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EGM called on 3rd October


RiG

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41 minutes ago, old caley girl said:

Can I refer you to the post by A sofa in San Tropez on page one of the Chairman resigns thread. Explains exactly how we are keeping doors open prior to soft loans being written off. I think what club are saying is this is unsustainable in the Championship long term. 

If you are local come along on tuesday and ask exactly that! 

The post you're referring to implies that the providers of said loans are preparing to take control of the club. Why then, this EGM and the dramatic language that surrounds it? Is it just a PR exercise to prepare the ground for them to scale down the youth system when they come in?

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8 minutes ago, Caley Stan said:

The post you're referring to implies that the providers of said loans are preparing to take control of the club. Why then, this EGM and the dramatic language that surrounds it? Is it just a PR exercise to prepare the ground for them to scale down the youth system when they come in?

They were not mentioned last night to my knowledge. I think the purpose of meeting was to try to obtain new investment and persuade certain individuals to come on board? 

As for youth  it is very clear the current set up is expensive and doesnt work for us. There is an argument that it isnt value for money. Dropping down a teir doesnt have many benefits either. I think its clear to carry on as we are we need more funding. 

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I should add the best way forward is for us to get promoted. Apart from the obvious increase in money the added increase in away crowds would be welcome. 

Those who thought a couple if seasons down would be a great wheeze have now well and truly been shown a reality check 

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27 minutes ago, old caley girl said:

I should add the best way forward is for us to get promoted. Apart from the obvious increase in money the added increase in away crowds would be welcome. 

Those who thought a couple if seasons down would be a great wheeze have now well and truly been shown a reality check 

I can't say I ever subscribed to the 'couple of seasons down would be a great wheeze ' philosophy...I was more of the 'I hate getting pumped week in week out, we don't deserve to be here ' mindset....but hey, who knew!!

Hindsight is a helluva thing.

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Of course there are "political" reasons for the EGM. To me the message is clear. We need more funding from new sponsors - we need better attendances - we really need promotion or have to look at all the other options - we cant afford the present youth system but we have to maintain the present playing squad as they actually look like they may do something this season.

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2 hours ago, Caley Stan said:

The post you're referring to implies that the providers of said loans are preparing to take control of the club. Why then, this EGM and the dramatic language that surrounds it? Is it just a PR exercise to prepare the ground for them to scale down the youth system when they come in?

I'm of the opinion that even if it was a PR exercise then so be it, however I don't think it was. I do believe it's genuine and laying things out for transparency. They have to do it if they are to attract investors and additions to the board, only a fool would go in blind - I'm sure you know all this anyway.

The youth system quite honestly is a luxury we can't afford and given the choice I'm sure we'd all choose to lose it first over the club. 

If you break it down as well, has the youth setup brought about more benefits than downsides or is it the other way round? We need to be producing one or two players a year of genuine quality to justify the hefty outlay and that's relying on them generating money, even then our recent dealings in the selling market in recent years has been awful except for the sale of Ryan Christie. 

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3 hours ago, Satan said:

How about running a business that has nothing to do with football,  but channel the revenues  from said business into the footballing side of the business...perhaps another 'division' of ICTFC Ltd...?

If there are entrepreneurs interested in coming on board then maybe this is something that can convince them to get involved - using their acumen to generate funds for the club as well as profits for the business...

While I applaude your forward thinking and ideas out of the box, is this really what we need right now?

Over recent years we've struggled to run a football club let along a side line. 

This brings with it even more financial pressures which we can do without. For me the whole focus needs to be on the club for what it is just now.

If it was a genuine viable option why isn't every other club doing it? 

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Is it true that the CEO told people last night that Youth is only costing £200k and the other £300k is the cost of the Development Squad?

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29 minutes ago, MrCaleyjag said:

...

The youth system quite honestly is a luxury we can't afford and given the choice I'm sure we'd all choose to lose it first over the club. 

If you break it down as well, has the youth setup brought about more benefits than downsides or is it the other way round? We need to be producing one or two players a year of genuine quality to justify the hefty outlay and that's relying on them generating money, even then our recent dealings in the selling market in recent years has been awful except for the sale of Ryan Christie. 

If we can't afford a youth system in some form or other then we're truly fubar. 

Without a valid youth team involved there will be even less local interest than at present, you would end up watching a bunch of jobbers from far and wide with any local talent going to highland league or county.

 

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1 hour ago, Buster said:

Is it true that the CEO told people last night that Youth is only costing £200k and the other £300k is the cost of the Development Squad?

£205k on Youth and £285k on Dev...so close enough.

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If each development player is costing us about £25,000, then surely the fact we signed so many is the reason those costs have increased and not just Project Brave?  That's more than some first team squad players will be costing us.

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23 hours ago, old caley girl said:

Also can I encourage everyone who can manage to come to the social club at 7.30pm next tuesday to hear from the CEO and chairman how fans can help. All welcome. Please share news of this meeting to those not on social media 

Indeed. The last one had about 8 people at it which was depressing in itself. 

Although it was Yvonne Crook and a lot of talk about SLO and the ICT Trust, neither of which as far as I can see exists anymore? So perhaps they just didn't waste their time. 

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12 hours ago, Satan said:

you would end up watching a bunch of jobbers from far and wide

I've been wondering how much a part of the current problem that is.  No criticism of anyone intended - it's just the way it is.

Yes I know you can't simply manufacture local players of the required standard.  And yes I know that we have a few who might become first team regulars.

I'd start by suggesting that Charlie Christie asks Ryan to do some motivational talks in local schools, but I guess that may be impractical for a number of reasons.

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There was no indication at the EGM that the club intended to cut anything other than youth/dev in order to bring spending down.  The £500,000 (£250k of which has been pledged) needed to get to the end of the season (and we don't know what other extra new money has already come in this season) did not include what was needed to get youth to end of season...we weren't told how much is needed there.

I've raised this point before and received all kinds of abuse for "being negative" etc....however....relegation reduced income by circa £1 Million.  The club claims Robbo has reduced playing costs by circa £1.1 Million.  That means the books should have balanced...but they don't.  We are about to report circa £900k loss for the last accounting period, which means that there's been a circa £1 Million increase in costs elsewhere!!

The "plan" at the EGM was to find a way to keep funding that hole (is it still near £1 Million?) by just lobbing donations into it until such time as we get promoted or....and this bit was lots of words and not much substance....maybe open a cafe, maybe get some concerts, maybe re-engage with local businesses/community, maybe get more fans through the gate etc.  All great ideas...hard for me to say otherwise as all of them and more were in a document I gave to the previous chairman (Rae) 2 years ago...but they don't come anywhere close to plugging a £500k+ (maybe still as much as £1 Million) black hole anytime soon.

Ross Morrison is clearly passionate about the club and I trust his motives are entirely honourable...in short, I believe he's one of the good guys.  However, talk of managing expectations has to start with managing your own and if the expectation is that people keep throwing money into a black hole with no plan of any substance to turn things around and make the club self sustaining...and soon...then the much needed shorter term investment is going to be slow in coming...if at all!

Nobody wants to be the one to make cuts, but we can't keep running a championship club with a premiership club cost base.

A friend messaged me after the meeting and I fear they hit the nail squarely on the head...

Screenshot_20191005-095526_Messenger.jpg

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The updates on the meeting are very helpful. If we don’t go up this year, we obviously need to cut the cost base, unfortunately.

Caley need to keep the community coaches, in my view, as links to schools and kids seem essential.

The development squad and youth structure are surely linked. Pretty much all the current development squad came via the youth system. It would be possible to stop the pro youth system and keep the development squad going for a year or so, but that would be it, unless we then took in players released by other clubs, as the conveyer belt would stop.

On the other hand, the current development squad system has probably done more for the Highland League than for Caley. If you look at the development team that won their league three years ago (I think it was about then) - then if they are playing professionally at all, they are all in the Highland League, at Forres, Strathspey and Rothes, I think, other than Jamie Wilson who was at Rothes but is now in Australia. The players released this year seem to be in the Highland League as well.  

A previous poster suggested putting development players out to the Highland League, I think to cover costs. As far as I understand, Highland League teams generally pay their usual rates for new players to Caley, and the players get their bonuses from the HL club. Caley must surely be paying almost all of the wages for the boys on loan to Fort. So, it gets them experience of adult football, but probably doesn’t do much for costs. 

If we go up, everything is fine, at least for a while. If we stay down, and we want to compete with other teams, we’re obviously going to have to prioritise the first team squad. And that must surely result in some depressing decisions. 

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Garrincha--please advise exactly what you mean by the words  "prioritise the team".

My  feelings are that , even pro-tem,  if the  costs of sustaining the youth don't lead to any kind of revenue return on the money invested by the club then you must  terminate that process. Sorry,but "needs  must  when  the devil drives". And right now this is a desperate "prune root and branch" scenario. No half measures. Don't necessarily believe the nice words of incomers to lull you into a false sense of security. Ask for specifics and demand  proof of intentions.

You have a current situation where, apparently, no specific plans or deals currently exist or are in the  pipeline for any shareholder or incomer to fund the losses and/or the club on an ongoing basis. So how do you propose to run the club unless crowds get much larger?  Waving your hands in the air and saying "oh,something  will turn up" doesn't work when the chips are  down and the club has no plan for this situation to improve.

 The product is good but the punters won't show up so support through "thick and thin" doesn't loom large at the moment. So there is no other option but to sharpen your pruners and get busy supporting only stuff that has an impact on the revenue stream and the product on the park. All expenditures other than salaries must be reduced very quickly and on an ongoing basis. If you don't see that as a reality then go to the bank and ask for an extension of their credit-line. They will not get it unless the club offers additional security by way of guarantees from wealthy individuals or the provision of  items such as bonds or investment paper of real value.

Severe pruning of expenses is the answer and/or the addition of other revenue earners such as a canteen with an outside access point  for half-time bevvies--i.e if none exist at the moment. or..setting up a raffle each fortnight for sale of tickets as they enter the stadium,etc.

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Just a reminder for folk about the supporters' meeting at the Caley Club on Tuesday evening - any time after 7 for a 7.30 start.  I'm not able to go unfortunately, but most of the Supporters Trust Board members will be there to hear what the Chief Executive Officer, Scot Gardiner, has to say and, of course, what other supporters have to say.  

Reports of the EGM suggest that the Club is in no immediate danger of administration, but there is no doubt at all that with a much lower revenue stream than in recent years, the club will have to manage its finances very carefully indeed.  For a club of our size with the relatively small support base that we have, it is important that everyone involved in the club pulls together and works for the common good of the club.  This is a great opportunity for fans to meet Scot and to engage in an honest and constructive dialogue about the challenges ahead. The Supporters Trust will do what it can to facilitate that dialogue and to that end, I know my colleagues on the Trust Board are looking forward to meeting as many supporters as possible and hearing what you have to say.  

 

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18 minutes ago, jagster said:

Interesting the figures Duncan Shearer quotes. Much less than the club are claiming and I didn’t realise the youth themselves have to pay  as well. 

Believe Project Brave made the kids stop paying. Well below the norm, for 8 hours training a week, buses to games, etc. Think county charged 300 at one time.

Believe youth costs include full time staff, like Baz, Es, Charlie, Ross?

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