Tichy_Blacks_Back

Guess the best/worst that may be achieved would be a season in a lower league - FC Rangers - SFL 1st Division Champions 2012/13. They would at least be able to say they have achieved something that Celtic haven't yet....oh and the Ramsdens Cup Final - oh the irony of that double. But alas it will not be.... But no would still go to an ICT game

Lo bro - Gretna?

Livingston Home @ 1.80 - ta

Yip yawn - how long did it take Gretna to get to SPL after entering the Scottish league from non league - oh and disappear.... Simple gamesmanship....all Elgin or Peterhead need is three successful seasons ;-)

Below is a BBC article before the Rangers implosion that was reporting a net debt of 109M for the SPL clubs (even though Neil Doncaster tried to put a positive spin on it) that really puts the Rangers number into perspective.... “Clearly the doomsday scenario is that the clubs just cannot survive and some may go under.” David Glenn Pricewaterhouse Coopers (August 2011) Scottish Premier League clubs face going bust if the fans continue to stay away, according to a top football finance analyst. Attendance figures show that almost 600,000 fans have stopped attending SPL games in the past five years. David Glenn, from accountancy firm Pricewaterhouse Coopers, told BBC Scotland many clubs will not survive. However, the 2011 annual report on Scottish football finances shows clubs overall making a small profit. The latest report appears to show that clubs have heeded grim warnings from the past with regards to debt. The 12 SPL clubs combined posted their fifth bottom-line profit in the past six years - this time with a headline profit of around £1m. But Glenn is concerned with where clubs go now. "Each club gets around £1m a year from the broadcasting deal, therefore the majority of the income for Scottish clubs is actually coming from fans coming through the turnstiles," said Glenn. "Clearly the doomsday scenario is that the clubs just cannot survive and some may go under. "It is all about clubs continuing to cut their cloth accordingly and they are probably going to have to be selling clubs just to balance the books. That is not a good message for fans who will be wondering about club ambition. "My message to the fans though would be - if you want your club to survive, you are going to have to accept that they have to reduce the wage bill and sell their best players when they become of worth," said Glenn. The SPL remain bullish, despite the grim forecasts. The league's chief executive Neil Doncaster says Scottish football is posting positive results in a very tough market. "We are in the middle of a world economic downturn. That is the reality," he told BBC Scotland. "It is hitting supporters in the pocket but our clubs are responding to that with competitive pricing packages. "The facts are that this report shows our clubs making a profit for the season before last. "That is incredibly positive." Champions Rangers were boosted by reaching the group stages of the Champions League and were the most profitable club in season 2009/2010, posting a gain of £4.2m. Rivals Celtic recorded the largest loss at £2.1m. Net debt grew marginally to £109m - with only Hamilton and St Johnstone operating debt-free; half of the clubs recorded a rise in their debt. However, those figures don't tell the whole story. "The headlines look relatively attractive," said Glenn. "But if you dig a little deeper into those numbers, Hearts and Kilmarnock had debts written off totalling around £8m. "So actually there is an underlying loss there of about £7m."

Like that plenty plenty.... ;-)

Not sure how you can say this as I am sure pre-1960s (even up to the early 1980s) the tools to borrow money and raise capital to the levels of today was not available to football clubs (and more importantly their owners). Interesting point though - what about all the other SPL clubs that have currently run up large debts (Aberdeen (approx 12M), Celtic (approx 10M), Hearts (approx 30M), Hibs (approx 6M) in the SPL, and then there was Dundee, Livingston and Gretna) who are/were effectively fielding teams with other people's money as you have pointed out - should their records be cast in doubt also? - have they also assisted in the wrecking of the scottish game? Based on your criteria the answer is probably 'yes' and also makes you think what would happen to Hibs 'grand plan' if they were relegated this season.

Or even a 0-0 draw - didn't see that coming....ah well a point nearer mathematical certainty ;-)

Two of the fantastic four already booked....

Tichy Black's Back HT: 0-1 FT: 1-3 1st ICT: Tade 1st Opp: Sandaza Crowd: 3,374 Cal's Thistle HT: 0-2 FT: 2-4 1st ICT: Tade 1st Opp: Sandaza Crowd: 3,382

Yip - money already forwarded to Mr Coral - could be the day we do another Killie then again we could get pumped....

Ross County away @ 2.25 - ta

A Boost for the coffers of the clubs in Div 3, 2 and 1 as they climb the rungs - ain't going to happen though....unfortunately On another note the finances at the other one would really come under the spotlight if their cash cow disappeared from the equation....what is that industry buzzword of the 2000's - oh yes 'sustainability'.

Was taken to a Jags game by my father in the late 70s and can still remember where we stood that evening. After that they were my team and when the 'quango' Jags were formed there was only going to be one team. Was strange at first sitting in the stand at caley park watching CT as they were then but watching ICT in the SPL (mostly unfortunately on OSN Sports these days) still gives me a buzz to see how far our club has come in such a short time.

If that was the case half the country would be in administration and not be able to vote. Actually if Scotland did get independence how would it affect the flag sellers at the grounds of those great Scottish (cough cough) institutions....

Interesting piece of trivia that. So of those who has won the most trophies in their time as manager of their current clubs?

Ah but just think of the potential spondoolicks from those - better for the coffers to have 3 home games than 3 away games ;-)

Not heard the full interview yet.... From Sport.stv.tv "That was totally abhorrent and completely against my way of thinking and playing football," he said. "I'm the one who has to take the blame and it's my fault when my players can't pass, can't defend or deal with a long ball through the middle. "It's a disgrace and an embarrassment, but we've had these problems all season." From BBC Sport "That 90 minutes just encapsulated our season," he said. "In some parts, we were very good, but in other parts of the game we were absolute rubbish. "We gave away a soft goal at the first because Ross Tokely was not marking his man. Kenny Gillet was then at fault for the second goal and Josh Meekings the third. "In the second half, we had the back four from hell."

Sad thing that struck me about yesterday's game was if we had to go to Easter Road and get three points to move us clear of the bottom I do not think this team has the belief and mental strength to do it. I do agree with Butcher that there are too many individual errors and those do erode confidence and sap you as a player when you are up against it (and watching it on TV I wasn't sure at one point whether some of the players thought knocking the ball back to Tuffey after the early mishap was a good idea). This though is his team, compiled by him, and put out onto the pitch to play to his plan. The fact that so many fundamental errors creep into this teams game is frustrating - failure to put away chances created, wasteful set-pieces, inability to perform at times basic defending does not help our cause. After suffering through the full 90 minutes of our debacle yesterday I watched a programme on the Englands rugby 7's team and how their management team and players prepare for the 7's season and each of the individual tournaments. It is something like that if they are not already doing so that ICT maybe need to look to employ. And by that I do not mean who should play where but what do the players think are the other reasons they have not performed so well this season and what do they think can be done to help make this team stronger both on the pitch and mentally. Who knows if it would help but something has to change otherwise next season will be a lot worse than this one....

Although still bitterly disappointed after yesterday's result - I think 'yes' he is but as I have mentioned in other threads next season is a big one for both the players and the management team to show that they can change things around as you can only get so far on past achievements and you have to continue to strive to improve (and have the desire to do so). The process of self-healing/cleansing: 1) starts with the next six games, 2) getting our 2012/13 squad sorted out as soon as possible, 3) arranging an adequate team building/galvanizing pre-season, and 4) starting next season with a first 15 in mind that will take us forward. ICT FC (management and players) over to you....prove to us that you can take the club forward another step or two....

Re Butchers comments - I can understand his frustration as the game was there for the taking and I for one was really frustrated at the teams inability to put this game away. But I unlike he has the ability to change things when it is just not working. Was nervous about this game from the moment I posted my money with Mr Coral midweek based mostly on our previous performances against Hibs and watching it reinforced those fears. Yes on another day we could have won 3 or 4 nil but there never appears to be another day and the longer this game went on I was expecting a sucker punch but instead was forced to watch three. The third was just unforgivable for professional footballers. One thing that is for sure is that without Hayes next season we will be a much poorer team and retaining his services must be a priority. Would not be shocked if he ends up being part of the Hibs rebuild in the summer.

I agree there on corners - said this before - what are we working on in training when it comes to free-kicks and corners: C- must try harder....

Hayes Hayes Hayes ....about sums it up

Still seething at today's performance. We did it in August against them and again today. Yes there have been highlights through the season but too few and not consistently enough. I don't think it is too much to expect a win today against a Hibs side that are probably the poorest footballing side in the SPL and if anything were worse today than when they beat us 0-1. I don't think we need a full scale clear out but it will need 3 or 4 new players to be added to the squad. The biggest challenge is how do we change tactically to take the next step forward. I know we are not the worst team in this league but at times we like to show that we could be. A new approach is required soon or the rot will set in. Six games to go for these players to show that they want to be part of the set up next season and for our management team to show they have the ability to actually do it.

Hibs are sh*t but what does that make us - what a frustrating 90 mins - big changes are needed but it will need new personnel to achieve it. Even Hibs and Aberdeen have got a Scottish cup semi to look forward but what have we got - another six games of mediocrity. The players need to take a big look at themselves and prove they are not really this poor.