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I was in Browns the butcher in Nairn today getting some Haggis and was chatting to the owner who's a County fan unfortunately as he's from the Black Isle and we were chatting about the food at both venues and obv he reckons County's are streets better than ours. He said a couple of days notice is all it takes to turn out the number required I don't think the numbers are the issue. He actually gave me an individual steak pie to try for free which was nice of him and all I can say is that if anyone here lives in Nairn you are so lucky I've never tasted one as good ever I took a pic so I'll try and post it. No idea about the price but man it was so good I'll definitely be going back the freebie is going to end up costing that's for sure

I think the population is considerably higher than 50,000, if you include the suburbs, etc. Also, not sure if it is right to say Sneck has never had crowds like this. Maybe in the 50s/60s they were higher? Not sure.

From what I can gather, it's a Hastie & Dyce pie that the OP is complaining about as that's their van next to the North Stand.

English League One Marley Watkins (Bradford City 0-1 Barnsley)

It's not our core support though is it. It's the average attendance that gets swollen every time the away end is full up, plus people turning up to watch us play Celtic, County etc. Only the club knows what our home support is. Next season will be healthier but it would be better to create new interest this season too.

Another comparison you can do is to compare the sort of places in England that draw similar crowds to us and have a look at the size of catchment areas that these places have. Scunthorpe United - 3724 - 72,514 Hartlepool United - 3810 - 92,000 Exeter City - 3902 - 124,328 Wycombe - 3925 - 120,256

I'm guessing it's maybe more hope than expectation or excitement. There has been a lot of pretty tepid football recently from the players we do have available, and people are probably just hoping that Roberts might offer something different from, say, Vigurs. From what I know of him, he can play wide, which is something we've been missing for a lot of the season and, although it was admittedly against much more limited opposition, he scored a lot and showed up well in pre-season, which has probably added to people's hope that he could be a useful player for us. It may be, as bdu98196 says, that he simply hasn't done enough in training to warrant a start in Yogi's eyes, but I can understand why so many people, me among them, wish he was given a bit more of an opportunity.

Here are our average crowds for the last twelve seasons 2003/04 - 2375 (First Division) 2004/05 - 4067 (half season played at Pittodrie) 2005/06 - 5061 2006/07 - 4879 2007/08 - 4753 2008/09 - 4457 2009/10 - 3509 (First Division) 2010/11 - 4526 2011/12 - 4023 2012/13 - 4038 2013/14 - 3558 2014/15 - 3733 2015/16 - 3816 Average over those seasons of around 4399. That's our core support. One reason why the crowds are down now compared to when we were first promoted is the novelty factor wearing off. I've posted about this before but I can remember going to the home game against Aberdeen in 2005 and literally every seat was full, a complete sell out. The last home game against Aberdeen there were more than 1,000 empty seats. I think that there's a constituency in Inverness, and probably everywhere else, that maybe comes to derby games or cup finals or big matches v the Old Firm but don't show up every week. During the early seasons in the SPL they'd show up for games against the 'city' clubs but they don't now. Playing Aberdeen is normal, it's not a 'big' game unless league positions dictate that it is. For example, in the season with our highest average ever we had 6800 for a game against Aberdeen - we got 6400 for the same fixture this season. We had 7000 for a game against Hibs, last time they played us on a Saturday in Inverness the crowd was just over 4,000. We had 1,000 more fans for the game against Hearts. But if you compare games from around that time against more modest opposition, the crowds are broadly similar to what we get now. Overall though, I think the trend is good. For the ten years we were in the lower leagues most run of the mill league games had less than 2000 fans attending. We've developed that into a larger, more loyal fanbase - I remember going to games and there were people on the terraces genuinely more concerned with listening to the Rangers game on the radio than our game. We've got a far better away support, although it does ebb and flow a bit. When I started going to away games, it was usually a smattering of a few dozen. The character of our support is different as well, younger fans behaving a bit more like football fans than boiled sweet rattling old Highland moaners (although we have plenty of those). I didn't mean to make a monster post but I get a bit frustrated when people constantly slate our crowds and you get huge negativity about it. the fact is we get decent crowds considering where we come from, where we play and our catchment area.

Like mutumbo he has a almost cult following on here where if you say the slightest negative comment you get hi with the reds. Roberts has been injured a long period but if he was that good and rated by yogi im sure he would start or get more game time afterall look at warren he got thrown back in very quickly before he was even 100% cos hes a match winber and game changer and i bet there are some others in that situation or close to being thought that way.

A certain Ryan Christie made his debut for Celtic late on against St Johnstone.

The team : Hoban, C. Brown, Howarth, J. Brown, Gilchrist, MacArthur, McLennan, Foran, MacRae, Sutherland, Wilson.

Looks like Jordan Roberts is one of those players who becomes better the longer he hasn't played for.

In my view, CJT and Ross County have acted prematurely by supporting any and all sanctions (as they seem to in the joint statement that prompted this thread) and a great deal of the criticism levelled in this forum is little more than dressed up prejudice regarding young people. Sentiments that have gone without comment, except from Renegade, such as “at least they are at the head of the queue when collecting Darwin awards” are as humourless as they are tasteless. For those of you unaware, the sentiment expressed is that at least these people will kill themselves sooner than most. Nutty and discredited indeed. Scottish football supporters are already subject to surveillance from several sources and there is legitimate concern that they are being treated in a potentially criminalising way that non-football attending citizens are not. Clubs use CCTV to monitor crowds from a control room at every ground and have the necessary mugshots of persons banned to hand. The operators are in radio contact with stewards and police if their intervention is necessary. FoCUS, the national football intelligence unit, can be regularly seen filming fans. It is funded by Scottish Government to obtain the type of intelligence that the SFA appear to be saying will cost a further £4 million to refine and implement. To what end? Looking for smoke bombs? The people being subject to this are customers, not potential law-breakers. It is a palpable waste of money when the means to control crowds are already in place and it will do nothing to address the oft observed reluctance of stewards and police to intervene, especially when large travelling crowds are in attendance and “pyro” becomes more likely to be used. What will happen is that someone, more readily identifiable from a smaller support, will be chosen as an example. That puts ours and County’s fans at greater risk of prosecution than, say, those supporting a Glasgow team (who actually have a history of using flares) and that’s not justice. What is clear is that the use of these things is something that some younger supporters (customers like all of us) see as either a minor issue at football, or as something that they actually want. Contrary to what has been said, there is a place for these people in football. Why? For years, the media has lauded the “atmosphere” at (for instance) Bundesliga grounds as laudable, desirable and something to be aspired to and that appears to be what these kids have bought into. Nothing more. BT Sport, for instance, have published their 10 best “tifo’s” (fan displays). So have the Guardian. The Daily Record thought CSKA Sofia fans “astonishing” and awarded them a “gold star” for their star wars display whilst deploring anything similar in Scotland. The use of “pyro” is integral to these displays, so it gets copied and the media reinforce that by their double standards in reporting the issue. So kids keep doing it. It’s nothing more sinister, irresponsible or “stupid” than that. I’d better make it clear now that I personally don’t want to see “pyro” at our games. I don’t want to watch clouds of smoke, I want to watch the game. I certainly don’t want to watch younger fans get themselves into conflict and criminalise themselves. Above all I don’t want people to get hurt. What needs to happen is behavioural change by peer pressure from fans organisations to stop our fans from using smoke bombs. This will only be done by engaging, not ostracising them. If people don’t change, there’s a law in place for the authorities to use and it must not be broken. Let’s just not get carried away.

I am locking this thread as, quite apart from being posted in the wrong part of the forum, Alasdair (Titchy) Black remains alive and well and one of the finest and most entertaining players ever to grace a Highland League pitch.

Jagster, there is no such thing as a free lunch, your £4.99 haggis probably cost you £6.49 looks good though.

As a debut. it is hardly "To Kill a Mockingbird"

Yes I'm pretty sure Don said the same about both clubs a while back. Not wanting to miss out on a bargain I left my season ticked book at home and paid a fiver to get in.

Instead of neg repping my post I would be interested to know why certain posters seem to think Devine has 'acquitted himself well' this season. He has been culpable of errors resulting in goals on something like six or seven separate occasions this season through the concession of penalties, losing his man or giving the ball away. He is not good enough for the first eleven and that has been shown in the vast majority of games this season sadly.

A pie and a bovril is very much part of the matchday experience and it has been for generations of fans and long may it continue. Doesn't surprise me the likes of Bannerman can't get his head round it but when your munching your way through free sandwiches and guzzling cappuccinos he never will Our neighbours seem to have the right idea using a local baker for their pies, you only have to look at threads on P&B to see how highly they are rated by away fans travelling north Dougal

The exact same question could be asked about your experience/knowledge prior to 1994 Regardless football has become a lot less enjoyable in modern times, no longer the working mans game the middle class moved in and the game is slowly dying Dougal

I wasn't searched yesterday but was asked if I had any plastic bottles, blades, fireworks or other pyrotechnic devices. When I said I used to have flares but burned them years ago with the rest of my 1970s clothing the steward wasn't amused.

It should be remembered that the 3,141 earlier in the season was on a Wednesday night. Using that as the 'control'; a Saturday game against the same opposition and in the same competition should elicit a higher turnout. Factor in the 'pay-what-you-can' initiative, and I'd suggest the 3,556 attendance was disappointing.

Pretty sure Hearts are in the premiership this season...

Was the fans not criminals maybe aimed at the talk of introducing face recognition rather than talk about flares

from todays game

And now I remember why I don't really bother with this site anymore and haven't been on in months. You are still boring everyone senseless I see. Also explosives ffs. It is smoke bombs that are being set off not atomic bombs.

Except it's not the league who have cited the club, it's the SFA as they deal with these matters when it's the Scottish Cup.

I felt that the statement had more to do with cjt than it did with the actual issue. It was a self promotion and attention seeking statement. More of a look at us than anything else. Wanting our own fans banned and trying to shop them is pathetic. If they aren't happy with it then let the police deal with it. No need whatsoever to attention seek over it. I suppose we will hear the usual rubbish about making sure the club aren't fined or docked points etc. The league hasn't fined anyone over this and there is no indication they will or will ever dock points over this. A very poor justification.

In a word... yes. He who pays the piper calls the tune. The TV companies will only pay up on their terms, for the games they want and when they want them. Football below the very highest level is steadily becoming a non-spectator sport, and TV is one of the main reasons for the steady decline in attendances at a lot of games. The obvious key is to maximise income and that seems to have been done by a combination of charging punters quite a lot whilst receiving TV revenues which more than compensate for the drop off in crowds resulting from the presence of TV. Dougal can make as many simplistic assertions as he likes about the M-word, with all the predictable wisdom and logic of Spot The Dog or Postman Pat that you would expect from him. But declining crowds are a long term phenomenon across much of football. Kingsmills was bang on the money a couple of posts ago in that there are plenty of born and bred Invernessians and that the chip on Dougal's shoulder is now quarter of a century old. The effect of the M-word on crowds was, for the first 12-15 years, to create a steady 500% increase compared with Highland League days. This has declined in more recent years to around a 400% increase on what used to attend Thistle and Caley and is obviously a result of other, more recent factors. Unless of course Dougal is suggesting that it's taken a some punters a couple of decades to find that blue phone box on Telford Street and start subscribing to the paranoia that Gordy Bus fixed a vote involving 105 people in 1993.

Very many of us who support the club and attend the ground are 'born and bred' Invernessians. Whatever the causes are for the apathy it has very little to do with events of almost quarter of a century ago....

Why should the club need to approach Scotrail to introduce supporters services? The cost associated with that would far outweigh any benefits given that a minimal percentage of the ICT support will be coming from Edinburgh for games. If you want cheap travel then try and book your tickets in advance for a cheap fare. Scotrail now offer advance singles from £5 which is a great deal. If you're going to go on the day you are always going to pay more. It's not always £52. I've regularly been able to travel to games this season for around £22 return although I appreciate that some people are not able to plan too far ahead and commit to games to allow them to snap up cheap tickets due to varying circumstances. That said I agree that, in order to allow travelling fans to make the best use of any advance price tickets that may be on offer, fixtures that are to be changed need to be moved well in advance of the game. The Highland Derby on 19th March could still be moved for TV and we are now less than two months away from this match. I would like to see some kind of agreement in place whereby matches that are to be moved for TV must be changed no less than two (perhaps three) months before a fixture. A couple of seasons back Aberdeen had a game against Saint Mirren moved at two weeks notice which is a pretty appalling way to treat travelling fans. That said you can't expect BT and Sky to decide on what games they want to show all the way through the season when the fixtures come out for obvious reasons. Sky picked their TV matches for the first 5 or 6 months of the season when the fixtures came out but the Scottish TV games seemed to be done in two month blocks. Ticket prices for getting in to grounds are well known and if you're unsure have a look on a clubs website. I wonder if the club would ever think about buying 'Advance Match' tickets? If fans buy a ticket the week before they get a few pounds off? A bit like the advance train tickets you commit to going to a game on a specific date and are 'rewarded' by having a few pounds taken off the cost of the ticket but you don't get a designated seat? If you don't go then that's your problem and you don't get a refund. The same kind of deal is in place with advance train tickets. I suspect this would be quite difficult to implement however.

3566 was very disappointing and it reiterates my point regarding what born and bred invernessians think of ICT To be fair to the club I don't really know what more they can do to try and entice people to attend Dougal

As far as I'm concerned anyone caught with flares at a football game should be convicted with arson, discharge and in possession of a dangerous weapon in a public place and intent to cause harm. Ruin their lives like they could so easily ruin someone else's. The temperature of flares can reach thousands of degrees Celsius. If that hits your face it could easily scar you for life. Blind and cause other severe disfigurement or in the worst case death. A banning order goes no where near far enough. If your fans are so sh*t they can't create atmosphere without pyrotechnics then perhaps it's time that you just stopped bothering. As for smoke bombs, they can probably be used safely. But are they really needed?

I was speaking to a Partick fan earlier. He went up to the match because it was pay what you can. He said he paid a fiver to get in and wouldn't have gone if it hadn't been pay what you can. He said other Partick fans were paying 10/15/20 quid. I took a season book this year to help the club - especially in the hope of seeing replacements for Shinnie and Watkins (a tall order). However I won't be renewing next year as I've barely made it to a match. I can't justify spending £300 on a season book I've barely been able to use. I wish the clubs would approach Scotrail to see if they could introduce supporters services. For example, for the match against Hearts next week, people travelling from Edinburgh Waverley would either have to catch the 0633 service or the 0833 to make it to the stadium on time. Coupled with the fact that it's £52 return, it's not feasible on top of paying £20+ for a match ticket. The implications of fixtures being televised is also a major headache. ICTFC fans who live in other cities have to plan travel in advance but it's difficult to do this when fixtures can be altered only 6 weeks before the original date. Could the clubs thrash out which games they want before the start of the season and then publish the fixture list? Lowering the price for all fans (home and away) for televised matches would also be good. Hypothetically, let's say we have 19 Premiership home matches. 5 are shown on BT Sport / Sky Sports and they have been selected before the season starts. (Working on the basis we get rid of the split at the end.) Season ticket (adult, North stand): 14 untelevised matches at £18 each = £252 5 televised matches at £8 each = £40 Total of £292 Non-season ticket prices could be set at £20 (untelevised) and £10 (televised). I'd follow Partick's example of U16s go free. I'm unsure if pay what you can is effective or sustainable. I heard someone paid 7p to get into the home end yesterday. From my perspective, knowing the prices for match tickets in advance would be a big help. There appears to be simple solutions to combat falling crowd numbers but nobody seems to be bothered about doing anything.

So TV companies are more important than fans who attend matches.

They have become more important yes but I don't think they should be. Again, you can't expect Sky or BT to pick what game they want to show on the final weekend of the season when no one knows for sure how the league will play out but they should pick matches for TV a set time before the game is due to take place.

Getting back to the pay what you can attendance. We can't blame the cost of the match as the deterrent. We can't blame the team as you have to turn up in the first place to gain an opinion. Maybe it's kind of like the Interest the city has shown when we get to Cup finals, it wasn't there to begin with but now the whole city gets involved. Maybe the attendance is a work in progress. Even the posters were eye catching and if you clocked one it stood out. Maybe more info or a web address or even an android bar code on ones the next time. If they caught the eye then only a small percentage acted on it. So maybe the difficult bit was from catching the eye to acting on it and actually going. We have seen the positivity from a small but growing bunch of youngsters in the North stand. Why not make the Easter holiday match £5 under 16s or something similar and send a poster headed 'a personal invitation' to every secondary school with in 40 miles or even get the players out at the schools to pin them up on the notice boards. A bar code scanner that takes you to a private web page regarding them being part of the exclusive 100 fans project. It's on their phone and that's a start. When the belief is there that it's going to happen then it will happen. I mentioned pensioners before too as they are the richest of us all. Some people say if you stop moving forward you actually fall behind.

Just change league for sfa then and the point is exactly the same. Cjt aren't protecting the club from some mythical points deduction or expulsion from the cup. They are self promoting and attention seeking and actively working against the fans they pretend to represent. It is the job of the police to go after people with smoke bombs if they so choose.

Good point! I'm not sure why there's so much 'excitement' about him! Not sure what he's done to warrant such expectation. Got to remember he played in the same Aldershot team as Dani Lopez and was considered by the 'Shot fans as a poorer player than our now departed striker. Widely available to read on Aldershot fans' forum. However, happily, football doesn't work like that - Roberts could yet be a good player for us.

Where do people get their numbers from seriously? Our average attendance is well below 4000, in fact it's below 3500! Apart from the Celtic, Abereen and hearts games, we never have more than 3500! And those are the clubs that bring big away supports! The county games have a higher attendance but even these games are bringing less people through the gates! If you look on the club website fixture list, it gives you the attendances for each game and no where do I see a huge rise from last year! And even if they are slightly up, if you look at 2007 the attendances are well over 4000 which we hardly see for a game against Motherwell, dun utd etc. Also, there is far more than 50000 people in Inverness now and I'd bet a lot of supporters are from outside the town! So I don't think we can base low numbers on the population of the city! We need to stop looking for reasons as to why the attendances are going down and just accept that football is to expensive and there's not enough interest anymore! The tv issue really gets to me now! This is also a reason as to why less people attend football but it's not an excuse for our club as we only get around 5 league games a season! But live screening of games really has ruinied football especially when tv company's can basically determine when a game will be played instead of when it's going to suit the people that want to go and watch it! In reality, we should be getting around 4000-4500 a week but I can't see it happening anytime soon!