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What is it worth - a great day out fer the faithful - a place in the history books - prestige and potential attraction of more fans.

Can I suggest everyone focuses on getting out the maximum support for the Dundee United game and throwing themselves 110% behind the club and team.

As much as I like big Dunc I think we need someone who's preferably got a good amount of 1st team coaching experience and also more importantly has the character and confidence to tell JH when he may be in the wrong. I'm not sure DS is quite that character.

Aaaaagh! Terrible. Seems a bit patronising to me in a sort of 'I'm an incomer to this quaint place' sort of stylee.

For a start, NaughtyBob - Being from Edinburgh but having the sense and intelligence to not support either of their teams or the OF, I know plenty of Hibs fans who loved the appointment of Hughes at the time and were quite happy when things were going well. Though as soon as they hit a bad patch he became useless. This is nothing new for Hibs fans. Collins was the messiah when they had an 11 (I think) game undefeated run at the start of the season and were touting them, genuinely, as league challengers. Eventually the bubble burst and Collins somehow turned into a useless arrogant bully who belittled his players and fell out with the board etc. The only manager that Hibs fans think was any good is Mowbray. Not even McCleish who signed legends like Sauzee and Latapy as well as bringing in stars like Zitelli who was formerly part of a very good Auxerre team. He finished 3rd but apparently he was a manager who was just a Judas who overspent and nearly bankrupt the club (note this is not the managers fault. He works to a budget set by his superiors.) Hibs fans as a whole tend to be a little over ambitious as to their clubs potential and sadly some ICT fans have left their head in the same cloud and expect resounding success now we've had a good run. As for those who big up Butcher at Motherwell. Yes he turned it round there but people conveniently forget the only reason Motherwell weren't relegated, which would probably have killed them at the time, was because Falkirk who won the 1st division did not have a compliant stadium due to the crazy self preservation criteria of the premier league. Before Butcher left the teams performances were starting to wane. Many agree on this. However confidence was high and there was a winning habit. However we've faced a few teams in a very short space of time and a fair whack of them (St Mirren, Aberdeen and Celtic) were either on a good run or going to be very hard to beat anyway. The short spaces between games and the difficulty of them has brought the team to a halt abruptly. Confidence was already hit when the team lost their manager as they were all working together. Hughes is very much an outside man and is not yet part of the gang. Add to the tiredness, most of this team hasn't changed all season and it's not surprising there has been a recent dip in results. Though in periods the team has played quite well. They outplayed Celtic. Did well in the 2nd half against Aberdeen and Hearts. Also it seems expected that the team would just keep scoring and keep not conceding. It's like no one expected a dry patch, or the fact that our defence are not world class and may leak a few goals at some periods. I'm still fairly optimistic we can have a successful season with a potential final appearance (We've had enough semi finals now, lets get over the hurdle this time) and top 6 finish. That for me would represent success. I'd prefer a European spot, just for a chance to have a go at it. However optimism now for Hughes to do anything, even if he wasn't 1st choice is being looked at with smug dismissive "rose tinted spectacle" type remarks and pessimism is therefore the only course of realism. Great drinking company you lot must be. Or maybe we got really lucky with butcher and no matter who we chose they wouldn't live up to his recent success. He had been manager for near 5 years which in football is a very long time at 1 club. And as for Hartley.... look at him. he's a bloody hobo. I'm not too upset he didn't get the job. At least Hughes is more likely to stick around nowadays if approached. Young managers are 1st choice for English lower league teams. McInnes, Coyle, Davies, etc. Maybe Hughes has had his fingers burnt and would only leave for a very good offer. Or Hibs again. Hibs daft so he is.

Would you stop going because of a name change ? I doubt it. Plenty did stop going because of the MERGER, and the identity crisis many - like yourself - hold onto keeps those wounds well and truly open. I had a colleague, a Thistle fan of over 30yrs, "I aint supporting a team with the word Caledonian in it", he said, and who to this day watches Clach instead. Want more people thru the gates imho you're going to have to eliminate the barriers that restrict that desire, and your identity is one big barrier. Many years ago, John Boyle proposed a merger between Motherwell, Accies and Airdrie. Had he called it MotherwellOniansAcademical and played in claret/amber/red/white no one would have entertained it. Had he called it Buckfast Utd and played in Blue n Yellow for example ...... it just may have stood a chance. How do you know 'plenty did stop going because of the merger' ? By the end of our Highland League days the combined hard core of Thistle and Caley fans was circa 500 and while a number of those shunned the merged club, the vast majority followed ICT. Whatever the reason for our somewhat disappointing crowds it's not the name which has a unique stamp compared to the ubiquitous City or United and reflects over 250 years of combined heritage nor is it the fact that a handful of bitter and vocal anti merger brigade stay away and shout loudly about doing so. For goodness sake that was two decades ago and the initial 150 or so refuseniks are outnumbered ten to one by fans who if the think of Kingsmills or Telford Street at all, think of houses or a retail park,

Nah surely the merger caused this.

I blame John Hughes.

With 19 games gone it is time for a half term report: 1) Sitting 4th in the SPFL 2) 8 pts advantage and a game in hand for the top 6 places 3) Have the top scorer in the SPFL 4) 16 pts more than County 5) Nearly double the points amassed by County 6) League Cup Semi-Final place 7) A number of good young players coming through the U20 set up (and some local) 8) A good number of the squad signed up to more than 12 month deals 9) A current squad of players that provide a sound foundation to build upon going forward 10) The club is operating on a solid financial basis Overall rating: B Challenges: Repeating the same level of performance over the second half of the season. All in all though it is maybe not as bad as many of us currently feel it is and with a solid foundation to work on there is still every chance of this being a very good season :-) All the best to all for 2014

I never really got fishing either. "here's my opinion" "I disagree" "ha ha, it wasn't really my opinion but you responded in a forum designed for conversations with different opinions"

Not sure Prof. Stephen Hawking would accept it. Good shout though.

Can't agree with that. It is after all only a handful of players from the 50s and 60s who are talked about as "greats". The 3 exceptional players Dougal mentions undoubtedly bear comparison to the likes of Ronaldo and Messi in the modern game but bear in mind we are not comparing like with like as the nature of the game and the level of media exposure is so different now. Eusebio, Puskas and Pele played in a much harder era. Pitches were much more uneven and referees did not afford the kind of protection flair players receive these days. Flair players were targets for the defensive hard men who not only tackled hard but who routinely kicked and dead-legged opponents off the ball. They got away with that because there were few games being televised and even when they were, there might only be one or two cameras following the ball. It was only exceptional players with a mental and/or physical toughness to go with exceptional ball skills that came through these handicaps to shine. Remember also that the limited TV coverage of matches means that only a fraction of what these players did on the park is recorded and therefore it sometimes gives the impression that their fame is based on just 2 or 3 outstanding performances. Make no mistake, the 3 players Dougal identifies were exceptional players in their day and would have been exceptional players in any era.

I agree Huisdean. And if Hughes does, he should be praised. Meanwhile, with results going against him, he has to be subject to criticism, rather than assuming he can do nothing about it. Of course he can. That's exactly his job. Hughes doesn't deserve to be pilloried but nor do the results deserve overlooking. There's plenty of time to be either hero or villain come the end of the year. But we shouldn't be blind to bad results.

One of the greats from a great era you wonder how much the likes of Eusabio, Puskas and Pele would be worth nowadays if they were playing RIP Dougal

The song isn't to everyones taste but before this forum pushes another fan out the door, just wanted to say well done for trying and I hope your wearing your ICT hat in this cold weather whilst doing your rounds in the mobile library van.

Doubt it would be as much as £500k. From some old figures I have the winners used to get in the region of £110k prize money, a television fee of about £100k and 37.5% of the gate (after VAT...so nearer 30% in reality). Those are from the CIS sponsored the competition and it wouldn't surprise me at all if it's less now there's no commercial sponsor. You'd need a crowd of over 60k to take us anywhere close to £500k based on the above figures. Should also be noted the the league cup only pays prize money on elimination and not per round as the Scottish Cup does (assuming it's not changed). This means that there's no payment for semi final and then another payment for reaching final.

Butcher won 1 game in 9 last year as CapitalCaley pointed out. The previous year he won 1 game in 10 at one point. He was by no means a saviour and Hibs will find that out too. Hughes won't be as bad as people think, despite our run of bad results. We are 7 points from second with a game in hand and still in all the cups. If we get knocked out of those and drop to the bottom six then bring on the negativity, but truth is we are still in a rosy position and unless it's scuppered folk need to calm the FECK down. Hughes promoted Falkirk and kept them there for four years and got to the Scottish Cup final. He guided Hibs to Europe and fourth in the SPL, it was a hostile fan reaction that finally axed him there following bad results. We tolerated horrendous form under Butcher and look what we got as a reward in the end! I for one would be delighted if he could replicate the results he achieved at either Falkirk or Hibs. BELIEVE!!!

Certainly not from Motherwell fans - and who else is there ? He did a great job at FP, kept us in business and took us to a League Cup Final for the 1st time in 50yrs. There were a few Brentford fans on.

No. 2. I think if Clach had been involved in the creation of the club, it's likely that 'Inverness City' or 'Inverness United' would have been the chosen moniker. Inverness City now exist as a Junior outfit. Inverness United is often used for youth teams from the city when involved in youth tournaments like the Aberdeen football festival or indeed abroad. I think Charlie Christie's been involved with the latter. I can't remember, now, how the name was chosen. I think it was likely a compromise between the two clubs involved in the merger. Inverness was still officially (and considered by outsiders) a town back in 1994. I don't think a name-change is ever likely. We've established ourselves on the ICT name and changing it would make us look very unsure of our identity and fuel the fire of the central belters who see us as some sort of artificial franchise. Although this should be confined to the hackneyed 'merge' thread, I can't help but feel vexed that the Highlands were ignored so long. It resulted in us 'having' to merge to have any recognition in Scottish football. The recent (20 years) change in attitude has resulted in North clubs finally being accepted into Scottish football's National leagues. The impetus has continued with the introduction of a pyramid system that allows teams like Clach, for example, or Huntly, Cove, Brora et al. into the formerly exclusive system. It's a shame that the previously closed-minds of the blazers running the Scottish League didn't sooner implement the fairer system of cream-rising-to-the-top on merit. Who knows, all 3 Inverness clubs could have been in the now SPFL eventually! I would have loved to witness Inverness Thistle, (yes, my former club of choice) competing in the SPFL, even against 'the likes' of Montrose. But, I doubt either Thistle or Caley, on their own, would have achieved the level we currently enjoy!

From the outside looking in ------- You may metaphorically have 5 teams for football fans of Inverness to follow but what you don't have is a mass exodus - tens of buses - leaving the city every Saturday, so you still have 60 odd thousand potential customers out there. So, what if anything, are the Club doing to attract them ? Our hardcore support isn't much more than your own. However, there's probably more folk leave Motherwell to watch the Ugly sisters than go to FP, and that from a town of less than 30,000 souls is a very bad statistic. You may be interested to know that Inverness is the most unpopular away game --- according to a recent survey of Motherwell fans, and it's not the long journey that accounts for this. The location of the stadium in relation to bars, the Away stand, the toilets/pie stalls provision, getting to the ground, the muck in and around, and top of the Dislike List ....... heavy handed OB/Stewards. I see as the major elements for you to address:- (1.) Out of town Stadiums. May work in the States, but in this case you've disenfranchised your core and potential support, and made attendance an unattractive proposition for away fans. I live apprx 40miles away and I hate going to Longman. If I drive, i cannae get parked. If I take the train its a whoor of a walk out and back. There is effall to do in and around the stadium unless you are a Suit. (2.) Your identity. Inverness Caledonian Thistle FC. Ditch the drivvel and call yourselves Inverness United, and change your Caley dominated with a hint of Thistle appearance. Way too many possible/potential fans alienated by this. You're neither, time to move on and ditch the bitterness. (3.) Is one all Scottish Clubs should do something about. In October, I followed Edinburgh to Perpignan for their Heineken Cup tie. The Stade Amei Gerale wasn't overly big or palatial - 10,000 covered plastic bucket seats - but we arrived over 2hrs before kick-off, to enjoy a meal in one of the many stadium restaurants located under the main stand. I reckon there were at least 4,000 fans milling in and around the stadium 2hrs before kick-off. There were a selection of indoor/outdoor bars, eateries, barbeques to choose from. There were kids, and family entertainment zones, all doing a roaring trade. There was a pipe band, a brass band, and a ska band entertaining people on the concrete concourses. All these revenue streams bringing profit to the Club ...... and attracting fans with a sense of belonging. All in all, it was a far better day out than going to any Scottish football match. Shoot away

But not as pish as spending £47 on a train, £25 on a ticket, then seeing your team humped 4-0 or such like. Think positive!

At least British Transport Police will have an easier day Dougal

I enjoyed it but I would prefer a song like ring of fire or another "real" song as the clubs song!

Gosh Dougal, do you think there may be an issue regarding the merger ?

Best leave it be hind and stop fawning over the troll.

Nah surely the merger caused this. Both wrong - it was Jim Goodwin.

So much negativity amongst some posters on this and the calls for Hughes to go/be sacked are just plain ridiculous. The team that is currently playing is more or less the team that was playing when Butcher was here. The simple truth is that we were punching above our weight and now some players have hit a sticky patch, we are struggling a bit. I don't think we have a strong bench but really do think we need to change the team a bit as the same players played all the games over the festive season and some probably do need a little break to try and recharge the batteries. I don't think we are too far away from where we were and had we scored first against County, I am positive that we would have gone onto win. By the way, for those against Hughes, no matter what he does, it was Billy McKay who missed the sitter against County, not John Hughes.

If this is true it will surely be our downfall. Shearer has already stated he does not want the job.

It's not like Motherwell can do much else. They think the game will go ahead but rather than have ICT fans get all the way to Glasgow and find the game is off they are going to check things out as early as they can tomorrow. Fair play to them I reckon.

Eagle is a co-dependent :lol:

Here is an updated psychological perspective - many evidently did not take the time to read or consider my previously posted Aftermath of a Narcissist post. ICT had become Terry Butcher - he was in control of EVERYTHING. He had his co-dependents entrenched and wholly loyal to his cause. He manipulated others and bullied if necessitated. To be fair he was and is an impressive and characteristic individual and has learned a lot from the psychology that he has trained and invested in. I suspect that many of the players - especially many who feel indebted to TB - are still grieving. This was never going to be the case of a new manager coming in all around the club trying to impress and results being positive. Irrespective of who got the job they were in fer a very, very difficult initiation. I am informed that one of TB's main "beefs" was that he recognised that the squad was threadbare and wanted more funds which were never going to be available. He is adept enuff at seeing that the writing was on the wall and fecked off to Embra before he was the one that looked like a failure. The promises of Leith added to the lure. And from my perspective - what has Hughes changed since he arrived - the answer is feckin nothing - becos that would have totally upset the remaining co-dependents and many of the blinded fans on this forum. He is still playing the Butcher system and the TB selection, even down to the subs. He has really kept a back seat as he does not want to make waves. We had INCREDIBLE L.U.C.K in avoiding injuries and suspensions and we were always going to struggle when we did. Well that may well be Yogi's saving grace. I reckon that if we make the league Cup final and a top six finish that will be a success. Lets blood some of the youngsters instead of playing the TB/Vaseline selections from Down Saff. Hughes would not have been my first choice but I can see the logic and this forum is not helping in feeding the negativity and the anger - which again psychologically - is more about the loss of a Judas and a false hope that he had cleverly instilled rather than the arrival of a journeyman, an honest man and somebody who would die for a cause. This is ICfeckinT not Real Madrid.

Eagle. Are you Dougal in disguize?

It's been a poor start in terms of results and performances under Yogi but no need to panic. RIG, making comparisons to other managers starts is all very well but there are different circumstances every time. Perhaps we should have re-signed Baltacha due to his 13 points from 6 games!? Many folk were unhappy with the appointment. Fair enough. Most folk that were unhappy decided to set aside their disagreement with the appointment to give him the benefit of the doubt. However some of the doubters seem to be taking great satisfaction in the poor start as if to say 'we told you so'. It's 6 games in FFS. Hard fought draws at Midden, and Partick as well as a very good performance at Hearts. Three defeats at home, one of them narrowly defeated by Celtic when I think we deserved something and a narrow defeat to Aberdeen. The only match I was entirely dissatisfied with was the County match. Of course, i'm looking at it from a happy clappy style perspective. The pessismist would point out the disastrous start against Aberdeen and say we should have beaten Midden and Partick. However, we have drawn many times at the Midden. Last January we lost 2-1 (or maybe 2-0) in a midweek game. One of the worst performances of the season. Partick beat us at home this season and should have got something from the Celtic game. Speaking of the Midden game, Yogi had been in the door only a few days. He did not take the team that day. He let Shearer pick the team and Yogi sat in the stand to observe. It wasn't a great performance but it can't be attributed to Yogi. Last January and February was a horrible period for ICT. The performances in most games were similar to the performance against County the other day. Our players seem to take these bizarre dips in confidence / form. I genuinly believe that it is not the fault of Yogi, however it is now his priority to sort it out - asap. I noticed that before Yogi was appointed, although we were still getting results, we were starting to play more sluggish football and not on top form. We were excellent against Hibs in Mo's last game in the dug out. However there were games where we were poor. The 4-0 defeat in Perth, the 2-1 defeat at home to Partick, the half of football against County that was abandoned - wasn't great to watch and was generally poor. First half against Morton was awful for example. The victory against St Johnstone in Inverness - great result but overall not a great performance. Can't complain at the time but you can compare it to recent performances. I don't think it was any worse than say the performance against Celtic or the second half against Aberdeen and Hearts. Also, despite the horrific conditions I thought in the 2nd half the lads showed great confidence and skill when defeating Hearts. Could have and should have been more. Yogi said he was hoping his appointment would be a smooth transition and he would hope that everyone would feel like it was business as usual. If you look at the team line ups, he has kept the same team, only changing the starting XI when injuries dictate. Raven was out injured for quite a while before coming back onto the bench against Hibs. He has continued to be on the bench. The back four has remained unchanged. This was the same back 4 that beat Hibs, St Johnstone, Morton, Killie etc and got us quite a few clean sheets. The team are set up in the same way as Butcher would have set them up. I'm told that training is very similar to the way it was under Mo and Terry. I'm also reliably informed that the players like him and look up to him so it's not like he has lost the dressing room. So what has gone wrong!? Training is similar, the line ups are similar, and he has the dressing room. I would have thought that business as usual would have then reflected on to the park. I do believe cracks were showing before he arrived. We have a small squad and some of the performances of late have looked like some of them are tired. He's kept faith with the same back 4 that had won us many clean sheets. Business as usual for sure, but I do believe this was a mistake. The coaching staff know the team better than he does. He's still learning their strengths and weakness. I really hope that the coaching staff have convinced him / can convince him that we need Raven back at right back. I did hope that after Ravens substitute performance against the Dons he would have seen this as well. Butcher made mistakes. Every manager does and I do believe that Yogi has made a mistake in not starting Raven. Plenty of attack comes from him at RB and Shinnie is better at LB. After the Aberdeen game I believe Raven should have found his place back into the team for the Partick / Celtic / County games. Perhaps with his drive and build up play from the right hand side we would have scored against Partick and Celtic. Perhaps we wouldn't have conceded against County. All speculation on my part of course and Raven is just one player. Some of the players look tired (yet i'm led to believe they are not being overtrained). Therefore, it's time for Yogi to make changes. Starting with Motherwell on Saturday. Raven MUST come in. I hope the coaching staff can see that as well, as they have seen Raven play that position more than Yogi has. Yogi is a big fan of the youth so hopefully we see Polwarth and Christie feature more regularly soon. I stand by my very positive comments at his appointment. I understand why certain folk have reservations, but I do believe it's too early to write him off. Motherwell is one of the toughest places to go to, and we have a poor record there. Not the best game for a manager that is getting flack from fans. However I think some of the flack and comments are far too harsh. Yogis priority now is to stop the rot. I don't believe he is at fault for the rot, but he will need to stop the rot as soon as possible. This is his short term mission. I'm sure we all hope he succeeds.

Plenty fans stayed away under Butcher when we were `slipping` UP the league !!

What gingerjaggy says is fair. The season is still far from over and with everything to play for. We will be fighting the next few games in the face of adversity, it could just be the catalyst we need to kick start our season. No Foran, no Draper etc. On the back of the derby you could see how gutted some of the lads were. These things sometimes have a funny way of helping players raise their game...flip side is we could get gubbed, most of us will still be there regardless. Like it or not, want Hughes or not we just have to ride the hard times as fans and support the players out there on the pitch. Its not happy clapping and its not pulling wool over eyes...its support.

I have yet to see us under yogis stewardship apart from the celtic game on tv. Im sure everyone else is in a better position to comment but i think to many people are looking for an excuse to complain. Maybe it is not good to watch atm but these players started off like a train on fire so there is no reason to suggest we cant return to that. John Hughes is still finding out about the club and the squad and im afraid that if people want him out because of this it wont happen. What im disappointed in is Duncan shearer and Scott Kellacher who took control after butcher and kept us winning and playing pretty well. Since hughes has come in its gone down hill surely big dun and Scott would have filled him in like williams isnt a CM. maybe it is good we are having our bad patch now still plenty of time to get back into form and go up the table again instead of looking over our shoulders