CaleyD

For me, it just doesn't stack up. When CC resigned the club made a big hullabaloo about the fact that Park would be retained and the impression was given that this would be at practically any cost. We were told at the fans meeting that Park had told the club he wouldn't stand in the way if the new manager wanted to bring in his own assistant. We were told that even if the new manager did want to bring in his own man then Park would still have a coaching job at the club in some shape or form. Firstly, why were the club so desperate to retain the services of Park if they had such faith in Brewster...afterall they told us the Manager was the most important person at the club and he was there to make all decisions regarding his team....yet this was one decision they had taken out of his hands before he even arrived. For me it stunk of "jobs for the boys" and we'll retain Park and his experience/skills to bolster the weak choice of Brewster. Secondly, if Park had been missing his family so much and he told the club that when CC resigned, then him staying was never going to be a long term thing. Why try and hide the fact under layers of spin and BS, why not just come out and say that Park would stay on to offer a bit of continuity until such time as a suitable replacement could be found....do the club think we (the fans) are stupid? Thirdly, what is it with the club recently that sees them want to get rid of people who want to stay and keep people who want to go? All it does is create unrest at every level and that's not healthy for any team. Aside from any difficulties Brewster might be having as a manager and the problems players may or may not have in regards to discipline, the lies that are being told by the club only serve to further alienate the fans and make matters ten times worse. I am beginning to wonder if those who are responsible for the information coming out of the club retain any grasp on what the truth actually is anymore. They aren't even clever enough to keep a consistent theme running throughout all the BS that we're being fed...anyone can lie, but to be a good liar you need a good memory. Everyone is suffering because the club are unable to handle fan expectations and the term Public Relations is an alien concept. Brewster could be totally incompetent, but despite him not being my choice for the job I don't believe he would be as incompetent as he is coming across....not to mention the fact that even the BoD we have now wouldn't stand for it unless he was working to some kind of plan. That leaves only two possible scenarios that I can think of that would result in the BoD not having taken action in relation to some of what has being going on..... 1. Brewster is working to his own plan, trying to make this team his own and he has somehow convinced the BoD that getting rid of some of our more experienced/promising players and staff is for the long term benefit. 2. Brewster is just a public facing puppet who is being paid well to take the flack for executing someone else's plan and the casualties are those who do not wish to be part of such a charade. Regardless of what is going on, the club seem to have themselves tangled up in a web of lies, half truths and smokescreens. Every bit of news that comes from the club digs them in to a deeper hole and it's not going to be long before it caves in around them. The longer the club ignore the feelings of the fans and try to feed us on BS the worse it is going to get. to be fair, he already did ..... before it happened ! He wasn't the only one!!!

Are Gretna using Raydale Park for cup games? If so I wouldn't mind a wee trip there as it could well be the last game they use it for before it gets ripped down and replaced. If not a wee Jolly to Linlithgow would do me fine.

I really couldn't give a hoot about Gretna and it's a sad day when we have to pin our survival hopes on the demise of another team instead of being able to rely on our own club being able to do the job they are charged with. But, for me, this is way beyond just SPL survival, I fear that if we don't get things sorted (on and off the park) then we'll end up going the way of Partick and C*unty and slipping back through the leagues as the Board of Directors continue with an environment of "jobs for the boys" and to feck with anyone who doesn't like it. As I have said before...it's time for us to thank certain people for the job they have done in getting us to the SPL and then allow them to move on and bring in people who are capable of sustaining our position and perhaps even moving us forward a little. Donald Park, Craig Brewster, Ian Black, John Rankin, Stuart McCaffery, Marius Niculae....none of them are bigger than the club and I would suspect that none of them think they are bigger than the club...but these are the guys who are being made the scapegoats. Not to mention the fans who are being dished up large portions of BS by the club time and again. When the roots of the tree are rotting it doesn't matter how many branches you trim...it doesn't stop the tree from dieing. I didn't think Brewster was the man for the job when he was appointed and I still don't...but I do find it hard to criticise the guy when I believe his hands are being tied by others. Donald Park was in the same boat IMO, and he has decided enough is enough and he is getting out....I wouldn't be surprised if many of these players who are being touted for the off are doing the same thing, and I don't think the ones mentioned to date will be the last of them. Relying on Gretna to survive the season is one thing....but can you explain how you think Gretna are going to save us from going down the pan in regards to everything else that's going on?

I wish I could believe things wouldn't get any worse, but I fear we will witness a lot more deterioration before things start to improve....the most I find myself hoping for right now is that we can do enough on the pitch to survive the season.

I think our biggest problems lie further up the pecking order than Brewster and unless changes are made to personnel and attitudes at a higher level then it will matter not a jot who we have as manager/assistant manager.

It will be easy to spot Parks replacement....just keep an eye out for anyone in the industry making an appointment with Geppetto to have their strings attached before they arrive at ICT and are forced to perform under the control of our very own Stromboli.

I don't think anyone is saying that these lads, or anyone for that matter, should sit silently the whole game. If Fraser had been having a howler of a game, then jeering him may also have been justifiable, but (despite not being tested often) he kept a clean sheet and dealt fairly solidly with everyone that was thrown at him. McAllister is not rated highly among many of the support, but again he wasn't even on the park, let alone had a chance to do anything deserving the booing. If people want to berate players then during the match is not the time for it. We, as fans, have no control over what players are out there representing us...but the fact is they are out there in our colours playing for our team and you could argue that if your of the opinion that they are a weak link then they need all the more encouragement and support to get them through. There's a time and a place for protesting, but getting in a players back in such a fashion during the match does nobody any favours and only adds to and becomes part of the problem.

My first ventures into aftershave would have been stealing my fathers Old Spice...although I'm sure the Brut belonging to my older brother would have taken a hammering as well. Brut went through a whole image change not so long ago and I believe it is still up there with the big sellers, but I haven't seen Old Spice in a long time.

And you reckon I have a habit of getting het up about things Ya big drama queen :016:

I am a fan of Duncans and often find myself backing him when others move to criticise...but I would say that Saturdays performance was one of his poorest this season. You can normally rely on him to do the simple stuff well...like getting a foot on the ball or clearing a ball forward to take the pressure off the midfield and defence and I don't think he did that at all on Saturday and seemed too eager to just hoof it anywhere and everywhere. Duncan wasn't alone in that respect though, so I wouldn't rate him any poorer than most of the other players. My top 3 were Niculae, Cowie and Wyness as these were the 3 who were most instrumental in stringing together our counter attacks. Niculae edged MotM for me as I saw something from him on Saturday that we have lacked as a team all season....a bot of leadership. On a few occasions I saw him geeing up the team and offering a bit of encouragement and advice and I think this played a big part in ensuring we didn't descend into chaos in the same way we did against Motherwell.

The group of fans "under the microscope" at the minute are the exact same ones many of us supported when they were asking for a singing section, were getting heavy handed treatment by the stewards etc...but you really have to get rid of this "victim mentality" and start to accept responsibility for your own actions. Whether you believe you were right or wrong is of little consequence...the fact is, many people thought you overstepped the mark and you need to decide how you are going to handle that. You can take the points on board and make a mature and responsible decision on whether or not it really was a wise idea, or you can totally ignore what people are saying and carry on regardless...just don't forget that actions have consequences and you can only go around p!ssing people off for long before someone will decide enough is enough and move to act against you. Also keep in mind that many of these people are the ones who backed you before...and they may just decide that the next time you come under the kosh that your not worth sticking up for.

It's not just one person birdog, it effects many people. I understand that the club are not going to turn away money from Setanta, but I don't think it would be asking too much that Setanta get the finger out at the start of the season and make a decision as to what games they are going to want to show and when. At least that way people would be able to plan ahead properly. Aside from those in Gringo's position (and there are quite a few) consideration also needs to be given to those who purchase season tickets on the basis of having looked at the fixture list and calculated they are value for money. Will the club be willing to refund a portion of the season ticket cost to those holders who are unable to make the rescheduled matches.....I very much doubt it. ICT fans are not alone in these grumbles...it effects every club and every club is guilty of the constant take take take without giving a moments thought to the people who are being impacted upon time and again. Money is important...but so are the fans and this whole nonsense with changing fixtures needs to be better balanced....not just at ICT, but across the SPL as a whole. The Celtic fixture was changed to the 16th at 2pm...as far as I know or can find anywhere that has not been changed again.

If I'm totally honest...I stopped taking in much of what you post a long time ago. I agree with much of what you say in regards to other issues in general...I just can't be bothered with all the crap you cloak it in.

Forgive my ignorance (and laziness as I can't be ersed going to check elsewhere), but is the draw seeded?

Just to stand up for the club/stewards a little bit here. Had this happened earlier in the season then these lads may very well have suffered Steward intervention, but the club appear to be trying to adopt a more sensible approach to the Stewarding in the last few games and that is to be welcomed. I am also of the opinion that although the majority of those in that area yesterday may well be long standing fans/season ticket holders, there are definitely new faces among them who seem more intent on trying to provoke a reaction than watching the game and they are dragging some of the others down with them. I'm no stranger to the dangers of Peer Pressure, and I learned the hard way that the phrase "Fly with the Crows, get Shot with the Crows" is a warning well worth paying attention too. The treatment of Rory/Mike yesterday needs to be end, regardless of the reasons. The culprits may not want to listen to the views of the fans on this matter...that is their choice...but we are not so stupid as to think that your actions will have no impact on us if the club ramp up the strictness of Stewards again and we will not allow that to happen. Better a "friendly" word in your ear from one of your own than finding yourself on the receiving end of the Stewards/Clubs actions....and it will happen, regardless of how ridiculous you think it may be to treat you like that.

Almost.....Rory was being booed long before he came on and whilst he was warming up behind the goal at the North Stand.

Wasn't at the match but if that is true...... It's one of the wittiest things I've heard of coming from our support. And if his kicking was as poor as has been reported then probably deserved certainly not the kind of comment that should drive a professional to flick the vs On it's own, perhaps undeserving of a response by Fraser....but it was just one of many "jibes" he'd been almost constantly subjected to. I don't condone Frasers reaction, but it was certainly understandable.

Fraser was subjected to a constant string of abusive comments, as well as jeering from the lads at the back every time he kicked a ball. One person shouted "The pitch is that big green thing in front of you" which is what seemed to provoke the 2 fingered salute. As has been said by others, the shout seemed to come from the same person who gives Mike dogs abuse week after week and the response was directed at him. The lads up the back then decided to step up the taunting....call it showing off, playing the big man in front of mates or whatever, but the simple fact is that it was immature and unnecessary. The "your 5hit...arghhhh" chant may not have been made until after mike reacted, but it was certainly not the first chant, boo, jeer that they had aimed in Frasers direction. Even if it had been...why should they start it following the reaction from Fraser? If they had done nothing up until that point then it would have been obvious it was not directed at them and they had no reason to react themselves. If they believe it was directed at them, then they must have done something to justify that thinking. Doesn't matter which way you try to spin it...the chanting, shouting, jeering and booing was mindless and unnecessary.

Based on what is known, I would agree with Brewsters decision to delay his shoulder operation and that his actions in this instance are for the benefit of the team. Wyness and Proctor both had the same operation and the recovery period was in the region of 3 months. If Brewster was to go for the op now then that would put him out for the all but the last few games at the end of the season. Given that this could very well be his last season playing then it would foolish to count himself out. It's a no-brainer IMO....his shoulder is weak and he could very easily do damage to it again and see himself out for an extended period, but no longer than he would be out if he voluntarily went for the op...as it is, he is fit to play and could still play an important part in our season. With regards to his comments that we played well...compared to our Motherwell performance we played exceptionally well and if the game plan was to get our nose in front then dig in, then the tactics were executed well. As fans we like to see pretty, entertaining football, but that doesn't always win games and just now I'll happily watch us scrap for points...no matter how horrible it is to watch.

We all have a wee moan to each other when watching the game, but you don't do it to such an extent that it distracts the player and takes his mind away from the game or his preparations....even for a moment. I also don't think that the players are naive enough to think for one second that they themselves are everyones favourite player or that they are above criticism. If they or their families read comments on here, they do it of their own free will. A player on the park doesn't have that luxury. Once might have been funny, and to be honest I never reacted to it the first time because I thought they might just be having a bit of a laugh and Fraser would likely take it as good banter, but after the second, third, fourth time it was out of order...pure and simple. At least one of them continued the Fraser crap into the second half despite the player being at the other end of the freaking pitch...the only reason he could have for that is because he was looking for a reaction from other fans. Also, lets say that we did lose a goal today because of blunder by Fraser....you can be **** sure all these people who were berating him during the match would be on here giving him pelters with absolutely no thought as to the part they might have played in putting him off his game. It's not about being PC or trying to spoil anyones fun, it's about taking a little responsibility and understanding the consequences of your actions....a lesson that very few youngsters seem to be taught these days. I get sick to the back teeth with teenagers brushing things of with the "we were just having a laugh" excuse. It's groups like that who end up causing real problems...things have been better at the stadium the last couple of weeks after a poor start to the season with the Stewards and it's the mindless actions of these minority groups that will bring those problems back and then EVERYONE suffers. Nobody is expecting them to sit on their hands and be silent for the whole game....but I'd rather sit in silence than have these people spouting disruptive nonsense.

Caleyonup....I would agree that todays performance was far from a good one, but the lads on the pitch did what needed to be done to secure 3 points, and when all is said and done, that's what counts. We got our nose in front and the team dug in and showed they were determined not to give it up without a fight. Sometimes that's what it takes to win games and right now I'll take the wins no matter how they come.

Hadn't realised the info on Black was in the Sun (not a paper I read), but I had fully expected it to be in the Sunday papers as it didn't seem to be the best kept secret.

Black was missing as a result of his actions at the Motherwell game, we've been told nothing official but I've heard enough from "reliable" sources to leave me 100% certain that was the reason. I also heard that he had his performance money for the Motherwell match withheld by way of a fine. Agree that we missed his presence in the middle of the park today, we really needed a "terrier-like" player of Blacks ilk and none of our other players can do that job. As I commented elsewhere during the week, I'm all for discipline, but Brewster needs to find some way of dealing with that which doesn't have such an impact on the team. It didn't cost us today, thankfully, but it easily could have. Had it not been for the fact we scored first and the team seemed determined to dig in and not surrender the lead then we may have missed Black a **** of a lot more. Well done...although I was sure you were offside when you scored :015:

:023: - although I don't think I was the only one.

Glad of the 3 points in a game which could easily have gone the other way. Our defence rallied well, but still weren't on form, and Niculae and Wyness made the best of the scraps they were fed. Our midfield was a bit hit and miss IMO. They weren't holding the ball very well and were conceding too much ground to St Mirren which in turn put extra pressure on the back line. Going forward we lacked support on many occasions with either Wyness or Niculae having to try and go it alone. The big difference for me today was that the team seemed to be playing with a bit more spirit again. The way they fought and scrapped for the ball on many occasions was great and I don't think I can recall a 50/50 ball that bounced in our favour or things could have been a little more positive. The conditions were difficult and we handled them better as a team than St Mirren. For all the possession they had they did very little with it and I think Fraser only had one real save to make the entire match....unfortunately it seemed to be much the same story at the other, but it wasn't for the want of trying and with the way things have been going lately we can't ask for much more than that. Niculae put in a power of work today, chased everything and was unfortunate on 2 or 3 occasions that the ball never fell more kindly for him which hampered his shots. A couple of times he maybe should have done better. I also noticed him encouraging the other players a lot more today and trying to gee them up a bit...as someone else said above, we look a better team with him in the squad, regardless of whether he is scoring or not.