Crossing "The Great Divide"

[SMEE]

Inspired by Mr Bannermans revelation about Lofty and Titchy Black going to IHS , it got me to thinking, How many Caley fans had played for Thistle over the years. There was Wadd (howden ender) and Canyon in goals, another howden ender. There was Charlie Christie too, but the one i found hard to get over was Roddy Davidson turning out in a Thistle Strip. I think I am right in saying John "Doc" Docherty played up the hill too?

Thistle Fans feel free to join in if you knew Thistle fans who played for Caley.

Or even just players associated with one of the teams crossing the divide

Edited October 6, 2008 by SMEE

[Guest]

Charlie Christie & Danny MacDonald were never Caley fans. They were just jaggies who wanted a half-decent wage & signing on fee.

Roddie Davidson in red & black was a stomach churning sight, traitor. Doc was rubbish by then so he didnt matter. I still believe that losing to jaggies in that years Q-Cup was the final nail in Caleys coffin & to be honest, i wouldn't be surprised if money changed hands to secure that result. Money from INE.

I doubt Caley would have merged with the dross if we'd had another good Scottish Cup run that year,.

ps SMEE....its spelt divide.

Edited October 6, 2008 by Guest

[SMEE]

I did notice the misspelling but couldnt be assed changin it. I did spell it correctly in the text of the post tho...so thats something. I will go and correct the mistake now

Edited October 6, 2008 by SMEE

[Guest]

I did notice the misspelling but couldnt be assed changin it. I did spell it correctly in the text of the post tho...so thats something. I will go and correct the mistake now

Sorry.

I'm a pedantic ****.

[RednBlackComeback]

Mike Andrew, Mike Noble, Colin Mitchell, Peter Corbett, ....to name but a few off the top o ma head.

[Guest]

Mike Andrew, Mike Noble, Colin Mitchell, Peter Corbett, ....to name but a few off the top o ma head.

Peter played for all 3 clubs, as did Billy Douglas, Jeds old man.

I met Coco in Manchester before the Uefa Cup final. Bald as a coot.

[RednBlackComeback]

Billy Sanderson, Ian Polworth, Martin Bell, Derek Wright, Martin Murphy, ....

[Guest]

Does Martin Murphy qualify as a footballer?

[SMEE]

Billy Sanderson, Ian Polworth, Martin Bell, Derek Wright, Martin Murphy, ....

I recall Billy "Snoters" Sanderson being wi Caley, and was sure Polwarth also made the change. Decca Wright was another who played for all 3 inverness teams if i remember rightly. Had forgotten about Martin Bell and Martin Murphy.

[RednBlackComeback]

Before my time but...

Juppy Mitchell, Rod Clyne ....

This thread's been a good excuse to get all the old memorabilia out for a viewing again !!!

[Charles Bannerman]

Money from INE.

An intriguing revisionist theory, given that the replay in question was in November 1988, a full four and a half years before the Scottish League even began to think about a 4x10 team league at which point INE entered the football arena in May 1993!

I was there that day and Caley were quite simply *****. On the other hand I would agree that this was perhaps the start of the decline of Caley's on-field performances which, by 1993, left them in a sufficiently weakened position for a merger just to be politically possible (as I suggested in an earlier post on this thread.)

Edited October 7, 2008 by Charles Bannerman

[Guest]

Money from INE.

An intriguing revisionist theory, given that the replay in question was in November 1988, a full four and a half years before the Scottish League even began to think about a 4x10 team league at which point INE entered the football arena in May 1993!

I was there that day and Caley were quite simply *****. On the other hand I would agree that this was perhaps the start of the decline of Caley's on-field performances which, by 1993, left them in a sufficiently weakened position for a merger just to be politically possible (as I suggested in an earlier post on this thread.)

No Charles, you are wrong (again). It was 1993 when Roddie D turned out for Thistle against Caley. 2-0 to Thistle. All very dubious considering the teams current form at the time, together with the ongoing off-field events.

I believe you are thinking of the Q-Cup final replay in 1988. Keep up please.

[Charles Bannerman]

Money from INE.

An intriguing revisionist theory, given that the replay in question was in November 1988, a full four and a half years before the Scottish League even began to think about a 4x10 team league at which point INE entered the football arena in May 1993!

I was there that day and Caley were quite simply *****. On the other hand I would agree that this was perhaps the start of the decline of Caley's on-field performances which, by 1993, left them in a sufficiently weakened position for a merger just to be politically possible (as I suggested in an earlier post on this thread.)

No Charles, you are wrong (again). It was 1993 when Roddie D turned out for Thistle against Caley. 2-0 to Thistle. All very dubious considering the teams current form at the time, together with the ongoing off-field events.

I believe you are thinking of the Q-Cup final replay in 1988. Keep up please.

If by "that year" you mean the 4th September 1993 second round tie between Jags and Caley at Kingsmills which Jags won 2-0, I think Caley were well past their best by that time and that was why they didn't qualify for the Scottish Cup run to which a certain section of their support seemed to think they had a God given right.

As it happens I was at both games (1988 and 1993) and on both occasions Caley were rubbish. My abiding memory of the September 1993 tie (5 days before the merger vote) was two guys in respective Caley and Thistle scarves whom I met outside the Heathmount who could sdo nothing but mock the prospect of SFL football in Inverness. In particular they mocked the thought of playing the likes of Stenhousemuir. Well at least they didn't have to worry too much about games against Stenhousemuir which didn't figure for too long.

So who do you reckon was the go between who paid the money from INE to the Caley players for throwing the game? The same guy as rigged the vote five nights later? Or surely it wasn't the same public spirited fellow as laid his hands on a whole bundle of Couriers and returned all the merger poll slips in the negative to fabricate the only instance there ever was outside a Rebel meeting of public opposition to the merger? :thumb04:

Edited October 7, 2008 by Charles Bannerman

[Guest]

So, you're allowed to manipulate the media by writing, at best, inaccuracies or,more likely, pushing an agenda with the backing of the local enterprise board, but i'm not allowed to counter-act such under-hand tactics with a bit of opportunism? That's just not cricket, is it?

Also, i dont remember getting the local drug squad to raid any of the Caley commitees' houses. Nice bunch of lads, if a bit over-worked.....they were none too pleased at having their time wasted.

Wasn't that the initial merger vote, at the Muirtown? I've always wondered how they got a result of 55-50 from a crowd of 97 people (possibly 92, either or). Especially as they weren't accepting proxy votes.....as Mantis can testify.

Are you suggesting that the claims of backhand payments & other such slippery tricks are outwith the realms of possibility in this scenario? Really?

[Charles Bannerman]

I've always wondered how they got a result of 55-50 from a crowd of 97 people (possibly 92, either or). Especially as they weren't accepting proxy votes.....as Mantis can testify.

Maybe they took advice from the bloke who managed to get an 83% anti merger vote from the general readership of the Inverness Courier who, as a whole, couldn't really have cared one way or another.

I have to say I have very fond memories of that somewhat Pythonesque autumn of 1993 and that was one of several vintage moments of high comedy (albeit not quite in the same league as the bus!). Who would have thought that, out of all that chaos, Inverness would, 15 years later, be enjoying its fifth season of SPL football?

[Guest]

Fond memories,made fonder by the possibility of a book, and a few quid plus the opportunity to further ones career as a sports journalist without having to uproot oneself & go looking for stories.

Meanwhile, the much of the heart & soul was torn out of local football. You cant tell me that the majority of todays non-attenders weren't the most vocal in their support & enthusiasm for their clubs back then. We'd still have been there today....along with our kids.

In hindsight, it was all a good laugh trying to outsmart the local corporate machine but quite frankly, the sour taste of what i still percieve to be an injustice chases any fond memories out the window. Of course, i may have been putting too much emphasis on that particular issue whilst neglecting other, more important ones....but my eldest daughter seems to have turned out fine ( totally disinterested in football and, by default, ICT). Result.

[Kingsmills]

When on earth is the rancour from a series of events a decade and a half ago going to stop ?

Those non attenders that you speak about do not amount to more than a few dozen on both sides of the "great divide".

It's franky beyond me how anyone can seriously argue that to have two part time clubs continuing to play in an increasingly weak and impoverished regional league with the occasional foray as far as the last 16 of the Scottish Cup would be preferable to having professional club offering well paid full time employment to dozens and able to compete with the Old Firm and others on a regular basis.

We all had to cede a little of our footballing heritage in 1993 but there's no sustainable argument whatsoever that the merger has been anything other than a triumph for football in Inverness.

[reefinweedallday]

Money from INE.

An intriguing revisionist theory, given that the replay in question was in November 1988, a full four and a half years before the Scottish League even began to think about a 4x10 team league at which point INE entered the football arena in May 1993!

I was there that day and Caley were quite simply *****. On the other hand I would agree that this was perhaps the start of the decline of Caley's on-field performances which, by 1993, left them in a sufficiently weakened position for a merger just to be politically possible (as I suggested in an earlier post on this thread.)

No Charles, you are wrong (again). It was 1993 when Roddie D turned out for Thistle against Caley. 2-0 to Thistle. All very dubious considering the teams current form at the time, together with the ongoing off-field events.

I believe you are thinking of the Q-Cup final replay in 1988. Keep up please.

If by "that year" you mean the 4th September 1993 second round tie between Jags and Caley at Kingsmills which Jags won 2-0, I think Caley were well past their best by that time and that was why they didn't qualify for the Scottish Cup run to which a certain section of their support seemed to think they had a God given right.

As it happens I was at both games (1988 and 1993) and on both occasions Caley were rubbish. My abiding memory of the September 1993 tie (5 days before the merger vote) was two guys in respective Caley and Thistle scarves whom I met outside the Heathmount who could sdo nothing but mock the prospect of SFL football in Inverness. In particular they mocked the thought of playing the likes of Stenhousemuir. Well at least they didn't have to worry too much about games against Stenhousemuir which didn't figure for too long.

So who do you reckon was the go between who paid the money from INE to the Caley players for throwing the game? The same guy as rigged the vote five nights later? Or surely it wasn't the same public spirited fellow as laid his hands on a whole bundle of Couriers and returned all the merger poll slips in the negative to fabricate the only instance there ever was outside a Rebel meeting of public opposition to the merger? :thumb04:

Charles are you honestly saying that there were no underhand tactics used by the Caley Board,INE etc to force the merger through?? Or are you not allowed to give your viewpoint due to your friendship with ICT??

[CaleyHE]

When on earth is the rancour from a series of events a decade and a half ago going to stop ?

Those non attenders that you speak about do not amount to more than a few dozen on both sides of the "great divide".

You are very wrong their bud, very wrong..

It is far more than a couple of dozen either side.

Whether you like it or not, ict initially struggled for a proper fan base & its only due to a new generation of invernesian's coming through and incomers into the area, to make up the support, to a half decent amount.

I do believe if the merger had not happened and Caledonian FC had gone it alone, the home averages would have been significantly higher, plus we would have had an away support to be proud of.

Only my opinion of course.

[Guest]

Kingsmills, I've never heard anyone argue for 2 part-time teams continuing in the Highland League. We wanted a club in the Scottish League. Our club. Thistle were not our concern.

Just clarifying a point. Progression for our club was our aim, what happened to Jags was inconsequential. We weren't looking for the end of Jags, Clach or anyone, only the chance for Caley to go forward. People seem keen to portray us as wanting to stay in the Highland League.....how far from the truth can you get?

[Kingsmills]

That may have been your desire but without the merger and the support of those backing it that desire would have remained a forelorn hope.

[Guest]

That may have been your desire but without the merger and the support of those backing it that desire would have remained a forelorn hope.

I think the subsequent inclusion of both Elgin & Peterhead is sufficient evidence that it was a needless & pointless exercise, causing more resentment than it was worth. Even if we had to wait another 5 years, there was only ever 1 club in Inverness who merited inclusion & they played at Telford Street Park my friend. In terms of the merger,Jags are rather like a cuckoo, leaving their eggs in another birds nest, causing the original occupants to bail out.

[SMEE]

I maintain a lone Caley bid would have suceeded, and see no reason why it would not have recieved the same backing from the business community etc as ICT has enjoyed. Dont give me any p1sh about the likes of Sutherland etc, coz al tell you now, he would go where the money was, believe you me!

A lone Caley team could have been every bit as enticing as ICT to locals.

However.....its all speculation, and we will never know for sure. I just take exception to ppl who pooh pooh the possibility with absolutley no credible proof.

[Guest]

A lone Caley team could have been every bit as enticing as ICT to locals.

However.....its all speculation, and we will never know for sure. I just take exception to ppl who pooh pooh the possibility with absolutley no credible proof.

[BornCaley]

im in agreement, that a lone Caley Bid would have provided the same result. Im not convinced a lone Thistle bid would have succeeded, but hey its 15 years ago now, so none of the above really matters does it.

BNP - I notice your signature at the bottom of your posts is rather Anti-Mergerish....

can i assume your not a supporter of ICT