sheepslagger

Foundation/Fan Funding

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To be in the financial position we are in we must forget about "giving". I remember the days when youth coaches at Celtic had to have their expense sheet authorised by the CHAIRMAN Fergus McAnn and if they had given the bus driver a tip it came out of their OWN pocket. Let's be clear here, one person, should be in control of ALL expenditure, no matter how small, and that should be the Chair or Finance Director (don't know if we have one) and NOT the Chief Exec. From what I've been told the bonus to beat Ross County would choke a horse when winning should have been incentive enough. We don't have any money to squander so let's get severe controls in and live within our means.

Edited by caleyboy

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18 minutes ago, sheepslagger said:

DD,

I m flying a personal thought which is bourne out by real and credible concerns that the club is looking at losses for another year . Just common sense . Its my idea . They ve all seen it cos they now know who the mysterious Sheepslagger with the nice bike is ! 

For instance if the fans monthly contributions were going directly into the managers budget this would be a way that they could see their hard earned going to immediate good use.

Rathar than a the care and maintenance budget !

Are there 500 -1000 fnas out there   up for putting £5 - £10 a week into the club ? 

Like anyone putting money into their ltd company the contributor must directly see something for their money. As a director it is your responsibility to ensure it is spent where it is most needed. If supporters invested in the Supporters Society the shares would be held by them and this would eventually strengthen the supporters voting rights. I would also insist that ALL directors of this company have a substantial share holding before I asked for anyone elses money.

Edited by caleyboy

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17 minutes ago, sheepslagger said:

DD,

I m flying a personal thought which is bourne out by real and credible concerns that the club is looking at losses for another year . Just common sense . Its my idea . They ve all seen it cos they now know who the mysterious Sheepslagger with the nice bike is ! 

For instance if the fans monthly contributions were going directly into the managers budget this would be a way that they could see their hard earned going to immediate good use.

Rathar than a the care and maintenance budget !

Are there 500 -1000 fnas out there   up for putting £5 - £10 a week into the club ? 

Even as an OAP on limited income, I would be prepared to contribute to such a scheme, but only direct to ICT - not to any intermediary such as the Supporters Trust/shares/whatever.    As a Caley supporter for over 60+ years and ICT supporter since inception, I would want my cash, little as it may be,  to go to ICT to use for the good of ICT.  Where do I sign up? 

 

 

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18 minutes ago, sheepslagger said:

Are there 500 -1000 fnas out there   up for putting £5 - £10 a week into the club ? 

Frankly, I very much doubt it.

Would I do it personally?  I really don't know.  Up until the last few days, it's not been a great season to be an ICT fan and I don't think anyone would be surprised if our season ticket sales took a substantial hit next year.  I just don't think the timing is great to ask the fans for more money, although I totally understand the reasoning that it's best to do so now than wait until it's too late.

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1 hour ago, LundavraJag said:

I would be interested in hearing more, as would members of my family. I'm not sure how I would feel about paying for a journeymans wages for one but if it was put to good use such as youth development as mentioned above and there was fan representation then I would be happy to contribute.

We could have two funds , with the contributions going directly into the player budget or youth........or care and maintenance !!!

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First off, personally, I think Sheepslagger should be applauded for coming forward and putting a suggestion into the public domain, there's never a wrong suggestion and it can only generate interest no matter how big or small it may be especially given his exposure. 

Taking Hearts size out of the equation, they are a bigger club with a bigger turnover and bigger expenditure so income is all relevant. Being a smaller club our turnover and expenditure is smaller so we don't need the levels of interest that they generate. It would be great to be able to but it needs to be a realistic approach as well.

Without incurring the wrath of Caleyjag, we'd probably be interested especially given we don't get to as many games as we'd like to and would be interested in following any future developments should there be any.

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1 hour ago, sheepslagger said:

Are there 500 -1000 fnas out there   up for putting £5 - £10 a week into the club ? 

I was thinking that you might have to incentivise people, by having a draw every week and returning some of the money to the fans.  Say 10%, which would be £250 to £1000 given the figures above.

Then I remembered the Centenary Club.   I have no idea how it does, and I'm not asking you to tell us.   But maybe you could get some idea from it how much money a new scheme might take in.  Although two apparently competing schemes might not be a good idea.

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1 hour ago, lizi said:

Even as an OAP on limited income, I would be prepared to contribute to such a scheme, but only direct to ICT - not to any intermediary such as the Supporters Trust/shares/whatever.    As a Caley supporter for over 60+ years and ICT supporter since inception, I would want my cash, little as it may be,  to go to ICT to use for the good of ICT.  Where do I sign up? 

 

 

I would see role of the Trust being to work with the club on behalf of supporters to develop a scheme and negotiate on how any financial input from supporters  translated into influence in the club. I would also rather see any crowdfunding contributions going direct to the club. 

 

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53 minutes ago, DoofersDad said:

I would see role of the Trust being to work with the club on behalf of supporters to develop a scheme and negotiate on how any financial input from supporters  translated into influence in the club. I would also rather see any crowdfunding contributions going direct to the club. 

 

I agree - any crowdfunding must go direct to ICT.   If not, I for one won’t be contributing.  

 

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maybe the travel club could rattle buckets outside the stadium to raise money for the club and then pay for their own travel to games which might help

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The Travel Club fund raise to ensure fans can go to all away games to support ICT.   Buses cost money - the fares are low due to the fundraising by a few loyal fans, the Club and players appreciate the travelling fans.  What’s your problem with that?  

 

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2 minutes ago, lizi said:

The Travel Club fund raise to ensure fans can go to all away games to support ICT.   Buses cost money - the fares are low due to the fundraising by a few loyal fans, the Club and players appreciate the travelling fans.  What’s your problem with that?  

 

So you disagree they could try and raise money at games? I don’t quite understand why. Surely anything made by using buckets would be beneficial.

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Firstly, Ross I wish you well in your new role and hope you make a success of it. I have liked the way you have engaged with the fans on here in your first couple of weeks.

I’m not sure how I would feel in contributing even more money to the club. I have been an ICT fan for 25 years and a Thistle fan for 10 years previous to that. I’d say I’ve probably had a season ticket for on and off for about 25 years of those 35. I will have contributed thousands of ££ in tickets, merchandise, car parking, food and drink at the stadium plus at the social club and wider throughout Inverness and Scotland for away games. Why would I want to contribute even more in addition to that? Why should fans of other clubs pay what we pay but get Premier league football, new signings, good catering, nice stadium, not seeing all their best players leave, positivity. But we don’t? It’s not my fault all the supporters and money have all slipped away. It’s the job of the people in charge of the club to keep the fans engaged and look for constant new investment. This hasn’t happened, clearly. I’ve kept my side of the deal.

That said, personally I am willing to give this new board a chance. I feel it has a willingness to recognise there are big problems that need addressing. For any additional investment from fans though there needs to be tangible benefits. Wether that be free hospitality for a game or even a discount at the catering outlets. Just something. We can’t just be taken for granted all the time. Robbo blaming the fans the other week was a big own goal for me. Rather than moaning about them he should of been thanking them profusely for turning up and keeping the club going when so many others have turned away.

Also, I’m not sure how I feel about using any additional money from fans to give to players wages. I feel in general that footballers wages are completely out of control and that filters down to our level. I’m not sure how I’d feel if I was contributing extra money each month and that money was going to guys on good contracts playing in the Scottish championship, who then disappear when another club with even more money turn up. These guys are probably earning more money than some fans and it doesn’t feel right to me.

Ross, it’s not easy and you have a hell of a job on your hands, but I wish you every success with it. I probably would contribute a little extra if you follow through with positive changes.

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There isn’t the same possibility for the sort of scheme that Hearts ran. Living in Edinburgh there are a lot of armchair Hearts fans who contributed to the Foundation while rarely going to games. My brother-in-law pays into it and he probably goes to two or three Hearts games a season. We don’t have that sort of fan base so the people you’d be asking to pay for it would be season ticket holders, it’d effectively be a price rise.

Rather than trying to squeeze more money out of our existing season ticket holders we should try and encourage people to come back through the turnstiles. The reports in the press say that we are 30,000 fans down. We must have a database of people who have bought tickets for games but don’t have a season ticket or used to have a season ticket but don’t anymore. Have we reached out to this group of people to find out what would bring them back?

The main thing is to get a successful team on the pitch. If we get to the Scottish cup semi final and somehow manage to win promotion it will be the best way to boost things. 

 

 

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3 hours ago, lizi said:

I agree - any crowdfunding must go direct to ICT.   If not, I for one won’t be contributing.  

 

it would go direct to ICT that's where funds are required. 

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1 hour ago, ictchris said:

There isn’t the same possibility for the sort of scheme that Hearts ran. Living in Edinburgh there are a lot of armchair Hearts fans who contributed to the Foundation while rarely going to games. My brother-in-law pays into it and he probably goes to two or three Hearts games a season. We don’t have that sort of fan base so the people you’d be asking to pay for it would be season ticket holders, it’d effectively be a price rise.

Rather than trying to squeeze more money out of our existing season ticket holders we should try and encourage people to come back through the turnstiles. The reports in the press say that we are 30,000 fans down. We must have a database of people who have bought tickets for games but don’t have a season ticket or used to have a season ticket but don’t anymore. Have we reached out to this group of people to find out what would bring them back?

The main thing is to get a successful team on the pitch. If we get to the Scottish cup semi final and somehow manage to win promotion it will be the best way to boost things. 

 

 

I'm not sure , just because we have a smaller fan base than Hearts we are that much different. We have smaller everything but importantly no real pressing debt   just cash flow.

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2 hours ago, Satan said:

Any sort of scheme like this comes with a seat on the board, no?

I had a quick look at the Hearts documentation this afternoon, and the short answer is "no".  In fact the Foundation of Hearts documentation says explicitly that the Foundation will not interfere with the running of the club.

The ICT Supporters Trust already has 10% of the voting rights. Would be interesting to know what level of supporter involvement would be felt to be appropriate.

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2 hours ago, Sir C the 3rd said:

Firstly, Ross I wish you well in your new role and hope you make a success of it. I have liked the way you have engaged with the fans on here in your first couple of weeks.

I’m not sure how I would feel in contributing even more money to the club. I have been an ICT fan for 25 years and a Thistle fan for 10 years previous to that. I’d say I’ve probably had a season ticket for on and off for about 25 years of those 35. I will have contributed thousands of ££ in tickets, merchandise, car parking, food and drink at the stadium plus at the social club and wider throughout Inverness and Scotland for away games. Why would I want to contribute even more in addition to that? Why should fans of other clubs pay what we pay but get Premier league football, new signings, good catering, nice stadium, not seeing all their best players leave, positivity. But we don’t? It’s not my fault all the supporters and money have all slipped away. It’s the job of the people in charge of the club to keep the fans engaged and look for constant new investment. This hasn’t happened, clearly. I’ve kept my side of the deal.

That said, personally I am willing to give this new board a chance. I feel it has a willingness to recognise there are big problems that need addressing. For any additional investment from fans though there needs to be tangible benefits. Wether that be free hospitality for a game or even a discount at the catering outlets. Just something. We can’t just be taken for granted all the time. Robbo blaming the fans the other week was a big own goal for me. Rather than moaning about them he should of been thanking them profusely for turning up and keeping the club going when so many others have turned away.

Also, I’m not sure how I feel about using any additional money from fans to give to players wages. I feel in general that footballers wages are completely out of control and that filters down to our level. I’m not sure how I’d feel if I was contributing extra money each month and that money was going to guys on good contracts playing in the Scottish championship, who then disappear when another club with even more money turn up. These guys are probably earning more money than some fans and it doesn’t feel right to me.

Ross, it’s not easy and you have a hell of a job on your hands, but I wish you every success with it. I probably would contribute a little extra if you follow through with positive changes.

I have my Thistle boys club membership card from season 76'77 . I was number 7. The money I've put into the club in the past is in the past and I agree the best answer is to get a winning team on the park entertaining the b'Jesus out of all and sundry but in the meantime we need to try and establish a firm financial reliable basis for this club, our club, to survive. 

Without outside help from us, or an Ann Budge etc, it won't. 

I ve put well I to six figures iinto the coffers and I'm running on empty now so formulating a plan now is most certainly required 

 

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6 hours ago, ICTPAISLEY said:

I’d be interested in something like this possibly. I’d actually like there to be a kind of kids club for the younger fans, pay a certain amount each month and they get a little in return.  It wouldn’t need to be value for money but just some sort of interaction for the kids, a personal message from the mascot, stickers, badges etc and free entry for kid and adult to something like a summer friendly etc. 

Didn't they try that during the Reign of Foran and Hughes? Think it was the Pay what you can thing...

Was that a successful thing, and would it be worth reviving in the hopes of bringing future fans through the turnstiles? And, I also think it would be worth going back to the scheme of giving Primary Schools tickets, to get more kids to the games. From what I've heard, they haven't done it in ages. Though this may leave the club out of pocket for handing out free or cheap tickets, surely it'll pay off if the kids decide they want to keep coming back.

Otherwise, I like the idea of it. 

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23 minutes ago, Jack Waddington said:

And, I also think it would be worth going back to the scheme of giving Primary Schools tickets, to get more kids to the games. From what I've heard, they haven't done it in ages. Though this may leave the club out of pocket for handing out free or cheap tickets, surely it'll pay off if the kids decide they want to keep coming back.

Otherwise, I like the idea of it. 

I've said this time and time again. Get the kids along and whilst it won't happen overnight it will lead to a larger fan base in the future.

The club should also be giving out tickets to kids football clubs / groups. I'm not sure what the ratio would be, but 20 kids and 5 adult tickets would cost max £100 with the potential of 25 new fans who can spend money on food etc at the game. If 5 kids want to keep coming then the £100 would be recouped in one game (cost of 5 parents).

We only have 5 home fixtures left this season (before the pay offs!). If the club were to give out 200+ kids tickets for each of the remaining home game and we have a good run until the end to the season there is a great opportunity to attract more interest in season tickets for next season.

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6 hours ago, dave26 said:

I've said this time and time again. Get the kids along and whilst it won't happen overnight it will lead to a larger fan base in the future.

The club should also be giving out tickets to kids football clubs / groups. I'm not sure what the ratio would be, but 20 kids and 5 adult tickets would cost max £100 with the potential of 25 new fans who can spend money on food etc at the game. If 5 kids want to keep coming then the £100 would be recouped in one game (cost of 5 parents).

We only have 5 home fixtures left this season (before the pay offs!). If the club were to give out 200+ kids tickets for each of the remaining home game and we have a good run until the end to the season there is a great opportunity to attract more interest in season tickets for next season.

iThe club actively issued +200 tickets for every home game to primary school and secondary schools 25 years ago but I don't know how many of those kids are now season ticket holders. If you consider our poor numbers  now it doesn't  seem to have worked.

Edited by caleyboy

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On 2/24/2019 at 8:05 PM, old caley girl said:

Thats a point! Who would be our Ann Budge? 

Alan Savage?

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