THE MATCHDAY THREAD Discuss ICT & other games in this thread as they happen Inverness CT -V- Dundee Utd PREVIEW 9th Mar 2014 @ 12:30PM Tulloch Caledonian Stadium Follow us on Twitter Follow us on Facebook Go to the Chatroom Media Coverage   AUDIO   LIVE COVERAGE (BBC) [uK/VPN Only]   TEXT   ESPN BBC SKY Sporting Life   VIDEO   LIVE COVERAGE (BBC) [uK/VPN Only] SPFL YouTube Channel ICT Official YouTube Channel TEAM LINEUPS

 

Houston we have a problem and we are deluding ourselves about red cards and poor decisions being behind it . Basically wrong set up too much tight control football which is fine on training ground to improve skill levels but need to open up the pitch and defense get basics sorted - if in doubt put it out if you do not lose a goal you have a draw at worst . Sometimes you need to win ugly

Absolute crap. Why does Foran now start up front? It took Butcher about 5 years to find our best formation and players best roles but that was obviously wrong? Our discipline is also pretty bad at the moment and we could do with less stupid challenges. Also losing one game 5-0 in this league/cups is terrible, two in a row is unacceptable. Can only get better I suppose.

Shocking display all round today and agree with most previous comments. Devine has to play on weds as well as Polworth, Christie, Tremarco & Esson.

 

We can't rest everyone as that would be ridiculous, but some of these guys need to refocus and get the hunger back, to many today had an eye on final I feel.

 

What an achievement though a team that has lost 10 goals in 2 games, then goes on to lift the cup, big day for the underdogs, woof, woof

That referee should not take another game above League 2 level

From the mouth of my wife..........."the referee was bad but that performance makes me embarassed to be a Caley Thistle supporter"

 

I said last week that, regardless of who we were playing, we need to perform. I say now, and I hope there are players and coaches reading this, this team needs a damn good shake. Perform well and get beat is acceptable. Perform bad and get hammered is not. This is the same squad of players who were doing brilliant for the first half of the season. Whats changed now? The manager? The style of play? The tactics?

Fact is we are to far behind to catch 2nd/3rd place in the league. And if it all goes peetong next week then what do we have left to play for?

 

 It was a depressing result but don't let that get in the way of the facts.  There are still 12 league games left.  We have games in hand.  One of those is on Wednesday night at home to Hibs which we should win.  That would put us 3 points above utd with same games played and 4 behind out of form Motherwell with a game in hand.  Our other rearranged game is away to Motherwell so a win there would bring us within 1 point of them and still with a game in hand.  We would be just 4 points behind Aberdeen on the same number of games.

 

If we win our games in hand we will be in poll position for 3rd spot and within touching distance of 2nd.  We are still very much in the race but lose these games in hand and top 3 will be tough.  This is why Wednesday night is such a huge game.  I really don't know why everyone is talking about our season being as good as over when we still have every chance of finishing higher than we ever have before.

I'm struggling with that one today. If it could have gone wrong, it did. The second goal was an illustration of our whole day. Meekings missed the header, Brill panicked and after that there was no way back. United, I hate to say, were ruthless and after going to nine men we were completely lost. What do you do? Blame Hughes? I recall people on here screaming for butcher to go to 442 as a plan b, now that it's done we want back to 4411. Hughes couldn't legislate for poor defending and comedic refereeing any more than butcher could have. What really disappointed was the crowd. Surely we can do better and I hope to goodness we do next week.

Looking at the positives, its good to see grant munro back at TCS.

Serious now the players have got us to exactly where we are. Which is on the brink of securing a top six finish with half a dozen games to go. Reaching the scottish cup qfs and a league cup final. Its not been a good day but its been a good season.

A message to the players make sure u rest ur mind as well as ur body.

Let's look on the bright side; a defeat today eases our fixture congestion and we won't now suffer the ignomy of being beaten by a League 1 side in the semi-final

I'm struggling with that one today. If it could have gone wrong, it did. The second goal was an illustration of our whole day. Meekings missed the header, Brill panicked and after that there was no way back. United, I hate to say, were ruthless and after going to nine men we were completely lost. What do you do? Blame Hughes? I recall people on here screaming for butcher to go to 442 as a plan b, now that it's done we want back to 4411. Hughes couldn't legislate for poor defending and comedic refereeing any more than butcher could have. What really disappointed was the crowd. Surely we can do better and I hope to goodness we do next week.

I was one of the fans that was crying out for Butcher to make it a 4-4-2 formation because of the players we had at our disposal and they weren't getting used. Things were made harder for Yogi admittedly with the departure of Toby Agdestein and Curtis Allen but we haven't replaced them which has left us in the lurch of strikers and this is part of the consequences.

During the Butcher reign I thought Billy Mckay kept getting isolated up front on his own a fair bit and credit to Yogi for seeing that and amending it but for me Richie Foran up front with Billy Mckay isn't the answer and unfortunately Yogi got the tactics wrong today which is seeing him get stick. Richie Foran's best postition is holding the midfield, fighting for every ball and driving the team forward and we missed that today.

Edited March 9, 201411 yr by ICTRoughi

A message to the players make sure u rest ur mind as well as ur body.

Good call - they must be gutted. 8+hrs since finish and I'm still mulling over all the what ifs past and present.

We played like a highland league team today. What went wrong?

I can't believe folk are finding any positives, or excuses for that today. These are professionals footballers and if they're that distracted by a cup final next week that it turns in tbat performance then they really shouldn't being paid by the club.

That was quite simply shocking, the worst ICT performance I've ever seen. Hughes simply isn't up for the job. He hasn't a clue about tactics. Why didnt he shove Devine on when the game was lost? Or hook McKay and keep him fresh for next week?

Sorry but my patience has run out.

I think our poor performance has taken away attention from something which I think needs some comment.  Watkins' red card was clearly harsh as he won the ball and didn't even make contact with Paton.  Paton over-reacted and undoubtedly his behaviour influenced the decision to send Watkins off.  Given that Utd were already 5 up and Paton was the person who injured Mckay in a similar challenge earlier in the game (when the referee didn't even award a foul), I have to say, I am not impressed.

 

I trust that Watkins' card will be successfully appealed as Ciftci's was in the League Cup clash earlier in the year.  Otherwise it gives the message that we are at a bit of a handicap when their players are apparently allowed to grab our players by the throat but our players are not allowed win 50:50 balls fair and square.  I know the referees have a difficult job to do but we need a bit of consistency and we need the authorities to stamp out the play acting whether by instruction to referees or by taking effective retrospective action based on TV evidence. 

Looking at the positives, its good to see grant munro back at TCS.

 

Perhaps, but his performance as a pundit was as bad as the team's on the pitch! Good guy but wrong person for the job.

Saying "He won the ball" doesn't mean a challenge doesn't warrant a sending off.

EDIT: That's just a general comment. I thought Watkins red card was harsh.

Edited March 9, 201411 yr by RiG

Possibly the worst ever performance I have seen from a Caley Thistle team. We couldn't pass, we couldn't retain the ball, we couldn't shoot or create. We lacked any fight and we lacked passion. The home support was dire which may have had an effect on the team too. Was it the managers fault or an off day? We've shipped 10 goals in two games and we're up against Hayes, Robson and Rooney next week. Should I be worried? Hell yeh!

I guess the treble is now off then?

Just found this link on Willie Collum. Adding today's Red Cards that takes him to 14 Red cards!

http://www.soccerbase.com/referees/referee.sd?referee_id=966

We've known for ages now that Warren will miss the final and thus Devine will need game time.  Why didn't he start today?  Ok, today's game was important, so starting with our main back two was fair enough, but why not put Devine on at half time?  We had nothing really to lose at that point, the game was over, so surely we'd have more to gain in giving Meekings and Devine some proper game time together.  

 

Why didn't Nick Ross get some game time?  One would presume that it's more likely he'll play in the final than Polworth or Williams and where was the sense in throwing Ryan Christie on with so little time remaining?  I can understand giving him some game time, but why not give him 15-20 minutes at least?

 

And what was the deal with that formation?  4-4-2 was a disaster last week and Hughes should have known that playing such a system, particularly with no ball winner like Draper in there, would result in Dundee United passing through us dead easy.  4-2-3-1 was the system the players were brought in to play and were used to fill particular roles.  It should be no surprise that a big change has seen a downward slump.  And where's the logic in these people attempting to defend Hughes by saying "people wanted to switch to 4-4-2, you can't complain now"?  What nonsense.  The problem with Butcher and Hughes was there was no Plan B.  4-2-3-1 should be the system used when it is analysed that it is the best system to use in regards to the players available and players and system of the opposition.  If it is deemed unsuitable, then 4-4-2 should be used as a Plan B, unless another system is created and deemed more suitable.

 

Hughes and the gang, got everything wrong today.  Nothing was learned from last week.

Edited March 9, 201411 yr by Renegade

That was absolutely horrific watching. There are no excuses for such an abject and ill disciplined (both in technical and spirit) performance.

Our defence was caught ball watching too often.

People complain about Tanseys red, sorry but it you make a blatant stamping motion directly in front of the ref your giving him an excuse to send you off. He might have tried to pull out of it but the motion was still there. See that once as a ref and and you have to send the player off.

The penalty, soft, but again the right call. Had it been at the other end I'd be screaming for it. He's clumsily went into the back of his man and he's went over.

Watkins red merited no more than a yellow. As Michael Stewart pointed out post match it is nearly impossible to go into a sliding challenge without some studs showing, and he's won the ball which has hit Paton who's made a meal of it. But it really doesn't matter, The game was long gone by then and there was no way back such was the mediocrity on show.

What galls me the most is Dundee Utd didn't even need to work for that at all. Utter calamity handed them a early 3-0 lead. It was embarrassing.


The only saving grace is during the game I'd happily take a spanking if we win the final next Sunday. 

Talk about overreacting....

Talk about overreacting....

 

Not quite sure how its overreacting!!! I just hope the players and management are hurting as much as the fans today and go and put things right starting on Wed. 

I think our poor performance has taken away attention from something which I think needs some comment.  Watkins' red card was clearly harsh as he won the ball and didn't even make contact with Paton.  Paton over-reacted and undoubtedly his behaviour influenced the decision to send Watkins off.  Given that Utd were already 5 up and Paton was the person who injured Mckay in a similar challenge earlier in the game (when the referee didn't even award a foul), I have to say, I am not impressed.

 

Wasn't Tansey's 'foul' om Paton too? Had Collum been consistent, Paton should have been off for his assault on Billy, and then neither tackle would have needed to have been made.

It's the refereeing inconsistencies that are bad. The tackle by a Hearts player on Billy Mackay in the semi was worse than any of the tackles yesterday yet no sending off. Another general point, players can commit foul after foul all over the pitch and are only rarely yellow carded but one "error of judgement" can get a player sent off. Football authorities have basically taken the discretion away from referees now with very few willing to stand up and make their own decisions.