I know it has been discussed for years around scotland, but moving the Old Firm down south to be part of the EFL. Could it potentially improve Scottish Football?

If Celtic and Rangers go down south, it could mean boosted ticket sales for clubs around Scotland, clubs (like us) could have a fight in the chance of winning the Premiership.

Might sound like a majorly outlandish idea, but it could work out for the better in the long run. Celtic and (not so much) Rangers have been dominating the Prem for years, and we, sad to admit it, only got our Europa League spot (mainly) because of the lack of Rangers. For as long Celtic and Rangers are in Scottish Football, it'll be rotating between them for decades to come, like it has been for years before, with only Aberdeen stopping the rotation a couple decades back.

I don't want to sound delusional, but if this happens, we'll (like other Scottish clubs) more than definitely benefit from their move. We'll end up with less Glory Hunters, as they will choose to support their local team, which would also bring in more ticket sales, and we could definitely see attendances at the TCS increasing by a couple thousand, which means more money into the club, which means better facilities, which means better players, which means better results, yadda yadda yadda. Although I highly doubt the Old Firm will be put under the hands of the FA, as the SFA enjoy rolling around in their money pile from Celtic and Rangers. Their move would mean a whole league restructure, to an extent. Aberdeen will more than likely be the main challengers for the title, but, Aberdeen are a less feared opponent than either Glasgow team. Not only would the SPFL benifit, but the Highland and Lowland leagues would too! Brora and Clach, who have been down there since the very beginning, would have a chance to prove their worth and be one of the two to go SPFL. There'll be a major variety in cup competitions too.

I know a lot of you won't agree with this, but this could (potentially) be our only hope of going on another European Adventure (if we don't lift the Scottish Cup again).

The vast majority of "glory hunters" don't even attend games, many will never have set foot inside the stadium of the team they "follow" and watch it all on TV.....so you could move them to the other side of the planet and it wouldn't matter a jot.

Scottish football would, without doubt be better without the ugly sisters.

However, that will never happen as nobody else wants them and the unsavoury baggage they both carry.

Septic seem to be fairly prudently run from a financial point of view so the best we can hope for is that the other mob and their convicted criminal of a chairman overreach themselves once more and die again.

Do you mean improve Scottish Football or improve the competitiveness of the SPL?

The OF are not leaving Scotland and I don't see how the standard is improved if they are not in the league. I would be in favour of the 3 foreigner rule that was used briefly in Europe before it became a free for all, which would ensure that Scottish players played in the SPL. My bugbear with the OF is that they have the financial clout to buy any Scottish player they want as the rest of the teams are so impoverished they let their best players go for a pittance. The result is that no club gets an opportunity to build a really good side to challenge the OF. What's even worse is they can buy good young players and leave them in the reserves or loan them out (Scott Allan, Ryan Christie) thereby depriving the opposition of an important team member whilst denying them top flight football which does nothing to help the national game.

I disagree that we won the SC due to the absence of Rangers we defeated the team that won the league in the semi final and we finished as the third best team in the country.

Sadly, I only see a downward spiral for Scottish football in national and league standards there is just not the pool of players that was once available in the 60's and 70's. Our humiliation by a Belgian side who hardly got out of 2nd gear and our lack of possession (at home) reflects the true state of our national game it's abysmal. I can recall games at  home against the likes of West Germany and Brazil where we were the dominant side in both matches I think you can find the whole game against W Germany on line.

The OF NOT being in the spfl will not increase attendances at TCS. The bus loads that leave every Saturday morning in green and white and blue heading to Glasgow will still go. If anything it'll take more fans away as what is more attractive watching one of the old firm play the likes of Sunderland, West Brom, Aston villa, Leeds or Hamilton, Dundee, Livingston? 

The Rangers and Celtic are odd-balls in the Scottish Leagues because they are so much more wealthy than any other team. They simply no longer fit into Scottish Football I am afraid.

They should be in the English Divisions and everybody here in the Scottish Divisions might eventually heave  a sigh of relief.

Referring to the extra customers passing through the turnstiles of Scottish teams when these two teams do visit this only leads to a bad and unfair comparison of the resultant  receipts compared to games with the regular Scottish team coming to visit. It appears to evidence the fact that some people claim that without these two teams bringing their larger fanbase all other teams would be much worse off financially. Well that's sad reflection on Scottish Football at best, isn't it ?

 How often do they grace our portals with their teams? Would it really make that much difference to the annual revenue? And most likely any extra largesse is/or will soon be spent by  teams anyway in paying off debt or buying absolutely essential stuff that  will help to shore up the team pro-tem  --   all of which would otherwise  be unavailable for that spending anyway.

And it would offer up competition to bring in other Scottish teams from districts other than Glasgow which would surely be welcomed all over Scotland and provide a fresh experience to our grounds.

Unless you love watching Rangers, for example,  who in any event don't have a great team , what is the advantage and use of having them in the Premier Scottish League to us, the wee-er teams?

Opinions please?

 

14 hours ago, Scarlet Pimple said:

The Rangers and Celtic are odd-balls in the Scottish Leagues because they are so much more wealthy than any other team. They simply no longer fit into Scottish Football I am afraid.

They should be in the English Divisions and everybody here in the Scottish Divisions might eventually heave  a sigh of relief.

Referring to the extra customers passing through the turnstiles of Scottish teams when these two teams do visit this only leads to a bad and unfair comparison of the resultant  receipts compared to games with the regular Scottish team coming to visit. It appears to evidence the fact that some people claim that without these two teams bringing their larger fanbase all other teams would be much worse off financially. Well that's sad reflection on Scottish Football at best, isn't it ?

 How often do they grace our portals with their teams? Would it really make that much difference to the annual revenue? And most likely any extra largesse is/or will soon be spent by  teams anyway in paying off debt or buying absolutely essential stuff that  will help to shore up the team pro-tem  --   all of which would otherwise  be unavailable for that spending anyway.

And it would offer up competition to bring in other Scottish teams from districts other than Glasgow which would surely be welcomed all over Scotland and provide a fresh experience to our grounds.

Unless you love watching Rangers, for example,  who in any event don't have a great team , what is the advantage and use of having them in the Premier Scottish League to us, the wee-er teams?

Opinions please?

 

I really don't think you can compare Rangers with Celtic financially. Rangers only survive because of huge home crowds and individual investors and it's not that long ago that they were in liquidation. More to the point, the English leagues do not want them any here near them and I don't think you would find Rangers in their prem league.

3 hours ago, caleyboy said:

 English leagues do not want them any here near them

Neither do we!!!!

Caley Boy--you are probably  right about the desire of English teams feelings towards Rangers and Celtic,.

So, in effect, you are saying that they would not fit into their Leagues either?

My humble opinion is that there would have to be drastic changes in the British attitude to football before they ever did get close to playing in both England. Unfortunately,  Rangers have sunk in quality and attitude  and many teams in the English premier League could beat them handily. Celtic, well, IMHO, that's a different matter really and they could hold their own quite well down South and be a very attractive addition to their League, in general terms that is. If Caley Thistle can beat them in the Semi Final of the Scottish cup and show that, at the end of the game, Celtic were unable to cope with them and really just gave up then that's not a very flattering  scenario for them is it?

 

I still think that the Atlantic League, with the big clubs from the wee countries in W & NW Europe, could be a good idea. Celtic & Rangers were candidates for that.

Don't know if that idea still has legs, or if it has died.

The erse cheeks playing somewhere else, e.g. England (never happening) or Atlantic League, would have the same effect on Scottish football as the effect on the Highland League when ICT, County, Elgin & Peterheid got into the national leagues. More competitive maybe, but definitely lower in standard.

The only solution is if both of them went bust.

3 hours ago, Scarlet Pimple said:

  Rangers have sunk in quality and attitude  and many teams in the English premier League could beat them handily. Celtic, well, IMHO, that's a different matter really and they could hold their own quite well down South and be a very attractive addition to their League, in general terms that is. 

Both of them are massive clubs, even though it’s for dubious reasons, but don’t have access to the tv money that the English clubs do. It’s absolute folly to compare them on the park at present as they would be successful given the same funds.

Take the likes of Chelsea- not a big club, just a rich club. Never a big club in my lifetime till Abramovich came along. Once he departs they’ll sink like County without Uncle Roy, and most of those Chelsea scarves will disappear into the back of the drawer.

First sentence ----good point Mantis,

21 hours ago, TheMantis said:

Both of them are massive clubs, even though it’s for dubious reasons, but don’t have access to the tv money that the English clubs do. It’s absolute folly to compare them on the park at present as they would be successful given the same funds.

Take the likes of Chelsea- not a big club, just a rich club. Never a big club in my lifetime till Abramovich came along. Once he departs they’ll sink like County without Uncle Roy, and most of those Chelsea scarves will disappear into the back of the drawer.

Absolutely agree Mantis but I think the game down south will change when Sky/BT start to cherry pick the games they will show. When grounds are half empty due to games being televised the TV cos will start to pick and choose, only the rich will survive and I can see the day when the Champions league will be an actual league set in stone. Of course the game is nothing without full stadia as an event and a TV spectacle and I can see the public becoming bored with a European league without relegation. Even at the moment many of the group matches are not sell outs.

Football at the top level is becoming so expensive that it will face the "Rollerball vision" (a film ahead of its time) where the top clubs are owned by corporations and entire countries (which we already have in the case of Man City) where the whole game becomes politicised as a means of control/mass distraction.

The escalated fast!!

It’s interesting to look at the situation in Wales. The big two there play in the English set up and so too do some smaller teams. This means the teams who compete in the Welsh league have a chance of European football and of winning a national championship which they otherwise would not have had. 

But as the Irn Bru cup has shown, the top sides in that league are at Scottish Championship level at best. Their crowds are dismal. Merthyr who play in English level 7 probably get bigger crowds than most of the Welsh level 1 sides. So whilst I don’t think that having 2 sides dominating a league is healthy, I don’t think allowing top teams to play in England would be healthy for the game in Scotland either. 

With more money in the game and with improved transport networks, I personally feel that the best way forward would be to have a British league with regionalisation at perhaps the 3rd and 4th tiers which might allow several Scottish teams to play against teams from the Northern half of England. Below that the tiers would be more local so a fifth tier would have a Scottish only division. This would bring Scottish clubs into the mix for the big TV money and give fans the opportunity of seeing a wide variety of other British teams.  Promotion through the tiers would give all clubs the potential to experience the broader dimension  

I am sure this would be good for the game in Scotland, but the reality is that it will never happen for a variety of reasons related to vested interests and politics