starchief

It would appear the Hartley camp coincide red him to have dodged a bullet .

Let's just leave it at that .

I have no idea what that means.

If it's true that Hartley didn't want to move up, then let's retitle this thread Alex Ferguson.  He would have been a great manager if only the board had been able to overlook his retirement.  If Hartley wasn't full-time, then it would not have worked.  Or are you seriously saying we should have allowed a manager to live four hours away and just come up occasionally?  Togetherness is at the heart of ICTs good run.  Not someone that didn't want to leave Glasgow (let's see what happens if England comes calling).

A draw away is a decent, if not great, result.  No need to be so negative already.

What happens if he makes a complete fist of it?

And Graeme Spiers saying the interesting thing about the SPL is Aberdeen or Dundee United. Who will finish second?

 

 

Where is the evidence for this. If the team gets to a final, wins a cup and finishes top 6 again, why would Hughes want to dismantle the team. If he keeps this team together, then he has a really strong base to work from and his job is much more secure. ]

 

My worry is it'll be the players doing whatever they can to get away from him, not him wanting to dismantle the squad.

 

 

This is what's happened to ICT during Butcher's reign, apart from this season.  It'll be no surprise when our best players leave for a higher pay packet as they always have done.  Don't believe we can lay that at Yogi's feet.

Didn't think Dundee United were boring to watch.  Thought his tactics were very strong in raising DU from relegation favourites to near top of the SPL.  I came to the opposite conclusion with a talented Hibs side that played hoofball and went sliding down the table under Hughes.  What's entertaining about Liam Miller and John Rankin watch the ball sail over their head, Riordan sprinting to the bye-line trying to catch up and lob a blind hope ball into a box for Nish to have it bounce off him?

Paul Sturrock may have had a lot of clubs but I wouldn't say journeyman.  He's excelled in a number of posts, with an enviable promotion record.

That said...

It's not my choice but it's done.  Time to give Hughes the benefit of the doubt and welcome him.  You never know.

(GK) Mark Brown at his best was near Scotland quality. Hence, Celtic.

(RB) There's only one.  Ross Tokely.

(LB) Been a few good 'uns.  Hastings in his youth was superb.  Suffered when Dods left second time around. Gillet as well was solid.  But I'll go for Djeb...nah, just kidding.  Mr G Shinnie, just over Hastings.

(CBs) Difficult one.  Warren stands out.  He's the only one you could see dominating the centre-back position in any team outside the Old Firm. Alongside him? Probably just about go for Munro. Little to choose between him, Dods and Mann though.

(RM/LM) Shame we didn't get the best of Robson but he's in there, along with Wilson. Always a good, talented, reliable player in multiple positions. As well as Hayes, Rankin deserves a mention.

(CMs) He's a little ned but Black was a great player for us.  Alongside him, Foran would make it a formidable midfield.  If one doesn't get you, the other will. No escape.

(ATT) Definitely Mackay. How can we look beyond potentially the top scorer in the SPL? I'd liked to have seen Stewart in the top divisions but it's so difficult to tell. Brewster is certainly there.  Dargo was sensational in the short time he was here and just edges it from Wyness. Mind you, in the real world, Brewster would be a target man alongside A.N. Other.

Seem to remember that in the straight choice between Robbo and Butcher, Tel was the fans choice.  Different scenario here.

I'm kind of "Didn't want him, not keen on him, but prepared to give him a chance", which straddles both Optimistic and Fairly Disappointed.  So, not voting at the moment.

Contrary to some, the only positive might be that he brings in Riordan.  Horrible person, terrific player.  Could say the same about Foran.

Both Jimmy Calderwood and Robbo more popular than Yogi in the poll.  I'd have been happy with either.

I thought Butcher was unlucky with a few jobs (Coventry mainly but was also sacked pretty early on with others).  Can't say the same thing with Hughes.  Up-and-at-'em only works for so long, then tactics take over.

I can only presume we didn't actually have 'quality' applicants (although I agree with no Hartley - no commitment should mean no job).

 

 

I for one will be glad to see the back of long ball guff anyway

 

A lot of Hibs play during Hughes tenure was long punts up the park bypassing the midfield.

 

 

Dislike. I cant recall much of his spell at Hibs TBH but seemed to recall his Falkirk side playing neat passing football. hopefully the long ball at Hibs was down to crap players an not his tactics

 

Not with a midfield of Rankin, Liam Miller and Riordan.  I used to get so frustrated at such a potentially good midfield having to watch the ball sail over their heads, then run down to the corner flag for a big lump into the box.  Their centre-halfs were Hogg and Ian Murray.  Not exactly hoofers (esp. Murray), unless they were told to.

As I said at his sacking from Hibs:

"Despite building an impressive number of attackers, including new signing Ed van der Graffe, Yogi prefers to ‘have some point to the passing’. Unfortunately, this generally means lugging the ball up to a chase down the wings. A team with Hibs talent should be doing so much better."

Not so sure this means an end to the long ball.

Was never really convinced by the "they came becaue of Butcher".  They came coz they were in lower league football, reserves or heading nowhere. 

Maybe Foran was an exception.  Here's a piece I wrote a few years ago on Yogi and Hibs.  They weren't far off a cracking team then.

http://www.bigsoccer.com/soccer/starchief/2009/11/01/the-rise-of-hibs-the-new-force-in-scottish-football/

And here's my piece about Yogi being sacked

http://www.bigsoccer.com/soccer/starchief/2010/10/05/john-hughes-first-managerial-casualty-of-the-season/

Was never really convinced by the "they came becaue of Butcher".  They came coz they were in lower league football, reserves or heading nowhere. 

Maybe Foran was an exception.  Here's a piece I wrote a few years ago on Yogi and Hibs.  They weren't far off a cracking team then.

http://www.bigsoccer.com/soccer/starchief/2009/11/01/the-rise-of-hibs-the-new-force-in-scottish-football/

Hughes built a truly great Hibs team, being short of a couple of quality players to be a real force.  However, he just couldn't stop the slide.  As I've said previously, he needs a good tactician, otherwise it could happen again.

I'd still rather Jimmy Calderwood. Enviable record at both the Dons and the Pars.  A lot better than any of the other choices, bar potentially Hartley and arguably Levein.  But if Hartley has said he doesn't want to live in the Highlands, best shot of him. No part-timers please.

I'm amazed Billy Reid is still out of a job.  Did incredible things at Accies, winning promotion twice and bringing in millions.  He'd be a real coup for a club with that behind him.

Leicester were nearly bankrupt. Levein's job was to get the wage and age down. He was angry that the backing from the board disappeared, even though they said they would support him losing millions of pounds of players without adequate replacement meaning a relegation fight.  I think he was niaive there.

He did well at Hearts.  Can't deny that.  At DU though, he took over a failing club (from Brewster).  Completely turned it around.  Played good football (not negative) and did well on tactics.  Hence, why he was offered the Scotland job.

The Scotland job didn't suit him but can't deny he is a good club manager.  If it's between Craig and Hartley, there's nothing to choose.  I'd be happy with either.  Prefer Hartley if he has a good assistant that's worked in full-time football.  His own version of Donald Park as it were. But wouldn't be disappointed by Levein.  Hartley is a bigger risk.

The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced Sutton would be a horrible choice.  We need a big personality to take the team forward, and I'm led to believe he has a personality that makes Craig Levein look like Barack Obama!

Mind you, Henrik Larsson's boring drawl makes Sutton look like Churchill.

Fully agree.  There's nothing to pin any faith on Sutton on.

Please not Sutton.  There's no reason to take someone so unproven.

Levein, Hartley and....?  I wonder.    I'm going to guess Burley.

You mean Renegade. My bits are in red. I'm quite happy with some of the names.

I'd be happy with:

People who applied/expressed an interest in the job -

• Kenny Shiels - Ex-Kilmarnock, Carrick Rangers, Larne, Coleraine, Northern Ireland U17s and others manager.
• Chris Sutton - Ex-Lincoln City manager.  Failed to get ICT job when interviewed for it the last time round.
• Billy Reid - Ex-Hamilton and Clyde managers.  Recently failed to get the Airdrie job.
• Gus MacPherson - Ex-St.Mirren and Queen of the South manager.
• Billy McKinlay - Fulham Coach (needs an experienced assistant)
• Antonio Tapia - Ex-Malaga, Real Betis and Tenerife managers, along with others.  Sacked by most clubs it seems and failed to get the Hibs job.
• John Robertson - Ex-ICT, Hearts, Derry City, Ross County, Livingston and East Fife managers.  Not much of note everywhere post-ICT. (think he'd be a great assistant or coach)
• Barry Wilson - Wick Academy and Dingwall Spar manager.  Former Elgin City assistant and recently turned down the Queen of the South job. (as would Barry)
• Paul Hartley - Alloa Athletic manager.  Two consecutive promotions.
• Rainer Bonhof - Ex-Germany assistant, along with Germany U21, Borussia Monchengladbach, Al-Kuwait and Scotland U21 manager.  Won the World Cup as a player.
• Csaba Laszlo - Ex-Hearts, Uganda, Chaleroi and Lithuania managers, along with some others.
• George Burley - Ex-Scotland, Hearts, Southampton, Ipswich Town, Crystal Palace and Derby managers, along with a couple of others.  Recently sacked after two games by Apollon Limassol.
• John Hughes - Ex-Falkirk, Hibs, Livingston and Hartlepool manager. (good eye for players but needs a more technical assistant)
• Alex Miller - Ex-Aberdeen, Hibernian (ten years there), St Mirren and Morton manager, along with spells at JEF United in Japan, South China in Hong Kong, AIK in Sweden and Sibir Novosibirsk in Russia.
• Unnamed Italian - ???
• Unnamed South American - ???
• Jimmy Calderwood - took Aberdeen into European group stages, took Dunfermline into Europe, turned down Killie job, did well (apparently) in Holland

Removed themselves from the running - 

• Craig Levein - Declined to be interviewed.
• Richie Foran - Ruled himself out and has yet to do coaching badges.
• Maurice Malpas - Turned the job down.

Now unless the unnamed South American and Italian are up to much, that's a rather uninspiring list.

 

Really?  I think there's a few good names in there. Calderwood, Laszlo and Burley have all shown quality at previous, bigger clubs (with Calderwood and Burley doing far better than should have at Dunfermline and Ipswich).

I get the feeling Robbo would stay for life for either a manager or coaching position.  I don't think it's the same as before.  I'd love to see Robbo and Foran, plus Paterson as scout, develop an old Liverpool boot room over the next decade.  Real continuity in the coaching staff.

wouldnt say either sutton or larsson have failed at management. given suttons only had 1 year in it, in charge of lincoln, he kept them up after they had a horrendous start to the season, and then left due to ''family reasons''.

Larsson had 1 good year just missing out on promotion and 1 indifferent year avoiding relegation in his experience managing. What we know is that both were very good players and have experience working at the highest level with some of very good managers over the years.

Sutton left Lincoln in 20th place.  Larsson had a team tipped for promotion fighting relegation.  There is nothing in their management careers that says they are ready for taking a successful team in the SPL to the next level.  Nothing whatsoever.

As I've previously pointed out, a successful playing career means nothing in management.  Truly awful players and even those who haven't played at all have also made fine managers.  Who would you rather, multiple-title winning McCoist or perennenial reserve Walter Smith as a player?  Now who as a manager?  No relation between the two positions.