Charles Bannerman

Hey... you're right! I wonder why that is?

OK DJS! I suppose in comparison, Caley Thistle are just a fairly new club in a partly quite new, partly very new stadium in the fifth biggest city in Scotland!

DJS... I take it that this statement refers to Caley Thistle!?

Buckett... there's a Tardis on Buchanan Street in Glasgow which is trading as a sandwich shop. I passed it last week and stopped to ask the wifie behind the "counter" if she was a Time Lord!?

OK BNP.. but I really WAS at the last Rebel Reunion in the Tarry Ile. It was great! Beer at 1993 prices and the Guest Speaker was Jimmy Falconer on the subject: "SPL football at Fiona Larg's petrol station down the dump." The ceremonial re enactment of the Deposing of the Chairman was also a nostalgic moment. Alan Savage was riotually ... sorry, typo, I meant "ritually" .. on second thoughts let's just stick with riotually... voted out and replaced by Deryck Beaumont. Then, just before going home time, someone threw a symbolic firework to mark the start of a minute's silence for the passing of Finlays, which was brought to a close by setting off the fire alarm.

No need to indulge in revised histories of the merger since I wrote the original one. I suppose BNP must be one of these people who attend Rebel Reunions in the Tarry Ile, drooling beneath a huge, heroic portrait of Deryck Beaumont reading a copy of "Life Support", reminiscing about what an original thinking and progressive bunch they were and how they were cheated out of their masterstroke of preventing two ailing and moribund Highland League clubs from joining toghether and reaching the SPL, despite the fact that none of these clubs' fans wanted this to happen and as a result they all stayed away, leaving the Caledonian Stadium as the sole preserve of the central belt.....

Saw one in the Glasgow Transport Museum last weekend! I didn't realise until quite recently that they were blue since I only ever saw them before on black and white TV. Messerscmitt bubble cars with no reverse gear and a single door at the front. (Think about it....!)

Things I don't see any more... in the case of most contributors to the Memories! forum, I suspect that's most things because most of us are heading towards senile blindness. Bikes with dynamos, canvas awnings in front of shops, BB boys with pillbox hats, the Courier without photos and no news on the front page (well... on second thoughts...!), the Belt in schools, free milk in 1/3 pint bottles.....

I would place the total number of people, Thistle and Caley fans, who initially refused to go to watch Caley Thistle at a maximum of 200... a number which has steadily reduced since the mid 90s. Even at that top of the range estimate, it's a drop in the ocean and indeed I note that I've managed to be drawn into a discussion of what is really a non issue.

Beachcomber... just to clarify what I meant.... I have always been convinced that the loss of merger "refuseniks" was very small in relation to the size of crowds which there have been since entering the SFL/SPL. However I am now beginning to wonder if the conflict mainly with Old Firm sympathies since promotion to the SPL has more recently caused a bigger loss of support than the (perhaps) couple of hundred or so in the mid 90s.

I do sometimes wonder how much support Caley Thistle lost when they moved up to the SPL and a number of "fans" were then forced to decide between ICT and another club, mainly one of the Old Firm. For many it was easy enough to have ICT, and before that Thistle or Caley, as their "wee" team and Celtic or Rangers as their "big" team. Then the wee club became a big club and I fear that many did the brainless thing, took the simplistic, glory hunting approach and plumped for one of the Old Firm. I actually find that quite sad. You live and/or come from a particular place and you abandon the team from that place in favour of a club 170 miles away which to a large extent owes its status to the existence of religious intolerance in West Central Scotland. Indeed I have a feeling that the haemorrhage of support for ICT for this reason has been significantly larger than what I remain convinced was only a modest loss due to disapproval of the merger. On which subject, two further observations. I cannot agree with Clacher's assertion that Thistle and Caley "died". They simply merged to create the much more substantial entity which is there today. Also, albeit briefly because I don't really want to open old wounds, the merger was referred to somewhere above as a "takeover". I can't really agree with that. It was accurately stated late in 1993 that Caley were contributing 70% of the assets, 80% of the membership (admittedly after a large and synthetic recruiting drive by both sides of the merger controversy) and 90% of the fundraising capacity. It never was an equal merger and I have always contended that the balance which came out of it was pretty fair.

FW... if you reckon you're entitled to call me "young man" then you must be Footballer's Granny!

Do Rangers get credit for the away goal? After all, I believe the game was played in JAFFA which must have really felt like a home tie for them! :021:

Unglush longwudge.... yerjokeenmun!!!

Bill came to the school in 1951 as Principal Teacher of PE, was promoted to Assistant Rector in 1973 and retired in 1977. He died in 1999. Calum MacLeay was assistant teacher of PE for a number of years before, for some reason, changing to Tecky in various outlying schools. Colin Baillie did part time in the early-mid 60s before moving to Millburn Junior Secondary School and was succeeded at the Royal Academy by Alastair "Chunky" Hamilton. God knows what Bill would have thought about his playing field being ripped up if he'd still been alive.

Why do you never hear about kids getting their adenoids out any more? Are they born without them these days?

SMEE.. a slight excess of Hellmanns and Horlicks there I think. Yes, crowds of 8000 were know in Inverness in days gone by but you're rather nostalgically trying to present that as the rule rather than the exception. Yes, crowds were bigger in these days because of a lack if counter attractions but, in general nowhere near THAT large. RandBCB... even the total Thistle and Caley support was only a fraction of current levels and the modest slice of that which was lost was a tiny price to pay for massive progress.

Most likely Bill Murray or maybe Calum MacLeay.

DBS's video clip in the first post looks just like an average afternoon in Serie A, B or C!

Kingsmills.... Notwithstanding... love it!... what a word.. I really wish it was much more widely used than by the legal profession!

This is a subject on which I prefer to comment sparingly since my means of entry to football is not through the turnstiles. But in reality I'm there to work so will ignore any (grumpy!) response which "moves off at a tangent" so to speak! The economics of football are crazy. The nature of the business is such that your "plant" (the players.... sorry lads!) is only able to work profitably for an hour and a half a fortnight. As a result there is always a struggle to make the books balance and doing so involves accessing other significant income streams outwith the turnstiles. (As a result, in relation to what it costs to produce what people pay to see, seat prices are in effect already heavily subsidised from other sources but I'm not going to take the risk of dwelling on that one.....) However, in order to survive financially in a very marginal situation, clubs have no alternative but to try to maximise income through the gate. This seems fairly fundamental if survival in the SPL is to be sought. Question - do you do that by opting for higher prices and a lower crowd or lower prices and a higher crowd? In economic terms, we are looking here at how price elastic demand for seats at a football match is. It has been assumed in some earlier posts that demand is quite elastic - in other words if you lower your prices, attendances will increase at least in proportion. Would this be the case? Would income be maintained if prices were significantly lowered or would it collapse? Should the board try to find out? Can they afford to take the financial risk? In a short term experiment, how would season ticket holders react to, say, a "pay £10 on the day" experiment for occasional fans? I certainly think that price elasticity of demand is probably rather variable from match to match. But certainly in the case of a Scottish Cup quarter final at home to Celtic, prices could go pretty high before the game failed to sell out. As a result, in this case, the Board, within the framework of what is normal within top Scottish football, is responsible to the club's stakeholders to glean as much income as possible from this opportunity.

Celtic presumably have some kind of say in this too since they are entitled to an equal share of gate receipts. I can't imagine them or any other visiting club in a cup tie, accepting a situation whereby Caley Thistle season ticket holders got preferential rates for a match where there's an equal share of revenues. Indeed I wonder how much input (?) there was from Celtic in the overall "agreement" over the prices?

Rhubarb and bananas Buckett! ... we were on nothing more interesting than an athletics meeting. Wood doesn't grow on trees laddie! (Readers who did not attend Inverness Royal Academy during the 60s or 70s should ignore this!)

Johndo.... do you not mean that you were majorly under the influence for the entire duration of the merger!?

Brand New Poster... NO, NO and thrice NO!!!!! Can we please get this ridiculous myth about the "bad feeling after the merger" affecting crowds killed off once and for all because I am fed up with having to make this post every few months? Please remember that, typically, Thistle and Caley between them in 1993 were pulling in around 600 fans. A majority of these were either happy enough about the merger or, even if they didn't like it, still came along to Caley Thistle games. I would doubt if the number of fans who stayed away exceeded 200 and even some of these have drifted back. That is a mere drop in the ocean compared even with the disappointing 2000-4000 home fans who now turn up for non Old Firm and Aberdeen games. Compared with the admittedly less than outstanding numbers which turn up for home games now, those who gave a serious toss about the merger are a mere minor appendix. As for the 6000 who travelled to Perth, many of these were "I only go to big games" type "fans" (of whom there are still plenty on some occasions now). I really can't imagine too many of them caring enough about the club still to be so outraged and incensed at the heresy of the merger that they feel motivated to stay away from the glory hunting occasions which they were wont to attend in the past. Quite simply, the St. Johnstone replay in 1992 was a massive occasion in Inverness football, possibly only upstaged by Thistle's trip to Celtic Park in 1985 and Caley's home game against Rangers in 1984. Occasions like that were Mega in Inverness in these days and of course attracted fans in their hordes. Even replaying Dundee United in 1998 was a very big occasion, but meeting them at home in Caley Thistle's third season in the SPL is bogstandard. And, in the perception of your average gloryhunter, so is the fourth round of the cup for a club which has twice been to the semis and to which the quarters are well trodden territory. Playing an SPL team was massive pre merger and attracted huge crowds. Playing in the Third division at a new stadium was massive immediately post merger and attracted huge crowds. But to be realistic, at this rather more advanced stage of evolution, playing the SPL team immediately below you in the table is no longer sexy... especially if it's not on the season ticket and the said team has refused to allow reduced prices. Once again the novelty factor has worn off. But PLEEEEEASE.... abandon this myth about the merger!