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no. a supporter is a supporter. if you come to a game you deserve nothing but praise in my book. regardless of whether you sing/sit/stand/dance/take your shoes off/sweetie rustle/conga etc etc. we go to games to support our team i care not whether you do it at home or away or both. obviously at home you give your money directly to the club, but some of us just can't get to inverness for games and some of us just can't get out of inverness for games. judgements about how loyal one fan is compared to another are a waste of time in my book. either way, come on the mighty caley, terry and mo will turn this little slump around and we'll be flying again

Just wanted to say thanks The last 2 years have been absolutely great as an ICT fan, we have had the against all odds emotional battle to gain enough points to claw our way back up the SPL, so close, so very close. Life back in the 1 st Division that looked near impossible to climb back out of, with the mighty Dundee steam rolling their way up the league but with finding the best in our current players and adding a few new faces produced a crack unit ready to take on anyone, climbing from a mid table position being a huge 15 points adrift from Dundee to win the 'Caley Thistle Champions ha ha ha ha ha ha ha cup' with 12 points to spare. An unbelievable 13 months undefeated on the road and this season being our most likely for a top six finish. So best of luck to Terry and Mo, to Grande balls at one end of the park,to Grab all the balls at the other end and all the die hards in between.

The home support gets a lot of stick for being quiet, but I don't think anyone could accuse it of disloyalty - in terms of numbers it held up far better last season than the supports of some relegated clubs have done (Livingston being a case in point). It's basically a case of location for most - I make a point of going to every away game now that I no longer work on Saturdays, unless it's Aberdeen midweek, but only make 4-5 home games per season. Many of the guys I travel with are in the same sort of situation. The guys I probably admire the most are those I see at nearly every away game, who I know travel from Inverness and also attend the home games - a lot of them are from the younger end of our support too, which is really encouraging for the future - and there are also the likes of Top Six Next Year, who make all the away games and also keep a season tcket and travel north frequently. For a lot of people, though, it just isn't possible, financially or timewise or workwise, to make every game home and away: degrees of loyalty don't come into it.

This isn't an opportunity to have a radical redevelopment of the SPL, the proposals put forward by the league so far make this abundantly clear. There is little interest in redevelopment beyond making sure that clubs survive economically. The only Unique Selling Point the SPL has is, like it or not, the Old Firm and any TV deal is dependant on as many matches between the two of them can be squeezed out which means that the knock on effect for the SPL is that the 4 games a season isn't going to change. Why would they limit access to the most desirable part of their business, it's simple supply and demand. As supporters we might want 14, 16 or 18, but it isn't going to happen. The real fight is to avoid it going to 10, which would be a disaster both economically and, more importantly, from a football point of view. A 14 team league with some imagination going into the split to ensure as few 'meaningless' matches as possible is the best we can hope for.

each to their own ..... no one fan is better than any other just because they do an away trip .... this kind of one-upmanship is naive in the extreme. some fans cant afford it, some fans have to try and fit work schedules around games, some fans simply dont have the time, some of the away fans are actually closer to home at an away game than they are at a home game ..... whatever the reasons, and they are numerous, we are all pretty damn good because we all support ICT !!!! And what about our overseas fans? Is there a hierarchy there too ? Is Gabby a good supporter because he stays up into the early hours in Australia to listen to or watch a game on radio/TV ? Is Scarlet a better supporter than me because he gets up at 7AM Vancouver time to listen to a 3PM kick off and I only get up at 10AM Toronto time ? What about our fans in Egypt, Japan, Africa, or our supporters in the forces who have listened in from the middle east or the Falklands? Many of us dont make it to a game regardless of whether it is home or away but you can be damn sure we make time to show our support in our own ways.

The whole "We have to do it for the money" argument just underlines everything that is wrong with the game and the mindset of those charged with running it. Doncaster and anyone else spouting such nonsense should be driven from the game.

Really? Only started going regularly pre-match last season and found absolutely no problems, one of the few places in Inverness that is full of ICT fans and it's a good focal point for away fans too. Would be an absolute shame for it to disappear although it sounds like efforts are being made to ensure this doesn't happen. I know it is open to non members on matchdays but perhaps they need to get a bit smarter about how to get people through the door? Maybe if every season ticket holder automatically became a Social Club member as part of purchasing a season ticket it would encourage people to use it on a more regular basis through the week?

<rant on> Given that the current SPL set-up, mostly, bar the very odd most welcome bookies' aberration if you are inclined to bet on something such as ICT holding one or other of the OF to a draw, is the most mindbendingly boring set up in existence....what makes the SFA think that reducing the number of teams is the way to go....except to increase the take for the ten left....and to hell with every other team in Scottish football? Being cynical, I do wonder if the ten will be chosen on merit at the end of the season according to league placements if Aberdeen ends up 11th or twelfth or if they reserve the right to do picky and choosy depending on the wishes of the Central Belt Shoo-in clubs.. We can do logic and query whether 42 senior teams in four leagues with a few teams in a few of those leagues paying really relatively silly money to players, are sustainable at all in Scotland, even at the self-important level of Rangers and Celtic, with an average possible attendance, if every soul from babes in arms to old women on zimmers were to attend, of 123,000 per team, when you consider that England, without including the population of Wales could, using a whip, "encourage" nearly 560,000 punters of all ages to turn up and pay at the gate. Or we can do realism..and acknowledge that the SPL is run by the OF for the OF...and the SFA does not have the backbone of an amoeba. As a one-time...and long-time...Celtic Supporter, who has, over the years, gradually become more and more hacked off by the influence of the Old Firm on Scottish Football to its detriment, I think that it is well past time Rangers and Celtic were put in their place as one of many and not the be-all and end-all of Scottish football. After all, if the Engish Premiership don't want them, (and they don't appear to want them, despite pleading), what option do they have but play where they are...and in that case, why should they be any more favoured than any other club? How come Dundee went into administration with a lot less debt, while Rangers are still running, but not in official administration attracting penalties....but bank administration just the same. The difference in pure chancer level is what, exactly? The OF may have been giants in football terms at one time...but no longer...and why on earth should the SFA kowtow to their image of themselves as the most important clubs in Scotland when the only reason they are the best is because they, unlike other teams don't have to live in the real world because there is always someone prepared to make allowances for them..and because there is a plethora (and I admit I was once one of them) of punters who do glory rather than football? I always remember the Lisbon Lions of 1967, when every player was born within 30 miles of Glasgow.......and looking at the Ne-erday team of this year, I was struggling very hard to find a Scotsman in the named squad and bench of either team. And, in the end, that is not good for Scottish International football...because I am not convinced that every Scottish kid taken up and then let go by the OF is crap....but there is a tendency for the SFA to assume that if they don't play in the SPL/English Premiership after 19 they are not worth looking at....and it is a laughable situation that those scouts paid (I assume) big bucks by the SFA to find suitable Scotland contenders appear to wait for coaches to point them at kids outside the incestuous Central Belt, rather than turning up at games all over the country and actually doing the job for which they are paid. Scottish Football, a bit like Politics, is a "you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours" set up, and, while I have always hated Quangos with a passion....Scottish football is one place where a Quango of punters, rather than CEOs may just inject an element of realism into the irrationality of Club owners looking to add money to their back pockets by reducing the options so less clubs are getting a share of the available pot. I'd much rather have a Scotland team of Scots doing relatively well in World football than an SPL team, in which you can count the Scots on two or three fingers, taking every European title in the firmament......but then, maybe I'm weird. </rant off>

Statement from George HERE The future of Scottish football has to involve the people that pay through the gates and its high time the powerbrokers realised that. They also need to realise that without all the other clubs there would be no Celtic or Rangers. Those people are supposed to be developing the game not ensuring the OF stay top of the league and ultimately in European competition. Every team should get a sensible share of the pot and every team should have to operate within their means and without debt. Let the league expand and let every club have a fair chance to win it.

1. Stick to cricket 2. Go back to Yorkshire.

Impose a rule on the amount of foreign players in a team as well as focusing money on youth development not on foreign rejects. Scrap the "Win at all costs" mentality of youth coaching and teach how to play the game with a focus on technical ability.

Increasing the midweek games wouldn't work, UEFA have reserved most midweeks for Champions League and Europa League matches and games aren't allowed to clash or be scheduled for those dates, most of the spare weeks are used up anyway for league games. More midweek games would be less of a benefit to a lot of fans who travel as they potentially wouldn't be able to make it due to work commitments etc. Dropping ticket prices is a must and surely has a bearing when people are thinking about whether to go or not, yes you will always get the fans who go no matter what but some prices are just stupid. I agree that the league shouldn't be dropped to lower than 12 teams, it's been tried before and was scrapped for the 12 that we are currently using, only the tinkering of the SPL in creating a split has caused a change since then, this is another thing that has to go. Whoever thought of this ridiculous rule needs shot, let us never see a split in a league again please!!! The only thing with increasing the league size is that there has to be a minimum number of teams in it, 16 or 18 I think would be needed, to guarantee our teams will be eligible to play in European competition (I am sure I will be corrected if I am wrong) but UEFA rules stipulate a minimum number of games must be played over the season. The main problem comes from the fact that the SPL don't want to include any teams from the SFL in a proposed bigger top league, Doncaster himself said on the radio he didn't want to dilute the quality of the top division, totally unfounded and completely wrong in my opinion. The other problem is that all the SPL teams want 4 games against the Old Firm to guarantee a good revenue on those days so will be opposed to any increase that means each team only meet twice. I would structure a 16 or 18 team top flight, with the same as a Division 1, then I would regionalise the rest of the Scottish game. Have a 2 up 2 down system from top flight to Division 1 along with a play-off also which would give the 3rd placed team in Division 1 a chance of promotion. Open up Division 1 to relegation also so that regional teams have a chance of promotion which could be worked on a play-off system as well at regional level.

more water on the real mr christian........ i am not going to get into a Peeing contest about fan loyalty as to be perfectly honest the prospect of it strikes me as particularly pathetic and playground-esque

It's a shame that the free kids away season ticket scheme idea, for home season ticket holders, was dropped after just a season. That was a great idea, and saved me a fortune on away games. Think it was our second or 3rd season in the SPL it was introduced?

No idea about the commercial merits of this decision as I am unaware of the financial detail. All I will say is that it is not good coporate practice to do "internal" deals without ensuring that all avenues have been explored. It may well be that the rumoured deal is best for everyone but, for the avoidance of any doubt it would be best practice to test the market or at least explain how the decision has been reached. That said, can't remember the last time I was there!

Used to think 16 was the best idea but changed my mind to 14 as 16 isn't really workable outside the ideal world scenario. 14 teams have a few different options but I'd like to see the split remain and go 8-6 after 2 rounds then play each other twice again in your group. That would guarantee 40 games for the top 8 and 36 for the bottom 6. By making the top group that bit larger it gives the 4 lucrative Old Firm games as a carrot with the knock on effects on TV money, prize money, etc. for the clubs who make it. For the group in the bottom 6 they are all involved against each other in a very real relegation battle and as we found ourselves, interest and attendances increase when there is something to play for. Automatically 1 up, 1 down with a straight play off between the 12th SPL v 3rd Div 1 and 13th SPL v 2nd Div 1 for 2 other potential relegation/promotion places. They key, for me, is getting as many competitive games which matter as possible. Football is too expensive for people to attend when there is nothing to play for, no matter how many youngsters or homegrown guys are playing that day.

Until this discussion, I have never been a big fan of some of the administrative procedures in play in MLS .... but the more I read, and the more I get involved in this discussion, the more I realise that MLS may just be onto something ..... MLS try to create a somewhat level playing field by using the college drafts in the same way as the NBA or NFL (something that would never work in the UK), but also have the designated player rule and "allocation money" rules that allow teams to sign the odd superstar outside of the salary cap and if - in the case of New York for example - they want to sign multiple designated players, to pay a "luxury tax" that gets ploughed back into the league and distributed to poorer teams .... As much as I dont like citing Wikipedia as it can be grossly wrong, the following pages seem reasonably accurate in terms of the philosophy and rules within MLS. Read the 'ownership' and 'game first' sections of this Wikipedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_League_Soccer How the league can control finances, distribute money but still allow teams to make a bid for superstars if they want to: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Designated_Player_Rule How the league tries to even up the playing field a bit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allocation_(MLS) How the league fosters and develops talent (along with requiring each team to have a youth academy): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_Adidas

The more towns, clubs, players and fans involved in the top flight the better. A bigger league would give teams the leeway to try to play entertaining football, give local youngsters a run in the first team and reduce ticket prices.

Just because people are showing interest does not automatically mean the lad is for the off. However, if he is intent on moving on, then the club need to weigh up what they might make for him now against what value he adds to the team over the remainder of the season. Unless Butcher is confident he can replace Rooney for less than what we would get from letting him go now, then I'd be looking for the club to hold on to his services until the end of the season. A deal that only puts ?50k or ?60k in our pockets could end up costing us in terms of league places if we can't replace him with someone who has a similar goal to games ratio....and even losing one league place as a result would mean it was a negative financial outcome. Regardless of all of the above, what I do hope we can avoid is a situation where it's strung out till the end of January. Far too much of a distraction and if he was to move on, then Butcher needs more than a couple of days to find a replacement in what would be, by then, a depleted market. We either need to tell his agent that we want him till the end of the season or put a minimum price and time limit on the table for offers to take him now. Something along the lines of "If we get an offer of ?250k before 15th January then we'll talk, if not then he's here till the summer. Beyond that date and the price starts to go up" If all the clubs who are alleged to be interested are really serious, then the ball is very much in our court. They're not going to lose out to the opposition for the sake of a couple of hundred thousand and if we're going to have a bidding war, then having a time scale will focus the minds and get the ball rolling sooner rather than later.

The aim - as far as I can see - is to line the pockets of 10 teams, especially two of them, and further widen the gap between them and the other 32 clubs. Its nothing to do with improving, repairing, or revitalising the game in Scotland and everything to do with money. They seem to be under the mistaken belief that the extra money they would get by splitting the pie 10 ways instead of 12 or 16 ways will allow them to compete in a global market for players and in European competition.... and that is absolute folly as the collective money on offer for the entire league in Scotland would be regarded as loose change for some individual teams in other leagues !!!! Scottish Football needs sorted and it needs sorted from the ground up not by those at the trough throwing scraps to the riff raff down below and telling them its prime steak !!! If we can develop football and encourage homegrown talent then teams at all levels can reap the benefits.

Although my club is for ten teams I am vehemently opposed to it! As are the vast majority of ordinary fans in this country. I want 16 possibly even 18 teams. There are too many leagues in Scotland all together for a country with 5 million people!

Aberdeen and St Johnstone are for it ICT, Hearts, Dundee Utd, Kilmarnock are aginst it. I wonder where the rest will fall. It seems, from reading all the quotes carefully from those wanting the 10-team league, that the most important thing is to get more cash to buy player s in and pay them big wages. Seriously, it's all on BBC from Milne and Topping. Is that really what we are up against? Such basic, idiotic, short-sighted, never-learn clowns?? The SPL nearly ruined teams by chasing off Sky Sports. Anyway massive credit to George Fraser for doing the right thing, the only thing. Shame on Milne, Topping, Doncaster and Brown.

40% of the fee. That would amount to ?0 then as this is all tosh.

Hibs got ?250k for Sol Bamba with only 6 months left on his contract. Get that off the Russians and buy Leigh Griffiths I say.

Ha!! Bawbag.

I'd watch anything with Catriona Shearer in it...... even the news. Duncan Shearer looks more feminine than her! She's a dug!

Well said, agree totally. How long till Sky and other broadcasters push for a 10 team English Premiership so they can have Man U, Arsenal, Chelsea, Spurs, Man C and Liverpool all playing each other four times a season? Beware the Birminghams, Wigans, West Broms and Blackpools of this world!

So what do you propose? What do you think is the best system? And why? I say 16 is best because it will alow us to re-build broken, debt-ridden teams, by bringing them in from the cold, that is, if we get people in place that also want to save Scottish football. It will also allow teams to forego buying in over-paid imports, and play youth, which are free, and a source of revenue, far greater than TV money, and a lot more stable. Tackling debt, by supporting clubs, by taking away the fear of oblivion, and creating a real effort-based all-leavel youth programme. Ideas such as regional youth leagues, drafts, etc., have all been discussed here. Splits and play-offs to combat reduction in games/competitiveness have also been discussed. What are your alternatives? Don't be like the SPL and just say no. It's not drugs we're selling... Sorry but that is just pure fantasy. It's been reported clubs would lose £1m by going to a 16 team league, budgets would have to be slashed, the quality of player would reduce dramatically and therfore the quality of the league, crowds would probably drop as well. Yes we would be playing more youth players but at the moment we are seeing plenty of young players get their chance at a young age, the ones who are good enough. The reduction of games will harm clubs and what split has been proposed in a 16 team league? You don't give any example of a workable one. And any idea of playoffs at the top end of the league has already been thrown out. I just don't think 16 or 18 is workable and going by this article on the BBC http://news.bbc.co.u...rem/9339466.stm all member clubs have been persuaded against a 16 or 18 team league so it looks like it's not even an option. I would prefer a 14 team league, play each other twice (26 games) then split into a 6/8 giving 36/40 games. The lower end have 2 more home games which can ofset not playing the bigger teams and these teams are generally not going to be in Europe, later stages of cups regularly as well. Also have playoffs at botom of spl/top of 1st. The only realistic options at the moment seem to be a 10, 12 or 14 team league.

Both Foran and Duncan were disppointing in the last two home games. I haven't seen much from Gil to get excited about so far this season, but I hope he makes the most of his start today.

I swear this is a genuine question. He came into my pub, The Royal in the city centre after the game. The amount of time he spent in there would have put paid to travelling back to Inverness that same night. Perhaps he stays in Perth or was in a hotel overnight? I just wanted to know as he was amusing the pub's regulars with his outlandish attire. Don't get me wrong, I am all for our national dress but this guy just looked really silly!

It is unrealistic for a club our size to hang on to our best players for ever. You can't blame the younger ones for wanting to move onwards and upwards. After all it is a short career and they need to maximise their earnings while they can I have been tremendously encouraged over the years after losing 'star' players (Robson, Brown, Rankin, Black, Cowie etc) by the way we have overcome it and sometimes replaced them eventually with better players (Esson for Brown, Hayes for Cowie as examples). I just wish our Board would be a bit more bullish in the fees they negotiate for our top players who leave. Other clubs seem to be able to command huge fees for very average players, while we seem to get relative peanuts. So Board, show me you can do it and don't accept less than 500K for Rooney if he has to go.

Problem is SMEE,yer preaching to the converted,this subject has been flogged to death on here, and abody who has an opinion one way or the other, has aired it several times. Yeah it's getting boring now . Yet DC...your still inclined to look in the thread and see whats been sed. Hmmmmmm, INCONSISTINCIES! The kids from the gaelic school would likely have spelt it INCONSISTENCIES!

Have to admit this is a hard one for me in terms of who to support on Saturday, on the one hand I honestly feel that if we retain our squad in January we have a great chance of a cup run. On the other hand I have a soft spot for Elgin as my dad's side of the family are from there, also my recently deceased grandmother was a die hard Elgin City fan and lobbied the BBC to get Highland League results read out on BBC Scotland back in the day. An upset would do her justice. I think regardless of what the result is on Saturday I'll be happy.

Ive always seen the club as a gathering place for the "old skool" and ive always been made to feel rather uncomfortable when entering to buy tix for their bus etc...so close it i say!

Well said, agree totally. How long till Sky and other broadcasters push for a 10 team English Premiership so they can have Man U, Arsenal, Chelsea, Spurs, Man C and Liverpool all playing each other four times a season? Beware the Birminghams, Wigans, West Broms and Blackpools of this world! Birmingham etc are big enough clubs to sustain top level football and there are plenty others in the championship of a decent size who could fit into the top level. Cowdenbeath and Brechin aren't and will never be a big enough club to operate at the top level. Comparing us to England is daft as they have over 10 times the population as us and can sustain a top flight of 20 teams. In Scotland we can't and it's just fantasy thinking we can.

Would most people agree that any fan who attends at least a few away (2+ matches) a season is more loyal than a season ticket holder who refuses to attend any away matches ? My wife & I have been to a few home & away & I am unable to persuade (as if we should have to) any of the season ticket holders I have spoken met to come to even one away match. We always have more fun at away matches,have never had any trouble & if finances & work would allow we would attend more.