Charles Bannerman

By which you presumably mean people in their 50s? :huh: :D :D

Sorry... my original mistake. It was November 88! 87 was the year Jags won the League. But to return to Cup ties v Dundee.......

Yes, having had a chance to think about it, I suspect what someone of Dalneigh Caley's vintage will be questioning is that you referred to it at the Comet End rather than the Distillery End. I'm not sure when the change was made. Late 70s perhaps and maybe the tin shed went at the same time? That was decrepit in the 60s when I was a kid. Sorry... I seem to have hijacked and altered the course of this thread rather! So to go back to previous cup encounters with Dundee, that 1-1 game v Dundee was CT's first ever cup tie at home. The previous month they had put East Stirling out of the Coca Cola Cup away in what was their first ever competitive match... before losing 3-0 in the second round... at Dens!!!

Talking about Inverness derby cup ties at Telford Street in the Highland League days, I'm sure, if you are old enough, that someone with a name like yours will remember a certain Qualifying Cup final replay there between Caley and Thistle in 1987. :D Oh yes... and Jags' last trophy was the 1993 Inverness Cup when in the final at Telford Street they beat Clach (winners over Caley in the "bus" semi final) 1-0. Jags' winning goal was scored by..... the current manager of Clach!

Steady on Heilandee! You are suffering from Dens Park Delusions of Grandeur!! I had a strange uneasiness about the facility with which you claimed the Dark Blues progessed to the next round and so consulted Against All Odds which tells me the game took place in 28.9.94. and that it was 1 all and Dundee went through 4-3 on penalties! :P Yes, I was there that night though. Dalneigh Caley.. not sure whether you are doubting this or simply indulging in nostalgia but the Comet End was indeed what the "away" Distillery End at Telford Street was called after the Distillery was replaced by retail units It was at that very same end that about ten months previously the Banned Rebels parked their bus and watched an Inverness Cup semi against Clach from the top deck! (Inverness Cup?.... v Clach?.... don't suppose the forthcoming revival could create such controversy... could it? :D )

Hey Grover... you're bringing back memories now with the guy with the trike... and sliders!! I'm too young to remember the 40s or even much of the 50s but if you go into the 60s and later Stratton certainly led the non Italian challenge. And I've just remembered the great ice cream you used to get at Bellfield Park which I suspect came from one of the Italians. One well known figure who used to be seen frequently at the Bellfield shop was a gentleman who at the time went under a rather unkind nickname but in the current PC era might most safely be described as having had a profound physical disability despite which he managed to ride a bike with some considerable difficulty.

My first ice cream memories were of Salvadori's in Greig Street. There was old Salvadori, his son Vaaro and I think a daughter whom "older boys" regarded as a bit of a looker. The ice cream was superb, especially with the raspberry cordial on it. My mym would take me in for one on our way homwe from town. Round Dalneigh it was Pagliari's wee blue van which used to play the Harry Lime theme and which used to de pretty good "threepenny cones". Stratton has been mentioned by other posters and it was definitely a contender for the best ice cream in town - and certainly the best "non Italian". There were so many great ice creams in Inverness in the 50s and 60s, most of them Italians such as Coffrinis (Ness Cafe), The Locarno and Dorandos. Tragically there's not an Italian Cafe left in the place now. Even more tragically, into the 60s, we then had the invasion of the gastronomic nihilism which is Mr. Whippy.

Is this a reference to the North Stand in Inverness or something?

"Entertaining" does not even begin to describe! He's actually away on a five year expedition looking for the Chic Allan Cup but that project is still at the very preliminary stage of finding out who Chic Allan was. Somebody suggested he should ask a few former Caledonian fans. And what about Calgacus, Realjags, Sorearse, Alternative Maryhill? Oh and there also used to be this guy called Johndo MacKenzie.

If he's not still presenting The Old Grey Whistle Test, I head a whisper that he's playing for Queen of the South.

Indeed they should, but in practice they are not - to the extreme detriment of football.

I wonder if Dornoch Caley may be referring more specifically to the Irish War of Independence, or what the various shades of Republican opinion which exist appear to regard as a war from 1969 - 1994 or indeed to the present day, depending on how hardline Republican the viewpoint is? One way or another, there is a contingent attached to Celtic which is rabidly opposed to anything to do with the British military. That has not been atypical of Ireland post 1921 where, for instance, the GAA for many years banned competition against representatives of the British forces or police. However that kind of mentality has found its way over to Scotland as a result of Irish immigrarion etc etc. But then, on the other side of the divide, we have the obscenity of the Orange Order (aka The BNP in Scotland) strutting its equally vile stuff on our streets. To make things worse, both sets of disagreeable behaviours have attached themselves to the two biggest football clubs in the country - and have arguably made them a good deal bigger since they have acted as a kind of magnet for people with such views. In fact I often wonder how big Rangers and Celtic would be if the Irish Sectarian problem had not found its way into the fabric of life in Scotland? The question therefore arises - how significant a factor have the religious and political problems of Ireland been (allowed to become) in the shaping of the nature of football lin Scotland? That is why, and I have said this on these forums before, I find myself attracted to the view that we should simply have told the whole lot of them to clear off in 1921 and go away and sort out their own problems on their own patch.

Bridge Ender.. a response for each of your three paragraphs above! 1) The official attendance last night was 590. In addition to that there was corporate hospitality (with food donated by local businesses - I took my son, it was very good) with raffles, extra Lily Lotto sales etc. The "pie shop" was also extremely busy. OK, the crowd could have been bigger but, although they did not know on the spot how much they had made, they reckon it was "a good few thousand". They say it's well worth repeating and the word is that at least one other "major club" may be lined up to do a repeat. 2) There is actually a League game there this Friday v Turriff who have been flooded out of their ground so the venue has been switched. Admission ?6. Get yerself along there! 3) Caledonian Thistle Properties (Caley D... geezabreak with the precise designation of the company! ) bought the playing surface and immediate surround from Clach in 1997 for ?280K and a few years later sold it on for the same amount to the Common Good Fund to whom ?46K is still owed in rent arrears. The land at the ends (Wine Shed, Social Club, Dressing Rooms, Car Park) still belongs to Clach but is now in the control of the Administrator. This land could be the key to the short to medium term survival of Clach but its disposal or otherwise is the business of the Administrator. Some time ago, Clach floated the proposal of making Grant Street an all weather facility and yes indeed, Inverness City do not have a home for their entire season. However no progress seems to have been made with regard to this.

I see that Charlie also gives a good plug for tonight's game at the back end of his piece in today's Courier. I hope it helps to bring in a few more.

HD, the comparison I would make is that both programmes exploit the "herd instinct" where people are manipulated with the complete cancellation of their capacity to think for themselves. I see where you are coming from by comparing the X factor with New Faces or Opportunity Knocks, but I think there are also significant differences. NF and OK were straight entertainment shows, but from a former generation. XF is now taking place the best part of a generation later and in a completely different social environment where there is mass obsession with the cult of the "celebrity"... a term which too often merely means "artless freak" or "raging nonentity". (For instance we are in an climate now where the main claim to fame of one of the most written about people in the land is that she has had considerable quantities of silicone surgically inserted into her thoracic cavity.) In addition to all of this there are the incredibly self centred judges, including an individual who has an ego the size of Mount Everest and who is also extremely good at exploiting the "Sunreader Factor". Indeed I can even see parallels between the manner in which these programmes achieve mass manipulation and the manner in which the German peole were seduced in the early 1930s. So perhaps, in tribute to a former generation of shows, they should rename The X Factor "New Faeces". :D

I just don't understand why people watch mind numbing trash like this and programmes like Jeremy Kyle which are no more than symptoms of the manner in which this country has steadily slid down the pan in recent years. Worse still those same people seem to become so terribly animated when the programmes in question do not follow the course which they would prefer. The theory apparently is that programmes like The X Factor and Strictly Come Dancing have gained a great deal of extra following since Big Brother went off the air because the typical BB "Sunreader" type audience had dispersed itself elsewhere. The distressing thing is that it will probably be these people who will also determine which bunch of inadequates forms the next Government... in similar manner to the original election of Margaret Thatcher in 1979 and then John Major in the infamous "It's The Sun Wot Won It" election of 1992.

Whats this story then? This will be a reference to the "non awarding" of the Highland League title in 1993. Initially Elgin City were presented with the trophy after they beat Forres 6-0 at Mossett Park on a Friday night in April. Then, six days later, they were stripped of the title by the HL Management Committee when it emerged that as a result of the game being brought forward (at Elgin's request I understand) to the Friday night, suspensions on player-manager John Teasdale and John MacDonald, which began the following day, were avoided. The final decision was not to award the title that year and it all created a huge furore, just at the time when the SFL were on the point of declaring two vacancies. It has always been believed that the whole affair contributed to Elgin's abysmal showing in the entry vote the following January which brought in CT and Ross County (which would have happened in any case I believe.) The other issue which emerged was that Teasdale was also accused of having placed bets on a 6-0 scoreline in that game in which he subbed himself off at 6-0. This was in serious breach of SFA rules but Teasdale got away with it. As it happens I was standing ten feet away from him when he was being interviewed by David Love for MFR post match and I clearly heard him refer to the bet. The other thng Teasdale did, on this occasion in a post match interview for the BBC, was to attempt to rubbish the Inverness claim for a place in the SFL... words which of course backfired seriously nine months later. I would, however, also want to acknowledge the massive contribution made by his brother Mike to ICT over a number of distinguished years on the field.

Sandy is now putting ideas into my head... maybe I should follow this latest book up with a transvestite sequel.... called "Up Stephen's Bra" :P

You mean you had two OGs as well as the two for yourselves?! Wyness 101.. and anyone else hoping to attend... the kick off v Celtic is 7pm at Grant Street. This is to allow Celtic to avoid an overnight stay. I could thoroughly recommend to anyone to spend a tenner here in a very good cause. I'm taking my Celtic supporting son to hospitality (which is a bit more than a tenner but money well spent.)

Yes I had rather!

thats a new way of describing a "dive".grant street park,makes albion rovers cliftonhill look like old trafford Look here mate, I really do wish your new enterprise well along there in Grantown but I think there's enough glass in your own house at Strathspey to make the throwing of stones a decidedly hazardous idea. After all your start in the Highland League has hardly been spectacular and as I understand it you have not yet reached the stage even of paying players (which Clach continue to do - albeit modestly). You have been on the wrong end of a few real roastings and you just don't know how things are going to go although I do hope they go well. It might be a more prudent strategy as a Highland League "new boy" (and apparently, from the tone of your posts, a "lifelong" Strathspey fan who has never had an interest in any other club?) to keep your head below the parapet and just find out how the set up works first. After all, Clach are founder members so have been in there for 116 years. Your club has been there for 13 very uncertain weeks. For instance you will find that the rest of the Highland League are totally behind Clach and their efforts to survive. One final point... has it not occurred to you that Clach, especially since they are a fellow North FA club, MIGHT just have been one of the clubs you depended on to vote you into your recently acquired place in the Highland League? In that event, your gratitude does not appear all that evident.

.... and certain Merkinchers attempting to rough up the visiting support which led to them getting very lengthy bans from Clach. I remember that game well. Also, I know exactly what you mean by a "'proper' football game" and couldn't agree more. I call it "the old Inverness football" which I was very reluctant to see go when there were initial moves for a three team merger but which I was delighted to see survive when Clach went alone. There is a certain "old world" feel about walking into Grant Street Park and I love it. I would certainly be terribly disappointed to see it go if Clach were to fold but the other way of looking at that is the very small number of fans who turn out to experience it. I was at Clach Park yesterday before moving on to ICT (missed all the goals there though ;) ) and I have to say that the crowd was just about the usual - no noticeable surge after the administration announcement. Maybe folk were spending a couple of extra quid in raffles (I certainly did) but little seemed to have changed. I took the opportunity to wander round and speak to a few Clachers and there is a burning desire for that club to survive - but at the same time a great deal of apprehension that it may not. The other thing that seems to be emerging is that other Highland League clubs also seem to be very keen for Clach to survive and that was more than evident from the Wickers I spoke to. One Clacher made the point that wee places like Rothes and Lossie can sustain Highland League football so why should Inverness be having such difficulty? I suppose the top line of a very lengthy conversation which you could have on that one is that Rothes and Lossie don't have a Caley Thistle in town.

OK... so go on Sandy and tell us which Chief Constable really was a transvestite! You'll get away with it EITHER if the man is dead or you can prove it! ;)

This also, apparently, is the measure used to correlate school exam results with "affluence" or otherwise.

That is another prime example of a "novelty factor". When the Caledonian Stadium opened in 1996 there were crowds (even excluding derbies and celebrations of promotion/D3 title) of up to about 3000 just for bogstandard Third Division matches. Scottish football was absolutely amazed at this! However, as Mantis says there, these steadily subsided, with perhaps an upward blip when the second promotion was in the making. But once Caley Thistle became established in the First Division after going up again in 1999, apparently with no serious prospect of further advancement :) anything over 2000 was something of a rarity. Funnily enough, I'd be interested to see what size of crowd this week's goings on bring out at Grant Street v Wick on Saturday. In fact from a "news" point of view, this is where the local story is on Saturday (even if there's a "Caley Jags In Home Win Shock" line :) ) so I think I'll head for Grant Street for at least a large part of the game. On a more personal note, I would have to say that if Clach is not going to survive, I'd like to get there as often as possible for what's left (rather like visiting a seriously ill relative in hospital) and in addition the thought of the end of Molly's incredible Boardroom half time teas absolutely appals me!