gordieict

If it wasn't for Brill could be 4 or 5 down this half 

Dreadful game, agree we made the best of the chances but both sides were fairly poor. I also thought Billy worked hard and was unlucky not to get on the scoresheet. 

I didn't hold out much hope of reaching Europe before the game so not that disappointed with the draw.

 

Don't know how to post images but this shirt is outstanding. Really not a fan of our current home strip but something bold like this would tempt me to buy my first shirt for years. http://images3.newscred.com/cD05ZWE1NTA1MDI0MDQxMjJmMTdkZmU0ZDEyNGMwN2RmYiZnPTQ3NDk0MjczODEzOGFmZGI5YzgwNDQ0Y2M1MzMzYzc2?action=padding&width=640&color=f4f4f4&height=427

Gorgeous that is, would love something like that!

 

I don't know why but when I see that strip I just think Rangers

Gordie thanks. THat will get updated as soon as possible. Apologies Don.

No worries Davie 

 

 

 

I think that some have become to cosy because they happen to have some involvement with the club that that they would never criticise the board/management no matter how bad things might get.

 

If that's aimed at me, then you couldn't be further from the truth.

 

I may not be so publicly critical of the club as I once was, but there's reason for that and it has nothing to do with becoming "cosy".

 

There's two main reasons for it.....firstly, having people at the club who are willing to directly listen and take on board the views of the fans....and secondly, in allowing me to do what I do for the club there is the need for an element of trust (from both sides).  I trust that if I raise a matter with the chairman he will give it due consideration and he trusts that I won't abuse the access and information that's made available to me and which allows me to improve communication with fans.

 

I receive no salary and am not an employee of the club.  There is no contractual obligation for me to refrain from being critical of anything...and I am critical when I see need.  I'm pretty sure if you spoke to Kenny Cameron he would attest to the fact that I can be as big a pain in the ass now as I've always been when I get my dander up over something....I just don't see the need/benefit in doing that on a public forum when I can speak to the man direct.

 

I would also add that anyone could phone up and ask for an appointment with the Chairman if they have an issue they wanted to discuss and it would be welcomed....just not this week as he's away for a few days.

 

 

It wasn't just aimed at yourself but more those involved in CJT at the higher level, I have never seen one of them on here once expressing a worry about the way things are going under Yogi, perhaps its a coincidence and they are all happy and have no concerns going forward.

 

I would question your reply about how you don't need to post on here if you are not happy with things yet will have a dig at fans that do have concerns. There is not much point in coming on a forum unless you put your views across.I hope you can understand that why this is as seen as just defending the club because you have relationship when as you explained this is not the case.

 

I do not want this to be seen as a dig at CJT who I think are doing a remarkable job, however they like us are just fans and there is no real point on coming on a forum unless an honest opinion is put across or in my view that opinion losses credibility. 

 

 

Just to be clear.  I have not been a CJT Board Member for about 7 or 8 months now.

 

 

 

They need to updated their website then  

 

 

 

I think that some have become to cosy because they happen to have some involvement with the club that that they would never criticise the board/management no matter how bad things might get.

 

If that's aimed at me, then you couldn't be further from the truth.

 

I may not be so publicly critical of the club as I once was, but there's reason for that and it has nothing to do with becoming "cosy".

 

There's two main reasons for it.....firstly, having people at the club who are willing to directly listen and take on board the views of the fans....and secondly, in allowing me to do what I do for the club there is the need for an element of trust (from both sides).  I trust that if I raise a matter with the chairman he will give it due consideration and he trusts that I won't abuse the access and information that's made available to me and which allows me to improve communication with fans.

 

I receive no salary and am not an employee of the club.  There is no contractual obligation for me to refrain from being critical of anything...and I am critical when I see need.  I'm pretty sure if you spoke to Kenny Cameron he would attest to the fact that I can be as big a pain in the ass now as I've always been when I get my dander up over something....I just don't see the need/benefit in doing that on a public forum when I can speak to the man direct.

 

I would also add that anyone could phone up and ask for an appointment with the Chairman if they have an issue they wanted to discuss and it would be welcomed....just not this week as he's away for a few days.

 

 

It wasn't just aimed at yourself but more those involved in CJT at the higher level, I have never seen one of them on here once expressing a worry about the way things are going under Yogi, perhaps its a coincidence and they are all happy and have no concerns going forward.

 

I would question your reply about how you don't need to post on here if you are not happy with things yet will have a dig at fans that do have concerns. There is not much point in coming on a forum unless you put your views across.I hope you can understand that why this is as seen as just defending the club because you have relationship when as you explained this is not the case.

 

I do not want this to be seen as a dig at CJT who I think are doing a remarkable job, however they like us are just fans and there is no real point on coming on a forum unless an honest opinion is put across or in my view that opinion losses credibility. 

 

 

Just to be clear.  I have not been a CJT Board Member for about 7 or 8 months now.

 

I think my views on Hughes are well documented on here and elsewhere, but in summary....I believe that there are far too many factors outwith his (and the clubs) control which have contributed to us not getting the results/performances we might have hoped for.  I also draw comparisons to previous seasons when results/performances at this time of year have been much the same or worse.  I like what he is trying to do with the team/squad.  I like the fact that talented young players are being given a real opportunity.  I'm heartened by the fact that players are invested in his vision for where he wants to take things. I'm encouraged by his willingness and ability to actively change things when it's not going right. I share the players belief in him...this is not only evidenced in interviews they give to the press bu by their actions in signing extended contracts etc.

 

Do I like losing games? No.

 

Do I have any immediate concerns about Hughes as a Manager? No.

 

Do I buy into the theory that just because things aren't going our way then we need a fall guy? No.

 

Do I think it would have been any different under TB or any other manager? No.

 

It's human nature to want to attach definite cause to any effect.  I choose to look at the wider picture and take all aspects of the situation into account whilst others, IMO, seem to be solely focused on a single element...the manager.  There's really no arguing with many of these people, especially when they choose to ignore the possibility of alternative causes, dismiss counter arguments by claiming stuff being said is toeing the party line or lies, accuse those of making the arguments as being in some kind of cosy situation with the club or being somehow beholden to be non critical.

 

You might argue that in refusing to accept an argument which points the finger of blame squarely at the manager then I am doing the same thing.  I don't think so.  I acknowledge that some people have that view and whilst I have dismissed it, I believe I have done so with reasoned argument based on all the information to hand.

 

I only hope you are right

I am curious as to what those alternative causes are and how they came about so quickly after TBs departure when we were sitting 2nd in the league?

Gordie (and DD) Believe me, there is no "cosiness" about relationships between CJT and ICTFC. If there are things to be said to the club on behalf of the membership then that gets done at whatever level it needs to be done at up to and including the Board and Chairman. Likewise, if there are fan issues that need addressed they will approach us even if we might not agree. It's a mature relationship which is completely transparent and has to be - if it was any other way at a club our size, it wouldn't work. But we tend to deal in matters of fact and requirement, not opinion which is what this thread is. DD, you are right CTO represents the views of a part of the Caley Thistle support and it's clear that there are divergent opinions even in that one part of the support (or this thread wouldn't exist)  Neither pro nor anti John Hughes supporters can extrapolate other arguments out to suppport others - linking our crowd size ( a challenge that existed long before John Hughes arrived) to his management of the club isn't valid as there isn't clear supporting evidence and doesn't demonstrate that there is a wider body of discontent. It could equally be put down to the price of attendance, timing of matches or any number of factors. At the moment, we lie 5th in the League and may well finish higher, have been to a cup final and a quarter final of another, established dominance over our closest rivals and remain in with a chance of qualifying for europe. That's all fact and on that basis I'd have a hard job going to the club and complaining about the direction of the mangement of the club. Next year? We'll judge that on it's merits at the time or as directed to by our membership.

Davie Balfour

Chairman CJT

Davie

Thanks you kindly for you reply.

I haven't suggested that CJT should go to the board about Hughes at this stage, as I also don't think its something that should be done at this stage and hopefully will never get to that stage.

My main gripe was that if members of the CJT board are not prepared to give an honest opinion on concerns they may have about Hughes management then they shouldn't be criticising those that do. I also said previously that perhaps it is just a coincidence that CJT have no concerns but that would surprise me as a large majority of ICT fans  that I speak to are concerned 

 

 

 

 

 

I think that some have become to cosy because they happen to have some involvement with the club that that they would never criticise the board/management no matter how bad things might get.

If that's aimed at me, then you couldn't be further from the truth.

I may not be so publicly critical of the club as I once was, but there's reason for that and it has nothing to do with becoming "cosy".

There's two main reasons for it.....firstly, having people at the club who are willing to directly listen and take on board the views of the fans....and secondly, in allowing me to do what I do for the club there is the need for an element of trust (from both sides). I trust that if I raise a matter with the chairman he will give it due consideration and he trusts that I won't abuse the access and information that's made available to me and which allows me to improve communication with fans.

I receive no salary and am not an employee of the club. There is no contractual obligation for me to refrain from being critical of anything...and I am critical when I see need. I'm pretty sure if you spoke to Kenny Cameron he would attest to the fact that I can be as big a pain in the ass now as I've always been when I get my dander up over something....I just don't see the need/benefit in doing that on a public forum when I can speak to the man direct.

I would also add that anyone could phone up and ask for an appointment with the Chairman if they have an issue they wanted to discuss and it would be welcomed....just not this week as he's away for a few days.

It wasn't just aimed at yourself but more those involved in CJT at the higher level, I have never seen one of them on here once expressing a worry about the way things are going under Yogi, perhaps its a coincidence and they are all happy and have no concerns going forward.

I would question your reply about how you don't need to post on here if you are not happy with things yet will have a dig at fans that do have concerns. There is not much point in coming on a forum unless you put your views across.I hope you can understand that why this is as seen as just defending the club because you have relationship when as you explained this is not the case.

I do not want this to be seen as a dig at CJT who I think are doing a remarkable job, however they like us are just fans and there is no real point on coming on a forum unless an honest opinion is put across or in my view that opinion losses credibility. If any member of CJT has concerns they would like raised then contact can be made by either emailing admin@ictst.co.uk or by personal contact at our desk in the sports bar pre any home match. Board members are elected to represent members and our personal views may difer from that being raised. However any concerns would be discussed at our meetings and passed on to the club if thought appropriate.

Sorry but you are missing my point, was just passing an opinion I have no need to bring it up in the form of a complaint You misunderstand me. We are happy to hear fans opinions. If you don't come and tell us how are we meant to know? As Fraz says we are happy just to have a chat etc

 

I posted my opinion on here thats what this forum is for, like I said previously I have no gripe with the work that CJT are doing,  CaleyD was kind enough to respond to my initial post that I think that things have become "to cosy" and I understand that as CJT want to keep a healthy relationship with the club to keep communication going. What my initial post was aimed at was that CJT board members seem to refrain from posting that they might be concerned with when things aren't going well and i stick by that opinion. 

Can I ask you, taking of your CJT hat and just as a fan, do you have any concerns about Hughes as a manager ?

I am pleased  to hear that you are happy to hear fans opinions, but you can also read them on here.

 

 

 

 

I think that some have become to cosy because they happen to have some involvement with the club that that they would never criticise the board/management no matter how bad things might get.

 

If that's aimed at me, then you couldn't be further from the truth.

 

I may not be so publicly critical of the club as I once was, but there's reason for that and it has nothing to do with becoming "cosy".

 

There's two main reasons for it.....firstly, having people at the club who are willing to directly listen and take on board the views of the fans....and secondly, in allowing me to do what I do for the club there is the need for an element of trust (from both sides).  I trust that if I raise a matter with the chairman he will give it due consideration and he trusts that I won't abuse the access and information that's made available to me and which allows me to improve communication with fans.

 

I receive no salary and am not an employee of the club.  There is no contractual obligation for me to refrain from being critical of anything...and I am critical when I see need.  I'm pretty sure if you spoke to Kenny Cameron he would attest to the fact that I can be as big a pain in the ass now as I've always been when I get my dander up over something....I just don't see the need/benefit in doing that on a public forum when I can speak to the man direct.

 

I would also add that anyone could phone up and ask for an appointment with the Chairman if they have an issue they wanted to discuss and it would be welcomed....just not this week as he's away for a few days.  

It wasn't just aimed at yourself but more those involved in CJT at the higher level, I have never seen one of them on here once expressing a worry about the way things are going under Yogi, perhaps its a coincidence and they are all happy and have no concerns going forward.

 

I would question your reply about how you don't need to post on here if you are not happy with things yet will have a dig at fans that do have concerns. There is not much point in coming on a forum unless you put your views across.I hope you can understand that why this is as seen as just defending the club because you have relationship when as you explained this is not the case.

 

I do not want this to be seen as a dig at CJT who I think are doing a remarkable job, however they like us are just fans and there is no real point on coming on a forum unless an honest opinion is put across or in my view that opinion losses credibility.

If any member of CJT has concerns they would like raised then contact can be made by either emailing admin@ictst.co.uk or by personal contact at our desk in the sports bar pre any home match. Board members are elected to represent members and our personal views may difer from that being raised. However any concerns would be discussed at our meetings and passed on to the club if thought appropriate.

 

 

Sorry but you are missing my point, was just passing an opinion I have no need to bring it up in the form of a complaint merely an observation.

 

 

 

 

I think that some have become to cosy because they happen to have some involvement with the club that that they would never criticise the board/management no matter how bad things might get.

 

If that's aimed at me, then you couldn't be further from the truth.

 

I may not be so publicly critical of the club as I once was, but there's reason for that and it has nothing to do with becoming "cosy".

 

There's two main reasons for it.....firstly, having people at the club who are willing to directly listen and take on board the views of the fans....and secondly, in allowing me to do what I do for the club there is the need for an element of trust (from both sides).  I trust that if I raise a matter with the chairman he will give it due consideration and he trusts that I won't abuse the access and information that's made available to me and which allows me to improve communication with fans.

 

I receive no salary and am not an employee of the club.  There is no contractual obligation for me to refrain from being critical of anything...and I am critical when I see need.  I'm pretty sure if you spoke to Kenny Cameron he would attest to the fact that I can be as big a pain in the ass now as I've always been when I get my dander up over something....I just don't see the need/benefit in doing that on a public forum when I can speak to the man direct.

 

I would also add that anyone could phone up and ask for an appointment with the Chairman if they have an issue they wanted to discuss and it would be welcomed....just not this week as he's away for a few days.  

It wasn't just aimed at yourself but more those involved in CJT at the higher level, I have never seen one of them on here once expressing a worry about the way things are going under Yogi, perhaps its a coincidence and they are all happy and have no concerns going forward.

 

I would question your reply about how you don't need to post on here if you are not happy with things yet will have a dig at fans that do have concerns. There is not much point in coming on a forum unless you put your views across.I hope you can understand that why this is as seen as just defending the club because you have relationship when as you explained this is not the case.

 

I do not want this to be seen as a dig at CJT who I think are doing a remarkable job, however they like us are just fans and there is no real point on coming on a forum unless an honest opinion is put across or in my view that opinion losses credibility.

If any member of CJT has concerns they would like raised then contact can be made by either emailing admin@ictst.co.uk or by personal contact at our desk in the sports bar pre any home match. Board members are elected to represent members and our personal views may difer from that being raised. However any concerns would be discussed at our meetings and passed on to the club if thought appropriate.

 

Sorry but you are missing my point, was just passing an opinion I have no need to bring it up in the form of a complaint 

4 points 

Renegade,  I am glad that you want Yogi to succeed and I do believe that most of our support do. What annoys me is the constant criticism of what he has done in the past, picking on every single failure that occurs now and not giving him any credit for attempting to improve our players' style of play. We have very good players but he knows that they can still be improved and genuinely believes he can help them reach an even better standard. ( remember Bruce and the spider story) There will be blunders made I'm sure, as there has been but given the chance this man could and I feel will succeed, given a reasonable amount of time by the Club and patience from the supporters. Certainly the players themselves seem up for it and they want success.

 

It would also be a help to him if the dark glasses came off some of the so called support and they looked at the wider picture now and again. Why do they think that players are being played in the wrong positions when in fact what is happening is that they are being trialled in different positions in order to build the strongest formations throughout the field.

 

 

Gordieict  yes at the moment we have only two real wingers. Is it not prudent, in our circumstances, to wait till the transfer market opens and then supplement that area from a wide choice rather than rush to get someone in now? I know you are not saying do something now but you say it is a worry we have only two fit wing men!  Hopefully they will both stay fit for the remainder of the season. I agree it is a worry because they were a joy to watch against County.

No I don't suggest that we go and get wingers now, in fact I am not ever sure Yogi will go and get some in the summer as I am not sure that is in his master plan also its not easy to find effective wingers on our budget, particularly now that SM has gone with his talent for finding gems in the lower leagues. My point was he continued to play his system when the wingers were not fit when it was obvious it wasn't working. 

I am not saying Yogi can't get it right but I do have doubts and this is not just to do with his previous track record, sometimes managers just click at a club, my doubts come from the matches before County. 

Anyway one of us will be proved right and i hope its me thats eating humble pie, I did over Butcher

 

 

 

Interesting to hear Warrens views on 'total football', despite how shocking the results, manner of goals conceded or the online outcry from a typically submissive support was in reaction to it. 

 

CaleyD, the win up at the pikeys came about due to abandoning the tippy tappy sideways stuff up the middle that Hughes just a week ago was keen to promote. "Togetherness" hasnt come from Hughes footballing vision but the footballing vision of the fans and the previous manager, if you want to talk about dismissing information relevant to a discussion for the sake of having a knock, then ignoring how we played to get our last win and how it contradicts the pass-it-in-circles stuff Warren and Yogi love.is doing just that.

 

Hughes had to drop his own principles to bring us back on track, we aren't there because of them.

 

I've already had this discussion and am not in agreement that anything was abandoned in our match against Ross County.  The only real difference was that we had 2 fit wingers for the first time in a while and that, IMO, better facilitated the balance that Yogi has been striving for.

 

 

The big worry there Caley D is we only really have 2 wingers and if one is out his whole system falls apart as in previous matches, and why play a system if he doesn't have fit players to make it work ?

 

 

Absolutely...and therein lies the need for change/development of alternative ways of playing.

 

And that is my worry I am afraid, take away the County game and we have been woeful 

 

I think that some have become to cosy because they happen to have some involvement with the club that that they would never criticise the board/management no matter how bad things might get.

 

If that's aimed at me, then you couldn't be further from the truth.

 

I may not be so publicly critical of the club as I once was, but there's reason for that and it has nothing to do with becoming "cosy".

 

There's two main reasons for it.....firstly, having people at the club who are willing to directly listen and take on board the views of the fans....and secondly, in allowing me to do what I do for the club there is the need for an element of trust (from both sides).  I trust that if I raise a matter with the chairman he will give it due consideration and he trusts that I won't abuse the access and information that's made available to me and which allows me to improve communication with fans.

 

I receive no salary and am not an employee of the club.  There is no contractual obligation for me to refrain from being critical of anything...and I am critical when I see need.  I'm pretty sure if you spoke to Kenny Cameron he would attest to the fact that I can be as big a pain in the ass now as I've always been when I get my dander up over something....I just don't see the need/benefit in doing that on a public forum when I can speak to the man direct.

 

I would also add that anyone could phone up and ask for an appointment with the Chairman if they have an issue they wanted to discuss and it would be welcomed....just not this week as he's away for a few days.

 

It wasn't just aimed at yourself but more those involved in CJT at the higher level, I have never seen one of them on here once expressing a worry about the way things are going under Yogi, perhaps its a coincidence and they are all happy and have no concerns going forward.

I would question your reply about how you don't need to post on here if you are not happy with things yet will have a dig at fans that do have concerns. There is not much point in coming on a forum unless you put your views across.I hope you can understand that why this is as seen as just defending the club because you have relationship when as you explained this is not the case.

I do not want this to be seen as a dig at CJT who I think are doing a remarkable job, however they like us are just fans and there is no real point on coming on a forum unless an honest opinion is put across or in my view that opinion losses credibility. 

 

Interesting to hear Warrens views on 'total football', despite how shocking the results, manner of goals conceded or the online outcry from a typically submissive support was in reaction to it. 

 

CaleyD, the win up at the pikeys came about due to abandoning the tippy tappy sideways stuff up the middle that Hughes just a week ago was keen to promote. "Togetherness" hasnt come from Hughes footballing vision but the footballing vision of the fans and the previous manager, if you want to talk about dismissing information relevant to a discussion for the sake of having a knock, then ignoring how we played to get our last win and how it contradicts the pass-it-in-circles stuff Warren and Yogi love.is doing just that.

 

Hughes had to drop his own principles to bring us back on track, we aren't there because of them.

 

I've already had this discussion and am not in agreement that anything was abandoned in our match against Ross County.  The only real difference was that we had 2 fit wingers for the first time in a while and that, IMO, better facilitated the balance that Yogi has been striving for.

 

The big worry there Caley D is we only really have 2 wingers and if one is out his whole system falls apart as in previous matches, and why play a system if he doesn't have fit players to make it work ?

Interesting to hear Warrens views on 'total football', despite how shocking the results, manner of goals conceded or the online outcry from a typically submissive support was in reaction to it. 

 

CaleyD, the win up at the pikeys came about due to abandoning the tippy tappy sideways stuff up the middle that Hughes just a week ago was keen to promote. "Togetherness" hasnt come from Hughes footballing vision but the footballing vision of the fans and the previous manager, if you want to talk about dismissing information relevant to a discussion for the sake of having a knock, then ignoring how we played to get our last win and how it contradicts the pass-it-in-circles stuff Warren and Yogi love.is doing just that.

 

Hughes had to drop his own principles to bring us back on track, we aren't there because of them.

I can't agree more, the result against County was fantastic but going by Hughes previous statements it was not played in the manner that he likes his teams to play. I want him to succeed and hope he has leant his lesson from the County game but I am not so sure.

I think that some have become to cosy because they happen to have some involvement with the club that that they would never criticise the board/management no matter how bad things might get.

To the original question - no, for at least 3 years - give time to judge properly - I like a passing game with loads of posession - takes time to perfect.

3 years, regardless of results????

Amazed that some people think that just because you pull on a football shirt you are immune to any sort of human reactions. 

If somebody punched me twice in the face I would retaliate if nothing more to make sure they don't land a 3rd blow. 

I think another argument that can be put to bed tonight is that our recent poor form was down to tiredness, the lads certainly didn't look tired tonight 

It woz the wingers that won it for us tonight!! and a good finish from the maestro.  And a good performance from everyone else.  Well done lads!

Yep I agree, but to be fair to Yogi he chose to start with the wingers so credit where credit is due 

You tell them Charlie boy, pathetic comments by Adams 

Much, much better tonight, created loads of chances and Doran made a huge difference 

Yessssss

Ref's having a mare, never a booking for Shinnie or Watkins. Goal should never have stood, pen should have been given

To be fair we should be down to ten men though