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I was dubious when we appointed Butcher in the first place. There's no doubt that he was a wonderful player but, as a manager he had one good season as a manager with Motherwell but failed dismally at Coventry, Sunderland, Brentford and in Sydney. Similarly Malpas had the same good season in (assistant) management but always failed elsewhere when a manager in his own right. There is no doubt that in his first season there was an initial "Butcher Bounce" but that soon ended and having taken us out of the relegation place he contrived to lead us back below a frankly poor Falkirk team who demonstrated quite how bad they were by taking the drop themselves the following year. There were some bizarre selection decisions along the way; who realyy thought that it made sense to play an out of form and lacking in confidence Michael Fraser ahead of Ryan Esson in those crucial relegation encounters ? The following season he was fully supported by the board. Despite savage cuts elsewhere in the company, he was allowed to retain the core of the SPL squad. Assisted by an on fire Adam Rooney and Dundee's implossion on and off the pitch, he has to be given credit for getting us straight back up. Last season was satisfactory again, in no small measure to Messrs Rooney and Hayes. This season he was given carte blanche to reshape the team and was ruthless in weilding the axe. County's debut in the SPL is in no small measure due to the rock at the back who is Grant Munro. I know we have been unlucky with injuries but which of the new recruits has been an outstanding success ? In my opinion the best of the new bunch by far was David Davies and such was Butcher's influence on him he chose to ply his trade at the foot of League one in England than to remain in the Highlands. I am not calling for a change just now but unless there is a dramatic improvement by January I fear that the First Division beckons again.

These statements are typical of the egotistical Mr Butcher. He has a squad of some very good players but he doesn't have a team. A person can make a mistake and that mistake may result in the opposition scoring but a team would get it together and counter the mistake. Put eleven of the worlds best players together and chances are they wont be a team. Think England have proven that on many occassions. There's no team spirit with us. There's nobody capable of holding everyone together as a team. Nobody directing play. No doubt I'll face the wrath of some but Richie Foran is not a captain. He's a screamer and a moaner but not a director of play. Of the squad we have I've probably seen some seventy five percent play exceptionally well in games and I believe most can yet we aren't able to string a couple of wins together. Why? Because there is little or no emphasis on team work. That is proven by the managers after match quotes. Terry, its the team who lost this game not the individuals. And you are a part of the team. Terry, digest the bold bits and then either put up and shut up or ship out. Nothing will work without the TEAM

The difference between success and failure is a thin line. This forum is awash with negativity at the moment as a result of 2 very disappointing defeats but things could have been very different. After a stirring win at Aberdeen we were very poor against St Johnstone but could easily have won: we had the better chances, we hit the bar and 2 penalty incidents went the wrong way. We played much better against Hibs, again having more chances but simply failing to take them. We could and should have won that but were unlucky to be up against a side who managed to take their chances when they came. We could easily have been reflecting on 9 points in 9 days and the talk would have been about whether we could equal our highest ever finish for the 2nd season in a row. And to some extent, I think this sums up our season. We have not had the rub of the green. Penalty decisions have gone against us, red card decisions have gone against us and there are certainly far more times we drew or lost games we should have won than the other way round. Our well documented injury problems have obviously not helped the cause. What I am saying here is that we nearly have a very good side and if the luck had been with us over the season as much as it has been against us then we would be in the top six. No, it is not just the last 2 games fortune has not been on our side, it is the whole season. But before I am pounced on for being a happy clapper (if only some others would clap their team a bit more often) I have to say that to some extent, you make your own luck. Losing games you should have won is not just down to luck, it is about the other team scoring more goals than you. There has been some poor defending and undoubtedly injuries have not helped here. The defence more than any other part of the team needs to work as a unit and that needs consistency of team selection. But even when players are available, Butcher switches things around just because someone makes an error one week. He seems to have no faith in any line up and then slates them when things go wrong. It's hardly going to help the players to be composed in their role at the back. Butcher must take responsibility for that. And whilst on the subject of defenders, there can be little doubt that we are a poorer side without Munro and Butcher must take responsibility for him not being here. But it is not the defence that is the real problem, it is the attack. To some extent (but not much) I have sympathy with Butcher here. Everyone says that being an effective striker is a confidence thing (look at Torres and Carroll in England!) and that you need to let your strikers have a decent run in the side and the goals will come. Butcher has done that with Tade and MacKay but unfortunately the goals have not come. But in fairness to the players, part of that is simply the wrong tactics. Tade is too wide and long balls are hoofed up to Mackay - poor lad doesn;t have a chance. What Mackay needs is balls on the deck and he so nearly scored a good goal on Sunday when Hayes played him in with a cracking through ball. More service like that and I am sure MacKay will score. If Tade is playing he needs to be the target with Mackay playing off him. And I don't for the life of me understand why Butcher plays Sutherland the way he does. I think he could play the Rooney role well. He's often got a good first touch, he can hold the ball up and he can turn and shoot well. Play him as the target with MacKay playing off him and we'll do better. Bring Tade on as an impact sub to terrorise tiring defences and he'll always keep a couple of defenders busy when the opposition is trying to chase the game. And what of Winnall? Who knows? He just isn't given the chance which seems extraordinary given the lack of goals in recent weeks. We may not have the greatest strikers in the league but Butcher is certainly not making the best use of them. I don't think there is much wrong with the midfield and I think the number of chances we have created over the season bears witness to that. But again we seem to get change for change's sake and are never quite sure what the team is going to be. The players need consistency to avoid there being too much pressure on them and so that they can gel. By the way, I think there is too much criticism on here of Tansey. Whilst he has been hugely disappointing with his free kicks, he plays some pretty inteligent balls and a lot of the chances we create involve him in the build up. He's not the best we've ever had, but we've had worse. So whilst as I say, we are nearly a good team, we've still got a little way to go. Yes we have not enjoyed the best of luck, but for me, the biggest reason is down to the manager. I think he has done well to bring in the quality of player he has, given the financial constraints he is working under (a point people tend to forget), but he is not making the best use of the players once he gets them. His team selections are irratic, his tactics can be naiive and his substitutions can be baffling. I don't get the sense that team spirit is particularly good and that is hardly surprising given the lack of consistency around selection and the extent to which players are asked to play out of position and are then publicly castigated when it doesn't work. He also seems to be stubborn and can't see when he is wrong - and one suspects he does not tolerate the players suggesting he might be wrong once in a while. There is no doubt that Butcher is a charismatic figure and I am sure he is a great asset to the club in terms of profile, but in terms of his managerial credentials there are huge question marks. Given my criticism of him here, it is almost surprising that we are not struggling below Dunfermline at the foot of the table. But the fact that we could still end up comfortably in mid table indicates that there are several things he gets right. For me the jury is still out. As far as this season is concerned, I think we should write it off as one to forget but I think the Board should be concerned and should be sitting down with Butcher and Malpas to discuss certain issues. This season was meant to be the start of a new approach but it is fair to say that it has been derailed to some extent by factors outwith his control. It is highly unlikely that we will be as unlucky next season as we have been this. I expect us to do better next season and I will reserve my judgement on whether Butcher is the man for the job until this time next season.

There is only one Mann4thejob !! As far as I am concerned and at the risk of repeating myself - this season has been a feckin shambles from the pre season onwards. We were totally caught cold by the early start and were rushed in to some "panic buys" and some very reactive "loanees". We were well and truly left stuck in the blocks. We have had more than our share of injuries and mishaps but the selections have been far too reactive and changeable. You do not get self confidence or team spirit when there is apparent favouritism for some but the acute "chop" fer others. As others have stated we are more like a band of mercenaries than a Highland regiment - and there is a good link there to Terry and Prince Charlie !! I actually think that we do have the potential to be an attractive side but we have to be consistent all round and we have to adopt a "system" and stick to it - tactically and positionally - and that is the one "task" that I am not shure that Terry and Mo can provide. Whether anyone wants him there or not he will be - and I agree. But he has to bring about improvement all round. He has to start working this out NOW and deciding who HE is going to tag along and who he is going to bring on board. And lets cut out the Top Six shittt next season rite now - it is mid table, early survival that we should be aiming fer. TB can keep his favourites but he has no excuses next season. I may well be harsh but I actually feel that TB was assisted by some of the injuries/suspensions this season as it gave him reason, at times, to chop and change.

I thought we played pretty well for an hour. Tansey looked good, he did what you'd want him to do in the middle. Hayes looked decent but not at 100% and we were completely untroubled at the back. The issue is our defending, yet again. First goal, Tokely left his man at a corner, bang, goal. Second goal, TWO left backs are beaten and then the least mobile striker in Scottish football got away from our defence to score. Unforgivable. Third goal, Meekings was out of position by a couple of yards and then Tuffey could've done better with the shot. The story of our season - promising display, lack of cutting edge and then defensive ineptitude. We have two international defenders as our managemetn team, this shouldn't be happening.

My problem with Butcher is that he's ripped the ethos right out of the club. Although there's a bit of Brewster in there too. We used to be a hard working side full of good scottish players that played for the badge, but now we're full of foreigners that don't care and just want to further their careers. For example, here's a team from a game in 2005 against hibs where we won 2-0: Brown Tokely Dods Munro Hastings Duncan McBain Black Dargo Brewster Wilson And here's the hibs team: Malkowski Whittaker Caldwell Smith Fletcher Thompson Beuzelin Riordan Brown Sproule Glass Some change, eh? I preferred that team then and I can geniunely say I've never disliked a crop of players like I do the current one. No passion; no effort; no skill. The days of the hard working squad are over and I think we may have a few more tough seasons like this ahead if we keep reshuffling and gambling with youth from the depths of English football. What we need is continuity and a squad where each and every player has to prove their worth and doesn't walk into the team (Foran). Look at a few seasons back when Golabek was our captain and he got injured; he didn't get back in the squad pretty much all season. The message should be clear: perform or be dropped. That isn't the case right now. As for my earlier point on Scottish players; look at County. Their team is predominantly Scottish this year and they've romped the SFL1. Just a thought...

I'm not massively up for managers slagging off individual players - what does it do to confidence? Especially since Gillet has been as good as anyone this season, Tokely had come off two excellent performances against Aberdeen and St Johnstone (and for me is still a full-back filling in at centre-half), and Meekings is a young boy still learning his trade. As regards Meekings, Butcher has more experienced options (Proctor, Piermayr and Tokely himself) but keeps picking Josh, so the buck stops with the boss. If Butcher feels the need to criticize individuals then why not start with those a bit more deserving of the criticism, such as our esteemed undroppable captain, the esteemed undroppable Tansey, or the esteemed undroppable McKay? The latter in particular is clearly so bereft of confidence anyway that you couldn't make him any less effective in front of goal by whinging about him to the media. Or, how about for once TB says "I picked those defenders that couldn't defend worth a damn, those midfielders who can't run, can't tackle and can't pass, and those forwards who couldn't hit a cow's backside with a banjo, so the buck stops with me"?

That was an utter embarrassment. Hibs fans won't be able to believe their luck. They were hopeless, disorganized and couldn't put two passes together - so what does that say about us? I'm sure there will be plenty of apologists who come on and say "we had all the possession", "we created chances", "we've had lots of players injured" - these excuses don't wash with me. Our two goals today were a penalty (which looked a bit soft from my view) and a fluke. McKay has played 1,182 minutes of football this season, all at centre forward, and scored one goal. It's more than 1,000 minutes since he last scored. I don't give a damn if he runs a lot and his link-up play is good - it clearly isn't helping the team. He may work harder than big lugs like Garry O'Connor, or Scott Vernon (Aberdeen), or Paul Heffernan (Kilmarnock), or Steven Thompson (St Mirren)...but these guys have all scored far more goals. Tade had a mare on Wednesday, and picked up where he left off; his touch was dreadful and, like McKay, he too made an arse of a one-on-one. Our midfield were pretty dreadful today aside from Hayes (who, apart from a good ten minutes at the start, did little else until his moment of good fortune). I'm sick of watching Tansey apologize to teammates a dozen times a game for giving the ball away cheaply. Foran looked slow and his touch was rotten. These guys have started 28 and 31 league games respectively - what do they have to do to get dropped? Gavin Morrison couldn't be any worse than they are. Graeme Shinnie looked like what he was - a full-back who was out of position. As for the defence...well, watching that would have left Alan Hansen contemplating suicide. Tokely just decided to watch and admire Hanlon's run and free header for their first. Neither of our two left-backs could stop their winger crossing for the second - and O'Connor was given all the time in the world to score. As for the third, Meekings and Tokely just stood off and watched, and even then Griffiths' shot should have been better dealt with by Tuffey. I thought Golobart did all right, but is it possible for a defender to be MOTM when his team have conceded three? As soon as we concede a goal now, we cave in and our manager does not know what to do to turn things around. He has no plan B. His substitutions are bizarre - even though we were losing, he still took 79 mins to make one sub - and then brought two guys on in injury time. What is the point of that? It is clear to see there are no tactics - he simply chooses eleven players and a formation and leaves them to get on with it. There is no organization, and I don't believe there is much motivation either. Few, if any of the ICT team look like they want to be out there playing football. So our last 9 games read as one win, three draws and five defeats, 6 scored, 16 conceded. Remember the end of the 2007-08 season, when we only won three of the last sixteen under Brewster? Watching Caley then felt a lot like watching them right now does. And remember what happened the season after that...

Our defence was a complete shambles for all three goals which, given that our management team consist of two international defenders is difficult to comprehend.

The most disappointing thing this season is that I know we have players who are capable of much better. Last week against Aberdeen we were a dream to watch in the first 45 minutes and then showed real guts after going down to 10 men to hold on for the win. To then watch the exact same players come out and play like a bunch of lads picked up at the local park the day before is a bit gaoling....and that has been the story of our season. Yes, we've had more than our fair share of injuries and dubious cards/suspensions...but that doesn't, on its own, explain the flip-flopping performances. You can understand one or two players having the odd off day, but for us it seems to be everyone or nobody who's up for it come game time. We can argue the reasons for that around and around all day long. It's easy to sit and look at the effect, we all do it. Can we honestly put our finger one thing and say "that is the cause"? I don't think we can. Yeah we've got things wrong with our tactics here and there, but we've also had more than our fair share of misfortune with injuries etc. I was speaking to a few guys who support other teams around the country yesterday (was at a meeting of Trusts) and some of them were surprised that we hadn't been cut adrift at the bottom and were praising Butcher for holding it together and doing what he have done under the circumstances. So the picture from the outside looking in is very much different than the one we may have from being so close to things. I've said it before....Butchers biggest mistake this season was all the talk of a Top 6. It created an inflated expectation among the fans and now, having failed to deliver and regardless of the reasons, we're seeing a bit of a backlash on that. I personally saw/see nothing wrong in his previous approach to questions on the league table where focus was always on catching the team ahead...wherever that was in the table...and I'd be happy for us to go back to taking that approach again in future.

That truelly was the lowest ive felt this season as an ICT fan. The rollercoaster of emotions ended with me feeling very depressed at what i saw throughout that 90 minutes. Same old story. Missed chances, poor defending, late goals blah blah blah. I'am absolutely sick to death of it. I dont care if we performed better than we did in the St Johnstone game and i really don't care about what excuses were churned up at the end. We simply were not good enough. Hibs weren't any better but the difference is they had 3 chances in that game and they took them. We had 3 in the first half and didnt take any. We had at least two more before we needed a penalty to get ourselves in front. This is by far the weakest ICT side i have ever seen in terms of fighting spirit because their arses simply dropped as soon as Hibs drew level and this was followed by the usual headless chicken routine of passing to shadows and chasing a game we know we should have had dead and buried before Hibs even drew level. I just want this season to end. I will never give up on my team but i have defnitely given up on this season and achieving anything even remotely worthwhile.

This is pretty much the polar opposite of reality. Tuffey - agreed, good back up. Nothing more. Foran - Yes he was good in the First Division, but this isn't the First Division. He is crap in this league, you know, the league with the good players? Cox - A poor mans Ian Black. Not a match at all. Gillet - Was good, then he got injured (I think) and he's been crap since. Golobart - Not convinced at all. Tansey - Mr consistently crap. I struggle to see what he takes to the team. Tade - A threat to our teams ability to remain in this league. Can't finish a fish supper. Dorans - A poor mans Hayes. Scarcely a replacement. Meekings - A ticking timebomb. Too slow, can't defend, and always good for a red card. Always. A. Shinnie - Crap start but has improved. The question is, what's he going to be like when he comes back? Davis - Doesn't play for us anymore... But when he was here, he could beat entire midfields on his own when he wanted to. Also to address the topic... HE'S HAD THREE YEARS!!!! He's relegated us, promoted us from the worst First Division in recent memory and unsuccessfully attempted to rebuild from "losing" most of the ageing core of the team. Does he have to be photographed taking a dump on the club crest before some folk on here turn on him?

As someone has already said, for 64 minutes, we were so much better than Wednesday and waited for us to kick on after the penalty (stonewall by the way) but then the defence just blew up and we lost a game we should have won comfortably. Haven't heard the post match interview from TB and while it may be true defensive mistakes cost us the game, had we taken our chances up front, that wouldn't be an issue. We need to defend from the front, something we seem incapable of doing. Substitutes today were baffling. It was obvious Tade was either not fully fit or so lacking confidence that he should have been replaced so much sooner. As for the last two subs coming on in injury time, what was that about. This game could so easily have been won as could Wednesdays and that is the most annoying/frustrating thing. Finally if some fans appear to be saying they would rather not renew their season tickets but go to watch County instead, then to me they ain't fans.

all that butcher can account for is the tactics on a match day. not giving away soft penalties, not missing easy chances and not players getting sent off. has been one of the most inconsistent seasons weve ever had. and personally id put that down to injuries. butcher hasnt been able to pick the same team over and over like last season or the season before which ultimatly led to a great promotion push and our joint highest league finish. so i dont see how bringing in a new manager or management team would help matters i agree with pele if thing are worse next season then it should be cosidered but for me that would depend on injury situation and what butcher does with his resources then. remember last time butcher was under pressure and we stuck with him. when we were in mid table obscurity in the 1st division. he got us promoted. ive alway taken pride in the fact that we done that and im also proud that butcher is the longest serving manager in the spl. stick with him through the hard times and the good times will come

FOOK aff with the talks of budgets etc. ICT NEVER needed them before....as we had teamspirit. and THAT is what we are missing now. I dont know if its because most of the team are on short term contracts or on loan...but NONE of them seem to be playing with any passion for the club. Most are mercinaries and would jump ship if they got an extra fiver in their wagepacket. Thats how i see it. ICT strength lay in the camoradarie of the team......a few new faces every season...no wholsesale changes.....and it worked for us.....until tinkering terry came along. Well, i hate to say it...but i believe we have seen all we are going to see from him, i would be preparing for a survival scrap next season

I think he is the way forward, unless the team does not improve, but what annoys me is how long it takes him to make a sub!!! he always seems to leave it till the last 10mins. Against st. Johnstone, he left it too late for a sub to make a decent impact, and was basically the same today against hibs!

Fact One: We have two international defenders with nearly 140 international caps between them and our defending (not just our defence) is a shambles. Why? Fact Two: Our management team saw no worth in Garry MacKay Steven (the young Highland boy that the Dundee Utd fans were singing 'Are you Messi in disguise? to yesterday). Forget the bull about him rejecting an offer. He was not rated or wanted. I make no apology for keeping on about this as I think it is a clear statement of intent from Butcher. As clear as the departure of Grant Munro was. Not sure which of these two facts cause me the most concern. There has been no progress at the club, on the park, since shoes off debacle of Brewster's departure. Anyone who suggests there has been should be prepared to provide some evidence to the contrary. I gave my tickets to my brother and his son as a birthday treat. Kid hates me now....... Wake up and smell the coffee. We are as poor a side now as we have ever been at any point in our SPL history. Butcher is getting preferential treatment that none of his predecessors (Charlie included) did. His image, persona and media status are all saving him from real subjective analysis of his career at ICT. How long will it continue?

Have to disagree with gillet out. He had a poor game today however many times this season I've felt he has been MOTM. Starting to agree regarding Foran, he has desire but he's really beginning to irritate me, often giving the ball away then whining that it was the recipients fault. First half today was a joy to watch but must take our chances and build on our corners. 9 in the first half yet all wasted.

Inverness Caledonian Thistle manager Terry Butcher : "That 90 minutes just encapsulated our season. "In some parts, we were very good, but in other parts of the game we were absolute rubbish. "We gave away a soft goal at the first because Ross Tokely was not marking his man. Kenny Gillet was then at fault for the second goal and Josh Meekings the third. "In the second half, we had the back-four from hell." Worst post match interview ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! How can he blame his 787869774769308757th back four when he changes the back four 75629573205757603728568569 times?!?! There was never enough injuries in the season to warrant as many changes as he did to the back four! Blame game again from Butcher and surprisingly no mention of Tade, Tansey, Foran, McKay, ad any other player. Obviously this is a snapshot from the BBC but if this is the crux of the interview then we need to get shot of this man! What a poor poor poor excuse.

I agree with much of this. Gillet did have a bad day today. But over the season he has been one of Terry's better imports, even winning Player of the Month a couple of times. I'd give him the benefit of the doubt as it was his first game back after injury. Generally I prefer him at left back to Shinnie. I agree re Foran, McKay, Tansey, Tade. But why did you stop there? Meekings?, Williams? Gnapka? And probably one or two others! Terry made it evident at the start of the season, by his clear out of most of the ICT old guard, that he wanted his 'own team'. Well he has got it and it is clearly much poorer than the old one. So the buck must stop with Terry.

The elusive 4-5-1 formation. Long balls aimlessly punted forward. Lone frontmen who weren't built for the role constantly played no-matter what. Talented established players disappearing. Players being played despite week after week of sub-standard performances. Players looking bereft of confidence. Team playing without bite or flair. Manager picking his favourites no-matter what. Substitutions made far too late. Substitutions made in the ninetieth minute while desperately needing a goal. David Proctor always in the squad, despite being rubbish. Manager blaming everyone but himself for poor performances.....Oh sorry, I was talking about Brewster! Is the Butcher the man for the job? I really don't know. In my opinion, this man has made far too many changes than was necessary. There's no doubt that getting rid of Munro was the worst decision ever made any ICT manager. The defence was pretty good last season - it's been awful this season. Oh and by the way, County's is great this season, funny that..... Butcher's got some people eating out of his hand, but really where is this club going? Backwards is the only gear right now. I reckon that it all comes down to Christmas and the club is in the same position this December or worst of all, has gone backwards, then it will be time for him to stand aside. One thing I will say though, when Butcher signed a new deal in 2009 I said it would all end in tears. I see no reason why in the end I won't be proved correct.

I'd idealy see the ten teams re-join the SFL. 16 team Division 1, 16 team Division 2, 16 team Division 3 then a Highland League and Lowland League below with a pyramid system for entry to Division 3. This would mean we would need 8 more teams to join Division 3. 4 from the HL and 4 from the Lowland junior leagues to join Division 3. Rangers and Celtic can apply to join straight to Division 1 with the former SPL teams, but they have to sign up to the new league rules which means all potential sponsor and TV revenue must be split between Division 1 teams evenly. Also, no matter what league your in, terracing is allowed. No silly stadia rules that will get teams into debt building them. Far too sensible a suggestion for it ever to happen CC.

Safety reached. Thank feck for Dunfermline.

We did look promising for a while, but it all fell apart as soon as we scored. We can only play with the players we have at our disposal, but what does concern me is how we utilise that players and how we ask them to play when selected. I don't think we are getting the best out of some of our players and maybe Butcher needs to look at his tactics. There seemed to be little point in delaying the substitutions as late as the last two were. Both Sutherland and Jones came on after the ninety minutes had elapsed. FFS we needed a goal five minutes before that............why the delay, is Butcher trying to prove something here. I am simply deflated by these last two results and sick to the back teeth of watching McKay chase long balls way above his head aimed at 6ft 4in defenders, it is criminal. Tade has been poor recently and would find it difficult to trap a bag of cement. Everything that could possibly go wrong recently has done so. We have not had a great return from our strikers this season considering the amount of hits at goal, this is purely down to a lack of talent, no? It is commendable to see one or two still trying to justify our team picking up their wages, but in all honesty, some of the stuff on display is the equivalent of watching the team under Brewster's regime and he was not afforded the same grace. So, come on Terry, show us a new side to your undoubted charisma, a cutting edge development whereby we play the ball neatly around the park to our own players and we put the ball into the opposition goal. Is it too much to ask? It's a while since I have been so gruntled, please fix it for me or let someone else fix it. Yours' Mr Disgruntled.

Have just read the Daily Don (P&J) and TB's take on the game. It was Tokely, Gillet and Meekings fault in that order. I have been supportive up until now but must reopen the Grant Munro case, surely chickens coming home to roost as we have struggled in central defence all season, while by all reports Grant has been player of the season up the road, and may well punish us next season. Terry may well have won his battle last year, but is clearly losing the war. Also his persistence with playing players so clearly out of position and so consistently all season (injuries are not the case yesterday - why was Shinnie preferred to Nick Ross, Shane Sutherland and who is this Winnall everyone is asking about? Even Gnakpa why was he leaving the ground at 2.45?) I am afraid there are more questions arising every game and the answer is certainly NOT to blame individuals even if their mistakes lead to the goals that cause our defeat, That just installs fear and destroys confidence???, something that is so obviously missing. Come on terry sort it out take your share of the blame, then maybe we can all pull together and get some team spirit back. Also should mention the from the stands piece from David Sutherland in the DD, couldn't agree more, the fans are being short changed, buying a season ticket not knowing what you are buying 18 (usually) 19 (sometimes) 20 (never) home games. That and the poorer performances may well have something to do with the dwindling performances. Like many previous posts we are considering our commitment next year. Not all doom and gloom though at least we now know who our penalty taker is.

And yet above both Dunfermline and Hibs, whilst pushing to be above Aberdeen. Either these players aren't as bad as you're making out or Butcher's a terrific manager to get this much out of them.

It's funny how when there is just the slightest nudge in the box, an accidental contact with an elbow or a face to face confrontation when foreheads gently touch, players collapse to the ground as though poleaxed. but when there are real fisticuffs as at Bradford and Toronto, they all some how manage to stay firmly on their feet.

I post about how bad we are because ***NEWSFLASH*** we are worse than bad, we are relegation material. This season we've been bloody fortunate that Dunfermline just happen to be worse than we are. I'm confident on showings like today, Hibs will finish above us. Don't be surprised to see us as bookies favourites for the drop next season. Being better than the opposing team for 64mins, isn't good enough. You can't polish a turd but you're certainly doing your best to roll it in glitter, eh? You're saying that the only difference was that they had better finishers. Well is that not fundamental to the game?! Who's fault is it that we don't have clinical finshers? Who's fault is it that we're stuck with a clueless but hard working First Division level forward who can't finish a fish supper?...

As regards whether Butcher has a good eye for a player, here are his signings by transfer window according to Wikipedia and Soccerbase. Apologies for those I've missed. I've listed Foran, Cox, Hayes, Duff (controversial, I know!), Gillet, Hogg, Andy Shinnie and loanees Golobart and Davis as hits. That's not very many, considering it's been three years... January 2009 (Gatheussi, Morais and Mihadjuks were all Brewster signings) Richie Foran - HIT at least until this season, now club captain Eric Odhiambo - JURY OUT hugely inconsistent but certainly got a few goals. Now playing for Denizlispor in Turkey Summer 2009 Nauris Bulvitis (loan) - JURY OUT a regular at centre back in div 1 but loan not extended beyond end of season. Now back in Latvia playing for Spartak Jurmala Lee Cox - HIT only 18 when signed but a regular in midfield for two seasons. Left in January 2012 for Swindon Town for about £50,000 Robert Eagle - MISS flattered to deceive in midfield. Now playing for Lowestoft Town Stuart Golabek - JURY OUT clearly not as good as he was in his first spell, but was solid enough at left back Jonny Hayes - HIT even in the SPL, he is still our biggest attacking threat Dani Sanchez - JURY OUT infuriating at times, but definitely showed flashes of ability. Now at Wellington Phoenix in the Aussie A-League Dan Stratford - MISS mediocre midfield player. Back in the USA playing for West Virginia University Stuart Duff (loan in November 2010) - JURY OUT only played a few games before returning to Aberdeen Summer 2010 Gil Blumenshtein - MISS hopeless Israeli midfielder with more hair than ability. Now playing for Hapoel Ramat HaSharon back in Israel Stuart Duff - HIT solid but unspectacular midfield player who gave us versatility and depth. Now playing for Kazakhstan side Kairat Kenny Gillet - HIT missed much of last season injured but has looked good for the most part this year Chris Innes - JURY OUT experienced reserve centre back, but clearly past his best. Now at Arbroath Kevin McCann (loan) - JURY OUT started really well but injury-prone. Now at Livingston Jonny Tuffey - JURY OUT certainly a good backup keeper to have around but has played only a handful of games January 2011 Aaron Doran (loan later made permanent) - JURY OUT looked great initially, but injured for the majority of this season Chris Hogg - HIT when fit, our best centre-back. Cruciate injury has kept him out since November Alex MacDonald (loan) - MISS - just one goal and no better than anyone else we had available Summer 2011 Tom Aldred (loan) - MISS struggled in his first few games, then threw a hissy fit when dropped Aiden Chippendale (loan) - MISS didn't look anything special and his loan wasn't extended past January David Davis (loan) - HIT added drive quality to our midfield - now a first team regular at Wolves! Roman Golobart (loan) - HIT some dreadful blunders but several MOTM performances and in the running for CTO's player of the year Billy McKay - JURY OUT might come good, but 1 goal in 18 games is a woeful return Josh Meekings - JURY OUT a lot of naive defending but he is still young. Long throws are useful! Thomas Piermayr - JURY OUT decent in patches, but rash at times and picks up a lot of bookings Andy Shinnie - HIT after a hideous start he was in stunning form when he broke his foot Gregory Tade - JURY OUT nine goals are a plus but is either very good or very bad Greg Tansey - JURY OUT a regular in the team but so far has not lived up to expectations (except when playing Dunfermline) Owain Tudur Jones - JURY OUT cursed by injury this season January 2012 Claude Gnakpa - JURY OUT a few bright flashes but rarely looks bothered Steve Williams (loan) - JURY OUT looked good initially but made scapegoat for Rangers hammering and out of favour since Sam Winnall (loan) - JURY OUT but has barely got a chance since joining

I'm sorry, but what? I can only assume that you're on anti-depressants or something but really there's no excuse for the rainbows you're vomiting in that post. The entire team (Hayes excepted) was crap from start to finish. OK, so Tansey got on the score sheet with a well taken penalty and he had a better than average game but I'm afraid a better than average game is just not good enough. Our team as a whole, is just not good enough. The fact that we have to solely rely on Hayes is nothing short of a joke. am i on anti depresants or are you on depressants because all you ever seem to post is about how bad we are. im as unhappy with the result as anyone but for 64 minutes we were better our whole team than hibs and we realy should have won not winning was a huge disapointment for everyone but im looking at it from the point of view that we were 100 times better than we were on wednesday and we certainly got a response from the player the main difference for me was that hibs had 2 clinical finishers in their side who took their chances when they came to them.

Having JT is brilliant............if we can afford it. I don't think we can. Think Grant would have been more than useful this season. Seen him play three times and he has been outstanding. I think we are entitled to dwell on his departure. No problem when guys who have served us really well are allowed to move on (with dignity) because someone better has come on the scene. This is not the case. Cheers.

Well i'm as fecked off as anybody, really am. It was as posted above, a better performance than wednesday, purely because Hibs didnt press us like saints did which gave us more time to think about playing football. However... The starting line up was pleasing as it was great to see wee jonny back playing, but Shinnie left midfield??? that just looked like a wee boy lost, he did not have much of a clue as to what he was supposed to do! But really what shocked me as to why that donkey Tade got a start yet again, what the feck does TB think he is doing? and he wants to sign him for next season!!...... feck me TB continually goes on about taking chances, he signed the damn players,he and MM take the training! TB its YOUR responsilbility! Meekings let us down today, passing was pysh, his fault for 3rd goal, got booked (again) A lot of these players are just not mediocre SPL quality they are worse than that. Oh... thought he pitch was terrible, ball bobbled all over the place.

The reason why we have such young inexperienced player playing in these positions is down to Butcher. For example, whilst I'm not certain he would have started every game but, Grant Munro was allowed to leave and has been outstanding for County this season. Even being suggested he could win First Division POY. Appreciate it's not the same standard but there is little difference from the bottom of the SPL and top of the first for me. How good would it have been for these young kids to play with a real solid pro like Grant? Also don't buy the finance part either. TB could have signed cheap back up goalie and used the money being paid to JT (big money by our standards) on someone who could play every week. Was a replacement for Ryan Easson high on your list of priorities? No, not on mine either. There have been some really strange decisions made by TB and they were his alone.

tansey- his long range passing is top class played the diagonal ball to hayes superbly dont think 1 missed and his pen was quality hayes- welcome back what an outlet he is golobart- the usual the man is a hero and as a man of my word i gave the referee an excellent. i said the day we get a penalty will be the day i give it. couldnt realy fault the referee either good performance from baldy

Someone give tm4tj a hug!

Sums up our season for me. For 64 minutes we were excellent. We got our penalty which tbh for me is a pain in the arse because it means I have to change my signature and it didn't come to anything but it was great to see we have such a competent penalty taker. For 64 minutes everyone from back to front( bar graeme shinnie who looked a stranger in the wide left position) we're superb but as soon as they got their first goal we crumbled. It was a horrible way to lose but that sums Up this season but overall it was a much better performance than the st Johnstone game and some of the football we played was sintilating and we really deserved to win

Above Hibs and only two points below Aberdeen (win the game after the split and we're above them - not easy but far from impossible). Like to compare transfer budgets with those two? Also, clear of relegation, with Dunfermline almost certainly having a bigger budget. Of course you could point out that St Mirren have done well. In fact, what we did last season. If they don't manage to do the same next season, however, would it be fair of the Buddies to sack their manager? I think that would be very harsh of them, so naturally, it would be very harsh of us.

I despair. That's all.

As for those folk who keep saying "who would we get to replace Butcher? We can't do better than him" - look at St Johnstone who dared to give the untried Owen Coyle a chance (did very well, moved on to better things), replaced him with the novice Derek McInnes (did very well, moved on to better things), then came up with rookie Steve Lomas who seems to be doing all right... ...of course the risk is that for every Derek Adams (taking County to the SPL) there is a Scott Leitch (who took County to the second division). But Butcher increasingly resembles an old dog who can't learn new tricks. His 'let's get it up 'em' style appears increasingly obsolete in a modern world where the successful coaches are the ones who know how to set a team up.tactically, and who do enough research to know that, if you press our back line high up the pitch, we'll spend 90 minutes punting high balls at our 5'7" striker instead.

Yes he is the man for the job. He deserves at least another season, if we are in same position this time next year or worse off then maybe it would be time for a change.

I would also question the coaching staff. What do the players actually do in training all week? We have a very young team but I don't see many improvements since the start of the season. Those calling for Butcher to go are OTT. We aren't really any worse than any of the teams around us. Even on weeks like this where we are terrible we still only lose games by a single goal. It won't take a big swing in form to change these defeats into wins.

Still seething at today's performance. We did it in August against them and again today. Yes there have been highlights through the season but too few and not consistently enough. I don't think it is too much to expect a win today against a Hibs side that are probably the poorest footballing side in the SPL and if anything were worse today than when they beat us 0-1. I don't think we need a full scale clear out but it will need 3 or 4 new players to be added to the squad. The biggest challenge is how do we change tactically to take the next step forward. I know we are not the worst team in this league but at times we like to show that we could be. A new approach is required soon or the rot will set in. Six games to go for these players to show that they want to be part of the set up next season and for our management team to show they have the ability to actually do it.

Is it true that Butcher wouldn't speak to the media after the game? Presumably he's trying to work out how to explain to the press that this defeat, like all of our defeats, is everyone else's fault but his. And, of course, he'll tell them that he's going to make 42 changes to the starting lineup for next week.

How can you say it was the right team and then say McKay scoring 1 goal all season, and Tade the ever brilliant master of one on one mess ups? Surely they should have been dropped? Also Tansey (woop dee doo he scored a penalty), Foran? Meekings? All of them should never be allowed to play after week after week of poor performances. who would you have played? tansey imo was decent today and didn't think meekings was any worse than the other 3 defenders in the 2nd half. ideally, i would like to see winnall up front but the team created numerous chances - more than enough to win the game.

And i agree wholeheartedly. I dare say i will be singled out and attacked for that, as i often seem to be anytime i inject a large dose of reality. I think maybe my cute little avatar makes me an easy target. Totally agree with this. It's time to wake up and smell the coffee, I hate the term 'happy clappers' as it's good to see the bright side of things, but right now we have no bright side at all. I have no opinions at all as to who could take over which some I think will take this as a redundant statement but BUTCHER NEEDS TO GO! He has and has done for most of THIS season made wrong choice after wrong choice, claiming after each loss he'll make changes and the 'boys are ready for the next game' but has left each time empty handed. I never saw the game today but spoke to my old man who said a penalty (yes a long time coming) and a cross/shot that totally confused the keeper was the only things of worth. Tade and McKay guilty again of one on one disparity and a lacklustre midfield followed by amateur defending cost us the game. Hibs had 3 CHANCES and took those, not 3 shots, 3 chances. Hopeless. Again as always said, thank god for Dunfermline.

Lets be honest.....we still went down in out first half season with Butcher, a situation which was salvageable when he took over. Second season, we went up from a league which is notriously difficult to win. Season three.....we allow Butcher to throw the whole ICT ethos out the windows and we have struggled ALL season, and have regularly played some of the most clueless football i have seen from an ICT team. Thank fook we have had a team who couldnt buy a win at home all season in the league....or we would have been looking at our second relegation under Butcher in three seasons

Two games in a row where we have had the lion's share of possession and couldn't turn it into wins. At this rate we could finish 11th and be firm favourites for relegation next season. Our strikers couldn't light a match! Two 90th minute substitutions! Not for the first time this season I ask what on earth the point of that is. Despite many of the posters on here being tolerant of Terry, my patience has now worn thin. He clearly talks the talk, but as he has shown at other clubs before, he doesn't walk the walk. His tactics have been suspect all season. We have massively regressed this season. We can't use the injuries excuse any longer - all clubs get injuries. Many other clubs would have binned Terry by now. In the recent poll about how satisfied people are with him, I voted 'fairly dissatisfied'. I'd now change it to 'very dissatisfied'. I fear the man is a 'chancer', an opinion I felt right from day one, but fought hard to repel for over two seasons, but now I think I was right all along.

We should spend the money on something for the future. I suggest a solid gold statue of Ross Tokely.

Aye right. If we had no injuries we would still be as poor. I don't think so. The football has been like that because we have been without many of our first choice players for major parts of the season. It does not make for pretty viewing, but it has just been enough to keep our heads above water. SPL football for another season, whether we finished 5th 6th 7th or 10th, it matters not apart from the extra cash for every place.