How many penalties have been awarded this season? Loads, far more than any other team. How many were we awarded in the whole of last season? Hardly any at all. Why the dramatic turnaround?

Interesting to get Kenny Shiels take on it today. (BBC)

Shiels said that, if he gave his opinion on the referee's decision, "he could bear a grudge against me" but praised Caley Thistle manager Terry Butcher for his own relationship with officialdom.

"I know Terry was complaining that they did not get penalty kicks and I don't think he's got into any trouble yet," he said.

"He's politically unbelievably good, how he deals with the press and how he deals with referees.

"It's working for him and his work with the referees is outstanding and he's done really well there - I wish I knew the secret."

Shiels is a bitter man, and a very vocal fool. It is fair to say that Terry is excellent when it comes to the media side of things, but lets not forget that even he recently got a suspension for comments he made, so he's certainly no golden boy. And to suggest that Terry's approach generates favourable decisions is just plain nonsense.

We may well have had a bit of luck with the odd 50:50 call, where last season we got none at all, but I think the increase in the number of penalties is really just a case of fortune favouring the brave.

The way we now play football results in us spending more time than before on the attack, and patiently in possession of the ball on the ground in the opponents box, where we have several tricky players who can be a real handful. The outcome is so often inevitable.

All we need now is a more reliable penalty taker.

How many penalties have been awarded this season? Loads, far more than any other team. How many were we awarded in the whole of last season? Hardly any at all. Why the dramatic turnaround?

Interesting to get Kenny Shiels take on it today. (BBC)

Shiels said that, if he gave his opinion on the referee's decision, "he could bear a grudge against me" but praised Caley Thistle manager Terry Butcher for his own relationship with officialdom.

"I know Terry was complaining that they did not get penalty kicks and I don't think he's got into any trouble yet," he said.

"He's politically unbelievably good, how he deals with the press and how he deals with referees.

"It's working for him and his work with the referees is outstanding and he's done really well there - I wish I knew the secret."

Shiels is a bitter man, and a very vocal fool. It is fair to say that Terry is excellent when it comes to the media side of things, but lets not forget that even he recently got a suspension for comments he made, so he's certainly no golden boy. And to suggest that Terry's approach generates favourable decisions is just plain nonsense.

We may well have had a bit of luck with the odd 50:50 call, where last season we got none at all, but I think the increase in the number of penalties is really just a case of fortune favouring the brave.

The way we now play football results in us spending more time than before on the attack, and patiently in possession of the ball on the ground in the opponents box, where we have several tricky players who can be a real handful. The outcome is so often inevitable.

All we need now is a more reliable penalty taker.

I agree with you there he is a bad bad looser! I hope Terry learnt his lesson the last time he missed a game for his remarks, he just has to keep the team playing like they are and he does not have to be concerned about the ref.

Kenny Shiels - gobshyte

We've had more penalties simply because we are playing the ball on the deck in the box. Long may it continue. What we do need is a reliable penalty taker. Whatever their other attributes may be the Shinnies do not look like natural penalty takers - apart from those that have been missed the ones that have been scored have looked saveable. Also, I would not be surprised if the referees start giving us only ones that are stonewallers. If they see us getting more than what might be seen as our "fair share" they may think we are playing for the penalties and we'll not get them. Worse still, we may have players booked for simulation. If that happens it will be important not to complain but just get on with it. We are creating enough chances that we should not need penalties to win games.

Shiels claimed, in an interview with Sportsound or some such body, that he was standing at the sideline (no doubt glowering and fuming ..smile) when the game ended at half time and, as the ref came off, the latter official made a sarcastic remark to him despite the fact that Shiels claimed he had not uttered a word to him.

If he is right, then the ref would have been wrong and should have just ignored Mr Shiels, on the grounds that he could not understand his Irish blarney made under his lowered chin and his hissing breath.

But reporting him to the SFA is a bit of s stretch..he should have just sent him an anonymous note dipped in vitriol and printed with individual letters out of different newspapers claiming to be a reporter, then signing it C.B.

You know, Commander of the British Empire.

Proving what? Why, that referees are..human. What else?

Interesting to get Kenny Shiels take on it today. (BBC)

"He's politically unbelievably good, how he deals with the press and how he deals with referees.

"It's working for him and his work with the referees is outstanding and he's done really well there - I wish I knew the secret."

Shiels' interview with Chick Young was a disgrace. He would not answer a straightforward question on whether he thought Kilmarnock should have had a penalty because he said that if he criticised the referee he would be in trouble. Even when Chick Young explained to him that he wasn't asking him to criticise the referee - just to give an opinion on whether he thought it should have been a penalty - he still refused to say because he would get into trouble if he told the truth!

He says he has to be really careful what he says - but he's actually been very careful to deliberately refuse to express an opinion on a particular matter in a way which made it absolutely clear what he thought and which implied strong criticism of both the referee and the authorities. What he said was clearly designed to be far more controversial than simply saying that he thought the referee got it wrong.

But worse, to my mind, is the quote above about a fellow manager. Just what is he saying there? It's said in a pally sort of way and is seemingly complimentary to Terry, but it is very difficult to interpret his statement in any other way but that Terry has developed a relationship or arrangements with referees such that they will give the 50:50 decisions our way. That is a very serious thing indeed to imply and he really needs to be taken to task for that.

What we do need is a reliable penalty taker. Whatever their other attributes may be the Shinnies do not look like natural penalty takers - apart from those that have been missed the ones that have been scored have looked saveable.

The only Rooney-esque unstoppable penalty I've seen from us this season was Gavin Morrison's in the Stenny shoot-out.

How many penalties have been awarded this season? Loads, far more than any other team. How many were we awarded in the whole of last season? Hardly any at all. Why the dramatic turnaround?

Errr.... we had Tade last season, and he used to fall over his feet outside the box.

I think the main reason why were getting penalties is we are getting I. The opponents box a lot more than we have been. Last season our best outlets was counter attack and crossing into the box but there wasn't much intregate play in the box. This season I think shinnie, McKay, foran, and doran have a great understanding and are able to play in tight areas without losing each other. I put this down to pre season. Playing against the smaller local sides have given us the chance to work in our game attack vs defense compared to years gone by when we've played league 1, league 2, and decent foreign sides where we've had to be a lot more cautious in games and its given us less time attacking. This has probably helped the defense aswell playing with less pressure on them than they would against a professional team.

What we do need is a reliable penalty taker. Whatever their other attributes may be the Shinnies do not look like natural penalty takers - apart from those that have been missed the ones that have been scored have looked saveable.

The only Rooney-esque unstoppable penalty I've seen from us this season was Gavin Morrison's in the Stenny shoot-out.

Gavs always been a great striker of the ball.

would still have owain starting before hin right now. However I suspect owain will be away at the end of the season so he'll just have to sit tight as a back up to draper and owain just now. It's always good to have Replacments in the ranks.

I personally think reguero Should take them.

If Foran isn't on, apart from McKay, I'd wouldn't mind seeing Jones taking them. There's something about the way he hits the ball that to me gives the impression that he'd be one of those players who are good at placing them.

Eight penalties so far this season - and four in eight days. This confirms what we always suspected - that the refs are totally biased towards Inverness Caledonian Thistle!!

Either that or they just keep giving us penalties until we learn how to score with them!!!

Don‘t worry about Shiels . He‘s just a very good WUM.

Have to take what Shiels says with a pinch of salt. Some of the things he's said in the past have just been acting the WUM.

Roberts for me but maybe a bit young for responsibility certainly a good dead ball kicker

Just saw the Killie highlights. I wouldn't have given the Shinnie penalty, as well as Killie's claim before that was ridiculous, if G Shinnie caught the forward's arm at all, it was outside. The Draper incident was stonewall, however, both penalty and red card for the keeper.

Looks like a penalty to me, blocked and barged over, penalty kick and unfortunately a great save from Bell.

Bell was on fire yesterday and denied us on at least 4 occasions with massive saves....one of which was the penalty. I was almost tempted to applaud him off the park after his red card myself, and not in a sarcastic fashion.

In regards our penalty count in general. Those who have commented on us spending more time in the oppositions box are spot on in my opinion. We've also been denied a good number of penalty claims this season, so it really is all down to the numbers game.

Agree with both these points Don, Bell was brilliant against us earlier in the season up here, also looks like we are getting payback for the confidence in our front players for getting forward in numbers and passing our way into the box!

But who should be taking the penalties?

You've got to admit, although McKay scored it, if the keeper had gone the right way McKay's penalty was an easy one to save.

Tudor-Jones maybe?

Draper?

Warren?

Meekings?

If he was playing I'd be tempted to say Esson, he's got a fierce shot on him and I think a keeper has a (very) slight advantage in that he may be able to read the other keeper better.

Either way I agree we are only getting the penalties because we are creating so many opportunities and the passing is fast, effective and on the deck. Long may it continue.

Foran will be on them when he gets back.

If he was playing I'd be tempted to say Esson, he's got a fierce shot on him and I think a keeper has a (very) slight advantage in that he may be able to read the other keeper better.

I've watched Esson do something in the warm-up a few times that suggests he might be quite good at the old penalties. He would take one step and whack it left footed into the top corner and he'd get it bang on every time. He might be someone who could place a good penalty better than some of the outfield players.

I suspect A Shinnie misses very few in training but it is not so easy when the pressure is on. Maybe it just needs a bit more practice because really you should fail to score on vert few occasions. Hit it hard enough and wide enough in those difficult to reach places and no keeper will stop it. Easier said than done but the technique Renegade refers to is one I can't understand is not used more. There is a little loss in power but it is more than compensated for by the fact that the keeper simply has no opportunity to move before the ball is struck. It gives a greater margain for error but because you are not taking a run up there is less scope for making an error.

Of course, if you must take a run up then take a tip or two from the best. A few penalies from the King towards the end of this clip.

Can't really have the keeper taking it ... if its saved the opposition have an open goal at the other end! Red card was harsh I thought, Draper had pushed the ball well wide, not surprised they've thought of appealing.

Doesn't matter how far the ball has been pushed away, as long as it's still in play. Idiot rule, but we have to live with it.

Other point: I watched the highlights once more and can see what tm4tj means. You can give it, but you don't have to. That said, I was never too quick in handing out penalties in my time as a ref...

Can't really have the keeper taking it ... if its saved the opposition have an open goal at the other end!

Not if he's very good at it, and even if that did happen once or twice (as seen in the video of Hans Butt), if the keeper really was a penalty specialist (like Chilavert and Rogerio Ceni), then the amount that would be missed and the opposition then scoring would be fairly low in comparison to the amount of penalties actually scored.

Hamish McAlpine did a good job of it at Utd. (apparently - I'n not old enough to remember!)