marks

We often use scales in SFBT interventions so i am going to conduct a psychological research project.

What are your expectation levels for next season ?

I appear to be 12 months behind a lot of you - I would have gone for 4-5 this season and I have been sorely disappointed. I am going fer 5-6 next season as I feel that we have had enuff time to regroup, have wasted that time and opportunity and we have to step up - especially with the gudgies expecting to grow above us.

In what way do think we need therapy? Do you not think some NLP would be more effective in the short term? Some hypnotic word patterns to spin our minds around to your way of thinking? How are you going to use the results of your little experiment?

Our wounds are often the openings into the best and most beautiful part of us.

My original "goal" has been acheived in relation to this boring, non footballing thread - The mind ought sometimes to be reverted that it may return to better thinking yet melancholy, indeed, should be diverted by every means but drinking and yet, almost every man wastes part of his life in attempts to display qualities which he does not possess, and to gain applauses which he cannot keep; so that scarcely can two persons meet, but one is offended or diverted by the ostentation of the other.

I understand where you are coming from. But I really don't officiate games, like these.

I blame Terry Butcher for all this disharmony and anger.

Get yersel' back on Pie and Bovril mun, yer sorely missed.

I hate you, then I love you. Its like I want to throw you off a cliff and then rush to the bottom to catch you.

Or perhaps folks who have to quote others are widely read and more intellectual ?

As ma old mucker Oscar Wilde once remarked to me - "Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation." And then Plato butted in with - "Life must be lived as play." i simply retorted - Do not take life so seriously as you will never get out of it alive - and in unison Oscar and Plato replied - "feck aff, that is nothing more than the ramblings of a needy, attention seeking old man?

:lol:

At least that is less offensive than being called a pr!ck !!

Envy shoots at others and wounds itself - and as ma old mucker Winston churchill once said to me during a pyschosocial intervention - "“Johndo - You have enemies ? Good. That menas that you have stood up for something, sometime in your life.

;) if it helps to view me as an enemy feel free. Have you ever thought about how folks who have to quote others really have nothing of their own to say?

It's a shame that your emotions would never be reciprocated, have you noticed lately that people view your posts as nothing more than the ramblings of a needy, attention seeking old man?

Nope - Siggy is the father of psychoanalysis which has "fathered" many of the offshoots. He was born in a different era but his "Interpretation of Dreams" publication is still revered by most and his theories were modified by the like of Jung and Adler - who viewed them to be too sexually orientated and cocaine influenced (which Siggy never actually took but did advocate as being medicinal). His theories of transference, the unconscious mind, the libido, dreams, psychosexual development and particulary the id, ego and super ego are all revered and copied.

He would basically have sectioned Craig Whyte and cured Caley D - although Oddquine would have been a challenge.

Have to agree on CW, definite psychopath without a doubt.

We often use scales in SFBT interventions so i am going to conduct a psychological research project.

What are your expectation levels for next season ?

I appear to be 12 months behind a lot of you - I would have gone for 4-5 this season and I have been sorely disappointed. I am going fer 5-6 next season as I feel that we have had enuff time to regroup, have wasted that time and opportunity and we have to step up - especially with the gudgies expecting to grow above us.

In what way do think we need therapy? Do you not think some NLP would be more effective in the short term? Some hypnotic word patterns to spin our minds around to your way of thinking? How are you going to use the results of your little experiment?

I bow down as CaleyD is evidently projecting his negativity, anger and frustration on this seasons' performances on to a more acceptable focus.

According to Sigmund Freud, projection is a psychological defense mechanism whereby one "projects" one's own undesirable thoughts, motivations, desires, and feelings onto someone or something else. 'Emotions or excitations which the ego tries to ward off are "split out" and then felt as being outside the ego...perceived in another person or subject,

Very good, most of Freud's ideas, whilst respected and revered at the time of writing, have been dismissed by modern psychologists. Have they not?

Marks, I have had e.mails in the last couple of days asking why we have not done as the Dons have in issuing a letter to the club, and also why we are not pushing the club for a statement on their view on the situation.

I can assure you that the matter is on the agenda, but we have not met, nor had a chance to meet to discuss what, if any, action may be needed on our part at the moment.

I am, however, willing to give my own personal thoughts on the matter.....

In regards to a letter from the Supporters Trust to the club. We already have regular contact with Club Chairman, Kenny Cameron and he is fully aware of what the fans are saying on the matter. The "Open Letter" issued by Dons Trust would suggest to me that they perhaps don't have that kind of relationship/dialogue with Aberdeen FC and the letter was necessary in order for them to get their point across.

In regards a statement from the club on their position on things. With the situation changing daily...even hourly...then any statement would likely be out of date/context before it was read....certainly up to this point. I would love for the club to come out and say "We will not support any move by Rangers to re-enter the SPL as a NewCo under any circumstances", but I'm realistic enough to know that for the people who have to balance the books then it can't be as cut and dry as that. I don't think any statement at this stage would tell us anything more than we know already....and that is that it's a very delicate situation and, as evident from last weeks postponement on rule changes, they are not ready or in a position to make a decision. So, IMO, better no statement than a non-statement which would only serve to frustrate.

Once again, to make it absolutely clear, that is my thoughts (at this moment in time) and not a representation of the Supporters Trust or anyone else.

Thank you D, it is enough for me to know that this is on the agenda.

For the rest of you, what are your thoughts on the situation? How would you suggest as a group we could protest let our feeling be known to the SFA/SPL/ICT?

You are correct, I have had my answer...but the poll is to see what answer others give

I really am surprised at how many people have responded to your survey CaleyD as I think the result is obvious.

I obviously have a greater faith in our fans than you then.

We might only have about 35% who would support such a scheme, but if you assume a core support and apply the poll results as a guide to the wider fanbase then we have 1000 fans who would be interested in making a contribution. Even if we only averaged £10/month from each then that's £120k a year. Not earth shattering sum of money, but I believe if/when faced with the very real possibility of financial armageddon then it would increase....and of course there's also a high chance of corporate backing as well.

Time will tell whether my faith is misplaced or not.

Nothing at all wrong with putting out feelers, if my club stepped up to the plate and did the correct thing I would consider myself a hypocrite not to financially support them when I have asked them to show faith in us. Whatever I felt I could reasonably afford.

If and when Newco Rangers are disallowed access to the SPL it would be down to every club in the league to adjust their spending accordingly. If they could raise money by asking the fans to do something as suggested by CaleyD then fair play to them but if not they'd have to tighten their belts, Ross County gaining promotion this season will go a long way to offset any loss we would feel by getting rid of the cheats, our budgets are set with relegation in mind and there is bound to be back up plans should we find ourselves in the 1st Division. In case you have short memories there are no old firm teams in the first division to boost income. In my opinion if there was an untapped revenue stream available to the club should Rangers be gone then the club should be attempting to tap into it whilst Rangers are in the SPL, not doing so is folly.

I think that if ICT did return to Division 1 then part time might well be on the cards this time

Which would you prefer, to support a team which lives within it's means and is morally just? or to support a team who is party to engineering the ability to cheat and then wipe the slate clean just so they can keep paying for underachieving "stars" in the top flight? In other words are you a sports fan or a 'sports' entertainment fan?

If and when Newco Rangers are disallowed access to the SPL it would be down to every club in the league to adjust their spending accordingly. If they could raise money by asking the fans to do something as suggested by CaleyD then fair play to them but if not they'd have to tighten their belts, Ross County gaining promotion this season will go a long way to offset any loss we would feel by getting rid of the cheats, our budgets are set with relegation in mind and there is bound to be back up plans should we find ourselves in the 1st Division. In case you have short memories there are no old firm teams in the first division to boost income. In my opinion if there was an untapped revenue stream available to the club should Rangers be gone then the club should be attempting to tap into it whilst Rangers are in the SPL, not doing so is folly.

This situation is all about the moral standpoint and how you personally choose to follow your conscience. ICT have a vote on bringing in rules which deal with a newco being punished should they be allowed into the SPL. The SPL board can at this moment place any sanctions they see fit on a newco but by voting to have a set of rules in place, a vote which falls on all SPL and requires an 11-1 majority, legitimises newcos and accepts that there is a possibility of allowing them direct access to the SPL. The SPL members should, for the sake of our game, be making a rule which requires newcos to restart from scratch. You cannot just wipe out your debts, acquired through trying to maintain a false position within the footballing world (cheating), and expect to keep your place in the top tier of the countries league system. If the SPL vote to legitimise cheating in this manner then I am done with the SPL.

The Dons supporters trust released this open letter, I am dismayed that the ICT supporters trust have not followed suit.

The Board of Dons Supporters Together have sent this open letter to Aberdeen FC Chairman Stewart Milne in regards to the upcoming SPL Meeting later this month.

Dear Mr Milne,

As you prepare for the meeting of the SPL clubs on 30 April 2012 to discuss the proposed changes to the rules of the SPL, we wish to make you aware of the views of the supporters we represent.

It is our opinion that the proposed changes to the SPL rules do not go far enough, and have as their main purpose the facilitation of the direct entry of a Newco Rangers into the SPL following liquidation of the previous commercial entity. You will be aware of the strength of feeling that such a potential outcome arouses amongst followers of football across Scotland, and the potential damage to the game as a whole if financial self-interest is allowed to over-ride the principles of fair play, integrity and honouring ones obligations.

The astonishing number of responses to the recent splsurvey and consistency of views expressed (even from Rangers supporters) cannot be ignored. Ultimately, the finance in the game comes from the pockets of the paying supporters, either through their direct contact with the clubs through ticket sales and merchandise or indirectly via their subscriptions to TV companies and sponsors.

In survey after survey, these same customers whose money funds the game are telling every club and footballing authority in Scotland that they want more variety in larger leagues, more positive open, attacking and attractive football played, a fairer distribution of money within the game across all the leagues, and an even-handed application of the rules by officials and regulating bodies. Until the customers views are listened to and their views acted on, the game in Scotland will continue its slow and steady decline

With regard to the SPL proposals our view is

Resolution 1 – In favour.

Resolution 2A – Against. Instead, we feel that an alternative Resolution 2 should be proposed which specifically prohibits an Insolvency Transfer Event.

Resolution 2B – Not applicable due to the prohibition of Insolvency Transfer Event.

Resolution 3 – In favour.

Resolution 4 – The principles of our views on Resolutions 1,2A, 2B and 3 above should be applied to whatever specific updates are proposed.

Resolution 5 – Not applicable due to the prohibition of Insolvency Transfer Event. An alternative rule should be proposed under which a member club’s share in the SPL is not transferable, and in the event of liquidation that share lapses. The remainder of the current season will be played out by the remaining clubs with games already played against the defunct club declared null and void. The vacant place will be filled by a double promotion from the top of the SFL first division at the end of that season.

Resolution 6 – In favour.

Resolution 7 – In favour.

With regard to the potential of “life without Rangers”, it seems to us that the official statement you made in the Annual Accounts of 2002 is as relevant to the current situation as it was during the events of 2002 :-

“It is difficult to envisage exactly what is going to happen in terms of the infrastructure of the game in Scotland

but, as things stand, Aberdeen, along with all the other SPL clubs other than the Old Firm, will be leaving the SPL at the conclusion of season 2003/4. If that does happen, Aberdeen, along with the other clubs outwith the Old Firm, will be looking to form a new league with a new voting structure which Rangers and Celtic will be invited to join. If they choose to decline this invitation there is little doubt that, in the short term, there will be a reduction in revenues from broadcasting and sponsorship due to their absence. However, it is my firm belief that within a short period, a Scottish league, in which a number of clubs will be capable of winning the championship, will become extremely attractive to television companies and business organisations alike.”

If the current 10 non Old-Firm clubs were to pursue today, the course of action proposed 10 years ago, it would be with the full support of DST. The notion of individual clubs owning their own TV rights in a league is preposterous, as is that of 2 clubs acting as a concert party and having the power of veto over the majority. The situation is entirely analogous to the rugby 5 Nations situation of the past when England’s demands for an unfair share of TV money were successfully faced down by the other countries.

In the event that Rangers go into liquidation, as an alternative to the 10 resigning from the SPL, we suggest that an immediate egm of the SPL is called and the 10 push through changes to the voting structure while Celtic are in a minority of 1, and before any resumption of Old Firm hegemony can be re-established.

DST considers that the time has now come to arrest the rapid decline of Scottish Football by restoring democracy, and re-distributing finances fairly in the game. The supporting public will no longer tolerate irregularities by the game’s fat cats, nor the subsidy of “too big to fail” enterprises whether they are banks or bankrupt football clubs.

Best Regards

The Board of Dons Supporters Together

http://www.donssuppo.../category/news/

The choice ladies and gentlemen is your own, if you feel that you can follow a club which condones and is a party to cheating on this scale then that is your choice and should not be condemned. My choice however is that I will not tolerate or back any club who, for their own financial gain, legitimises cheating and removes the sport from our wonderful game.

Just been listening to Sportsound.

If I wanted to listen to an expert talk about being a centre forward, holding the ball up, finishing etc. I would be more than happy to listen to Billy Dodds. But..........why would I want to hear his totally tainted (word of the month I understand) and ill informed views on the processes of administration, liquidation or adjudication? Surely the BBC can do better than this?

Thought he hit a particular high with the 'investigate the investigation' quote

Dodds is a two faced @rsehole

http://www.thecourie...e-is-clear.html

They decided to vote against the CVA on a point of principle because of the way the club has been run — and Dodds believes the finger of blame for Dundee's problems should be pointed elsewhere.

Not sure, got my updates from here

County team-

County starting team: Malin, Miller, Morrison, Flynn, Munro, Duncan, Craig, Quinn, Morrow, Byrne, Corcoran

County legends team, Bullock, Perry, Campbell, Williamson, Belshaw, MacLeod, Ross, Gilbert, Adams, Connolly, Hislop

Pretty poor County starting line up.

2-0 ICT half time.

Knowing the SPL, there's probably some rule or other that prevents it.

Hearts brought in dynamic pricing for next season.

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20120320/bseason-tickets-qab_2257176_2685496

I think we should follow suit, costs nothing to set up a paypal account and if it even gains a tenner from someone it's worth it.

Discussion on the subject from elsewhere, well worth a read!

http://www.pieandbovril.com/forum/index.php/topic/172164-if-rangers-newco-are-voted-straight-into-spl/

http://www.pieandbovril.com/forum/index.php/topic/172120-spl-resolutions-for-discussion/

http://www.pieandbovril.com/forum/index.php/topic/167655-rangers-now-in-administration/

http://www.pieandbovril.com/forum/index.php/topic/172214-spl-fans-survey/

http://www.pieandbovril.com/forum/index.php/topic/172317-get-your-chairmen-fuckin-telt/

ICT would not have a vote on whether or not a newco were admitted back in place of a liquidated club that would fall to the SPL board, however ICT do have a vote on the resolutions which allow for newcos to be given a direct route back, by putting rules in place which state a course of action to be taken against clubs going down the newco route they are saying that newcos are okay, they should be bringing in regulations which require the automatic expulsion of a club who have liquidated the finacial side of their operation.

CaleyD, could you in your capacity with the supporters' trust take this issue up with the chairman?

Also, seeing as the supporters' trust is a major share holder in ICT do they get to have a rep at Rangers creditors meetings with the administrator?

Allowing newcos to begin their existence in the SPL, especially when it is for monetary reasons, is selling the soul of our game. NO TO NEWCOS.

http://www.splsurvey.co.uk/

Black for Hearts, an absolute screamer too.

Cowie WEMBLEY - unlucky but must be first ex-ICT man to play there ;-)

Penalties from shoot outs are not classed as goals though. Had a good game did the former Staggie.