Sorted

Understand the point you make CMIB but would suggest there is a fundamental difference between dislike and hatred. The cases you raise would lead many, myself included, to dislike Neil Lennon's behaviour but can, in no way, be deemed legitimate reasons for hatred of the man. Any person of reasonable mind would believe the same.

That's a very interesting comment, similar to Nick Griffin's quote - "We can't talk about immigration without being accused of being racist." Not sure about you but I know that when he says that, that is exactly what he is being and will continue to be. As for liking or disliking of people, I was always brought up to believe that you actually had to meet someone and engage in dialogue before you were in a position to form a like or dislike (love or hatred) of them. Thankfully, this has held me in good stead as I go forward in life. My children are now brought up the same way which can only be good for us a society. People often develop hatred of certain evil figures that have has an impact on their lives. This can be legitimate as even though they haven't met. For example, people hate Ian Brady, Myra Hindley, Ian Huntley etc. without ever having come into contact with them in most cases. All are child abductors, abusers and murders. What is it that Neil Lennon has done that makes him warrant the same status in your eyes? What heinous crime has he committed to match the above? Or would you care to share with us, the meetings and difficulties you have had with Neil Lennon, the person not the pantomime devil, that gives legitimacy to your view?

I have never quite got this agruement that is continually promoted by a press that will not allow itself to differentiate. Whilst agreeing that there hugely unacceptable Republican elements within the Celtic support that sing totally unacceptable songs about causing destruction and inflecting misery on people who oppose their view point, I cannot see how you can take the Neil Lennon abuse agenda and turn it round to be, in some way, the responsibility of his club? This is surely just another attempt to hide the real cause and give justification to the abusers. I don't condone but........... I'm not a racist but......... I'm not homophobic but........ Please focus on what is happening here. A football manager is being terrorised, abused and attacked in, alledgedly, a 21st century democracy and some people are spending more time looking for reasons to justify, explain or seek reason on behalf of his pursuers. It is shameful

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-13378140 And still, it keeps coming....

Would be more than a bit surprised if both guys ended up in Dingwall. Looking round the SPL this season I am certain that either could still do a job as a squad player for most clubs. In Granty's case, how many better and affordable left sided centre backs are out there? Agree with Starchief. If they do it must be for family reasons.

Some of the posts on here are incredible! To suggest that Neil Lennon is, in any way, responsible for what he is now being constantly subjected to is, in my view, supporting the behaviour of his aggressors. Football has been full of guys like Lennon. Annoying, agressive, angry individuals who, when they wear the colours of the team you support, are idolised and hated by opposition in equal measure. Many have portrayed the same traits as Lennon but can anyone name any individual in our game (and it is a game) who has been subjected to the kind of abuse that Lennon has? To play down last night's incident is nonsensical. You have an individual, already the subject of numerous death threats, gifts through the post and round the clock guard, doing his job at a place of work. From nowhere he is attacked by a yob who could have been in possession of any weapon and caused untold damage. The fact he didn't is down more to luck than planning. Thankfully it appears he was an idiot intent on making a name for himself rather than a more twisted bigot intent on serious injury. Is this cause for celebration or humour? Another factor which totally destroys the arguement that some have promoted on this site i.e. this is not sectarian just good old fashioned hatred, is the location where the attack took place. Tynecastle and Heart of Midlothian have long been recognised as the bastion of east coast unionism. They fly the same flags and sing the same songs as their west coast counterparts, often in a more vicious manner than portrayed at Ibrox. It is clear to me (and any reasonable individual) that this incident would not have taken place at Pittodrie, Tannadice or TCS for example. Why? Because none of these grounds are full of sectarian bigots full of hatred. The ramifications of this further incident are huge for both football and society. As police raid houses in Ayrshire this morning in pursuit of the parcel bombers, our newspapers are full of stories about a football manger being attacked at a game in Edinburgh. Don't let anyone kid you that this is a problem confined to Glasgow. I am 100% behind any government or organisation that is willing to tackle this cancer that runs through our country. I suggest that if more people shared that few and spent less time justifying, understanding or being amused by such behaviour we might have a chance of success. Without it we're doomed. The biggest target of hate, at the moment, happens to be an Irish catholic who manages Celtic. In the past it has been the Muslim shopkeeper running his business or the British soldier sent by his government to do a job. My view would remain the same no matter who the victim. There can be no justification and no support. As my Celtic supporting cousin said last night: Today, We Are All Neil Lennon.

Yes, you are quite correct, that is what you did hear on Radio Scotland - or at least the local Highlands and Islands news bulletin. But that will be it from me since I have now passed this story on to colleagues because it heavily involves the Council - my "day job" employers, so I don't cover Council stories. Not being involved in the story does, however, allow me to comment on it here. It's my understanding that on Wednesday of last week, someone from the Scottish Junior FA travelled North to meet with representatives of the Council and Inverness City to examine at first hand the proposed location for City at the Bught. However it seems that the project is not as far advanced as the SJFA had either understood or expected. So when they then met on Sunday, they decided not to allow City to be promoted to the Superleague, which has certain ground criteria. "ictewd" says above that City are due to play at the TCS on Saturday. What I have heard here is that this was the plan, but that the SJFA knocked this back because the TCS, despite having met the criteria of the SPL no less!, was not registered with them as a ground. Now IF this is the case, all I can do is to drop a into this post and simply ask how far up themselves the SJFA actually are? It would also need to raise the question of how much of a Jobsworth culture is alive and well within the SJFA. SMEE mentions the Meeting Park but here I understand that much of City's interest has switched to the Bught which they presumably regarded (until last week perhaps) as a more reliable bet than the Meeting Park where the cricketers seem to be totally entrenched. The main problem is that the cricket season, plus the long period they seem to need to get the place ready for it, significantly impinges on the football season. I had my say on that one in the Highland News a few weeks ago in response to the latest girn from a cricketer - this time to the Simple Minds concert going to the Meeting Park. It seems that what has to be just about the most anonymous and poorly subscribed sport in Inverness has an incredibly strong hold on what is a major venue near the city centre and seems to have a huge amount of sway as to what happens and doesn't get to happen there. I'd also like to know how much rent the cricket club pay for their use of the park and the extent to which they also deny that use to others. Think that's probably the key part of Charles post. No doubt the SJFA are being pedantic (it's a football administrator thing you know!) but were they lead to believe that matters were much further progressed than they actually are?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-13345655 Of course it's all Neil Lennon's fault and there's nothing sectarian about it..........................!

Agree Tug, he's fantastic. Would rather stay at home and stick darts in my arse than watch Ken Dodd!

One of the true legends of sport in my eyes, right up there with Muhammad Ali. World a much poorer place without him.

and can i just ask what sort of bases do you think we will have left if we are no longer part of the union? Hopefully none. One day we might finally recognise our position in life, concentrate on our own affairs and accept that if the USA wants to play the world's unaccountable policeman that we don't have to join in. We can use the money we save on weapons and infrastructure to invest in the communities that will suffer due to the closure of such facilities. We can be like Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark, Holland, Belgium and Switzerland instead of pretending we are like USA, Russia or China. Our neighbours can carry on pretending if they want but with their own money and reputation not ours.

Top team performance. As a point of interest, if Charlie Mulgrew is a left sided Scotland centre back then Grant Munro is Franz Beckenbauer!

Kencar is spot on and has highlighted a huge worry for me. Whilst it is correct that TB has signed one or two gems, his conversion rate is shocking. How many players will he have to go through to replace those (those who made a contribution that is) that he has released? Going by his current track record I would suggest around 16 to fill 4 places. How much will this cost in comparison to at least keeping low cost (which they are in today's market) options like Granty and Peds? If he has aspirations, like all of us, to make the top 6, them maybe these guys don't play every week but are part of the squad. Can he get better value? I doubt it. The other major concern is that of those he has offered a contract to how many will accept? It scares me that Rooney won't. It scares me even more that Duff will.......... For every Hayes how many Blumenshites, for every Foran (and it wasn't as if he was unearthing some unknown gem here!) how many Stratfords? All very well to clear out but let's hope he has a very cunning plan, after all it\'s not as if every single free player, and their agent, won't know that we are absolutely desperate for bodies as we have no one!

I agree with Alex.

Wild card - RD for the Dons! A much changed Aberdeen will need some experience (Hartley now retiring?) after losing so many players. Peds fits their wage structure, hails from that part of the world and would be happy to play the role of a squad player. Just a hunch based on nothing other than logic!

I tire of this "both clubs are as bad as each other" nonsense. It is a term of convenience to ensure that offence is caused to no one. Until this changes the problems will go on. Fact: Celtic is not and never has been a sectarian club. People of all creeds and colours have played a prominent role in the club's history since its formation. It could be suggested that there was a bias at boardroom level but this was more to do with family ownership than bigotry and changed when Fergus McCann took control. Fact: Rangers refused to sign players of RC origin thus operating a policy of discrimination. On occasions, mistakes were made and these "mistakes" were quickly transferred. Although this changes with the signing of Mo Jo (remember the scenes of punters burning season tickets outside Ibrox on Reporting Scotland?) and subsequent foreign players, this was never acknowledged as a change of direction by the club as the previous policy was never publicly accepted. So, one club operated a bigoted/sectarian policy for most of it's history, the other doesn't and never has. Fundamentally different. There are many more differences both politically and socially but you have to be willing to consider them. As pathetic as much of the OF is, the attitudes of non OF fans is equally pathetic at times. As for Lennon, I've never met the man. But one thing is for certain, is had he played for our team he would be our hero. His treatment is appalling and has been part and parcel of his career since before coming to Scotland. I don't feel as sense of shame that it is happening in our society, I am ashamed that people (and the authorities) do not recognise it for what it is and deal with it accordingly. Neil Lennon, has my full support no matter what team I support. None of this is his fault or responsibility despite what some agendas certain parties chose to promote.

Always found the ramblings of those who believe they are the third force in Scottish football very amusing. At any given stage in time it can de deluded Dandies, arrogant Arabs, jealous Jambos or hysterical Hibees but the story is the same. The sad reality is (open to be being proven wrong!) that without the OF the available external revenue streams for Scottish football are almost non existant. A move such as suggested would result in our game becoming comparable with the League of Ireland or Wales, maybe, at a push, Finland. It may be that some are prepared to accept this standard as a price to pay for sport without the OF. Not for me. However vile the OF can be at times, there is still nothing better than doing them. Take that away, the pounds that a full away stand generate for our club or the money generated from TV deals only secured because people want to watch the OF and our game would be of significantly less interest to me. For the record, without using the web, who are the champions of Wales, Ireland or Finland? I don't know and I doubt I ever will. Every now and then, in principle due to the OF (and not always because Rangers fans trash Manchester or because Sevillie loves Celtic fans) peolpe at least know what Scottish football is.

What internationals of major countries even play for the OF? AR isnt an international of a major country - he is from NI and good as he is, he isnt the best player in the SPL or near it at the moment - may as well stay in Scotland and improve his game, afterall look at Boyd & MacDonald - 2 prolific scorers in the SPL repeated over numerous seasons went down south cant hit the net. Personally if he decides to leave I hope its to a bigger club where he gets the chance to perform and develop his game whether thats in Scotland or not - always want to see ex-players do well - Robson, Cowie, Black - always get a bit of pride when our team is mentioned as helping them on their way. Last time I looked, Dublin was very much in Eire (although in the eyes of some this includes NI).

As I understand it: When the club got the right enter the SPL the conditions were pretty stringent. As soon as USH was mentioned the club argued the case that it wasn't required due to the location of the pitch and its history. SPL "diplomats" insisted that it was a necessity. The contractor advised at the time of installation that the pipes needed to be buried further below the surface in order to allow adaquate drainage materials to surround and the ability to spike the pitch to a decent level. It was realised at the time that this was not possible unless the pitch level was raised by circa 80-100mm within the time constraints dictated by the SPL. A question was asked about extension in time and this was rejected by the SPL. So as I understand it, from the contractor, the USH will function well for what it has been designed but has now created a blockage in the drainage system which is exasperated by the low level (almost sea level) of our pitch. It is reckoned now that any prolonged intense rainfall and a high tide makes it impossible for the pitch to drain. Tommy can't spike down any further and there is no exit for the water. Solution: spend a fortune raising the pitch and relaying the USH with new drainage materials or remove the USH! That's how I understand it and it appears to make perfect sense.

Excellent. It will be great to hear from someone who has definite knowledge on the cause of the problem and what is required to fix it. Please can you give a brief (not too technical pls) description of what is required and an approximate cost to do this. This thread has too much theorising and speculation (including my own) and you have the power to put it to rest. Were you involved with the installation of the USH or do you had some professional dealings with such things? Apologies if my last post descended into what you refer to as a "slagging match" but you will understand my frustration at there being nobody seemingly held accountable for repeated and increasingly costly postponements. I have always been quick to defend the club in the past (tho it has been a while since I last posted) but if this issue isn't sorted out soon we may be in danger of becoming like Fir Park circa 2007-8 Happy to do so once you have addressed the issue of postponements pre and post installation of USH. Think it's important to reach agreement on the cause before deal with the solution eh?

Don't share your distrust of Tommy but if you think the fault lies with him I have to disagree with you. I am very familiar with how the USH was installed, what depth below the surface it sits, what material it is embedded in, where it has worked/failed elsewhere (not as a heating system but as a blockage to drainage) and what corrective action is necessary to have the issue resolved. Suffice to say, none of this is down to Tommy Cumming. Perhaps you would wish to comment on the level of postponements pre and post the installation of the USH and the reasons why? Once again, we have a perfectly adequate discussion on an issue that is causing concern turned into a slagging match of all those associated with the club. Boring, just **** boring.

Sorry but USH did not cause the problem. Very heavy rain caused it. Spiking would not have made a blind bit of difference because the water had no place to go. It should have gone into the firth but the extremely high spring tides held it back. Covers over the pitch would not have helped the problem. The water still needs somewhere to go. I'm just surprised IHE hasn't been around yet to explain the effects of the aquifer. Disagree Alex. TCS has endured numerous downpours over the years but, to the best of my knowledge (await correction), a match had never been postponed due to a waterlogged pitch prior to the installation of the USH system. Surely the format of the rain hasn't changed in this period therefore it must be the alteration to the drainage that is the cause? Previously, despite the location of the pitch and the impact that the tide has in its ability to drain, the pitch coped. Now it doesn't. The USH is the cause. Ask Tommy.

However we look at this, it's unacceptable. Something needs to give as the USH system is now the cause of postponements not a solution to matches under threat.

I've come to the conclusion that the "refusniks" are not the problem. We are. People who have never/will never set come to a game are not important. They (both of them?) have made their (a dozen of them?) position clear. They (hundreds of them?) won't be coming. Their (thousands of them?) loss. What is concerning me is how few of us (CTO posters) appear to go to the games now is we take the POTY Voting as an accurate measure. 11 votes this time round. Appreciate we all have good reasons and that my own attendance has been shocking this year but surely this is far more worrying than 2/4/6/15/45/80/150/1235 people who said in 1994 that they don't want to play and still can't get over the fact that it succeeded way beyond their dreams despite their bitterness?

Rangers - other than Stamford Bridge, the only ground in these islands where, outside on your way the game, you could by a copy of National Front newspaper as a companion to your pie and bovril. Enough said. MK Dons - can't be arsed with franchise sport. Amalgamation or merger is one thing (please no Dougal!) but doing what they did is just wrong. Get your own team!