PerfICT

5 hours ago, RednBlackComeback said:

They were also having a go at Tansey for his interview when he stated that he "could look in the mirror" implying he had given his all and performed to the best of his abilities but maybe others hadn't ? 

I was not impressed with Tansey's interview, which was annoying because he's been a great servant for the club and instrumental in our successes, which I applauded him for today....before his comments. He suggested that whoever's fault relegation was, it wasn't his. Again, where is the team ethic in that? Everybody at ICT has a part to play in this downfall. Tansey was a shadow of himself through the dark days of this season and needs to acknowledge that - he is not blameless as Willie Miller was very quick to point out.

We certainly have the players to launch a credible challenge next year, but we do not have the manager. Equally, as mentioned above, there will be a stack of losses on financial grounds, not to mention those not wanting to play under a clown. I would invite Fon Williams out to save a wage - get Deano back. What to do about Doran? Allegedly on the top wage and crocked. Offer him a cut in wages for a year to see if he recovers or punt through mutual consent? I'd try the former...could work for both parties.

So, I'd try to keep the following of contracted players:

Tremarco, Warren, Raven

Vigurs, Polworth, Mulraney, Doran

Boden is unproven, would prefer to keep Fisher, but think he'll be gone. So, we certainly have the core of a competitive team....for now. We might have nobody in 2 weeks (except Foran). Quick decisions have to be made.

Shocking for a manager to blame a few "bad apples" for his failings. Really cowardly. You win together and lose together - everything else should happen behind closed doors. Richie is embarrassing to himself and this club.

A swift dismissal has to happen NOW. You cannot leave it for RF to have any role in personnel next season. Equally, the club has to send a message to players who will be rushing for the exit, that things will change and there will be an experienced boss at the helm.

NOW!

Yes, of 9 possible W/D/L combinations, only 2 will do us (excluding the unlikely scenario of us drawing and Hamilton losing by 5 or more). So, the straight odds are against us. However, I feel our chances of a win are better than Hamilton's because they're on a 4-game losing run. Whatever way you look at this, we're not really favourites to get out of the hole we've dug ourselves...but this is football, so what do odds matter! C'MON ICT

...er, hum. Speaking of fickle fans, I have a confession to make. It seems I was a bit hasty in the aftermath of the County debacle in saying I wouldn't be back this season. I will - today! Some fans are just so fickle!

Just down getting extra tickets - everywhere is almost full and plans are in place to start filling South stand too. Should be a packed hoose.

So it's DUFC who await tomorrow's showdown. Let's just hope that it is that are lucky enough to have a crack at them.

Not any more: 2-1 United. I'd like that to go to extra time.

First, let's see what sort of a crowd we really get. There is a lot of interest and I'm makinf full use of the good deals available for ST holders and children under 16. But, there won't be many from Motherwell and I'd be surprised if we get 4000.

Your question, however, is a good one. I think it comes down to the meaning of the word "support". ICT's hard-core, through thick and thin, support is about 2k. Then there's the occasional supporter who can't be at every game, but goes when they can - these people are equally entitled to the term supporter. Then there's the fairly large band of armchair "followers", who might say they are fans if asked, but only go to big games (OF, cup finals and final day show-downs). They go for the drama and the glory, but don't invest as much emotion as true supporters. We'll get about 500 - 1000 of these tomorrow, mostly going on the freebees. They would also go to the play off, if we're lucky enough to make it. Converting this group into supporters that invest cash and emotion into the club is proving exceptionally difficult!

15 hours ago, snorbens_caleyman said:

All this talk about "the losses incurred by relegation".   What losses?  Can anyone say what they are, and then quantify them?

If the club is relegated then there will be less money coming in next season than this season, and, one hopes, less going out.  But losses?  Less or no TV money isn't a loss - it's less or no TV money.  Less or no prize money isn't a loss - it's less or no prize money.

The club will have a smaller turnover. It may make a loss - though there is the parachute payment to take into account. But relegation is a fact of life for a football club, and I think you'd be hard pressed to point to a particular loss - an actual loss, not a shrinkage in revenue - and say "that is directly as a result of relegation".

There is no question that there would be a big financial loss on account of reduced revenue with only a small reduction in costs. Only today, auditors have issued a warning to Dundee Utd after they posted a £1.5 M loss on account of relegation (despite the parachute payment). Somebody on this site previously indicated that we lost £900k after the previous relegation, evidencing the accounts. There will undoubtedly be a big loss and it would be the shareholders that would carry the cost. Directors might be responsible for the decisions leading to the loss, but have no obligation to fill the hole.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p052fk3z?intc_type=promo&intc_location=sport&intc_campaign=1in100&intc_linkname=5live_fac_vidclip1

It seems even the SFA's estimate of 5% of kids in academies making it is optimistic. This article indicates 99% don't make it! Put simply - the model is completely wrong - the focus of the coaching is wrong with too much emphasis on winning instead of fitness, psychology, attitude, determination and technique (probably in that order). While it is quite easy at age 7 to identify those who have techinque, it is impossible to determine whether they have all of the attributes...and you really need the full set. Another issue is the system - at each age group a squad is trained up essentially with a player in each position. What happens if a particular year group is flush with, for an extreme example, goalkeepers? Experience would suggest that one or 2 would be selected at a very young age and the rest discarded because they have to be formed into a team throughout the system and there is only ever need for 1 or 2 goalies. On what criteria would that decision be made at, say, 10 years old? Almost certainly size. Wrong!

Looking at these odds, ICT have done pretty well over the last few years (e.g. Nick Ross, Liam Polworth, Ryan Christie, Graeme Shinnie) from 5 or so years of youth squads - that would be nearer to a 5% hit rate. The problem is that the cash return to the club was zero in 2 of those cases and that just does not make business sense. That said, Shinnie and Ross made significant impacts on the first team at ICT which should surely be the primary purpose of youth systems, but it is impossible to put a value on that contribution.

This is now pretty much off topic for this thread, but I think this makes the point that the Board may well be responsible for many deficinecies at the club, but I don't think youth development is something that they can be blamed for. It's the system that is failing.

..God, I wish I could have got off work for that. A great showing from ICT on and off the park tonight. I salute you all!

I say again - Phil Collins: Against all odds!

7 minutes ago, Kingsmills said:

He has had an appalling season but Richie deserves a great deal of credit for that. If, and it's still a very big if indeed, he keeps us up, he probably deserves to be given until Christmas to try to get to grips with learning to be a manager.

Agree to the first part, not the second. That argument is for later, though. Right now, we all need to just get behind the boys and roar them to victory on Saturday. What happens elsewhere is not in our hands, but we just need to do everything we can to help get a victory on Saturday.

Really tricky team talk for Foran. For me, trying to just contain is dangerous. I think they have to keep at it. I could see a 3-1....or a 2-2. Go for it lads!

Well, oh well! Come on lads, turn the screw.

While ICTChris is excruciatingly accurate, he forgets the crucial ingredient that is present in every football fan - even him, if he were to be honest with himself - HOPE! This is an irrational virtue, it can defy logic and fly in the face of all the evidence. Football is the perfect vehicle to foster such irrational tendencies because there is always that single example of something ridiculous happening that is remarkable and often undeserved. tonight is such a night.....

Against All Odds - Phil Collins. A bit morose, but apt.

Brilliant effort from all those going - if we go down, make it a noisy departure will you? If we're staying up, even noisier!

5 hours ago, ilpadrino said:

Technically, if we draw at Dens we still have a chance of making 11th, so "must not lose" rather an absolute "must win".

Ilpadrino is right...technically. A 1-0 defeat for Hamilton in their last game and a 6-0 (!) victory for us will be enough if we draw tonight. Those straws are getting almost impossible to clutch!

No, it is genuinely "must win". Ironically, it was the home match against Dundee away back in January that Foran first said was "must win". This time it is for real, so I'm glad we've had a dress rehearsal, although it didn't go quite to plan back in January....

There's a roar in the jailend??  yeah, it is a really odd feeling wanting County to win.

It is an elaborate hoax! I fell for it

well, that's the conspiracy theory put to bed....or the plot is highly elaborate! I think County fans would take max satisfaction from giving us the opportunity, only for ICT to screw it up.

1 hour ago, Scotty said:

seems unlikely ... With Partick and Killie just ahead in 6th and 7th and Dundee just 3pts behind,  County could go into the final day anywhere from 6th to 9th based on the result s tonight and tomorrow... are they really willing to forego prize money for a potential finish as 'best of the rest' just to **** ICT off ? 

Not quite true - it is one of the odd issues thrown up by the split system: whatever happens, County cannot finish in 6th...even if they have motre points than Partick. I agree with you, though, County have their own targets and I don't buy the conspiracy theory. As Hawkeyethegnu says - we're very capable of succeeding in relegation without any help from County.

I think there is an urgency beyond what Kingsmills says. Last time we went down, there was still some goodwill mongst the players towards the manger - Butcher had done a reasonable job in trying to prevent relegation (but for a misjudgement by Tokely, he might even have succeeeded). There was also the desire and presumably the finances from the Board to allow those who wanted to stay on to do so. The result was retention of a very solid team that ultimately succeeded the following year.

None of the above will be true this time if Foran is not removed immediately. If he stays, there will be a stampede for the door amonstt those players still contracted - who in their right mind would want to play for a manager who genuinely has no clue whatsoever? Draper, Raven, Polworth, Warren, Tremarco and Doran will all invoke any clauses they have in their contracts or be offering to leave  by mutual consent to reduce the wage bill. The board will gleefully accept and we'll be starting from nothing. Do nothing or wait until long into June and the damage will be done to the squad IMO.

Bring in a new manager who has the respect of the players and there's a chance that some of them will want to stay and give it at least one shot in the Championship.

9 hours ago, IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER said:

Well I travelled with forlorn hope and a fair degree of trepidation. But that still did not stop me and my 146 compatriots from sitting in the away stand, cheer on the boys and hope for some salvation. My only negative thought at the start was the inclusion of Anier but otherwise I was quite happy with the first team choice. Fisher has deserved his chance and may have been a more polished player if he had been given a run early. He had a clear cut chance in the 2^nd minute, through on goal, 1-1 with McDonald and he totally fecked it up. If he had kept his composure, as he did 69 minutes later then it may have been a different story.

So we have a plastic pitch. We are playing in to the wind and the driving rain. Killie know the surface and they play tippy tappy at the back, use the width, take people on and are patient. Us we hoof at every opportunity. Billy Mckay must wonder what the feck is going on. Anier offers sod all and Mulraney has an off-day but rarely gets a ball at his feet or a pass to run on to. The clear tactic was to feckin hoof it. And for the second time away from home Esson makes the second big error (OK there were 2 errors) of his belated season and gifts the first goal to Longstaffe. Just what we did not need. You could see some heads go down at that time. Have to say that I was really impressed by Frizell, Jones and Wilson. If we had that three playing for us we would have hammered them. But we have Foran and the hoof.

So half time comes along and you think lets have a go. But God lets us down again. The wind dies down, the rain stops and some feckin sunshine comes out. And as if that wasn’t bad enuff we hook Mulraney for Vigurs. We put Draper up front and we switch Fisher to wide right midfield. Yes wide right midfield !! Foran complained about our defending for the second but I thought it was tidy lead up play and a very tidy finish by Jones who had tormented Brad all day long. And guess who had the two long range shots on target – of course – David Raven !!

Anier goes off, 58 minutes too late, and gets replaced by Polworth who never got into the game. Not sure exactly where he was playing though. And then we hook Draper and take on Cole. BUT we put Cole on the left BUT keep Fisher on the wide right and put Mckay up front on his own. We pack feckin midfield with the lackadaisical Vigurs and Tansey with Polworth running around like a headless chicken.

But as the chants against Foran begin to grow we put ourselves back in the game. Great pass from Tansey and Fisher tucks it away very neatly, 69 minutes too late. Lee McCulloch summed it up nicely – “The last 10 minutes were a bit nervy but we got there in the end.” We began to show the desire and fight that we should have been showing for weeks, nay months. No player can be faulted for endeavour in the last 15 minutes. Killie looked shell shocked and took their feet off the pedal. And wee Billy could have got us that desperately needed point with a glorious lob which would have been a goal of the season contender if it went in. We actually started playing football as well. Alas too late.

And Foran summed up the day – “I'm delighted with the players' performance, believe it or not. I told them they should be proud of themselves, how they handled the occasion.” Well he must have just been watching the last fifteen minutes and had forgotten the deplorable first 45. And then "Individual mistakes have cost us again. The only disappointing part is the second goal. Jones has so much space to run at us. It's a set-piece for us, they break and score - that's schoolboy defending but overall we were the far better team and had far better chances.” – DOH – wrong goal – and we deserved a point and that would have been a bit of a robbery. “We didn't get what we deserved and that was the three points, in my mind. We need to cut out the individual mistakes, it's been the story of the season.” – Yes agree about the individual mistakes and add it has been the story of MY season. Some players do NOT play for you. And then he concludes as a modern day Lazarus – “We need help from other clubs now, simple as that. We need to do our business on Wednesday and Saturday. There is still a chance. It is probably a small chance, but there is a chance." – WTF !!

No Smileymometer but here are my conclusions. Esson did OK but that one mistake early doors killed us. Brad was taken apart by Jones, Raven was solid and full of endeavour. Warren was my MOM for clearly giving his all. Laing was quietly effective. Mulraney never got going and Anier never has got going. Draper looked OK in midfield but was lost up front against a very tall Killie central defence. Tansey looks pretty but he is keeping himself for Aberdire. Fisher gave his all but was a fish out of water wide right. Wee Billy never got used and was a waste in the hole role. He is best on the toes of the last defender. Vigurs actually started trying to play football but he is such a lazy *******. Polworth and Cole made no impact. Ah Well it looks like Dumfries will be my ”home” game next season.

Thanks, IHE - useful. I think this tells us everything we need to know and everything we already know. Foran meade the best selection he could to start the game - maybe he has learnt from mistakes....once we go behind, he invariably panics and makes the same mistakes all over again:

1. He brings Vigurs on to a midfield that he doesn't fit

2. He puts Draper up front where he's always looked out of water. Because that fails, he then subs him. Warrior removed from the fray.

3. He shifts Fisher to anywhere he can think of... Surprised he hasn't popped up in goal yet.

4. He changes the system to one that is unrecognisable to players and fans alike. Polworth, Vigurs, Tansey, Draper is never, ever going to work so stop trying it.

God knows what the line up and formation will be against Dundee. The players must despair. Maybe Hamilton will put us out of our misery the night before, but if they don't I can't see anything but another calamity coming on Wednesday.