Treatment of disabled fans at TCS

[CaleyD]

ITN Jnr decided to remove his post himself around about the same time as I was posting my reply. We all make statements which we later realise are not best placed which is what happened on this occasion and I think it is best left at that.

[Guest Devlin]

Ok fair enough CaleyD. ITN Jr, I can't say how much I'm looking forward to seeing you next season, you're a real legend aren't you :018:

Yeah RiG, I thought there was too initially, but apparently not.

Blackieforce, its a shame that anyone feels that they should avoid a football game for this reason, but in all honesty I really wouldn't recommend taking him to ICT. The bad experiences may just be limited to us, but with the upset it has caused I wouldn't wish it on yourselves. Please come across and say next season though. Thanks for your kind words too.

[Guest Sam]

Devlin,

I wasn't suggesting "going to the papers" to berate ICT, more just to make other fans aware of what it is like to be a disabled person at that ground - i.e. at the fans, not at the club. If you have a complaint with the club, I think you should address that through the club and I am pleased to see that is what you intend to do.

As for a raised viewing platform, I would have thought a lot comes down to health and safety and so you probably wouldn't be allowed to use a lift to get to a covered or higher vantage point solely in case of fire or an emergency where the lift so happens to go out of order. The chances of that happening, I am sure, are unlikely but I suspect that is the cause.

However, it surely cannot cost too much to provide a ramped, covered section for wheelchair users? Might be an idea to 'cc' your letter to David Sutherland to see if he is willing/able to do anything.

[Interthenet Jnr]

Ok fair enough CaleyD. ITN Jr, I can't say how much I'm looking forward to seeing you next season, you're a real legend aren't you :018:

Yeah RiG, I thought there was too initially, but apparently not.

Blackieforce, its a shame that anyone feels that they should avoid a football game for this reason, but in all honesty I really wouldn't recommend taking him to ICT. The bad experiences may just be limited to us, but with the upset it has caused I wouldn't wish it on yourselves. Please come across and say next season though. Thanks for your kind words too.

yeah should be intresting

[strathyjags]

If you have a complaint with the club, I think you should address that through the club and I am pleased to see that is what you intend to do.

is there much point? we have seen numerous times this season the club frankly couldnt care about the fans,so why even bother speaking to them,there only shooting themselves in the foot

[Guest Sam]

Blackieforce, I do agree to a certain extent... but you still need to offer the club an opportunity to rectify that which is within its control before taking further action. If they then fail to act, that is when they can be rightly criticised and when further action should be considered.

[Scotty]

I would like to think that the majority of decent fans do not have a problem with other fans who happen to be disabled, or those who may have become disbled through the course of their life and reading some of the comments on bad treatment within this thread disturbs me.

Certainly, as far as I am aware, the crew in the Innes has done nothing to make one particular disabled fan feel anything less than a part of our group. We got to know Colin very well over a number of seasons and his disability was inconsequential to us as we just treated him like any other fan. Thanks to the likes of Bronson (his carer at that time), Govan Jaggie, and others, Colin made numerous trips to both the TCS and to many away days and also appeared on the website quite a few times in some of our pictures from games/pubs .... Bronson in particular also did a lot to educate both supporters and some at the club about what was right and also what was wrong with arrangements at the TCS.

I know from comments that Bronson has made on the old site and in person, that the TCS is definitely not perfect, but that we do fare better than some grounds including Hampden, where Colin was made to sit in front of opposition supporters and without his carer .... however, those at the club responsible for providing adequate facilities for the disabled should perhaps take some time to listen to the disabled supporters themselves and their carers rather than make 'able-bodied' assumptions over what is adequate and acceptable ......

If the club are really that bad, and previous communication attempts have failed then that is sad. Hopefully you (Devlin), may decide to make further attempts to discuss it privately with the club who have a duty to listen. I would also recommend that you consider passing the information to the Supporters' Trust who have said they will bring issues affecting supporters to the attention of the club.

[ICT90]

i would get banned with the amout of stuff on here if i said it, *****************************

That's quite enough of that young man. Consider yourself warned.

EDITED BY THE MANTIS ON 7/05/06 AT 2050

[Alex MacLeod]

I think, going on from Scotty's post, that it would be an excellent idea for the trust to get involved in this. Set up meetings with those affected and the club. A problem such as is being experienced can easily be sorted by communicating, in the first instance, and by some very easy low cost alterations. e.g. bus shelter type enclosures pitch side, perhaps at each end of the dugouts. This is the sort of thing that I would expect the trust to get involved in. It is, after all, in the interest of the club and their relationship with the greater community to be more responsive to the needs of those less able.

We should all take an example from our temporary home at Aberdeen. They have areas for wheelchairs, with ramp access, at the front of the main stand and, providing the police and stewards keep out of the way, the view from here is excellent. I know this because when I was on crutches last year I was directed to this area. And whats more, niether myself or my carer (wife) had to pay to watch the game.

[CaleyJulz]

I myself have a child with speacial need and disablilites and the club and fans have been amazing to us we have got so many good really nice new friends the club i have never hd any issues with the club over taking in his big buggy they have always been so helpfull and yes as we have some close friends we will now do away games to .

[DJS]

Just to confirm that on behalf of the Trust I contacted Devlin a couple of days ago and he has been back in touch with us. We'll see what comes of it.

[CaleyD]

Apologies for going (slightly) off topic, but glad to see the Trust have changed their policy on taking up fans concerns, especially after I was previously told that where an issue arose then they "have to be formally approached by who ever was affected" in order for the Trust to intervene. I'm sure others will also welcome this new pro-active approach by the Trust, long may it continue with regards to ALL concerns.

[bigmack]

Devlin,

Iam pleased to see positive comments and posts on this subject, I am classified disabled but can walk for 200/300 yds before major pain is a problem so my objective is getting my vehicle or driver close to stadium.

This is nothing compared to the treatment that fans like your client need, easy access and the ability to view the game,courtesy and respect from "normal" people. It is encouraging to see the genuine responses from the likes of CaleyD,Scotty, A Macleod and several others.With regard to I. Jnr he is a disgrace, and should be disregarded as rude,ignorant and does not portray the the average ICT supporter and Forum contributors,I have no doubt Scotty et al will deal with the comments and behavior of I. Jnr.

Keep up the good work Devlin whoever you are supporting.

[Alex MacLeod]

CD, you are an intelligent person and normally very sensible in your postings so why do you find it necessary to use, what is a serious forum, on a serious subject to fire sarcastic remarks at the Supporters Trust. Ive noticed this in other threads and, to be honest, I, for one, am getting p***** of with consistently being reminded of your little public vendetta against the Trust.

[Interthenet Jnr]

Devlin,

Iam pleased to see positive comments and posts on this subject, I am classified disabled but can walk for 200/300 yds before major pain is a problem so my objective is getting my vehicle or driver close to stadium.

This is nothing compared to the treatment that fans like your client need, easy access and the ability to view the game,courtesy and respect from "normal" people. It is encouraging to see the genuine responses from the likes of CaleyD,Scotty, A Macleod and several others.With regard to I. Jnr he is a disgrace, and should be disregarded as rude,ignorant and does not portray the the average ICT supporter and Forum contributors,I have no doubt Scotty et al will deal with the comments and behavior of I. Jnr.

Keep up the good work Devlin whoever you are supporting.

I accept i was wrong with what i posted and that's why i removed what i said. As Caley D said sometimes you regret some of the things you post and regret what i said, i was frustrated with Delvin. I will take any disciplinary action Caley D or Scotty see fit to take. Once again apologies to all, even Delvin. Although it was nice to see no one saw it as out of order Delvin mocking the death of someone, may it be someone he didn't like or not, that in my book is just as disgraceful as the dribble i posted.

[Mrs Pauliebee]

i would get banned with the amout of stuff on here if i said it, *****************************

That's quite enough of that young man. Consider yourself warned.

EDITED BY THE MANTIS ON 7/05/06 AT 2050

Mantis - is that no a wee bit harsh! We read what he posted and laughed.

We took it completely tongue in cheek and an attempt to defuse the situation Jnr started?

Jnr - quality not quantity lad - has Bronson's spelling taught you nothing? :015:

[ICT90]

:019:

[The Mantis]

Mantis - is that no a wee bit harsh! We read what he posted and laughed.

We took it completely tongue in cheek and an attempt to defuse the situation Jnr started?

His tongue hasn't spent much time in his cheek before though has it! Let me say I was alerted to it by another admin and that's how I called it.

Maybe you're right, but only the lad himself knows- let's see what he posts next time.....

[KingBeastie]

Devlin, I remember you posting the same thing on the previous boards and (like many others I think) thought that your main intention was to wind up the ICT support that used the board simply by the way and manor in which you tried to put your point across. The very nature of a fans football forum often means that your point can be percived not in the way you intended.

I hope this situation can be resolved quickly and effectively.

And by the way good luck with the degree (I know how you feel!)

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

Well said Evelyn.

[absent friend]

To echo Alex MacLeod's point about Pittodrie, I was with Colin and Bronson at the first game of the season and the hospitality extended to Colin was great.

He was seated at the front of the Merkland stand in a special enclosure, slightly raised with a super view.

He was taken and welcomed into the 'Home' dressing room and was fussed over by players and management alike. Robbo asking Colin which player would score first and when Colin gave his answer Robbo turned to the player and said he was lucky as if he had not been Colin's choice he was on the bench! Good fun and not reflective of the bad craic from the posts above.

However I have no doubt that the statements above re the behaviour are correct - you only have to accept the mentality of the few - checkout I Jnr for instance.