focus off their league games?

 

Looking at the remaining fixtures, and assuming we take nothing from Celtic or Motherwell, winning our remaining home games (a big ask!?) could just be enough!

 

This really isn't being overly harsh on United, giving them a draw at Perth followed by a win over Motherwell. They finish this hypothetical scenario by drawing with the Dons before also even getting a point at Parkhead.

 

Dundee United                54  (St Johnstone (a) 55)  (Motherwell (h) 58)          (Inverness (a) 58)    (Aberdeen (h) 59)             (Celtic (a) 60)

Inverness Caley Thistle   52       (Aberdeen (h) 55)          (Celtic (a) 55)  (Dundee United (h) 58)  (Motherwell (a) 58)  (St Johnstone (h) 61) 

 

So, it could be done in theory, but a win in Dingwall is a must - otherwise our chances will be virtually extinguished!

[bdu98196 1,117]

I don't want to see us qualify for Europe even if we could do it through 4th, as that would be seen as success and while the players deserve it for the first half of the season, I fear it would 'paper' over the cracks that have appeared since Hughes has come in. Our form and displays have been awful and the 'togetherness' seems to be evaporating. Maybe the bar of expectation has risen after the first half of the season, but on current form we are relgation fodder - a team of good players don't become bad overnight - we are trying to put square pegs into round holes at best.

[ymip 321]

Clearly none of us were present during the interview process but I'm assuming that the thrust of Hughes oratory master class was broadly along the lines of the media sound bytes we all heard after his appointment wherein we were assured (quotes from BBC website): 

 

 "Terry has done a wonderful job, so I'll be taking on the mantle."........"I'm not going to change too much,".......yadda, yadda...."right good laddies"...etc,etc.

 

Again, assuming this is what he told the board then I'd suggest they have grounds for a dismissal citing misrepresentation on Hughes' part.  The scary part from my perspective is that I'm not entirely convinced that the board members have the footballing nous to appreciate what he's attempting to do in terms of deconstructing the high tempo pressing style of play adopted with such success under Butcher and replacing with this tiki-taka lite in our own box with the train wreck consequences we've seen to date.  Assuming Iniesta and co are unwilling to swap Catalunya for the frozen North and the harsh reality that we are unlikely to attract players of their ilk on wages south of £1,000/week it would appear sensible to play to the strengths of the players we currently have under contract. 

 

I received a text last week from a reasonably reliable source with no real interest in ICT matters who recounted a rather convoluted and long-winded line of dialogue allegedly emanating from Hughes along the lines that he didn't rate a lot of the players, too many lacked heart and he couldn't wait until the Summer to get some "proper" players in.  Whether or not this is actually what was said by Hughes is a moot point, I would suggest that his actions/tactics to date would suggest that this is precisely his thought process.   The last part in particular fills me with dread - letting Hughes free in the transfer window is akin to letting toddlers play with power tools. 

 

As much as the thought pains me I would imagine that messrs Dorran and Ross must be tidying up their CVs as we speak.  They are clearly surplus to requirements in the Hughes era and despite both being "right good laddies" are pretty much redundant given his proposed tactical (sic) game plan.

 

Call me crazy but that's kind of how I see it...

[+Naelifts 345]

You gotta be crazee man!

[Renegade 2,602]

Hughes wanting to punt certain players would certainly explain his tactical stubbornness.  He'll keep plodding away at this rubbish and punt the ones who don't like it or fit into the system.  No doubt they'll be replaced by journeymen and other harlequins such as Derek Riordan and the like.  Nick Ross will surely be one and maybe Watkins and Williams as well.

 

Hughes has been a disaster for this club.  Maybe in the long term, losing the cup final wasn't such a bad thing at all.

[RiG 3,596]

 

All of what is being said on these pages is exactly what fans of Falkirk, Hibs and Livingston were saying on Pie and Bovril when he was appointed. None of this should be a shock to anyone.

Is P&B really that old?

 

 

Been on the go since January 2003.

[TopSix 658]

Losing in the cup final was an awful experience. Really awful.

On the other hand, winning the cup would have merely served to mask over issues which many supporters now have. I really hope we can hang on to Nick Ross and the young players we have started to see more frequently in the first XI. Next season could be very messy and with some of the teams in the 'Championship', well, who knows. I doubt we'd see bouncebackability though.

[DoofersDad 4,102]

 

I received a text last week from a reasonably reliable source with no real interest in ICT matters who recounted a rather convoluted and long-winded line of dialogue allegedly emanating from Hughes along the lines that he didn't rate a lot of the players, too many lacked heart and he couldn't wait until the Summer to get some "proper" players in.  Whether or not this is actually what was said by Hughes is a moot point, I would suggest that his actions/tactics to date would suggest that this is precisely his thought process.   The last part in particular fills me with dread - letting Hughes free in the transfer window is akin to letting toddlers play with power tools. 

 

 

 

This is supported by the clip posted at 415.  There is a very clear suggestion that he thinks the players are not working hard enough. Where I think he may have a point is that there is a tendency to stand off too much and not close down quickly enough. But that ignores the real issue.  The issue is what we are doing with the ball when we have it.  If he would use some width and allow the players to attack the space with pace, he'll soon see that the players have heart.

 

These players got us to 2nd in the league.  They are good enough alright and we are lucky to have them.  What we need is for the manager to have the guts to change his tactics to suit the very considerable talent and heart at his disposal.

[RiG 3,596]

Sound familiar? (Link to post on P & B)

 

I just heard this on the radio when I was in the car  

 

Given the folk who applied I'd be severely underwhelmed if not utterly disappointed if my team had just appointed John Hughes.

 

His time at Falkirk was frustrating to the max, you could see that there was so much potential in the squad or you could see that a game was there for the taking but John would just stick to what he 'knew' and you'd sit there pulling your hair out at his inadequacies and lack of ideas.

 

He has a genuine eye for a player though - I think he'd make an excellent scout or even an assistant manager - but he failed to use the players he brought in properly ... sometimes not even using them at all !!! usually cause he fell out with them or they wouldn't be bullied !! Take Denzil for instance, the only time I saw him play was on telly during the World Cup where he had David f'kin Beckham in his back pocket for the entire game - he played zero minutes for Falkirk ! And then Roman Wallner ... I saw him come off the bench and change a game .... then he never plaed for Falkirk again  

 

And then there were the players he insisted on using all the f'kin time who should not have been anywhere near the pitch !! 

 

He also hated fans favorites for some reason (other than Latapy of course) Chanting or shouting for a player to come off the bench was the worst thing you could do as a supporter cause it meant John would just not bring him on !

 

I think he could have done more at Falkirk - his stubbornness and lack of a Plan 'B' (and sometimes even a Plan 'A') let him down - I believe he has had the most resources at his disposal than any other Falkirk manager in my time, I think other managers would have done better under those circumstances,

 

In the end he left us in a right ruddy mess with a team of over-paid, OAPs on longer contracts than he ever offered any youngsters  !!

 

It still felt like we had a rookie in charge right to the end  

 

 

Also this post, also on P & B, from a Falkirk fan which I am sure was referenced in other Hughes threads on here.

 

I have mixed feelings.

There's no denying he's done remarkably well to get us where we are just now, we don't play a boring long ball game (but more on that later) and have a good squad of great young players (Barr, Scobie, Cregg, Craig and Finnegan to name a few).

However, he has several bad points.

He has a streak of pride that I believe seriously prohibits players signing for us. We've seen players be benched, dropped and never play for us again after (allegedly) falling out with the manager, we've all heard the rumours and McBreen, McKenzie, Tiago and O'Donnell. Similarly, his "pals" seem to get a game every week regardless of form or fitness (Latapy, O'Neill and Kernaghan when they were here). It can't be good for players looking for a club to see things like this happening.

His record on signing strikers is very, very poor. True, we've seen Duffy and Stokes (and Thomson and McBreen both did a job) but we've also seen Lee, McMenamin, Xsausa, Barret, Stewart, Moutinho, Gow - who, despite a couple of them being good players, are not prolific goalscorers. Which brings me nicely to...

...We have no Plan B. Sure, we play passing football, but we are much the same as Arsenal (without the ability, obviously) in that we try to score the perfect goal all the time. We can't vary our style of play to counter teams who have learned to block us out, and that's why we can't beat teams like Aberdeen, Motherwell, Kilmarnock or St Mirren on a regular (if at all) basis. Also...

...We don't actually play good football all that often. Even in the season we steamrollered the first division, we were only brilliant up until the transfer window - then in came Kernaghan and we amazingly went to a back 5 of James (or Sharp), Hughes and Kernaghan, and played the most boring long-ball football I've ever seen. Which I wouldn't have minded had we the players in midfield or attack to deal with it! In our first season in the SPL, we took 4 points out of a possible 48 or something like that in one horrible spell. Even last season, after Stokes had left the football wasn't particularly pretty to watch - but then neither is most of the SPL.

Has he done well? Undoubtedly. Can he take us further? Remains to be seen.

 

 

[PerfICT 1,212]

Clearly none of us were present during the interview process but I'm assuming that the thrust of Hughes oratory master class was broadly along the lines of the media sound bytes we all heard after his appointment wherein we were assured (quotes from BBC website): 

 

 "Terry has done a wonderful job, so I'll be taking on the mantle."........"I'm not going to change too much,".......yadda, yadda...."right good laddies"...etc,etc.

 

Again, assuming this is what he told the board then I'd suggest they have grounds for a dismissal citing misrepresentation on Hughes' part.  The scary part from my perspective is that I'm not entirely convinced that the board members have the footballing nous to appreciate what he's attempting to do in terms of deconstructing the high tempo pressing style of play adopted with such success under Butcher and replacing with this tiki-taka lite in our own box with the train wreck consequences we've seen to date.  Assuming Iniesta and co are unwilling to swap Catalunya for the frozen North and the harsh reality that we are unlikely to attract players of their ilk on wages south of £1,000/week it would appear sensible to play to the strengths of the players we currently have under contract. 

 

I received a text last week from a reasonably reliable source with no real interest in ICT matters who recounted a rather convoluted and long-winded line of dialogue allegedly emanating from Hughes along the lines that he didn't rate a lot of the players, too many lacked heart and he couldn't wait until the Summer to get some "proper" players in.  Whether or not this is actually what was said by Hughes is a moot point, I would suggest that his actions/tactics to date would suggest that this is precisely his thought process.   The last part in particular fills me with dread - letting Hughes free in the transfer window is akin to letting toddlers play with power tools. 

 

As much as the thought pains me I would imagine that messrs Dorran and Ross must be tidying up their CVs as we speak.  They are clearly surplus to requirements in the Hughes era and despite both being "right good laddies" are pretty much redundant given his proposed tactical (sic) game plan.

 

Call me crazy but that's kind of how I see it...

Terrifying.

[ictchris 1,200]

He's a dreadful manager, awful appointment.  We are going exactly the same way that his previous clubs did - no cutting edge, terrible home form, bafflement from the manager.  We'll be 11th or 12th by Christmas next year, if we don't sack him quickly enough it'll be goodnight Vienna.

[KingBeastie 748]

If there's a problem between the dressing room hopefully Ritchie will step up and represent the players point.  I'm sure the board will listen to him.