The season ahead

[Yngwie 3,886]

Sturgeon has now said that the phased return of fans from October is “unlikely”. I think we can take that to mean it won’t be happening- she couldn’t  ban folk from visiting their parents but then say it is ok for football matches to have crowds.Not good news for clubs. 🙁

[+IBM 1,392]

My glass is half full 🥃 Can our club survive with the existing sponsorship and season ticket sales? I hope that is the case. 

[Kingsmills 5,798]

1 hour ago, IBM said:

My glass is half full 🥃 Can our club survive with the existing sponsorship and season ticket sales? I hope that is the case. 

Agreed. If the club is in difficulty then I hope that they will be candid and say so and I am sure that those of us in a position to do so will chip in what we can afford to keep things afloat.

The new measures announced today seem sensible and proportionate given the recent upsurge in infections.

[Kingsmills 5,798]

3 hours ago, caleyboy said:

Boris J is basically saying that restrictions continue for 6 months so I don't see us survive without financial aid 

Boris J, much as he would like to , has no say in the matter north of Gretna.

[DoofersDad 4,102]

Even with no restrictions, there would be a good number of folk who would not feel safe attending and therefore crowd numbers and gate receipts would be down.  But obviously there will be restrictions on numbers whenever fans are allowed to come back and therefore any likely scenario is certain to see a major drop in income for the club.  Sponsorship money is also likely to be down as local businesses struggle to keep afloat.

We are being told that the main cause of spread of the virus is having people in each others houses.  This is because in the home environment there is not good ventilation and people do not follow the same hygiene, cleaning and social distancing practices which the indoor hospitality sector has to follow.  It seems to me that in an outdoor environment of a football stadium where there is socially distanced seating, people are required to wear a face covering and there is controlled admission and exit procedures, the risk of transmission is pretty low and probably lower than in pubs and restaurants.  Unless the Governments have evidence that the pilot games for allowing fans to attend has led to virus transmission, then it seems a bit perverse to put the pilot programme on hold.  Surely it makes more sense to continue with the pilots in order to get firm evidence of whether allowing limited numbers of fans into grounds leads to virus transmission or not.  If it doesn't, then fans could be allowed in more generally and further pilot programmes could then look at the impact of larger numbers being allowed in.    

It is likely that some clubs are not going to survive this crisis.  If there is a prolonged delay in getting fans back into grounds then the impact on Scottish football could be catastrophic. When governments are telling us they are trying to get the economy moving again, they need to explain why they seem hell bent on preventing football clubs from generating any income.

 

[+snorbens_caleyman 492]

3 hours ago, Yngwie said:

Sturgeon has now said that the phased return of fans from October is “unlikely”.

I find this slightly odd, given that watching a football match is an outdoor activity, and the current thinking is that the risk of passing on the virus outdoors is low.

I would have thought that a well-supervised and socially-distanced crowd - which might simply mean spreading out a normal crowd for the Championship and League 1&2 clubs - should be OK.  Especially if they are self-policing as well - i.e. calling out anyone who is being stupid.

Doofer's Dad posted his message above whilst I was typing this, but I thought I'd give you my tuppence-worth anyway.

[RiG 3,602]

I think, when we look back on this saga, we can all agree to blame rugby fans for the situation we found ourselves in.

[+Row S 256]

Aside from the bigger issue of the very survival of clubs, if there is no chance of fans being able to attend games in person for the foreseeable, will we be able to watch live on tv and at no extra cost if we have bought season tickets? I recall that being mentioned for the first 2 or 3 games behind closed doors around the time of promoting ST sales. The prospect of being in the hands of the hard to find and possibly costly Premier Sports channel does not fill me with enthusiasm either. This could lose us even more fans.

[+Row S 256]

3 hours ago, RiG said:

I think, when we look back on this saga, we can all agree to blame rugby fans for the situation we found ourselves in.

Why? 

[RiG 3,602]

Wow  

[Alan Simpson 258]

Never fear footie fans Kim Jong Sturgeon will guide us thro these dark times! See she's not at risk of loosing her livliehood or sanity like a lot of poor souls that's my 2nd job iv lost due to this virus lockdown could be doing more harm than good with the economy and other illnesses not been treated politicians don't always do what's best for the public remember that people there lining there own pockets Kim Jong nics taking home a whore of a pay packet bigger than boris's! 

[+snorbens_caleyman 492]

25 minutes ago, Alan Simpson said:

 Kim Jong nics taking home a whore of a pay packet bigger than boris's! 

What's your source?   A minute's research tells me that they are about the same.

[Alan Simpson 258]

58 minutes ago, snorbens_caleyman said:

What's your source?   A minute's research tells me that they are about the same.

I have sources way above your minutes research my man way above believe me Kim Jong is taking home an eye watering pay packet for her "hard graft" 

[Stirling Observer 451]

Hopefully we budgeted for no patg fans this season as a worst case scenario. 

[Kingsmills 5,798]

2 hours ago, Stirling Observer said:

Hopefully we budgeted for no patg fans this season as a worst case scenario. 

I am sure that we have tried to but, even in normal times, we struggle to survive financially outwith the top tier so there is bound to be a shortfall.

It is looking likely that there will be some government cash the professional football industry announced in the next few weeks.

It won't be a fortune and it won't remotely fill the income gap from having no fans or hospitality but, if forthcoming will be very welcome.

That combined with prudent housekeeping, a bit more merchandising and some financial support from the fans who can afford it might just see us through.

Normally we need to look to future planning, youth development and  where possible, improving the first team squad.

However, for this season, the one and only objective is to survive to hopefully get back to normal next season by which time there will, with any luck, be a vaccine and a return to normality.

[+Moogthurso 191]

I think financially we are in a much better position than anyone here expects. 

We have other companies leasing our car parks, significantly reduced wage costs, clear support from local businesses and healthy season ticket subscriptions (>1400) to allow us to view a remote camera of each home match.  

Compare that to our competitors.

Hearts lose 7000 fans each game behind closed doors compared to last year but have 11000 season tickets sold already. But with avg wages last year of 140k the balancing act will be hard. 

Dunfermline and Dundee have both had financial catastrophies in recent history so they may now have robust safeguards in place but who knows. 

 

 

[Kingsmills 5,798]

1 hour ago, Moogthurso said:

I think financially we are in a much better position than anyone here expects. 

We have other companies leasing our car parks, significantly reduced wage costs, clear support from local businesses and healthy season ticket subscriptions (>1400) to allow us to view a remote camera of each home match.  

Compare that to our competitors.

Hearts lose 7000 fans each game behind closed doors compared to last year but have 11000 season tickets sold already. But with avg wages last year of 140k the balancing act will be hard. 

Dunfermline and Dundee have both had financial catastrophies in recent history so they may now have robust safeguards in place but who knows. 

 

 

The £1,500,000 Hearts pocketed today from the sale of Aaron Hickey will go a very long way to plugging their financial gap for the season.

They were already the most formidable opponents in the division and will be all the more so now.

However, they are not as familiar with life in the Championship as we are and may take time to adjust which could be an Achilles heel in this fordhortened season.

If we can be fully prepared and hit the ground running in terms of the league season then we still have a decent chance of direct promotion.

[+Robert 1,046]

Anyone know the dates of the Elgin friendlies? Whilst they will be behind closed doors, it is the first we will get any idea about the shape and fitness of the team and indications of who may emerge as our first choices. 

[FrontRow 50]

This Saturday for first game I believe.

 

[Jack Waddington 322]

2 hours ago, Robert said:

Anyone know the dates of the Elgin friendlies? Whilst they will be behind closed doors, it is the first we will get any idea about the shape and fitness of the team and indications of who may emerge as our first choices. 

This Saturday and 1st October.

[Stirling Observer 451]

3pm ko on Saturday I presume?

[Jack Waddington 322]

Presume so. Either that or a lunch time kick off. No word on venue, so fans can't get a peek at the football either, which depending on where they are, I don't see why they can't let some fans watch as long as they stay 2m apart. Places such as the Fort George Pitches, is isolated enough that it won't be swarmed, and has more than enough room to spread the fans evenly around the pitch, unlike Borough Briggs or the TCS

Edited September 24, 2020 by Jack Waddington

[Stirling Observer 451]

The friendlies will be at the stadiums I expect. They will be used a bit like the fans test events. Players getting used to the new protocols etc for both home/away games. I saw Elgin have had 4/5 friendlies against Highland league opposition already.

 

[Gringo 689]

On 9/22/2020 at 6:47 PM, DoofersDad said:

We are being told that the main cause of spread of the virus is having people in each others houses.  This is because in the home environment there is not good ventilation and people do not follow the same hygiene, cleaning and social distancing practices which the indoor hospitality sector has to follow.  It seems to me that in an outdoor environment of a football stadium where there is socially distanced seating, people are required to wear a face covering and there is controlled admission and exit procedures, the risk of transmission is pretty low and probably lower than in pubs and restaurants.  

Totally agree DD. Far better and safer outside than in. Biggest problem I can forsee is the cleansing after the game especially in the seated area. Exiting the ground en mass wouldn't be allowed I don't think so some sort of staggered exit would need to be in place maybe?  

[Scotty 2,661]

4 hours ago, Gringo said:

Totally agree DD. Far better and safer outside than in. Biggest problem I can forsee is the cleansing after the game especially in the seated area. Exiting the ground en mass wouldn't be allowed I don't think so some sort of staggered exit would need to be in place maybe?  

Agree. For ICT it should be relatively easy to ensure social distancing in the ground - we have practiced it for years with the average crowd being 20% of capacity, although that crowd is typically congregated in specific areas and might need to spread outside of their normal seated areas.  That would hopefully be a small price to pay for allowing some fans back into the ground. It may also be unpopular to say this but it would likely only be allowed (or be sensible) to allow season ticket holders in. No away fans and no pay at the gate walk-ups. This would ensure they have contact tracing details for everyone present without much more overhead.

The bigger problem becomes all the stuff we might not think about. The choke points in the ground like turnstiles & toilets. The pie queue (I presume we just would not have food available), even the car park. Not to mention ensuring that everything is cleaned thoroughly after the game which would likely be more expensive than the perfunctory clean-up that happens now. I hope they figure this out but at the end of the day the health and safety of players and fans alike is most important so getting our thinking caps on and figuring out alternative revenue streams is another area they need to focus on. 

 

For comparison - Over this side of the pond we are resigned to not seeing anything in-person until at least March 2021 and probably later. The Canada/USA border is still pretty much closed down (since March) unless you have a dispensation to cross, so although they have resumed play in MLS its a lot different. Canada's 3 MLS teams just played each other 3 times in the league with only Montreal allowing anyone inside the stadium (250 fans spread out). Now they have all migrated to the USA for the rest of the campaign, quarantined for the required time, and will play 10-12 games between now and first week of November in temporary home locations. This is all in front of zero fans - or in some cases a handful of fans where local bylaws allow it.  Everything is broadcast on normal telly, not premium channels (in Canada at least) and to be fair, they do not try and pipe in crowd noise like I have seen in other leagues, instead they put better ground mics in place and also with the officials so it was fun to watch and hear the players and managers going loopy-s*** about things and actually hearing it!  However I wonder how they will do things in 2021 ... Toronto have about 95-98% of their ground sold out to season ticket holders so unless we are throwing an extra tier on it, how will they social distance in 2021 as I am sure that will still be a requirement. I will leave them to figure that out and bitch and moan about it later ....