CaleyD

Nowt wrong with my eyesight....I was confused as to the reason for the booking, and on consulting two other (independent) sources they both said it should have been Rooney that was booked for the trip.

The tackle Tokely got booked for was actually made by Rooney.....the ref booked the wrong man.

Straford strikes me as being a bit like Duncan....never does anything that really makes him stand out, but plays a simple game with very few mistakes. Tokely didn't have a blinder by any means, but just having him there seems to make the whole right side of the team click for us.....he was the one playing Hayes into the game for most of the game, and since Hayes was MotM then Tokely must have been doing something right.

Pretty much what I had hoped for/expected tonight. Same as the Stranraer game in so much as we went out there in the first half and got the job done, then in the second we just held possession and made Albion Rovers run around chasing it. Hayes and Eagles were commanding the wide areas all evening with the help of Rosscoe and LDZ....Hayes in particular seemed to be involved with everything and even when he and Eagles were switched they still continued to play well. Rooney scored one tonight, but couldn't buy a second (or more). Couple of times a defender managed to tip it off the toe of Rooneys boot, the keeper had a couple of blinding saves and it just didn't seem his night for getting a break. And yeah....before someone else says it, I did screw up one sub announcement...big style (totally wrong team)

Not the case. Caledonian Thistle Properties Ltd was the company set up when we took ownership of Grant Street Park to help Clach out of a hole a few years back, before it was sold back to Highland Council in 2001. This company is now Dormant. The debt is gone....at least in terms of the club having any liability for it and it will not/can not "come back to bite us".

I know exactly where the debt went and how it was made to "vanish". Been telling people for years, but most are happier to stick their head in the sand and leave others to worry about it.....which is exactly what certain people want.

Even if the club wanted to charge just ?5 they couldn't do so without the agreement of our opponents who have just as much say in the prices for Cup games where the revenue is shared. Since costs are deducted before the split of revenue then we'd be asking our opponents to wave any income from the game as well as us likely making a loss if we were to drop the prices to anything like the level you're suggesting.

We were actually nearer ?3 Million in the red and it cost us our Stadium to make that debt "Magically" disappear. We no longer have any tangible assets on which to secure any borrowing....or indeed to sell a second time to get us out of trouble. It would take far less money to put us in serious bother now thatn it might have back then. I don't buy the "prudent" line all that much either to be honest. Yeah, we saw a couple of good years where we made a profit, but that's been all but wiped out in the past couple of years. We might have accounts that look a lot better than the majority of clubs, but given the financial state of the game in Scotland, it's not all that much of a boast. The reality is, with no assets to borrow against to see us through the lean times, we're actually a lot worse off in some regards to many other clubs......all depends which way you want to spin it. We have two problems here. First, the mindset that Directors are there to put money into a business that can't sustain itself financially. It's exactly this type of thinking that has prevented fans of dozens of clubs asking the questions that needed to be asked to stop them getting into the kind of problems that's lead to an average of 4 clubs a year going into administration (or worse) in the UK in the last 15 years....a number that is increasing dramatically and could easily be in double figures for the season 2009/10. Secondly, their seems to be this opinion that a certain person has put more into this club than they actually have. That coupled with the fact that they've had far more out the other side than they;ve ever put in and they aren't necessarily the financial white knight many think they are. I don't actually want to see these people putting any more money into this club, because the cost of that will be more than is healthy. The majority of fans and shareholders are already struggling to fend off the might of a single shareholder and giving that person any more power, either directly or indirectly, will not do this club any favours.

I would imagine that the assets are made up in large part by the lease(s) we hold on the Stadium/Land.

You're ok posting the YouTube link for that Steve http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4e6Hr7VcFTo

Watching that game on Saturday served to emphasise just how boring football in the SPL has been for the past 5 years. It's been a long time since I've been at a game where I wasn't willing to nip off a couple of mins before HT whistle to grab a pie before the queues formed, but I couldn't pull myself away from the game on Saturday. Even at the end of the game where I'd promised the Gringos a lift to the Train Station for the 5:20 train and the game was going on and on we couldn't bring ourselves to leave....even with the risk of the Gringos being stranded (I got them there thanks to some "creative" driving). It's also been a long time since I could hand on heart say "I Believe" in our team and tactics, but that feeling is back and my post match thoughts are more about the positives and best performances as opposed to where things went wrong and looking for scapegoats to pin my frustration on. Do we have enough to win the league? Time will tell, but so long as we keep doing what we were doing on Saturday then I'll be content in the knowledge that we went out there and gave it our best shot, regardless of where we finish.

I believe it's ?12 and ?6

I'd imagine (hope) that our income would be up a bit from our previous stint in Div 1, attendances should be up as we've built, and appear to be holding on to, and growing, our fan base. However, I think that's about our only real area of growth and it will be quickly cancelled out (or worse) by increased costs...wages will be more than back then and things like Stadium Running Costs will have gone up as a result of inflation. You also have to factor in increased costs such as the additional floodlighting we now operate, the USH and the maintenance of 2 extra stands etc. Not sure where people get the idea that any possible liability in relation to the Niculae situation might be set aside and separate from the accounts. If the club were doing that then they'd be breaking several accounting rules/laws by simply removing ?350k from our accounts/return. I expect that we'll get a lot of spin and "We don't have to supply that information" type answers from the accountants again at this years AGM.....the question is, are the shareholders and fans going to allow themselves to be kept in the dark or are they going to start demanding proper, honest answers?

My biggest fear (aside from the payout to Niculae) is wages. Last year we spent 59% of ?3.6 Million on wages. Our turnover in Div 1 before we were promoted was somewhere in the region of ?1.8 Million. We've made a few off-field redundancies, but our squad is still pretty much the same size as last year and I can't see where we'll have made any significant dents in the wages figure there. Even if we've managed to knock 20-25% off last years wage figure, we're still looking at a wages to turnover figure approaching 70 or 80% for this season if turnover is as low as it was in Div 1 last time round. A couple of cup runs won't, IMO, stop the club dropping into the red by the end of the season.

What's your point caller?

ICT don't own any of it :D

How can anyone describe a loss as "not bad"???...and the fact that it was for two years running and we're looking down the throat of another likely loss this season as well as having a law suit hanging over us that could cost us in the region of ?350k.....aye the whole world's feckin rosey right enough!!!!

Slumming it as a Steward today at Dens Park :003:

Legislation requires that the Kingsmills Club have it's own separate entrance/exit, and that entrance must be supervised....thus allowing people to come and go in a controlled manner. People are not paying for the right to go out and smoke, it's just a "side-effect" of the legislation and one which anyone who wishes to smoke could make use of by joining the Kingsmills Club....as well as all the other benefits which equate to more than the cost. Staff/Journalists/Exec Box users etc all use the main entrance....again the main entrance is supervised and this (as with the Kingsmills Club) allows people to come and go in a controlled manner. Also, when your in the Kingsmills Club you fall within the scope of licensing legislation and not necessarily stadium legislation and/or stadium/club rules. In effect, those coming and going in those areas are taking advantage of the fact that the club need supervised entrances in these locations anyway, and are not incurring any additional expense by allowing people out to smoke. The number of people coming and going is also minimal and easily managed by those already there. To provide the same/similar service to everyone would mean additional staff. You can't just have one gate to go in/out as if you provide for home fans you have to provide for away fans and if you supply for Main Stand you then have to provide for North Stand.....you're looking at a minimum of four people (one at each corner of the ground) to supervise the coming and going of people to external smoking areas....the next complaint would then be that people had to queue to get in and out and they should have more people covering it, then they'd be wanting catering facilities there because they didn't have enough time to go for a smoke and the go get a coffee to satisfy their caffeine addiction.......by trying to solve one complaint, you create a half dozen more things for people to kick up a stink about. There's plenty of things I don't think the club do/have got right and I'm as quick as the next person to criticise, but I also realise that sometimes you just have to accept the fact that you can't always get what you want.....for good reason. My involvement with This Website, The Trust and directly as a result of being The Announcer (and trying to improve the matchday experience), and the various ongoing proposals being put to the club from all these areas, has perhaps given me a bit more insight into the "thinking" of the club and I can assure you that if someone came up with a way of making this possible that didn't cost the club money or cause them any additional problems then they would be more than willing to listen. People might not agree with that mindset...I know I don't always agree with it, but like it or not, every penny counts right now and we don't have the same level of income as we enjoyed in the SPL that allowed the club to absorb the cost of "nice to haves". Just so I don't get picked up on it again and accused of being "one of them"....when I say "We", I'm referring to the whole club which includes the fans and not "We" as in those viewed as being on the inside.

So we should pay ?250 for the privilege of having a fag at half-time! Do you seriously think this is reasonable? I didn't notice this as one of the benefits of joining. The fact is that the people who congregate at the front door to smoke at half-time are breaking the rules. Many of them are employees of the club, agents and journalists and therefore don't pay anything at all to attend the game. Tend to agree with that, you do see a lot that don't actually pay for the privelage of somebody opening the doors for them having a fag , and it probably goes back to whats wrong with football at the moment in Scotland if you can afford to pay to join a club you can have a fag if not you can't. Either it is a non smoking stadium or not !!! I'm not saying it's right....I'm just making the point that if people are so desperate to smoke then it looks like there's a means by which they can get around the "rules" and do so. The separate door for the Kingsmills Club which allows people to go smoke is a product of the legislative requirements put in place which allow the Club to exist as opposed to it being a deliberate/intended perk....so it has nothing to do with their being different rules for different people.

So we should pay ?250 for the privilege of having a fag at half-time! Do you seriously think this is reasonable? I didn't notice this as one of the benefits of joining. The fact is that the people who congregate at the front door to smoke at half-time are breaking the rules. Many of them are employees of the club, agents and journalists and therefore don't pay anything at all to attend the game. It's currently only ?100 to join the Kingsmills Club (?10 for day membership at C*unty Game)....do I think that's reasonable price to pay to be able to go for a cigarette? If I was that addicted to something that I couldn't last under 2 hours without it, then yeah....I probably would see it as reasonable. As it happens, I'm a smoker. I don't disagree with having a smoking area, I just think that as smokers are in the minority and as they should be able to go a couple of hours without a cigarette, then it's not entirely reasonable to be asking the club to shell out to accommodate us. I don't know anyone who doesn't go to football because they can't have a cigarette, so the club aren't losing revenue as a result of it. Also, at a time when the club are having to cut costs/staff then whining on about having somewhere to go and spark up is kinda getting the priorities a bit erse to elbow. For what it's worth, I arrive at matches 90mins before kick off and generally don't get finished and out until about 20 or 30mins after the final whistle...with no break...and I manage fine without a cigarette. I might be starting to crave a bit of nicotine by the time I finish, but I'm not going cold turkey or turning into a raving madman as a result.....so I don't buy the "need" argument. Those who go on and on about having to go any length of time without a cigarette are on a par with the kids you get stamping their feet in the supermarket because they've been told they have to wait until they're through the checkout before they can have their sweeties.....there's no reasoning with them and they think that the more noise they make the more likely they are to get what they want.

Not sure what kind of minibus your getting, but if it's using the same amount of fuel as a coach then you might want to check there's not a hole in the fuel tank!!!

You only have a "right" to be admitted to the stadium with a valid ticket and the club are perfectly within their "rights" to impose restrictions on people within the stadium. You are not being forced to go to games and you could easily exercise your "civil liberties" by choosing not to enter into a contract by purchasing a ticket with restrictions you do not agree to.

How many times does it have to be said that the Kingsmalls Club IS NOT like hospitality. It's a club that ANY fan can join, and in return for your membership fee you get a few added extras. If people are that desperate to smoke, then they too can join the Kingsmills Club and get the same benefits as other members and the fee you pay helps pay for the staff required to do things like man the door and control people entering and leaving the stadium. And, Yes....they do have a "special" membership card, but it's black not Golden

Going by This Thread the Supporters Club DID run a minibus.