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Who should we keep, who should we punt?


SMEE

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I don't know how many would agree but I would like to see a new Keeper on the shopping list.

I saw somewhere Polworth take Tanseys place? I don't know if that would work out, for me he is nowhere near the same quality, so a replacement for Tansey of course.

I would very much like to see Alex Fisher get offered something. Sure, he may not fancy a wage cut and championship football BUT he could be the next Caley Thistle Golden boy. a fan favourite perhaps? I may be blethering, its been a long day...

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On 29/04/2017 at 8:59 AM, PerfICT said:

 

Of the regular squad this season ignoring those on loan:

Goalies:

Fon Williams will presumably move on, Esson can stay as back up, give Mackay a chance as first choice, retain Hoban.

Defenders:

Meekings will presumably move on, retain Raven, Tremarco, Warren and Laing as first picks if they want to stay, with Mckay as back up. Retain McNaughton too if affordable.

Midfielders:

Suspect Draper will move on and Polworth probably will too (may be the best for him and the team I hate to say). I'd retain Vigurs and Doran if affordable, but not convinced about Mulraney. 

Forwards:

We must do all we can to retain Fisher. I'd retain Boden and Ebbe to see what they can do.

That gives a starting line up of:

Mackay

Raven, Warren, Laing, Tremarco

Vigurs, Doran, ??, ??

Fisher, Boden

so midfield could be the priority this close season depending on the quality of our youngsters.

I gather Andrew MacRae is one for the future, so may be worth trying along with Jason Brown.

No doubt the above will differ greatly from what happens in practice!

Edited by Robert
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7 hours ago, ictfcsince94 said:

Cammy 

Tremarco, Warren, McKay Raven

Mulraney Vigurs, Polworth,Doran

Boden Ebbe

with the exception of Doran's wage being a stumbling block, I don't see much wrong with this line up as a potential place to start.

Brad Mckay's level may well be suited to the Championship, but if his wage demand aren't met, and he can secure alternative employment who could blame him for moving on.

would love big drapes to stay, but suspect he'll be on the a96 bus as well?

That strikes me as a quite a lightweight midfield, and I suspect Doran will be a perennial 'sicknote', as for that front line...meh

If we have any decent youngsters next year is the time to get them into the team..but we do need a strong core, if we get that right, we stand a chance

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13 hours ago, ictfcsince94 said:

Would love Fisher to stay, but reckon he could be playing for our opponents today.....

Fonners and Draper etc will have release clauses I'm sure. I just wonder how many will opt to stay for the reduced wages just because they like it here, and maybe will want to atone for their mistakes. 

Fisher to Motherwell?

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Ross County bound? I am wondering if any of our players will be pulling on a RC shirt next season. I have heard that Andrew Davies is on 3k plus per week. If some of our guys have 'relegation releases' in their contracts, like living here and playing Premiership football, and with the money RC have, this could well be a dreaded scenario in a matter of weeks. :cry::cry:

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17 minutes ago, TheMantis said:

Try 4.5k. 

If that's correct then RC are quite literally in a different league to us in more ways than one!!

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23 minutes ago, Caman said:

If that's correct then RC are quite literally in a different league to us in more ways than one!!

I think that's just him as captain and the repeated rumours of keeping him/his wife from wanting to go home. Don't think it's a typical wage.

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Tremarco got player of the season, it's on his twitter account. He is also talking about us getting back up next season to where we belong. So i think he will stay, plus he is contracted until next summer. 

Raven, likewise on twitter is talking about 'sticking together' and he is contracted until January 18. 

Billy Mckay - I am sure he had Inverness etc on his profile, but now just states 'Footballer'. Didn't expect him to stay tbh. 

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Draper to st johnstone to replace danny swanson and play european football.

HOPE Fisher will stay if given a chance as we have kept faith with him but cant blame him if he gets a better offer. 

Jason brown at centre back along with warren and one other for cover.  Tremarco for lm not lb especially in championship.  Get a youngster in at lb who plays as full back not wing back. 

Rb is up for debate but raven could do a job. I think meekings will be lucky to get a contract anywhere with his record so may stay? 

Lets blood the youngsters..

 

                         Mackay/hoben

Raven/mackay warren  brown youngster

               Vigurs  polworth

Mulreany                   tremarco

Ali Sutherland ....Fisher 

Bench  boden ebbe mcnaughton?

Lots to try and recruit. . . 

 

Shane sutherland would be able to step up now. . . .

 

 

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OFW - (Contact Summer 2019). Would've kept him if we had stayed up, however, if a release can be negotiated (and I think he'd want to leave) then get rid of him. Not the worst keeper, but not the best either.  RELEASE. 

Esson - (Contract Summer 2018). Keep as a back up/coach. Won't be on too big a wage and has lots of experience. KEEP.

Mackay - (Contract unknown). Keep and make 1st choice. He's been in and around the 1st team for a while now and it's a good time to give him a chance. If he's struggling, then we have the experience of Esson to call upon. KEEP

 

 

Raven - (Contact January 2018). Been one of our best players over the last few weeks and loves the club. Definitely keep - would do a good job in the championship. KEEP

Laing - (Out of contract). I've been a big fan of Laing since he came and would definitely keep him, although I expect he may want to go. If he is willing to stay then I would love to see him get a new deal. KEEP

Warren - (Contract Summer 2019) Definitely keep. Exactly the kind of player we need to get us back up. Him and Laing have looked solid together. I think he'd be on a fair wage, however, I'm wondering if this might be a problem. KEEP

Meekings - (Out of contact). Can't see him staying. Expect to see him in an Aberdeen shirt next season with them needing a new CB. IF a new deal can be agreed then great, but I would be content with Laing and Warren. He's been a great servant over the years, shame he won't get a proper send off. KEEP (Unlikely though)

Mckay - (Out of contract). Keep. Solid player and I think he'd do well in the Championship (probably his level). KEEP

McNaughton - (Out of contract). Keep. Again, experience could be invaluable. Hopefully he would be affordable. KEEP

Horner - (out of contract). Has to go. Shocked at some saying he should be kept for his versatility. The fact is, he's terrible wherever he plays. How he's still with us I don't know. RELEASE. 

Tremarco (Contract Summer 2018) Goes without saying that we need Carl to stay. He's been fantastic and will be quality in the Championship. He's already talking about next season so he clearly wants to stay. KEEP 

 

Tansey (OFF) - Sad to see Greg go. Find some of the abuse he got yesterday shocking. One of the best midfielders in the league in my opinion, and the kind of player I love. Drags us through games at times with his range of passing. In fairness, he'll be 29 soon so we probably had the best of him. Worst part will be seeing him in an Aberdeen shirt. GONE

Draper (Contract Summer 2019) - In my opinion, the biggest bit of business this summer is keeping Drapes. I can't see it, he'll surely want off, but it would be great if we could keep him. We need that sort of player in the Championship. I think he mentioned when he signed a new deal last time that his family love it here and he's got a child growing up here, so hopefully that will tempt him to stay. I do fear, though, that his wages might prove too much for us. If he leaves, then we need to make sure we get some good money for him. KEEP

Polworth - Contract until Summer 2019) - Has to stay. He's been shoved out onto the wing this season to accommodate Tansey and Draper. Whenever he has played through the middle, he has been the best player on the pitch. I'm hoping next season he comes into his own. KEEP

Doran (Contact until Summer 2018) - Tough one. I can't see him getting many offers from elsewhere with him practically having 2 years out. My gut feeling is to keep him. On his day, he is (was) one of the best wingers in the top flight. That year where he finished top for assists, he just sprayed cross after cross in for Billy and was the main reason we did so well. If he can get back to that then he could be big for us. I'd say keep him if he takes a wage cut (although, if he's under contact I guess he can't be forced to take a wage cut?) KEEP

Mulraney - (Contract until Summer 2018) - Not too fussed. Has shown moments of brilliance, but have a feeling that him and Foran don't get on too well. If he stays he will do well next season but blow hot and cold. If he goes, I won't be gutted. I'd say keep if we can afford and if not, bin. (NOT SURE)

Vigurs - (Contract until Summer 2018) - like everyone else, he frustrates me. I like him as a player and he has moments of brilliance, but at times he is so frustrating. I'd say with Tansey going we should keep him and, especially in the championship, I think his quality will shine through. KEEP

 

Fisher - (Out of contract) - Hope he stays. Hopefully the love affair with the fans at the moment persuades him. Can see some bottom 6/St Johnstone kind of club taking him on with his recent goal spurt probably catching their eye. If he stays, give him the number 9 shirt and I reckon he'll bang in 20+. KEEP

Anier -(Out of contract) - Hopeless. Offers nothing anywhere on the pitch and if the ball comes near him, just chooses to foul the defender. RELEASE.

Boden - (Contract until Summer 2019) - In fairness to him, he's not been given much of a chance. I'd keep him and see what he's like in the Championship - he clearly has something about him after scoring so many for Newport. KEEP

Ebbe (Out of contract) - Looked good in Dev league and deserves a chance. KEEP

 

Out of all the loan players, I wouldn't keep any bar Billy (which I can't see happening). RF did say he'd like to keep 10 of yesterdays XI which gives me hope, but I can't see it. McCart has done well since coming in, but apart from that, all of the loan players have been disappointing. 

Foran - (Contract until 2020) - Richie has been thrown in at the deep end this season. Yes, he's made mistakes (none more so that Fisher's exile), but I would keep him. He has had to contend with injuries at the wrong times, player issues, and the club trying to recover from losing valuable players. Most of his signings have looked good on paper (McNaughton, King, Cole) but haven't materialised for a variety of reasons. There is no point sacking him now that we are down. He will have learnt so much from this season and if he was going to be sacked, it would have been done by now. We also can't afford to sack him. As he mentioned yesterday, his experience of winning Div 1 will be good too and I feel he will turn things around next season. He loves the club and you can see the passion in him and that counts for so much. KEEP

 

So next season, we have a potential starting XI of...

                 Mackay

Raven  Laing  Warren  Tremarco

      Draper Polworth   Vigurs

    Doran    Fisher     Boden

 

Back Ups

Esson

McNaughton, McKay

Mulraney

Ebbe.

 

Clearly, in the summer, we will need to bulk up the midfield as we're looking a bit bare there.      

 

Edited by CaleyThistle
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I wonder how many of the players we want to keep will make their decision based largely on who the manager is?

(Polite way of asking which of them will be off like a shot if Foran is staying)

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Undecided on Fisher.  Part of me enjoys his appetite for the game, he's almost a throwback to the days when we had technically limited but wholehearted players who would leave everything out on the pitch.  Another part of me thinks that this hides his faults and that he would bind us to a particular style of football.

As for everyone else - Tremarco, Warren and Draper are must keeps.  That's it.  Everyone else is either dispensable or will look to move on.  After hearing Tansey's aftermatch comments yesterday I'm almost happy he's leaving...  We talk about the club engaging with the community and the fanbase - his interview showed a huge amount of disrespect to both those groups.  Makes me reconsider spending £330 on a season ticket and funding his replacement's Jagerbomb/Nando's diet.

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Players who are contracted until next season are Fon williams, Esson,  Tremarco, Brad Mackay, Warren, Raven, Draper, Polworth, Mulreany, Doran, Vigurs and Boden. If we want to get rid of them we need to either pay up or hope someone wants to buy them. 

I was speaking to my mate the other night on the way to the Dundee game and we really haven't had a productive close season in terms of bringing players in since 2013, when we signed Watkins, Tremarco, Vincent and Williams. In 2014 we had a settled squad and in the time since then we've mainly signed utter dross. Our squad is stale and we thought that relying on the same guys we have done would do it this season - it didn't. We need to freshen up but doing that in the Championship, with a manager who hasn't given any indications he'll be able to step up to the challenge, is going to be very hard.

 

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Here is the next season guide of relegated teams from the SPFL in the years since we were last in the second tier

2010: Falkirk, 2011 - 3rd

2011: Hamilton, 2012 - 4th

2012: Dunfermline, 2013 - 9th

2013: Dundee, 2014 - 1st

2014: Hearts / Hibs, 2015 - 1st / 2nd

2015: St Mirren, 2016 - 6th

2016: Dundee Utd, 2017 - 3rd

Works out to an average of about a fifth placed finish for the relegated team.

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I'm happy with pretty much everyone in the squad, Cole and King apart*. A decent manager, or even Malpas alongside someone with a bit more charisma, could have made that squad competitive.

OFW looked a weak point but he was fine last season. He only really became dodgy when he had that injury and was forced to play on. Not sure how much that hampered him thereafter.

*(actually, not too sure about Boden, Horner or Arnier either)

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5 hours ago, ictchris said:

Here is the next season guide of relegated teams from the SPFL in the years since we were last in the second tier

2010: Falkirk, 2011 - 3rd

2011: Hamilton, 2012 - 4th

2012: Dunfermline, 2013 - 9th

2013: Dundee, 2014 - 1st

2014: Hearts / Hibs, 2015 - 1st / 2nd

2015: St Mirren, 2016 - 6th

2016: Dundee Utd, 2017 - 3rd

Works out to an average of about a fifth placed finish for the relegated team.

If we finish 4th by the way it gives us a shout at promotion through the play offs.

Surely achievable .

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Lonsana Doumbouya was allowed to leave in January under contract for nothing. The board havent made a correct decision since the end of the 14/15 season. Not letting yogi speak to United was the start of it. From the Board room to the twitter feed sack them all IMO. Terry butcher will bring us back. We'll see the highs of the 14/15 season again but not with the people currently employed by the football club. We need a massive rebuild

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38 minutes ago, ICT94Scott said:

Lonsana Doumbouya was allowed to leave in January under contract for nothing. The board havent made a correct decision since the end of the 14/15 season. Not letting yogi speak to United was the start of it. From the Board room to the twitter feed sack them all IMO. Terry butcher will bring us back. We'll see the highs of the 14/15 season again but not with the people currently employed by the football club. We need a massive rebuild

You were making sense right up until you mentioned TB....forwards not backwards

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Again, this seems moot - the players that will remain are the ones that either don't have a relegation release clause written into their contracts, or those willing to take the pay cut to stay here. 

The likes of Brad and Ebbe with 'options' will wait and see if anything presents itself, but a successful season in the Championship will guarantee them in the premiership next year, either with us or by putting themselves into a shop window.

We need a less sentimental and more hard-line approach to contract negotiations. Josh and Tansey refusing to sign extensions should have guaranteed they went up for sale.  That goes for everyone. Little money is better than no money, which seems to have happened a hell of a lot! If a contract is put on the table and refused, then cheerio! 

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3 minutes ago, ictfcsince94 said:

Again, this seems moot - the players that will remain are the ones that either don't have a relegation release clause written into their contracts, or those willing to take the pay cut to stay here. 

The likes of Brad and Ebbe with 'options' will wait and see if anything presents itself, but a successful season in the Championship will guarantee them in the premiership next year, either with us or by putting themselves into a shop window.

We need a less sentimental and more hard-line approach to contract negotiations. Josh and Tansey refusing to sign extensions should have guaranteed they went up for sale.  That goes for everyone. Little money is better than no money, which seems to have happened a hell of a lot! If a contract is put on the table and refused, then cheerio! 

That's how Terry and Mo went about it, you can't be sentimental in football management especially with a small club like ours who can't afford to carry any passengers. They made some hard and at the time unpopular decisions over players including our aging legends, but in the long run they were correct. Then there was also players like Adam Rooney, Danny Williams and Andrew Shinnie who decided that their future lay elsewhere months before the end of their contracts and they were allowed to move on, there was no point in holding them back because they didn't want to play for the club any more, we want players who want to be here.

Richie's comments about rotten apples and how he couldn't be rid of them just looked like a show of weakness, it was sad to see a once great player and a very good captain reduced to that kind of comment just moments after we were confirmed as relegated. If players don't want to be at the club while the season is in progress then they should be shown the door regardless, they are just taking someone else's place and wages who might want to.

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