Replacement Striker?

[12th Man]

And how old is he?

He's 25.

higher higher

[ICTPaisley]

Not sure if you mean Black or not but he's 30. 

[+DoofersDad]

One of the worrying aspects of this is the lack of faith being shown in our two young strikers Sutherland and Ferguson.  Despite our lack of replacements for Mckay and Watkins, neither of the youngsters was even on the bench for either of the Astra games and we seemed to be one short on the bench in Romania.  Maybe they are both out injured but surely this would have given options.

I've heard it said that Yogi is reluctant to play youngsters before they are ready .  I certainly agree that unrealistic expectations can put a lot of pressure on youngsters but if they are good enough they are good enough.  If either or both of them was fit or available I can't think of anything that would dent their confidence more than seeing that empty space on the bench whilst the manager allows a new signing to play the full 90 minutes in stifling heat when, by his own admission, Lopez is not match fit.  

[CaleyAlly]

One of the worrying aspects of this is the lack of faith being shown in our two young strikers Sutherland and Ferguson.  Despite our lack of replacements for Mckay and Watkins, neither of the youngsters was even on the bench for either of the Astra games and we seemed to be one short on the bench in Romania.  Maybe they are both out injured but surely this would have given options.

I've heard it said that Yogi is reluctant to play youngsters before they are ready .  I certainly agree that unrealistic expectations can put a lot of pressure on youngsters but if they are good enough they are good enough.  If either or both of them was fit or available I can't think of anything that would dent their confidence more than seeing that empty space on the bench whilst the manager allows a new signing to play the full 90 minutes in stifling heat when, by his own admission, Lopez is not match fit.  

Calum Ferguson posted on twitter a couple of weeks back he's injured not sure if hes still out and i though sutherland was more of a winger? 

[ICTRoughi]

He seems to still have *some* interest in adding to that position when he brought Norburn in on trial.  

Its interesting you say that because I was looking on Football Manager 2015 (I know) for information on Andrea Mbuyi-Mutombo and it said that his best postition is central midfield/attacking central midfielder but he can also play up front which would explain his lack of goals over the years.  

[GaliantGrunt]

A bit off topic, but an Ian Vigurs turned out for Inverurie Locos against Nairn Co on Saturday ?

[Renegade]

He seems to still have *some* interest in adding to that position when he brought Norburn in on trial.  

Its interesting you say that because I was looking on Football Manager 2015 (I know) for information on Andrea Mbuyi-Mutombo and it said that his best postition is central midfield/attacking central midfielder but he can also play up front which would explain his lack of goals over the years.  

That would fit more with the style of player he was against Nairn.  Wikipedia also alludes to him being a midfielder at one point.  As I've said previously, he looks more a Watkins/Christie than a Mckay and that info would go along with what we saw.

[Sneckboy]

A bit off topic, but an Ian Vigurs turned out for Inverurie Locos against Nairn Co on Saturday ?

Yeah, it was noted by Dawson on Saturday night in the 'Ex-ICT Players' news' thread - it is indeed him!

[DEANO96]

Derek riordan? 

[Kingsmills]

Derek riordan? 

Would rather have Ray Reardon....

[Renegade]

Derek riordan? 

A washed up never-was trouble making waste of space.  No chance.

[Row S]

Rumour going round that Marley is to return - issues with him at Barnsley apparently.

[DEANO96]

Marley wouldn't return even if there was problems...he'd end up at rangers or hearts! 

[bdu98196]

Window is open while yet so no panic, I always believe there are good players out there who will currently be pricing themselves out of ICT's budget, wait another few weeks til they have the choice of no club or dropping demands and expectations - that way we may get someone who is better value and desperate to prove themselves to get a move to a bigger club/salary.

[Kingsmills]

Window is open while yet so no panic, I always believe there are good players out there who will currently be pricing themselves out of ICT's budget, wait another few weeks til they have the choice of no club or dropping demands and expectations - that way we may get someone who is better value and desperate to prove themselves to get a move to a bigger club/salary.

Do we really want someone who is only prepared to come once they have run out of any other options ?

[+DoofersDad]

I don't see a problem.  If a player has not received a "better" offer it will be because clubs feel he is not worth the kind of money he is looking for.  If a player aspires to play at a level warranting that kind of money then he needs to prove himself.  He will only be able to prove himself if he gives 100% to the cause and develops as a player.  He might even like it here and decide to stay (if offered an extension)!

[+bughtmaster]

A man without ambition is a poor man.

An ambitious man will work for low pay if he knows he can prove himself and improve his wage given the chance.

[bdu98196]

An ambitious man will work for low pay if he knows he can prove himself and improve his wage given the chance.

Exactly my point, if its not ideally where someone believes or wants to be they will work hard to prove that and elevate to their percieved level (whether we agree thats where they should be or not)

 

Do we really want someone who is only prepared to come once they have run out of any other options ?

If it means we can get a higher quality of player then we would normally be able to afford because they have had to downsize expectations - then yes. Isnt this the exact same approach we take when we have signed risks who have failed to make the grade elsewhere or had a history of injuries - we are the highest level offering an option?

[ICTRoughi]

What about Lee Miller? Given the recent calls by our supporters saying we need an out and out striker, I reckon he could do a job. Granted it never worked out for him at Killie but he had competition from Tope Obadayi and Josh Magennis, it would have been difficult. His goal scoring record at Carlisle was quite good and I reckon we could get the best out of him. 

The only thing for me would be that Dani Lopez could turn out to be the all out striker and with time he could turn into a real goal scorer but I reckon Lee Miller would be a good addition to the squad.

[Sneckboy]

I think he's past Premiership standard, but I'm sure he'd do a decent job at Championship level. Nowadays, I'd say he's more suited to a club like Raith Rovers, Livingston or Dumbarton. Not a dud by any means, but I'd hope we can get better!

[Guest]

Ian Black, Derek Riordan and Lee Miller suggested in the past few pages, jesus. We will go nowhere but backwards if we sign these sorts of players - our success has been built on signing hungry youngsters and the odd experienced player with a great attitude. 

If you want to see what happens when your ambition only stretches as far as signing Scottish "name" players, watch what happens to Kilmarnock this season. I reckon they will be bottom six once again and probably in the lower end of that.

[Yngwie]

Ian Black, Derek Riordan and Lee Miller suggested in the past few pages, jesus.

It's only a matter of time til Garry O'Connor gets a mention!

Edited July 28, 2015 by Yngwie

[ICTRoughi]

Ian Black, Derek Riordan and Lee Miller suggested in the past few pages, jesus. We will go nowhere but backwards if we sign these sorts of players - our success has been built on signing hungry youngsters and the odd experienced player with a great attitude. 

If you want to see what happens when your ambition only stretches as far as signing Scottish "name" players, watch what happens to Kilmarnock this season. I reckon they will be bottom six once again and probably in the lower end of that.

I disagree with that as it depends on the attitude of the individual players. Granted the former two Ian Black and Derek Riordan shouldn't go anywhere near them with the baggage they come with but I definitely think Lee Miller could do a job for us with the experience he has in the top flight even if it's a back up to Dani Lopez. 

ICT are renowned for taking players in when the career's have taken a dip and got the best out them - why would it be different here? Look at the impact Scott McDonald made to Motherwell last season.

[Guest]

Miller has lost any pace he once had, is injury prone and scored 1 goal in 19 games in a very similar Kilmarnock team that managed to provide Kris Boyd with the service to score 20+ goals the season before. I don't think he has ever played in a top six side. He isn't what we need, even as back up, unless Yogi is planning on totally overhauling his philosophy to go down the hoofball route.

I don't think we have ever signed a player who was over the age of thirty and got more out of them than they were producing elsewhere. The exception may be Paul Ritchie who we signed at a time where the club didn't need the quality of player that we do now.

Scott Macdonald is a bit different as he still has the pace and finishing ability to trouble defences. Even so, Motherwell will get two more seasons out of him at most at his current level.

[ICTRoughi]

Miller has lost any pace he once had, is injury prone and scored 1 goal in 19 games in a very similar Kilmarnock team that managed to provide Kris Boyd with the service to score 20+ goals the season before. I don't think he has ever played in a top six side. He isn't what we need, even as back up, unless Yogi is planning on totally overhauling his philosophy to go down the hoofball route.

I don't think we have ever signed a player who was over the age of thirty and got more out of them than they were producing elsewhere. The exception may be Paul Ritchie who we signed at a time where the club didn't need the quality of player that we do now.

Scott Macdonald is a bit different as he still has the pace and finishing ability to trouble defences. Even so, Motherwell will get two more seasons out of him at most at his current level.

In an ideal world, I would like to get someone that is younger and more promising but I don't know, I just think that Lee Miller could offer us a decent turn even still if it was in a back up capacity. I also think under the coaching and guidance of Yogi and Brian Rice, we could get a better player out him than he was last season with Kilmarnock. 

Edited July 28, 2015 by ICTRoughi