Oddquine

Maybe, rather than continue to disrupt a forum/thread which is meant to be about ICT at some level,, somebody who can hit the right buttons could move those posts on this thread which have nothing to do with ICT per se, to a more appropriate place......because I get the impression that, because you consider yourself to be a dominant male.....and I only have your word for it that you are a male in the first place, as I haven't checked out your profile (though you do certainly come across an an unreconstructed Scottish male personage)...... I get the feeling that it is going to be a long time before either of us will concede the last word to the other.

What frustration and anger? What I post on here is simply puzzlement as to why some people who proclaim they are ICT supporters appear to be only ICT supporters as long as they are doing well, and promptly, in the event of poor results become ICT carpers. Supporting, imo, is looking for the silver lining beyond the current black cloud..and not reacting as if somebody has poured the contents of the half full/half empty glass they perceive onto the desert sands to be immediately dissipated into oblivion of the club. .Easily seen you don't post on the political forums I do.......because then you'd know what my frustration and anger really was like. Kinda shows you're you are good at applying theory to unknown and unknowable situations from what you read....which is something I have never denied. I just question as to whether you can do more than spout theory on forums. After all, I am not a "professional" " whatever it is you think you are"....but I have often accused others of having various personality disorders just from the tenor of their posts.....and nothing more concrete than that. I have found it an extremely useful method of getting round the "no personal attacks rule", and also handy because insulting politely means not having to go to the bother of bypassing the swearie filter (though Scottish swearie words do well on US based forums).so I spout theory on forums, as you do......but never claim I have any professional competence to do so....though I do admit sounding knowledgeable is inclined to stop people who buy into the idea that someone knows what they are talking about from responding and continuing the discussion/argument. Well done.......the pills thing is something I, too, very occasionally use when insulting others.....though not a lot, in case it is true, in which case I feel like crap, when folk are offended. I note you are also quite accomplished at assuming.....assuming that others don't consider their posts before making them.......assuming others don't know what they mean when they say/write something.....assuming you can read their minds. Way I see it is that as the years go on, universities have added various faculties to their set-ups to accommodate the latest theories produced by people with vested interests (and to attract students and money). and people, failing any ability to do something useful, latch onto the esoteric..which may make the graduates feel important, but mean nothing at all to the vast majority of the population. From the above, I'd not like anyone to think that I don't think that CBT, DBT and all the new versions invented to "update" them don't have their place...I'm sure they help some,..particularly celebriities who think it is a sign of importance and "self-awareness" and will give them excuses for /thinking behaving as they do. Won't necessarily sort them out......but will make them feel better about themselves. I do rather think that the original importance of CBT, way back, has been denigrated due to the vast extension of personality disorders defined by the AMA and accepted by rote by the UK. The very fact that you can say to Kiltarlity By the way DSM 1V is bit old hat- look at ICD10 instead.... rather proves my point.somewhat. Crap increases where there are people who have a vested interest in increasing crap (which is mostly everywhere in the world today if they can get a grant to fund it or otherwise make money out of it and can persuade other "professionals" to believe it).......and there are enough people who don't do logical thinking and who accept the crap because they think that a university degree implies the writer knows what they are talking about. That concept hasn't worked as long as I can remember with politicians as a truism........why would anyone think it should be a given with any other profession who wouldn't have a profession in the first place if they hadn't first produced a theory out of nothing but their own vested interests? I have read plenty books on all aspects of manipulation of people and the way they think, though mostly not through my deliberate choice, but because my reading matter was limited by that available......ranging downwards in common-sense from the Seven Habits of Highly Effective People to the ordure produced by professional entities who see any deviation from what they consider the norm to be a problem from which they can make money.

Do you really know anything about anything..or are you just really good at googling? If you want to discuss narcissistic tendencies....we can always start with your posts on this forum, in which you sneer at everybody you perceive as being less intelligent than yourself...can we not.because the definition seems to describe you very well. Oh dear me - hope you feel better after projecting all that internalised anger. I suspect that I must represent a domineering male figure from your past. My sincere apologies if I released some repressed memories or emotions. Suggest you may read up a little about narcississm and leave the formulating and "teaching" to professionals like maself. Professional what? And what has calling oneself a professional got to do with anything, anyway? The bankers who trashed our economy had qualifications and theories emanating from every orifice....and what did they accomplish in fact, as opposed to in their own minds? Our players are professionals, and they very often don't make any kind of a fist in even accomplishing the professional quality of giving 100% in doing their job and earning their pay....though maybe the modern football game, with its emphasis on tactics has trained all ability to think for themselves and react to unexpected situations out of players today. Many of our politicians are professionals....and they know, as far as I can see, very little about reality. Expert and specialized knowledge in the field in which one is practicing professionally, does not necessarily equate to translating that expert and specialized knowledge/theory into competence and skill......although it does allow the ability to spout theories as facts, and not just an opinion which will only pertain until enough professionals get together and come up with another set of theories which make that opinion obsolete.......or a pharmaceutical company comes up with a drug which will help some personality disorder, once they have defined the symptoms of the disorder in a way which encourages the use of the drug and get it into the medical bibles. You could call me a professional sceptic.

I hope he does well, and I'm sure he will, and comes back ready to do a turn for ICT. next season. The hot-house of the SPL, and the expectations of fans, makes it hard for homegrown youngsters to really break through....but maybe the extra year, now the squad is under-20, will save having to take 19 and 20 year olds up from elsewhere in the next couple of seasons, and we can at least bench our own boys, Fingers will be crossed that he stays injury-free while he is away. Good luck,Gavin.

Do you really know anything about anything..or are you just really good at googling? If you want to discuss narcissistic tendencies....we can always start with your posts on this forum, in which you sneer at everybody you perceive as being less intelligent than yourself...can we not.because the definition seems to describe you very well.

As some would say you are Not anyone that knows me . But everybody who reads this forum and doesn't know you can only go by how you, and others, come across on here......and you do rather come across as lukemackay has described you.

No sorry dont buy this! He is ICT manager and its his job to turn up as it was ICT v Ross County in the first half. He would not have got booed and I doubt he would even have got much stick. He could have watched from the hospitality area if he wanted. He missed some good performances from the younger players by not being there. BTW in not giving Russell and Grant new contracts Terry Butcher was just doing what he felt was right at the time ie his job. and although I dodnt agree with him I respect his right to make it.I think the damned if he did option was the one he should have taken in many fans eyes. He is the ICT manager, certainly....but he had.... as far as I can see...... absolutely bugger all to do with the testimonial....if you read the Testimonial FB page. I'd have been very surprised if the team wasn't picked from volunteers to play, as opposed to Butcher choosing it and making them play. Re the He would not have got booed and I doubt he would even have got much stick comment........you have a lot more faith in the decency of the usual suspect ICT "supporters" who post on here than I have after nearly three years of reading them...but then you may know them personally and know they whine on here for the sake of something to say........I don't and can only go by what I read. And, given the fact that it was a celebration of what Munro and Duncan did for the club in their years here......the fact that you can even say I doubt he would even have got much stick simply illustrates that you know that there would have been some who would have been arseholes just because they could. The Ross County forum for football supporting as opposed to carping is much better value than this one, tbh. A lot less hard on the blood pressure, anyway. Anyway...do any of you know that he hadn't already spoken to Grant, Russell and the testimonial committee before he decided to not turn up and the reasons he gave for that decision? He has no obligation to tell us anything, even if you all think you own all his time.

Given the fact that this thread is in the danger of, or has succeeded in, turning into a kick Terry Butcher one, rather than a praise Munro and Duncan one, maybe Butcher had an inkling of the way some ICT fans would react if he did turn up and decided to spare everybody at the testimonial the satisfaction of of making their day by booing him and possibly spoiling the day for Grant and Russell...and took the sensible course for the benefit of all......particularly of those who did the hard work of organising all the Testimonial for them. As CaleyD said, damned if he did and damned if he didn't.

Then you are going to be hoping we have to do the whole player change all over again next season, given 12 of the current squad of poor players are out of contract. Much better to start again, all over again from scratch, than re-sign poor players, don't you think, even if they manage to stay injury free and have a season's experience under their belts? Time to call for heads, imo, is when/if Butcher signs the core set of players he thinks will do a job next season, and they don't. Personally, I think the players have to take as much of the stick as the manager...because they are paid to do a job.....and they are not doing it remotely consistently. If they were surgeons, I'd be terrified of going under a knife they were wielding on a day when they were in "can't be bothered" mode. Mistakes can be forgiven, not trying can't.

Yep......I agree with A reserve team can be what you want it to be But is there any great need for a dedicated reserve league? Without a "reserve league" now, we play "a reserve team"....in Cup competitions under Highland League auspices we play "a reserve team", in bounce games we often play "a reserve team", in friendlies we often play "a reserve team". They may not be officially called that....but that is really what they are... a mix of those of the first team squad needing match practice and under-19s. I haven't seen any detail as to how an under 20 league will be set up...but if it is on the same lines as the under 19 one, with much the same wage structure then it would save the likes of the situation, which has happened in the past, and which would be likely to happen at the end of this season when kids are dumped....not because they aren't decent players but because they aren't perceived as being exceptional players. If holding on to the currently good, but not great, players won't mean first team professional contracts and the increased wage bill, then that would only help the club to grow their options. I'm of the opinion that it would be much better to have our own nucleus of 19+year olds who have been brought up within the ICT system, and with some ICT loyalty, getting a chance in preseason trials than assuming because a 19+ year old has been released from/isn't getting a game in one of the English leagues that they are better just because the English leagues are perceived to be better so it follows that a discard from there has got to be better than anything we can produce ourselves.

ROFLMAO!

No fun without them, though! Conspiracy theories are the stuff of forums......even football ones...so don't expect them to ameliorate any time soon! Seems to me that if you are going to have people injecting money into ICT, regardless of whether they get anything out of it for themselves or not, you are much better off with people who have Inverness family connections than with Craig Whyte types.....if only for the fact that it is more likely that they aren't going to take the proverbial....because, while they might be out of the direct firing line, being overseas based....their relations in Inverness won't be.....and relations can kick arse with the best. If we all had the spare cash wouldn't we all do the same, not specifically for personal aggrandisement, but to help out our team while at the same time protecting our investment. The only time, imo, that people might hand over money without having overview as to how it is used is if they win the Euro Lottery and have money to burn.......if you earn it by the sweat of yours (or your employees') brows....why would you want to hand it over to others to possibly waste? No idea what the Inverness Caledonian Trust is about tbh...but I don't feel that the first comment on the article in the link provided to the Courier is helpful at all.....and is edging towards a conspiracy theory on the same lines as the Illuminati/Bildenburg/Freemasons/ nine-eleven/the moon landing was a hoax/ New World Order ones, but one with more local impact than world relevance.

Like the Their consortium, which has injected an initial £250,000 into Caley Thistle last month. Initial implies there might be more. Doesn't it?

Don't usually postpone bounce games (or advertise them come to that).....just call them off..so it does look as if it was part of the transfer deal for signing Shane Sutherland and still to be fulfilled. Though not I don't suppose very soon. With my kind of luck, I'll bet it is the next time I'm away from home and not able to make it...like the 2nd week in May.

I would.....but my phone just texts and phones. Failing any other more high tech option, happy to text team, subs and scoring to anyone one who wants to post it on here if they give me their number.......but be warned......at my texting speed, Joe DiMaggio will have arrived home, produced and uploaded his game report before I get the final score sent out.

I'm in Lybster....but have hopefully rustled up a lift through.......or more importantly given the buses (or lack of them)....a lift back! Lol! It has calmed down weather wise here now. Fingers crossed it's the same in Wick..and that it lasts.

Might be a "kickabout" to ICT....but I'll bet it won't be perceived that way by Wick Academy. Weather pretty crappy though.

I'll be there as well. Not often I get to a game! I'll be the wizened old wifie at the side of the stand!

Heard it is a strong team going up.......but anybody know kick off time for sure? I think half seven.......but not certain.

If they can pull it off...and I'm not holding my breath....it would be a good move. If the usual suspects don't want to join......then they have the option not to join...and can play each other home and away weekly until the telly gets as hacked off with them as we are. As a Celtic supporter (my third preferred team)...I would welcome a week without Neil Lennon's incessant whining.......because he is rapidly putting me off Celtic after fifty plus years of armchair following.

For those members here who support ICT now, for whatever reason, but are not Invernessians, have never seen Caley or Thistle playing.....or only ever seen them playing against the Highland League team they supported (and then they could cheerfully have consigned the whole of either Inverness team to the lower reaches of hell on matchdays), the regular "I wish we hadn't merged.......Caley or Thistle could have done it on their own.....and fantasising about what might have been" posts are getting even more wearing than the "we should never have released Grant Munro ones". Acceptance of facts on the ground which cannot be changed is the sign of maturity. As my mother used to say.what can't be cured must be endured.

Noticed this today http://www.scotsman.com/news/spl-tv-deal-gang-of-ten-could-quit-league-over-votes-reform-1-2199629 Out of interest..could the impoverished 10 set up their own rival SDFL (Scottish Democratic Football League) and just leave the big 2 to play each other every week for the rest of their existence. Even the TV companies would get fed up with that as an option.

Celtic supporter from fairly young, 'cos sister (still) supports Rangers, but was not really interested that much in football..more interested in the arguments supporting opposing teams produced..but the Celtic/Rangers thing was passed down to the offspring on each side..and to the grandchildren. I blame myself for that. Forres Mechanics supporter from the time I was old enough to be allowed to attend games on my own, then work selling tickets for the stand and head to away games on the team bus (supporters who travelled rarely travelled in enough numbers to warrant their own bus in them days). Have to admit that I haven't really come to terms with the modern fitba game. I still think 1 is the goalie, 2 is the right back, 3 is the left back, etc. and squad numbers on team lineups muddle me up immensely because I don't really know what they should be doing in the tactical scheme of things any more. Got into ICT more through knowing kids from outside Inverness picked up by the youth system and following them via the Courier reports around seven/eight years ago...and liking what I read about the ICT set up and in Courier game reports, so I googled and got pointed here and to the original ICT official site. Though, tbh. if I could have read here without joining, I likely would have......but I am glad I couldn't, because I kinda appreciate the ability to pontificate without knowledge of much at all.(I do notice I am pontificating more as I get older and more opinionated..but I still don't attempt to understand or comment on game tactics, team lineups and the performances of players when I haven't yet worked out what they are meant to be doing on the field bar giving 100%) ICT has, to my mind, retained the "family club" Highland League ethos in an SPL in which many/most of the other teams are frantically chasing success/money even to the point of bankruptcy........and I hope that never changes. An aside......... I'm looking forward to Ross County getting into the SPL and playing in Dingwall because I will be able to plant myself on a cousin in Ross-shire and drag her along to ICT/Ross County Derby games (or to shop while I attend games) so I can actually watch ICT playing, rather than just spend match days on the Match thread here listening to the Beeb. It's fun but not the same watching games against Wick Academy in Wick, because I can get there relatively easily, or games in Forres against Forres Mechanics because I happen to be down at the sister for the weekend. I've never managed to be in Inverness en route to elsewhere when ICT has been at home in the SPL, though I have managed a couple of u-19 games at the stadium over the years.

As someone whose almost ex played for the Mechanics in the mid 1960s, and who still checks their scores after ICT and before Celtic .....love it!

Bearing in mind I know nothing about football.and your hypothetical is pretty woolly anyway......I have an opinion. Is it in the normal contracts of all players that they are obliged to do PR stuff for ICT in the community if requested, or is it an optional extra they can refuse? And by extra training, do you mean the extra training "punishment" the day or so after a really poor game? If the first is not the case, then all players are, it seems to me, at liberty to refuse participation because they are volunteers. If I were manager, I'd be noting those who volunteer to participate and adding brownie points to any decision making process as to their contract extensions so that those who are decent players. but not interested in/prepared to participate in club/local community cohesion are less likely to get contract extensions than those who do. But I'd be much more worried about team cohesion, in your scenario, if some team members p1ssed off after the Saturday game and turned up again on Friday for the next game (particularly if they were not just permanently bench warmers)....so I'd not be allowing any employee of mine to dictate their work practices, however fantastic their abilities were....because if those abilities do not translate into playing in a system for which they have never trained to understand, and nobody else in the team have any idea where they fit into the system they have spent all week training towards implementing......what use are they really? If you could just pick good players up and throw them into a mix without any team training...why do International teams bother getting squads together to train for internationals at all? If the first is the case, then it should be possible to organise it so the player who doesn't want to move to the area can still meet his obligations during the likes of school holidays, when his family can come up with him.(if he is Messi and you are prepared to have him dictate what he will accept). But having said that. I wonder if there is a tendency for the club to use the more popular players to the exclusion of others,,.. because, bearing in mind I can only go by what is reported in the Courier, it seems to me that, of the whole squad, relatively few are consistently reported in community activity articles...and mostly the same few. In the second case, re extra training...nobody should be exempt.and the player who would normally be heading down the road after a game should just have to accept that he has to put his travel plans off a day or so. But I have to admit, if it I was manager...and an prospective player said " I won't sign up unless you let me do this, that and the other" ..I 'd be advising him to find himself a team which thinks, as he does, that he is an individual more important than the team and the club.