ictchris

I don't think County are in that position anymore. Certainly Roy McGregor used to put substantial sums of money into the club, until he got bored of burning his cash and stopped. If some sugar daddy 'puts ?100k a year' into a club all that tells you is the club is running at a loss of ?100k a year, at least. Even Abramovich has got sick of losing money at Chelsea and has scaled down his spending - investing in football clubs in that wayis an easy, easy way to lose your money. Anyone 'investing' in Caley would basically be handing over their cash for no return and there isn't anyone who would do that, unless we have a secret fan who is an oligarch in the former Soviet Union or an Arab sheikh once met Pele in a casino. Why has this thread been closed?

Investment in football is always a strange option. What investment do people want to be made? Do they want the current board to have a share release and buy the shares, or arrange to have them bought by interested parties? Should the investment come from someone doing the classic 606, football-fan-cliche and 'putting money into the club'? Say our current board 'put ?xxx,000 into the club' - what should be done with it? Buy a load of players? Build a new stand or club shop? The fact is that approach is disasterous in the long run. Clubs who have benfactors put money in usually end up paying over the odds for players who are bought in a haphazard way. Most of these benefactors end up losing their money and often the clubs end up in financial disaster. If the club started building new stands or club shops then they should all be sectioned - these would be a giagantic waste of money and unless someone was willing to actually pay for them (and I mean actually pay for them in cash) they there's no way they justify the capital expenditure. I'm interested in those on this thread, and elsewhere, who talk of administration - what basis should we be put into administration?

If you ever see a survey of how people view themselves, most people say they are working class, although going by income groups most people are not DEF/working class. If you take the Marxist line on class then I'd say about 95% of the population are proletariat, in that they sell their labour as their primary source of income.

Airdrie is horrible.

So the ideology you profess to support is 'a dream' that can never happen. Why bother with it then? Socialism is based on the concept that by centralising power into the hands of the state a more efficientdistribution of wealth will occur. However, what's been demonstrated when this has been tried is that this does not increase wealth and actually decreases it making people worse off. Also, the concentration of power and the removal of economic freedom have a tendency to reduce civil rights and political freedom - it's telling that in capitalist countries people are free to join socialist movements but in countries like Cuba opposition politics is forbidden. Fascism is historically linked to socialist policies. Most governments described as fascist are economically in favour of interventionism and of an increased state role in the economy. Even the BNP has an economic policy that wouldn't look out of place in a Labour manifesto in the 1980s.

It's also what every state in the world does when it taxes us. Providing these extreme examples of authoritarianism isn't really helpful. While i accept that free market capitalism has brought more prosperity to more people than any previous system, it still has to be regulated to prevent it from doing harm. You've stated that "people should be able to do whatever they want provided they do not demonstrably harm other people in doing it", and i agree with that to some extent, but i think that the same logic has to apply to the system as a whole. If private nursing homes are leaving old people sitting in their own sh!t all day because they can make more money by employing less staff, then don't you think we should to take away the individual freedom that allows them to do so? Of course, deregulated capitalism has the potential to cause much greater damage than the abuse of old people. In the real world there can't be a political, economic nation state with no government, no state sector. I don't think any libertarian would seriously argue that this would be the case - in his work Hayek argues in favour of the state taking responsibility for some areas, as does Milton Friedman. If you live in the real world, which sadly most of us have to do, then a state will have to collect taxes and carry out various functions. The real debate in politics and economics is to what extent the state should intervene. The example you provide is an interesting one. When an elederly person enters into an old folks home (is it ageist to call it that?) they enter into a contract with the home which would stipulate what level of care has to be provided. The enforcement of contracts is an important part of law - one of the areas that most mainstream economists would agree should be the preserve of the courts. If this contract was broken then the home would face sanctions. If the home's treatment of it's elderly charges ammounted to violence or denial of rights to the patients then they would face criminal charges. The difficulty with this is how to enforce these contracts - ideally in the example you have provided the families of the elderly would have arranged for care for them but this isn't possible in all cases as not everyone has a family or keeps in contact with them. I do think that the problem with government intervention is that their intervention spreads like Bobby Mann's gut. Exposure to the real world is a good antidote to idealism :P As for my bonus, sadly seven figures are a long way off, as is a career in investment banking. :angry:

Homosexuality is normal and acceptable. Why should gay people not have the right to 'parade' or demand more rights? Freedom of speech and freedom of association are more important than offending some made up notion of faith, flag and family.

Taking control of people's reproductive rights is hardly the preserve of the National Socialists - the Romanian socialist state under Ceacescu banned abortion and rewarded couples for bearing children, many countries in the former Eastern Bloc forcibly sterilised undersirables (usually dissidents or gypsies). The usually childish refrain of 'I'm an anarchist, no central government, everyone should be equal, share wealth'. Sharing wealth requires that capital be distributed equally - who distributes it if not a centralised state? You cannot have any form of socialism without centralising authority to a Politburo, a Central Committee. It just can't happen, never has, never will. What usually happens, as in Venezuela, is a massive bureacracy is set up to give the illusion of workers co-operatives, local control but all this does is swell the state even further. A fairer society is a crock. What poor people need is not more company, it's more money and the best way to increase the wealth of a society is by free market capitalism. It's the proven method to improve people's lives, the world over. During Chairman Mao's reign, when he turned China into a very equal society (equally desperate) people queued up to try and sneak into Hong Kong, which is the most capitalist society in the world. I don't think many Hong Kong Chinese tried to jump the fence the other way.

Robert Van Persie has a date tonight (two weeks ago) Robert van Persie has just been released from prison (yesterday) =============== Lee McCulloch has joined the group "Strikers" (18 months ago) Lee McCulloch has joined the group "Left Wingers" (16 months ago) Lee McCulloch has joined the group "Right Wingers" (15 months ago) Lee McCulloch has joined the group "Centre backs" (8 months ago) Lee McCulloch has joined the group "Holding midfielders" (2 months ago) Lee McCulloch has changed his status to "confused" =====================

Some Premiership ones: Craig Bellamy has joined the group Money is ruining football - Benjani likes this ================================================== Alberto Aquilani: Oh no! I've just had my new house robbed!!! Steven Gerrard, Jerzy Dudek, John-Arne Riise, Lucas Leiva, Dirk Kuyt, Peter Crouch, Jose Reina and Daniel Agger like this ================================================== Sat'day random drinks n' antics LOLZ Ledley King has been tagged ================================================== Roque Santa Cruz is looking forward to starting on Saturday Craig Bellamy is looking forward to starting on Saturday Carlos Tevez is looking forward to starting on Saturday Emmanuel Adebayor is looking forward to starting on Saturday Robinho is looking forward to starting on Saturday Benjani is looking forward to starting on Saturday ================================================== Steven Gerrard hopes his 'groin' injury clears in time for Sunday lolz Yesterday at 20:03 ? Comment ? Like Ben Foster Ditto lolz ================================================== Joleon Lescott became a fan of money. Gareth Barry likes this ================================================== Marcus Bent is hoping to start at Old Trafford - 1 hour ago Sir Alex Ferguson Likes This. ================================================== Tomas Rosicky is fit and loving life! can't wait for the new season 1 week ago Tomas Rosicky is depressed 3 days ago ================================================== David Moyes is skint Mark Hughes likes this ================================================== Didier Drogba poked Jens Lehmann 3 years ago Jens Lehmann went down holding his face ================================================== Sir Alex Ferguson 's wife is at Aintree Wayne Rooney just poked Sir Alex Ferguson's wife ================================================== Joeleon Lescott enjoyed his chat with Shaun, Wayne and Gareth Mark Hughes Likes This Garry Cook Likes This ================================================== Bobby Zamora rejects Hull Hull fans like this ================================================== Micheal Johnson is eating a salad and is staying in tonight! All Man City fans like this ================================================== Chris Hughton hates Joey Barton :@ 10 minutes ago Joey Barton has been banned on facebook Ousmane Dabo, Jamie Tandy and 50,000,000 others Like This ================================================== INJURY LAWYERS FOR YOU Roque Santa Cruz, Michael Owen, Tomas Rosicky and Owen Hargreaves joined this group ================================================== Sheikh Mansour is going shopping tomorrow Jolean Lescott likes this ================================================== Graham Poll joined the group 'Yellow cards' Graham Poll joined the group 'Yellow cards' Graham Poll joined the group 'Yellow cards' ================================================== Daniel Sturridge is looking forward to playing at Wembley on Saturday - 1 week ago Daniel Sturridge is looking for a new club - 4 days ago ==================================================

My mate met Imrie and said he was a nice guy.

The whole political game about supporting 'the family' or supporting 'hard working families' is complete garbage. The Conservatives support for 'the family' is an absolute joke - tax breaks for marriage! Presumably this will encourage people not to get divorced as, although they may hate their partner, they'll pay ?25 a month less in tax if they get divorced! What a joke. The state should not get itself into a position of trying to 'nudge' anyone in the direction that the current government see's as right. As for gay rights, why should the state take a partial position in terms of what people do in their private lives? If two men or two women want to get married or live together or make the two backed beast, why should the government stop them? People are sovereign over their own lives and bodies - people should be able to do whatever they want provided they do not demonstrably harm other people in doing it. Why do you think protectionism is beneficial and necessary? This is, of course, a naive belief shared by the far right and the far left - protectionism is a leading cause of impoverishment and no serious proposals to increase protectionism are made by anyone in the modern sphere with any knowledge of economics. There isn't really a difference between your politics and the politics of a socialist like DornochCaley - you both want centralised power to promote some ethereal goal, be is 'faith, flag and famliy' or the 'workers of the world'. Fundamentally, you both believe that the state should take powers from individual citizens to puruse a 'greater good', which is the thinking that drives tyrannies from Tsarist Russia to Democratic Kampuchea. On the positive side you are both young so hopefully will grow out of this nonsense by the time you actually have a vote.

I can't go as I am going to the rugby thenext day and have peole staying with me. Kilmarnock is an absolute dump of a town. Someone should arrange for it to be napalm'd after we leave.

Alex Bone is p1ssed off. }-( Charlie Christie likes this. :-)

Rangers could sell their naming rights to Orange. The future's bright, the future's.... Celtic could flog theirs to PaddyPower.com. County could be sponsored by a band, perhaps a hugely successful European folk outfit the Gypsy Kings.

A 17 year old member of the Cornerstone Group? Get invited to many parties Tom?

Chris Kerr has a sore knee :-( Ross Tokely likes this.

I honestl think he was the best sports commentator this country has ever produced - absolutely brilliant commentary. A complete lack of bias as well. RIP.

what formation aare we playing?

According to today's Screws Filipe Morais was on the night out with Allan McGregor which has lead Rnagers' keeper to be questioned by the police over an allegation of sexual assault. I'll wait for the court case before making any assertion as to whether Morais scored or not.

Chavez has been elected repeatedly by the poor, miserbable, lives you describe. In itself, this is a victory for the masses in a continent that has seen small elites impose governments and ideolgies for so long. The thousands of co-operatives and community councils running health clinics and infrastructure projects is another victory for democracy in Chavez's Venezuela. The guy doesn't convince me to be honest. There is a massive personality cult surrounding him, he's far too into the military and isn't afraid to centralise when he feels threatened, but in spite of all that, it's impossible to deny that attempts to redistribute wealth and power have been made. Setting up a co-operative isn't a victory for anyone - if they were set up and providing goods and services then they would be. Venezuela's agriculture is being destroyed due to the Mugabe-esque policy of seizing farms from large estates and 'redistributing' them to Chavez supporters. Food importation has soared, as has prices and inflation. Other industrial concerns are equally haphazard - employees at a car factory making copies of decades old European cars went on strike recently in protest at the working conditions. How do define prosperity? Massive inequality and the exclusion of millions from health and education while the top 10% get stinking rich? A country like Chile has the highest GDP per capita in South America, lower unemployment than Venezuela, lower inflation, lower debt and is ranked higher in political freedom than just about any other country in Latin America.

And how do you know this? Where are you getting this information from? Thats one side of the coin. Cuba is by no means perfect. What country is? But you are looking at it in a stupid way tbh. Oh, and Trade Union and political association are permitted in Cuba. Stop listening to whoever tells you otherwise. http://www.poptel.org.uk/cuba-solidarity/C...nionsToday.html Have a wee read of that The trade union your link describes is not free, it's controlled by the state and the Communist Party. Anyone employed by the state (pretty much everyone in a socialist state like Cuba) is compelled to join the union, which requires a signature on an agreement to follow the socialist policies of the government. The Labour Code of Cuba states: Of course, freedom of assocation doesn't really exist either, with anyone expressing opinions contrary to the ruling Communist Party thrown in jail. The Cuban government also imprisoned the leaders of several independent trade union groups in 2003 for 'making threats'. It really sums up your argument that you could post a link to a Cuba 'Solidarity' website as though it's a credible source. Here's a link to the International Confederation of Free Trade Unions report on Cuba from a few years ago: 2006 report

I think he's been hard done by. This Killie chairman sounds a bit of a nightmare. JJ must've thought that his days of terrible chairmen were gone when he left Bradford.

Ah. The signature call of the idiot.

The wealth and power is still in the hands of a small elite, it's just they occasionally mouth Chavista slogans. The population of Venezuela still, in the main, live miserable lives beset by poverty and violence. The nationalisation programme by Chavez has seen shops lie empty due to his attempts to control food prices and the revenues from Venezuela's oil fields are falling due to inefficient production. Chavez also periodically moves his army to the border with Columbia. Is it really beyond comprehension that when the economy completely collapses Chavez might try and secure his power by a military move against Columbia? The countries who were influenced by the Chicago School are the most prosperous and politically free in Latin America. What's the difference between the Fascist dicactors and Castro? Try speaking out against the Castro revolution in Cuba, see what happens. Try using the internet, visiting another country, forming a free trade union or political association in Cuba. The main difference is that countries like Cuba allow left-wingers to indulge in Citizen Smith-style, anti 'imperialist' posturing.