CaleyD

This, IMO, is part of the problem and one of the reasons for the lack of atmosphere at football matches these days. Everyone is far to "PC". Of course there needs to be boundaries in terms of what is acceptable in terms of songs/chants etc, but does it have to be the expense of having any kind of craic or banter at the expense of the opposition? Rangers screwed up and are in an almighty mess. Nothing any ICT fan sings/chants about that on Sunday is going to make it any worse so...no harm, no foul.

Let me just make it clear that I wasn't talking about any celebration of the merger itself....nor do I think there would be much stomach for that, and rightly so. The merger is an important part of the clubs history, and whilst it is one that should be taught and remembered, it is not one to be celebrated. However, that does not mean that we should simply forget what came before....and in celebrating 20 years of (I)CT you can not and should not ignore the clubs roots. I for one would not be interested in any celebration which served to try and strike Caledonian FC and Inverness Thistle FC from the history books and sought to pretend that we emerged from nothing. As far as I am concerned, the official records may show ICT only came in to being in 1994, but we have a history that stretches back 125+ years.

The Supporters Trust did the Feb 8th 2000 10 year Anniversary Dinner and DVD (Still available to buy from Club Shop), so there's some experience there which could be drawn upon...especially for any DVD as the whole process can be a bit of a minefield, and expensive (right to use footage for one match cost in the thousands). I think a couple of "heritage" replica shirts would be a fantastic idea. Good chance to bury this fear that exists about all things "merger" related and for club and fans to view our heritage (from both clubs) as something to be proud of.

We only receive additional TV income for games over and above those agreed by Sky/ESPN/BBC at the start of the season (mostly cup and post split matches).

In reality, how many jobs are we talking about? As has been pointed out elsewhere, the "250" figure seems to have been plucked from mid air and the real figure is about 180....of that there's only about 40 or so full-time staff outside of the coaching staff and players. If players are good enough they will get places elsewhere and if they are not good enough then chances are they would have been looking for new jobs at some point anyway....same goes for coaching staff. If Rangers are stripped back to the bone then there's a good chance that a large chunk of those 40 staff will go anyway...and some will likely be out the door before the club exits administration (be that via CVA or Liquidation). It all boils down to maybe 20 jobs which are of any real concern. In regards to the money Rangers bring in to Scotland....you surely have to be kidding!!! Let's not forget that (win or lose) Rangers have denied the public purse of around £35 Million by not bringing money in to Scotland (UK). They also send a lot more of their income abroad by purchasing foreign players than they spend here. If anything they have a negative impact on the economy. One final thing...How many times have Rangers stated a desire to ply their trade south of the border? Just one more action that shows they don't give two hoots about the Scottish Economy. When all is said and done, there's absolutely no good reason...certainly not one that serves public benefit...why Scottish Politicians should be sticking their neb in and doing anything to try and save Rangers FC.

Dunfermline's case seems to be compounded by the effects of the postponed Kilmarnock match and the fact they have admitted to owing the Taxman £44,000. I also get the feeling they (Pars) are trying to play the position to their advantage by encouraging fans to get along and help boost the coffers. As it's just a cashflow issue and the money will come eventually, then what we might see is the SPL doing as they have done before when clubs have had problems and issuing some advance payments. Last time they did it was when clubs were hit with a lot of postponed games due to weather and nobody had any cash coming in.

Very cleverly worded letter which makes no commitment to pursuing a position which sees Rangers pay the FULL amount due.

No issue with links being posted to other forums when the intention is to add/share information on a discussion taking place here. It's blatant advertising/spamming from other forums/sites that we don't allow.

May aswell, feck all better to do!!!

What's more, Administrators have (yet) to locate the £24 Million from Ticketus and the police have been given files suggesting some kind of fraud. I think I'll start running a book on who is going to be the first person locked up over all this!!!

I've spoken briefly with the club about this and they are more than willing to accommodate anyone who wishes to assist with compiling articles and reports etc for the U19's. If anyone is interested then please PM me or drop me an e.mail to donald at caleythistleonline dot com

On one hand everyone is proclaiming that if Rangers go bust then everyone else will follow, and on the other we've got a thread saying we should be signing more players. Superb Logic!!!!

Do you seriously think Rangers would have placed themselves in administration if they had money there to pay everyone?

Proof of purchase is all you would need to get your car if it had been paid for and not yet delivered.

http://wingsland.podgamer.com/why-scotland-doesnt-need-rangers/ Pretty much what I have been saying for weeks/months/years!!!

I think you're spot on Gabby, and had it not been Craig Whyte, it would have been someone else. I have been known to criticise for the deal that saw ownership of Caledonian Stadium removed from the club. I may not have liked what happened, and still don't, but when you see stuff like this going on with Rangers even I can't fail to appreciate that some of the alternatives available to us back then would have had a far more disastrous outcome. Like, dislike or simply fail to understand what exactly happened when moving the debt along with the stadium, nobody was cheated of taxes, nobody was paid off to the tune of pennies in the pound and (at the time) employees weren't being cast on to the street. You have to wonder why the same options were not explored by Rangers. They've already stated that they wanted to seak a "payment plan" with HMRC which suggests they were willing/able to take on large payments on a regular basis. Why not, if refused that option, choose to do that by effectively mortgaging Ibrox, Moray Park and the Car Park? Craig Whytes' background hardly suggests that he is a trustworthy custodian and this has been borne out by revelations that he has clocked up near £10 Million in additional debt with the taxman since arriving at Ibrox. Is it possible that Murray was not willing to tarnish his own character by doing over the public purse via administration so that the Stadium etc could be mortgaged off on the cheap, so Whyte was brought in to do it instead? That's pretty much how I see it. Whyte will effectively end up owning everything for a fraction of the cost and I'll put money on some "Blue Knights" riding in to do a deal to purchase it from him, giving him a few quid for his part in everything and then disappearing. The only thing I don't think was part of the "plan" is Whyte running up all the additional debt. Yeah, from a ruthless self-interested business perspective, if you are almost certainly going to go into administration anyway, then racking up the debt as far as you can before hand and then paying it off at pennies in the pound along with everything else makes some kind of twisted sense....but it would appear that this happened to the point where, in terms of agreeing a deal to come out of administration, they are now going to be relying heavily on the good will of those they have screwed the most...and that is a ludicrous risk to be taking with the club. The only thing we can be certain of is that the only person who won't lose anything when all is said and done is Craig Whyte. Even if Rangers went out of existence, he would have property which could be sold for more than he might be invested at. Even if that "investment" is nothing more than paperwork and it hasn't cost him a penny.

It would be pretty naive to try and push for something if the demand is not there. For that reason it's important to gauge what the level of interest is, what people are willing to commit to, what they are not willing to commit to etc etc. I'm not just looking for those interested to reply, it needs the feedback from as many as possible, whatever their thoughts and position.

If Rangers are not out of administration by 31st March then they won't be allowed to play in Europe next season. If they do come out of Administration and the £49 Million case has not been settled they will not be allowed to play in Europe next season. If they go into liquidation and re-appear as a Phoenix Company then they won't be allowed to play in Europe for 3 years. If I was Rangers, I wouldn't be factoring Europe in to the budget for recovery.

Luke, you need to go back and read the opening post where I do my best to explain the ins and outs (as I am aware of them at this time). Safe Standing seats cannot be installed in the North Stand...and even if they could then giving cheap tickets is counter productive to the aim/need to raise the money to have them installed. If you mean Section E in the main stand, then this isn't an option as it would involve displacing existing season ticket holders (again) to cater for those who wish to me a bit more vocal...not likely to happen, IMO.

Yes, the "safe seats" do have to be used. They have to be used because they can be locked away safely when the area is being used for standing and because they incorporate the crush barriers that are needed between each row of people. What I don't know (yet) is why we could not simply rip seats out and put in Crush Barriers only. We could do that and maintain the 6000 seats needed by the SPL and just not use those areas when we get in to Europe....although a venture in to Europe would surely fund the installation of the safe seats so the area could be used!!! For now however, we have to work on the basis that "safe seats" need to be installed.

I hope (and intend) to prove you wrong on paragraph one...no offence, but I am pretty determined to make this happen. Not necessarily as laid out in the opening post, but in some form. Fully appreciate your other comments and arguments, but as I said in the opening post this thread isn't the place for those discussions as I really want to concentrate on what could be done to make it a reality within the options/criteria that are on the table at the moment. The other arguments have been dragging on for years and are set to drag on for years yet....I'd rather not spend all my time banging my head against that particular brick wall whilst ignoring the potential opportunities that exist here and now. That's not to say that the fight for common sense should not continue...just not on this thread if you don't mind...thanks.

Fundraising for it would be a tough sell as you are effectively asking other people to pay for something they won't necessarily benefit from using themselves...but it's not out of the question, it just wouldn't be a bucket rattling type fundraiser. It would also need to be fundraising that doesn't take away from money already coming in...so a bit more thought/work required over and above what is being done already. Sponsorship would be another option, £20,000 would pay for the conversion of 200 seats and (assuming the standing ration was allowed) provide 360 standing spaces....an easier sell because it would likely be the most active concentration of fans and as such would get more air time during televised games etc than other parts of the ground....however this would also need to be "new money" and not just existing advertisers moving boards there.....unless willing to pay a premium over and above what they pay already. I think the club would give fans an area for flags and banners anywhere they like so long as it isn't obscuring advertising boards....with or without the introduction of a standing area.

Interesting information in regards to the seating capacity v standing capacity. If the SPL aren't looking to maintain a one person one seat ratio (and I will check up on that) in these areas then it might open up further options. You could split the cost, and using the ratio you have given it would work out at about £55 per person. You could easily get around the "who gets the seat" problem by giving priority to other seats further back in the same area...seats which are not used at present and which wouldn't be used if they had people standing in front of them. If someone purchases a season ticket with the "standing seat" add-on then I don't think the club would be looking for them to pay any extra in future seasons to maintain priority for the seat (if ever in a situation where it needed to be used). So long as they renew ticket in future years then they could/should keep priority for having forked out in the first place. Asking/expecting the club to pay for the installation of the new seating in advance and having no set-up cost isn't going to be an option in the current financial climate...a climate that is only set to get a bit tighter in the foreseeable. Some food for thought in all that though and certainly if the standing v seating numbers thing plays out then it gives a couple more options.

Don, I accept your point BUT all the media have used the fact that JH got up and ran immediately after the tackle as PROOF that it was not a red card! Lie down like a wounded soldier and you are more deserving of an award than if you play fair and try to play on. Seems strange to me! Jonny also said after the game that he didn't feel he had been fouled....so!!! It all seems strange to me as well and I was playing Devils Advocate with the quoted questions. There's no definite answer and we'll never eradicate cheating and gamesmanship....but we should at least make a fist at deterring players from partaking in it.

I like to think our fans and club are made of better stuff than that and we can leave the pointless and petty stupidity side of things to others.....well, for the most part at least