Charles Bannerman

Doofers Dad is absolutely 100% correct here. All the SNP/Yes were interested in from the start was getting people's crosses in their box and they were never all that fussed about how they did it. One of the main things they benefited from was complete ineptitude on the part of the Labour Party from the mid 90s right through until the polls closed last Thursday. * In the mid 90s, Labour abandoned their Socialist principles in order to make themselves electable and hence created a political vacuum which the SNP instantly filled with various promises to the "have nots". In the run up to the referendum they knew, if successful, that these would only be exposed as completely vacuous AFTER an irreversible decision had been made. * By creating the Scottish Parliament in 1999, far from "killing Nationalism stone dead" (as George Robertson claimed would be the case) they instead obligingly provided the SNP with a soapbox. * One of their own - Wendy Alexander - advised back in 2008 that they should "bring it (a referendum) on" at a time when there would have been an overwhelming NO vote. They failed to grasp that opportunity and rejected Wendy's proposal. * They then proceeded to run such an inept 2011 Scottish "Sandwich Shop" election campaign that there materialised an SNP majority in the Scottish Parliament even although only 22% of the electorate voted SNP. * And finally, with the complacency which has always been the hallmark of the Labour party in Scotland, they ran such a poor NO campaign that they couldn't even hold on to a significant slice of their "own" supporters. But to return to DD's accurate appraisal, much of the Yes vote didn't actually come from people who support separation. Many voted Yes because they were promised more cash in their pockets after Yes were allowed to take over the Socialist agenda. As a result, much of the Yes vote was a consequence of Socialist - Capitalist considerations and not motivated by any fundamental desire for separation. There is also a further consideration which I fully acknowledge may offend some, but is a fundamental, albeit unfortunate truth. The experience of 37 years in the classroom told me long ago that, regrettably, perhaps around a third of the population are simply not capable of understanding the issues of the debate. I would also suggest that a disproportionate slice of these people were seduced by self interest and instead responded to simplistic bribes from the SNP and voted Yes. Anecdotally I found this definitely to be the case during the campaign, such as the Yes voter who had been given The Reverend Whinge's blue book but was unable to discern in which direction it was urging him to vote. Ironic isn't it that the SNP have bleated on self-righteously for decades about Scotland in 1707 being "bought and sold for English gold" and then resort themselves to a policy, the mainstay of which is cynical barefaced bribery and exploitation of those unfortunate people least able to appreciate what is going on.

This saga really gets more and more like post-WW1 Germany as time goes by. What we are now seeing is the classic Nationalist "We wuz robbed" and "stabbed in the back" routines which invariably surface when they are defeated. I even hear that there is some rally in Inverness on Saturday to demand a re-run of the vote... presumably because - 24 hours after White Man's Forked Tongue appeared to accept the outcome - he was already shouting that they had been " cheated". Interestingly enough when the rest of the Scottish political establishment were attending a service of reconciliation on Sunday and John Swinney (albeit sporting "Yes" cufflinks) was publicly shaking hands with Douglas Alexander, Salmond and Sturgeon somehow contrived not to be there. Salmond was apparently too busy stoking up more discontent and division in interviews with the media. Yngwie is completely right. "No" was consistently ahead in the polls throughout and I reckon that even the isolated poll on September 7th of 51-49 Yes was just Peter Kellner of YouGov pulling Salmond's todger for him in the full knowledge that the Nats would then get all excited about now "certainly" pullng it off. Meanwhile this also galvanised NO out of the complacency of their leadership and into a bit of realistic action. But I really do not believe for one minute that the promise of enhanced devolution changed the minds of 400,000 voters in the course of a few days.

Oddquine... why do you persist with quoting that delusional windbag The Reverend Whinge Over Skintland as if his pronouncements were some kind of Scottish answer to The Thoughts Of Chairman Mao?

I think it has to do with that the fact the over 65's are more likley to favour the union as it had a function back when they were growing up. alot of age group voted yes not only the teenagers! Your time will come eventually. By that time though, you may be a crusty old conservative voting for the Union. Absolutely true! One thing about being of the older generation is that you have actually seen this kind of thing happen to people time and again. On that basis I think there is a very high probability that, by the time he reaches 65, Clacherholiday2 will have become a dyed in the wool Tory!

The Yes campaign consistently said that people shouldn't have to live in a political environment that they didn't vote for. Glasgow didn't vote to stay in the UK so will presumably feel that it should not have to. Maybe they should therefore set up the Socialist Sectarian Republic of Greater Glasgow and become independent. Yesterday morning, in outlining what I saw as a case for independence, I said that Scotland breaking away would have relieved the UK of a disaffected and divided minority at the cost of a declining resource. It would also have relieved the UK of a disproportionate dependence on the public purse with the added bonuses of removing sectarianism, Rangers, Celtic, The Krankies and The Bloody Proclaimers. In reality, Glasgow breaking away would achieve nearly all of that, except (highly regretfully) geting rid of The Bloody Proclaimers and except giving up the oil since the thinking on that seems to be that it belongs to the territory nearest it. There is a compelling logic here!

Very uncharitable remarks about Oddquine in my opinion. I found her to be passionate, articulate and entertaining. I learned a lot about the debate, from both 'for' and 'against' perspectives from her informative posts. I have to say I found Oddquine pretty inoffensive, very knowledgable and highly articulate, albeit apparently completely obsessed by the notion of separation and not greatly enamoured of The English or anything associated with them. She came over to me as one of these very sincere old style Nats although I wouldn't be too surprised to hear that she had left the SNP some time ago. The thing about the SNP is that it has changed a lot over the last 40 odd years and I have watched it do so. Before the early 70s the SNP was principally a small nucleus of cranks, Chippy Jimmies and harmless eccentrics (not that I'm necessarily suggesting that OQ is any of these) and to a fair extent this persists. But when the oil came along the SNP began to take on a rather more sinister dimension through many of their resulting new recruits. I woke up to that on the steps of Inverness Town Hall at the declaration of the February 1974 General Election where the SNP candidate lost heavily to Russell Johnston. The SNP's response was the now familiar rentamob chanting and shouting and generally disrupting the declaration. It has therefore not surprised me that this kind of behaviour has persisted and manifested itself big time during the referendum campaign. I would guess that this is something from which OQ, being an apparently more civilised Nat of the old school, would recoil with distaste. PS - although the outcome means that we haven't actually got rid of The Bloody Proclaimers, there is at least the benefit today that we no longer have to listen to SNP types making their pitch through incessant use of the word "fantastic" and that ridiculous, patronising little giggle that the sychophants all slavishly copy from Alex Salmond.

Thank God that's over! Relief at last from three years of unrelenting toothache! Freedom from the Chinese water torture of this tedious referendum, but I have slightly mixed feelings about the clear NO victory which has emerged. I said recently that I had come to see a strong case for a Yes vote. Let me explain. I am British and have never bought into this "Scotland" stuff. To me, Scotland is simply a region of Great Britain, and Britain's interests are supreme. The SNP-led Yes campaign has been so unpleasant and divisive that it has rendered Scotland toxic, divided and, in parts, anti-British and anti-English. Scotland in that respect has arguably become a liability to the rest of Britain - hence the case for leaving. After all, for the loss of just 8% of the population (including a substantial Yes-cultivated awkward squad) and of a single, declining and overrated resource, Britain could have cut loose all this dissent, unpleasantness and division and along with it a disproportionate per-capita drain on the public purse. Incidentally this would also have offloaded much of Britain's sectarianism (plus Rangers and Celtic) ..... and, come to think of it, the Krankies and the bloody Proclaimers as a bonus!!! It's a tempting scenario in which event, and unlike Salmond, I had a credible personal Plan B to remain here (due to family and other commitments) as a foreign national under my British passport whilst shifting my assets to the safety of elsewhere. In the end it has gone NO, despite the SNP's desperate attempts to bribe the sometimes not very politically aware "have nots" with promises they couldn't possibly have kept. So rather than take certain benefits to Britain of a Yes vote, I will instead express my joy that the people who live here have performed an escape from a very unpleasant outcome. When this referendum was first announced I decided, in the event of a NO, not to sink to the level of the SNP and indulge in any of the triumphalism and hubris which is their hallmark and which would undoubtedly have emerged in huge measure had it been Yes. Since then we have had to endure repeated episodes of intimidation and mob rule by feral rabbles of Nationalist morons as well as the Nationalists' constant demonisation of not Jews and Communists, but English and Conservatives. That has seriously challenged my spirit of generosity in victory. And of course if there is one sight which is more glorious than a bunch of Nationalists in defeat, it's a bunch of Nationalists in defeat after they thought they were going to win! So, in response to the manner in which the Yes campaign has gone about its business, I will crack open a token bottle of Schadenfreude 2014 which I will probably get dirt cheap from the Gelluns since they won't now be needing what they had on ice. I will then imagine the scene at SNP HQ this morning with Salmond and That Ghastly Woman choking on their porridge, regurgitating their Irn Bru and spitting their single malts on to their tartan carpet whilst somehow crying "foul" and "fix" at the verdict of the Scottish people. A special word too for that 24 carat gold-plated roaster The Reverend Whinge Over Skintland who by now will surely be chewing lumps out of his tartan dog collar and spitting them out all over his refuge in England. I was interested that another contributor pointed out that people like him would have been immune from the risks which he was urging those who remain in Scotland to take by voting Yes. In that respect The Reverend Whinge rather reminds me of the First World War generals who, from the safety of their chateaux, thought nothing of ordering the poor bloody infantry over the top. The performance and demeanour of some Yes supporters on here has been less than impressive, but I would go out of my way to congratulate Alex MacLeod and Kingsmills for their unfailingly courteous and reasonable contributions. It's also difficult to criticise the impenetrably longwinded and overtly Anglophobic Oddquine. Among the NOs, Yngwie and Doofers Dad have been outstanding. So, as the dust settles on three years of going round and round in circles, we can at last get our lives back again and perhaps begin to concentrate once more on the things that really matter. However I have a message for the Yes campaign, since you will probably be hoping to keep having referenda until you get the result you want, according to that old IRA dictum "We only have to be lucky once. You have to be lucky all the time." You decided to have this referendum. You decided the date. You benefited from an optimum political climate. You benefited from a poor NO campaign. You set most of the rules. You decided the question. You intimidated and threatened your opponents. YOU LOST. So go away and stop bothering us.

What on EARTH is that obstructing my nostalgic view up the old Balnacraig Road/ Bumber's Lane?

I am now of the view that there is a strong case for a yes vote.

I would have to agree with OCG here. Sergei arrived at Caley in June 1993, spent a year there as player manager and was then appointed by the new board in 1994 as the first CT manager where he lasted a year before a quite civilised sacking. Given his 50 Soviet caps and all the other things (described by Charlie Christie at the time as "playing credentials others could only dream of") it must be between him and TB to be the highest profile individual at the club. And it was indeed a very bold and imaginative move by the Caley Committee who may also just have been manoeuvring their high profile name into pole position at a time when merger was in the air and a manager for some new club might be required fairly soon (as turned out to be the case). Unfortunately Sergei didn't quite deliver either as a player or as a manager. Indeed in the 2-1 defeat by QoS in CT's first ever Scottish Cup tie at Telford Street, Sergei gave away one of the two identical 20 yard free kicks which led to the QoS goals - and then turned round and blamed keeper Mark MacRitchie! The thing that struck me most when Norman Miller took him to Telford Street that day in 1993 to introduce him to the media was how bad his English was. IHowever I also have to suggest that when he left after two years at Telford Street it had probably become a whole lot worse! For instance, how do you translate "Howyadooen Sergmun?" into Ukrainian?

What an absolutely awful time to play a football match, but this is the price paid for the TV money.

Indeed, Scarlet. Slightly ambiguous wording on my part. And yes, I was just that bit too young to be among the rather large group of fans. Salvadori's was indeed in Greig St, down from the Post Office (the words are still inscribed in fading gold on the pavement), almost directly across the street from Diggar's and I THINK next door to what used to be the Coop before that became Highland TV Service which has fairly recently closed. Salvadoris I think closed late 60s/early 70s and the premises became a series of takeaway establishments. Salvadori's had great ice cream and especially good when you got raspberry cordial on it. There was old Mr Salvadori and the son Vaaro and how many daughters were there? At least two and as it happens a bit like earlier versions of Nicola Benedetti who I think is also of Italian ice cream extraction. Also working in the shop was Mrs Mitchell who stayed in St Valery Ave. She was the former Highland League player Ronnie Mitchell's mother, and a Glaswegian. On one occasion the little girl next door to her had been setting about her dad's garden with a pair of scissors, so Mrs Mitchell knocks on their door to announce: "She's went an' cut the taps aff a' they ingins" Then, on realising that the damage was even more extensive: "Oh, an' they buggers tae!!"

I have already been reliably informed that Terry Butcher, Maurice Malpas and Steve Marsela were seen having a pint in the Heathmount last Thursday night. I could just imagine the discussion on the way out of Victoria Park an hour previously. "OK Maurice, OK Steve, now we've had that discreet discussion with Roy MacGregor less than 12 hours after these sackings were announced, where can we find an anonymous pub, totally unconnected with football, where we could avoid bumping into any Caley Thistle fans?"

Strange how every Invernessian male above the age of about 65 used to have the complete hots for Singnorina Salvadori!

Scarlet... I'm not actually 100% sure what you mean when you speak about pensions being "uprated" so, in the absence of any knowledge of what the situation actually is, here's what I think might be a fair scenario. At the point that the ex-pat in waiting emigrates, he/she will have accrued a certain pension entitlement through his/her NIC contributions from the start of his/her employment in the UK through to the point of emigration. That would presumably entitle him/her to a proportional part of the full UK Old Age Pension. I would have thought that it would then be fair if, at each increment UK based pensioners get, ex-pats were to get the same percentage increase on whatever they are due.by way of some kind of index linking.

I was only wondering if anyone would notice?

In the 1st XI of 72-73 photo, Billy is front left, Davie is second from the right and third from the right is Jeff MacDonald, Kevin MacDonald's older brother. In the First Year/ U13 photo of 68-69, Davie (with a cracking fringe ) is front left, Billy is holding the ball and Jeff is second right. I am fairly sure that when they were in First Year, Davie was actually a striker and Billy a defender.

The wrath of the Cybernats It had to be me. They had no Plan B

Isn't that bullying If you had continued your quote of my post to include the next phrase - apart from the case of an especially annnoying little lad called John MacKenzie - I think most reasonably minded people would conclude that it in fact was not, but something more of a public service.

I can't say that I found bullying a significant issue at the Royal Academy at all during my time there (1965-71). I'm sure it happened because the school hasn't been built where it doesn't, but I have no recollection of anything particularly extreme. Oh to be sure, if some of the smaller boys were especially badly behaved or irritating, one sanction resorted to by the prefects was to drag the odd one into the prefects' room and set about his backside with a trainer. But even that didn't happen very often... apart from the case of an especially annnoying little lad called John MacKenzie. The original post does also inspire an interesting theory because wherever he/she was educated (or "attended school" might be a more appropriate term), the manner in which Dougal has turned out could very well be explained by the number of "swirlies" to which he/she was subjected as a boy/girl.

The Camerons and Black Watch they were there Singing very loud. Swinging from the chandeliers And....... There is a history of the Northern Meeting in the public library reference room and among the photos in the book is one featuring a young Lord Burton in about 1928 and I have to say that he was a surly, greeting faced looking little git even at the age of about 8. Mods... don't worry about a possible defamation action there. As you probably know, the decidedly ignoble lord is deceased so defamation is not an issue. In any case it would not have been difficult to plead Veritas.

Who precisely apart from some agitating journalists predicted that the English team was going to get booed ? That was never going to happen. One man's merciless caricaturing is another man's wry humour and the ability of an increasingly confident nation to be able to self deprecate. Kingsmills... Scotland has therefore been self deprecating furiously and damagingly ever since the days of Harry Lauder and before him Walter Scott. The initial fears about booing were articulated by Team England members. Whether these fears were motivated by a perception that this is what might happen when English performers appear at a Scottish football ground or by the perception of Anglophobia generated by the current divisive and long running political proceedings is not clear.

I'm not a fan of opening ceremonies for things like this anyway, but this one could have been worse. And at least the fecal brown socks and kilts and the 1970s holiday shirts didn't look quite so bad under that lighting. Then there was the baton which had been travelling for light years round the known universe apparently since the days of Jurassic Park and when it eventually got to the end of the road they couldn't get the bloody lid off I was also wondering what the Green Brigade were thinking about 40,000 people loyally singing God Save The Queen to the wifie herself inside Celtic Park. And is Rod Stewart incapable of singing in anything other than an American accent? (Or is it just that Rod Stewart is incapable of singing?) Inevitably, of course, we were never going to get away without a few episodes of the Caledonian Cringe - that limitless capacity the Scots seem to have of making merciless caricatures of themselves - the Nessie, the caber, the giant kilt and sporran and... horror of horrors... Andy Bloody Stewart!! I am told that the guy in the purple tartan suit was born in Glasgow but lives in the USA. The welcome the Scottish team got was wonderful and it was good to see the predicted booing of the English team failed to materialise.

The veune up the hill was possibly the 50/50 club which I think might have been on Raining Stairs? This is a bit before my time, but the Northern Meeting Rooms, where all the local toffs and nobs used to have their Balls (sic), were at the bottom of Church St and were demolished in the early/mid 60s to make way for the concrete block which is still there and used to include the Record Rendezvous. They were full of chandeliers and stuff and public functions used to be held there too. Harry Shore's son Martin was a year behind me at school and was an international swimmer - including the 1970 Commonwealth Games if I remember correctly.

Apart from suggesting that you familiarise yourself in more detail with the principles of conflict of interest, I am not going to burden this thread any more with what has become a private difference of opinion similar to our earlier one about the ICT Trust and related matters which, since your Damascene conversion, you now seem to make it your life's mission to defend to the death.