Charles Bannerman

SP... first of all horses. I think there has been a long and continuing association between the Dunain area and horses. For instance horses are still kept in a field just before Dunain Park on the A82 and there are more in the fields between the A82 and the canal where I think they still hold showjumping events. General Wade... an interesting tale of the Jacobite era. I could argue that there were FIVE Jacobite rebellions, if you include the attempts to restore James II and VII in 1689-90. Then there was an abortive attempt in 1708 where a French fleet got no further than the Forth and didn't disembark its troops. It's thought this was just a feint by Louis XIV to distract Britain's attention from the War of the Spanish Succession. After that there was the "15" where sanctions against its supporters were remarkably lenient I've always thought, followed by the short lived 1719 rebellion which ended in a battle at Glenshiel. By now the Hanoverian government was getting a bit fed up with this ongoing hassle and decided to set up a network of roads and barracks throughout the Highlands to facilitate troop dispositions and troop movements in order to discourage further trouble. General Wade was put in charge and the network included Ruthven Barracks at Kingussie and the road over the Corrieyairick from Fort Augustus to Kincraig. Old Edinburgh Road, as it continues up Glendruidh and past Milton of Leys to Faillie etc, is also a Wade Road. (And Inverness has a Wade Road off Old Edinburgh Road in the Milton Crescent scheme.) Wade's assistant and then successor was William Caulfield. Finally there was the "45", French support for which it could equally be argued was an attempt to distract Britain from the War of the Austrian Succession. There was always a lot of self interest in French "support" for the Jacobite cause. (Self interest... not at all like the French, eh?! :015:) This, of course, brings to mind the third verse of what must be the most turgid national anthem in the world (not a patch on the French one which is magnifique!) which begins "Lord grant that Marshal Wade may by they mighty aid victory bring. Then like a torrent rush, rebellious Scots to crush..." One more comment on Wade. It's a bit of an irony that one of the biggest aids the Jacobites had in flitting about the Highlands both at the begining and the end of the 45 was Wade's Roads! Charles Edward Stuart also fled from Culloden initially to Ruthven.

Yes.. two mistakes in one post... after the THIRD goal on the FIFTH of January! (On average I'm right though since 3+5 = 4+4) :015:

Which you find all around the Islands, rather than in the Loo-vre! :015:

And where Paris has Notre Dame, Inverness has a disused skating rink and a mountain of dogcrap.

Just texted Laura to warn her I'll be checking with Gordy as to who ordered gammon sizzlers. I will also be monitoring dfr's plate on Thursday morning (whilst stuffing myself with large helpings of fried Jaguar). Any one of the FFF who would like to join me for a run at any time would be very welcome. I'm just back from a 4 miler just now. On the other hand Les could maybe instead try a run round the block with the "bad company" he was keeping at the Clach Club on Saturday night. I predict the "bad company" will probably beat me in our next race, since she was only 8 seconds behind me last time out.

I think this thread should be used to "denounce" members of the Fitness First Five who have been seen to be backsliding. For instance, Les Kidger was spotted at a dinner in the Clach Club on Saturday night. (And before anyone starts up with topical jokes about short rations at Grant Street, forget it... the "Cuisine du Ferry" is out of this world!) I will keep you all posted (which possibly means it's unlikely I'll see Doug Ritchie visiting my Rotary Club for breakfast for a while!)

.... given that a lot of Caley Thistle fans seemed to be expecting it a month ago today, on Junuary 4th, just after the fourth goal went in at home to Gretna!

Can't say I can see much overlap between Inverness and Baron Haussmann's wonderful design of Paris!

Found this.... Culcabock (Inverness), C?il na C?baig. This name appears to mean "the quiet spot of the kebbuck of cheese", but the original name was possibly C?l na Ceapaich, "the back of the tillage land". The name Capaig is found in Caputh, and this may be another origin of the name. Whilst checking that one out, I was also reminded that "Dalneigh" is a corruption of the Gaelic for "field of horses". The pronunciation of that is more accurately "Dalneich" and that was what older Invernessians, including my grandmother, used to use. The "field of horses" presumably relates to Dalneigh Farm on which the housing estate was built of of which the current Dalniegh Church manse (of "nicking the minister's apples" fame) was previously the farmhouse.

Can't say I'm all that impressed by that chipper in Glenurquhart Road.... soggy chips and a bit on ther dear side. If you want state of the art in this depaertment, go up to Hilton and see Mr. Michael Miller who will, for instance, provide a wonderful chicken supper for ?2.99.

So I see the legacy of Jim Farry still lives on in Scottish football!

Smith Avenue actually runs from Glenurquhart Road to the roundabout on Bruce Gardens wjhere it meets Maxwell Drive. You may be thinking of Ross Avenue (or maybe Harrowden Road or Perceval Road.) I haven't a clue about Culcabock apart from the likelihood that it's of Gaelic origin. There's a book about Gaelic placenames around Inverness by a BBC colleague of mine Roddy MacLean. As for the dualling of Laurel Avenue, that always was a mystery, but on the other hand it did have the beneficial effect of increasing the width of "No Man's Land" at the top end! :015:

It seems that most of the "fields" are in two groups in the Fairfield Road and Annfield Road areas. I think also that both areas were developed at roughly the same time - latish 19th century. Presumably they refer to the vicinity of fields which were in the area prior to development. Calufied Road is different. William Caulfield was General Wade's chief engineer and eventual successor in the constructiuon of military roads through the Highlands between the 15 and 45 Jacobite Rebellions. SMEE, a couple of things. Bill Smith is not the current provost, it's Bob Wynd (so presumably we'll eventually get a Wynd Wynd!). Also, Provost Smith Crescent was named after Provost William Smith of the late 60s and early 70s whose biggest achievement was possibly fronting the campaign to have Eden Court built. The immediate past provost is also William (Bill) Smith. We also have Smith Avenue, but that's been there since before them both - in fact I think it's 1930s. We of course have two ex Provosts by the name of Fraser... Ian C Fraser (Coffin John) and William A.E. Fraser (Billy Butcher). However we also have two Fraser Streets (both pre dating these gentlemen but where else but Inverness could that happen?!). One goes from Bank Street to the junction of Church Street and Queensgate (about 50 yards from Billy Butcher's shop) and the other is off Haugh Road near Chalkie's shop. Then there's Dalneigh where all the Saints go marching in.... St. Andrew, St. Valery (with that spelling it's clearly names after St. Valery en Caux where the 51st Highland Division was captured by Rommel in 1940), St. Mungo, St. Margaret, St. Fergus, St. Ninian, St John's. the other end of Dalneigh, in contrast, is all trees. Laurel Ave, Lilac Grove, Limetree Avenue, Hawthorn Drive, Rowan Road. Laurel Avenue!! When I used to cycle home to St. Andrew Drive as a kid, I always used to speed up at the Dalneigh Road - Laurel Avenue roundabout and take a hard look to my left in case I was going to get chased by the Kirkhams or the Finlays!

At least he keeps up the tradition of a ******** in the place at all times. (I'm preserving your anonymity "ilig"!) BTW Caley D quite rightly sings the praises of the Hilton Chippie (even though his brother does cook their excellent fare!)

Just don't lose your head! :015:

And I thought you just abused your health in the Heathmount! :004:

CRINGE!!!!!!!!!! :33: :33: :33: :020: :crazy07: :019: :009: :009:

This thread seems to make the fundamental assumption that Graeme Bennett doesn't have anything else in his life apart from football.

The keeper was Jimmy Smith.

SMEE, you choose a very interesting time window, since in 1992 I might just have gone for Elgin City if I was being objective enough to ignore the fact that I am an Invernessian. They certainly had the more recent pedigree of being the top club, having held all five HL trohpies at one point in 1989 and Borough Briggs possibly had the edge over, for instance, Telford Street. Ross County were at that time the top Highland League team but weren't far enough on from their spell of debt and amateur status to earn a full nomination. Caley certainly would have been seriously considered as well because it was a very well run club wuith a good pedigree in the relatively recent past and had had a "letter of intent" lodged with the SFL since 1986. Into 1993 the situation changes because in April of that year, Elgin City became embroiled in the Teasdale Affair which did no good at all to a case which was weakening by the day. That then brings your scenario down to a straight fight between Caley and an ever strengthening Ross County. But then the whole question becomes completely hypothetical since in May 1993, INE came up with the merger proposal which was clearly (and has now proved to be so) a much more robust option. Now, given how well Ross County have done in the intervening years (and you can't say that geting to Division 1 and developing a 4000+ seater stadium is bad) I might indeed have been justified in backing an ever strenghtening County against a "go it alone" bid from Caley which I have always suspected would have become another Stenhousemuir, Forfar or Arbroath since it would have stagnated in the absence of the serious money which I believe only a unified bid was capable of attracting. But as it turns out, the merged Inverness bid and the Ross County bid were by far the strongest, and that was clearly backed up by the overwhelming nature of the vote in January 1994.

I would boil my thesis on this one down to two propositions. 1) In all respects, including on the field, Caley was a significantly more substantial entity than Thistle. (On the field, the Jags at best could claim advantage in the early 70s and to have matched Caley in the 86-88 period.) Hence the necessarily unequal nature of the merger. 2) Caley, although generally ahead of Thistle and really right up there, were certainly not, over time, streets ahead of all other Highland League clubs. (This is perhaps a romantic notion which tends to burgeon with a) the passing of time b) the introduction of threads like this and c) a few post match snifters in the Social Club of a Saturday night! :003:) Kingsmills.... I'm pretty sure Highland League clubs very occasionally featured in commentaries before 1992. For instance I sourced a commentary of Elgin City's 1968 Scottish Cup tie at Cappielow (incidentally thay remain the ONLY Highland League club ever to have reached the quarter finals). Caley 108.. I don't think you can take a single result v St. Johnstone (or even the run of three which also included defeats of Stenhousemuir and Clyde) as indicative that by 1992 Caley were enjoying a golden age. Caley won their last Highland League title in 1988. Later that year they were demolished by Jags in the Q Cup replay (which equally I wouldn't recognise as evidence of a fundamental Thistle supremacy) and indeed won very little indeed after that, except the 1991 Qualifying Cup and the 1994 North Cup in their very last weeks. However I would also point to the Airdrie victory in 1990 which further emphasises that this was still a side which, if past its best, could still pull off one offs from time to time. Equally, the Jags' 3-0 defeat of Kilmarnock in 1985 (which is indeed a very rare event of its type) is not evidence that this was a brilliant Thistle team although it was just a couple of seasons short of a period where Caley and Thistle jointly dominated Highland League football. Then in the late 80s there began a joint decline, coinciding with the rise of Elgin, then County then Huntly, to the relative low point of 1993. This I believe is crucial to any understanding of the merger - which went ahead at a time of relative weakness on the part of both clubs but which I believe would never have happened if it had come along earlier or especially in 1987 or 88.

Let's look at the history of the Highland League from the 80s onwards. You will see from the winners' list that Caley won three consecutive titles in 82-84 and then won it for the last time in 1988. During that period there were corresponding wins in other competitions, especially the Q Cup. Thistle had a very successful period in the late 1980s and in 1988 these two Inverness teams had a complete carve up of just about all that was going in the HL. Then they both began to go into decline. Thistle won virtually nothing and Caley's 1991 Q Cup win was about all they had in the 1989-93 period. Basically what happened was that Elgin (under Pele) and then Ross County (under Bobby Wilson) became supreme. Therefore, as the merger negotiations started, BOTH clubs were very much lacking in the success of which they had both enjoyed so much just 5 years previously. I believe that was an integral factor in making even the notion of a merger acceptable on either side of the river. I argue this case in detail in the first chapter of Against All Odds so won't go into the detail here. But as far as the most successful team is concerned, it's a difficult one to call. Older results are less relevant in the context of any discussion of Scottish League entry, and you will notice that post war Elgin won more HL titles than anyone else. Caley were big, but I suggest not as overwhelming as a lot of Caley fans (understandably) suggest.

The last several posts have been very enjoyable to read and very informed. I would, however, dispute a couple of statements. Firstly, I think SMEE (not atypically of ex Caley fans) has got his rose coloured spectacles out. Yes, Caley were a very successful club, especially in the 1980s, but by the time the merger came around, they were very much in a dip in fortunes and had a very poor recent record of trophy wins. In the first chapter of Against all Odds, I argue that one of the main factors which made an unlikely merger possible is that at the time neither club was going through a particularly successful phase. I'm also not at all convinced that Caley AND Thistle would both have got in at the expense of County. A double Inverness application would have split the vote and County scored very highly anyway since the mounted a great campaign. Indeed the fear was that a double application could have ended in NEITHER Inverness club getting in... which seemed a big danger before in very latterly became apparent that Elgin's challenge was much weaker than most had thought. Mantis' version of the Teasdale Affair is, as I understand it, spot on.

?8500 plus VAT for Billy which took it above the 10 grand Jock wanted the transfer to go through for. Am off to dentist so it may be a little time before I can reply in detail to the more recent posts on this fascinating thread.... but I will!

RBC... your suggestion of a brand new city centre social club is an interesting one - albeit possibly tinged with a bit of resentment of the current use of a property previously identified with "them"!? :004: How financially realistic this might be, I couldn't say but a single city centre premises incorporating a Social Club and a club shop would have a lot to commend it. There is one possible down side, however. As I understand it, much of the profit which the SC has regularly made is due to people resident in the Greig Street area whose "local" this is. (For instance there's this old guy like Jack and Victor who sites at the corner of the bar and Fs and blinds incessantly all evening and another one like Young Mr. Grace who needs virtually carried into the top bar.) If that clientele were to be lost, the profitability might be affected. Certainly ICT fans don't keep the place going since it's busy with them only after home games. However this is a completely different issue. What we were discussing was the relative contributions to the merger of Thistle and Caley in terms of assets. We had got as far as - Kingsmills ?486K, Telford Street ?1M. Thistle SC ?150K and lossmaking,Caley SC - unknown but very much bigger and has continued to make a profit. That comes out at around 70% Caley, 30% Thistle. You are not comparing like with like when you compare keeping football clubs and keeping the Thistle club going. Football clubs are kept open at all costs because they are the principal business. A social club, especially one which is surplus to requirement and at the top of a narrow stairs, is subsidiary to the principal business and it is therefore wise to realise its value for the overall benefit of that business. And by the way, you are hearing this from someone who had a lot more sympathy for the Thistle perspective on matter than for the Caley one during that fraught "Summer of Discontent" of 1994. It's just that you have to be realstic about the unequal nature of the merger, difficult though that may be for a fervent ex Jaggie. As far as the Clach Club is concerned, you will be hearing more about that in the Media this week as their overall plans for Grant Street become public.