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INTRODUCING RICHIE (the cat) AND JOHHNY (the mouse) Bejabbers Johnny I am really looking forward to this game. To be shure Richie lets put on the magic and get to the Cellic again. Begorrah - You just hug yon touchline Johnny and I will feed you all nite. Begorrah folks - Johnny is beginning to pishh me off with his antics Right ya frustrating little ersehole - take feckin that. But it is all forgotten in the dressing room with Butcher the Bulldog Coming soon to the Tulloch Caledonian Stadium !!

It's a ridiculous situation...and one that is only getting worse and will only cause further long term problems to the sport. I wonder if the decision makers really stop to think about the effect of moving games willy nilly like this? We are all aware of the impact it has on us as individuals and as a result the fans in general. It's bad enough when a game is moved to an earlier kick-off or a Sunday as we all, especially families, have routines and plans which need changing to accommodate. Moving a match to a weekday evening will almost certainly exclude younger kids who will have school to attend the next day....or who can't get off school to allow them to travel. Parents have to leave kids with friends/babysitters if they want to attend by themselves...and the kids, who we should be doing more to bring in to the game given that they are the future supporters, miss out. Even if they are lucky enough to have access to the game on TV, a 7:45pm kick-off means a match goes beyond their normal bed time, so still they miss out. More than ever clubs rely on fan volunteers for a lot of things. ICT, as with many clubs, have such people doing media duties at matches, videoing the games, selling programmes and 50/50 draw tickets. These people have other jobs and can't just go in late the following day after not getting home till the small hours, nor can they just swan off early to get to games in the first place. Even paid staff at clubs who have kids are severely put upon by the upheaval....and that goes for the players as much as anyone. But what can we do? The league and the clubs have sold out to TV and are now in a situation where they (TV) call the shots. Boycott these games? That's like asking fans to cut their own throat....but, IMO, it's getting to the "no choice" stages. Banner protest? Not really effective when protesting against the TV companies who would just not show the banners. Complain to Clubs? As I said already, they have long since sold out to TV and are powerless to do anything and just hide behind the "wasn't our decision" excuse. (hide is maybe a bit strong, and not all the current incumbents can be blamed for the situation as it is one they have inherited and almost powerless to do anything about.) Complain to the league? They'll just tell us that the game would be worse off without the TV money. Scottish football is, IMO, beyond practical repair...and the roots of much of that lies in the fact that we sold out to television. If Scottish Football was a horse we would have shot it and put it out of it's misery a long time ago. Maybe it's time to stop throwing good money and effort after bad, scrap the current setup in it's entirety and start again...it would almost certainly be a lot less painful than suffering the slow death that is currently taking place. Better to do it now while there's still some interest in the game than spend another 5 or 10 years driving everyone away and their being nobody left to rebuild it when the inevitable happens.

Even if that were to mean having insufficient funds to maintain SPL football? Yes. If that was what mattered I'd be supporting Celtic and Manchester City. Did you support ICT any less in SFL1 (or lower)? Are Dundee or Ayr fans any less passionate about their club? Create history on the funds available. I'd take a cup win against 10 seasons in the SFL1. What is St Mirren's greatest achievement? Finishing third? I grew up around Paisley and can't remember the year. Maintaining top league football? I don't know the years that started and ended or how long that run was for. Winning the cup? Without looking, 1987. Ian Ferguson latching on a through ball (from Abercromby IIRC) to beat Dundee Utd 1-0. I could even give you the team for that day. 'Nuff said.

Link please?

Yep, it's cos the other team score. Here to help.

I'll pretend to have a go and you slap Euan Norris for sending off Kenny in the first match, ready.....

So does that mean St Mirren will be relegated next season? Then in the following seasons January transfer window, he will be off again?

DD... the poll question asks specifically whether respondents would prefer to beat Celtic in the Cup or in the League. Instantly, responses come back based on a totally different scenario which is the huge extrapolation to ICT actually WINNING the cup. If that's not an inconsistency, then I don't know what is. I'm not actually advocating a response of "League" to the original question. I'm only pointing out that on the basis of that question, the answer is perhaps not totally black (green?) and white. On the other hand if the original question had been "Would you prefer to WIN the Cup or beat Celtic in the League" the answer would clearly have to be "Win the Cup". That, of course, is provided that the three points surrendered to Celtic were not the ones which cost a second relegation which - as I said before - would be literally catastrophic. I, and I suspect everyone else are well aware of what the question is. The answer remains that I would rather beat Celtic in the cup than the league. I would rather win the league than the cup but we have a better chance of winning the cup than the league. Also, losing in the cup ends your chance of winning it, but losing in the league does not end your chance of winning the league (or coming 6th or wherever). There is no inconsistency in talking about winning the cup. We would rather beat Celtic in the cup than the league because we want to win the cup and beating Celtic in the cup keeps that dream alive. In other words the answer to the question would be exactly the same if the question was "Would you prefer to WIN the Cup or beat Celtic in the League". There would only be a different answer if you didn't want to win the cup, but why would you want be beat Celtic in the cup and not want to win the cup!

Turning the question round in a different way.........which of the two games would Celtic rather win?

Cup for me. I know we would still be 3 games away from actually winning it. But we'd only be ONE game away from another semi at Hampden. That'll do me for starters.

Even if that were to mean having insufficient funds to maintain SPL football? Yes. If that was what mattered I'd be supporting Celtic and Manchester City. Did you support ICT any less in SFL1 (or lower)? Are Dundee or Ayr fans any less passionate about their club? Create history on the funds available. I'd take a cup win against 10 seasons in the SFL1. What is St Mirren's greatest achievement? Finishing third? I grew up around Paisley and can't remember the year. Maintaining top league football? I don't know the years that started and ended or how long that run was for. Winning the cup? Without looking, 1987. Ian Ferguson latching on a through ball (from Abercromby IIRC) to beat Dundee Utd 1-0. I could even give you the team for that day. 'Nuff said. jings...(Chic Youngs twin brother !)

54 was a nonsense figure. There were well over 100.

Simple answer to this question ....... BOTH !!!!!

Winning the cup would surely gain more money than 1 extra home game against the OF and realistically 5th or 6th placed prize money over 7th. I would rather finish 11th and win the cup over finishing 5th or 6th anyday!! Scrap that I would rather win the cup than finish 2nd or 3rd. Winning the cup puts you in Europe a further round than 3rd and the same as 2nd. And no one remembers who finished 2nd or 3rd in a random season years ago. Winning the cup has defined a lot of team's histories and is their greatest achievement. Killie in 97 Hearts in 98 St. Mirren 87 Motherwell 91 etc. I can list these off the top of my head but couldn't tell you who finished 2nd or 3rd in these years.

If we are safe in the league I would love a day at Hampden of course but would finishing top six not be better financially in the long run than say a final appearance?

He may be good at reading but he's a crap manager!