Contracts (Merged)

[stevico1]

No, as an ICT fan I want Tullochs to construct a new weatherproof stadium with sliding roof and to raid Serie A, Bundesliga, Premiership and La Liga for the best players but it's not going to happen. It is what it is.

true and you are what you are

[PullMyFinger]

Maybe Black was offered a contract, maybe he wasn't.....I don't know. All I do know is that we have the player saying in the press that the club haven't talked to him which is conveniently followed by a press articles and interviews from the club which seem to be trying to make a big deal of the fact that they have talked to him.

Dare I suggest that they may both be right?

Scenario

Club talks to agent and offers deal, agent wants a bigger piece of the pie and doesn't let player know about the offer.

Club believes that an agent will talk to the player and player hasn't heard from the club.

Pure speculation but there's a lot of that about at the moment.

true and you are what you are

No I'm not.

[stevico1]

Maybe Black was offered a contract, maybe he wasn't.....I don't know. All I do know is that we have the player saying in the press that the club haven't talked to him which is conveniently followed by a press articles and interviews from the club which seem to be trying to make a big deal of the fact that they have talked to him.

Dare I suggest that they may both be right?

Scenario

Club talks to agent and offers deal, agent wants a bigger piece of the pie and doesn't let player know about the offer.

Club believes that an agent will talk to the player and player hasn't heard from the club.

Pure speculation but there's a lot of that about at the moment.

true and you are what you are

No I'm not.

we all are mate

[gillian black]

I'll say this again.

Perhaps the recent quotes from Ian Black refer to the fact that the club have not returned to him with an improved offer, rather than not having offered him one at all.

No lies. No defamation. No histrionics. Just a simple explanation for what was, prior to Grassa's interview this week, a confusing scenario.

I have to wonder, given the virulence with which Caley D and stevico are pursuing this matter; do you know for a fact that Ian Black was not offered a contract at the start of the season?

Yes

[PullMyFinger]

I'll say this again.

Perhaps the recent quotes from Ian Black refer to the fact that the club have not returned to him with an improved offer, rather than not having offered him one at all.

No lies. No defamation. No histrionics. Just a simple explanation for what was, prior to Grassa's interview this week, a confusing scenario.

I have to wonder, given the virulence with which Caley D and stevico are pursuing this matter; do you know for a fact that Ian Black was not offered a contract at the start of the season?

Yes

How so? Are you his shadow?

[stevico1]

I'll say this again.

Perhaps the recent quotes from Ian Black refer to the fact that the club have not returned to him with an improved offer, rather than not having offered him one at all.

No lies. No defamation. No histrionics. Just a simple explanation for what was, prior to Grassa's interview this week, a confusing scenario.

I have to wonder, given the virulence with which Caley D and stevico are pursuing this matter; do you know for a fact that Ian Black was not offered a contract at the start of the season?

Yes

How so? Are you his shadow?

I would put that back and ask with the way you are defending it do you have any proof that he was offered a new contract at the start of the season

[dead_ball_specialist]

Fraser is lucky to be a full-time professional footballer AT ALL. The club would be insane to give him a bumper contract. There are plenty of higher quality goalkeepers in the SFL who could replace him.

[gillian black]

Alex,

1. I've already explained twice in the past when you've used the "it's an emolument not a salary" argument that they amount to the same thing. Surely I don't need to do so a third time?

2. You are correct, Charles Bannerman has as good as called Ian Black a liar for saying that he had not (at the time) been approached by the club. Quite a bold, if not somewhat compromising, position for him to have placed himself in. Other journalist might have just reported on the content of the interview without making such sweeping conclusions.

3. Given the fact that most, if not all, clubs are largely subsidised by "non-footballing" income streams I don't think that any player (whether obtained for free or not) could be said to have turned a profit where little or no selling fee is received on their departure.

4. We're also only 5 points from the bottom of the table...so as I said, just!!!

By definition "emolument" implies Grassa has to work damn hard for it, could it possibly be travelling expenses and accomodation while on company business? I don't know. Very few know and why should we! ;)

Someone is lying, ask yourself who will still be here in a couple of seasons and is more likely to lose face if they lied. :018:

What non-footballing income streams do we have? A car boot sale? :thumb04:

Glass half empty here too.

Blackie is quoted in the P & J today as saying he has had one offer, and through my source, it has been told to me the offer was made only weeks ago and this was at BREWS insistance, the story goes, they were concentrating on Cowie, thought they had plenty of time to tie up the others, F***** Joke, Grassa at his best. So who was it telling the Porkies, I can tell you honestly, and I believe my mate, Blackie was not lying when he gave his statement, THE CLUB HAD NOT APPROACHED HIM, the agent was coming up, only to be cancelled, because Grassa was away on his HOLS, another F***** Jke, but is this not the story of or lives, he is stating today, he wants to stay, does anyone know if Grassa flew to Tenerife today, that would be par for the course, again the story of our lives.

[Council Juice]

Blackie is quoted in the P & J today as saying he has had one offer, and through my source, it has been told to me the offer was made only weeks ago and this was at BREWS insistance, the story goes, they were concentrating on Cowie, thought they had plenty of time to tie up the others, F***** Joke, Grassa at his best. So who was it telling the Porkies, I can tell you honestly, and I believe my mate, Blackie was not lying when he gave his statement, THE CLUB HAD NOT APPROACHED HIM, the agent was coming up, only to be cancelled, because Grassa was away on his HOLS, another F***** Jke, but is this not the story of or lives, he is stating today, he wants to stay, does anyone know if Grassa flew to Tenerife today, that would be par for the course, again the story of our lives.

Sorry If it means not getting Fraser or even Cowie, tied up on a new deal, I'd be happy if we could get Black signed up.

I'd rather Black gets the wage increase his form and importance to the team deserves than sign up Fraser who could be readily repaced.

And if losing Fraser also meant we could keep Cowie. Then all the better. But the club should look at what they can afford and make Black the priority.

From what i hear he loves the area. So give him the deal that he deserves and gives him the security he would want.

Edited December 6, 2008 by iamthecaptain1

[PullMyFinger]

I would put that back and ask with the way you are defending it do you have any proof that he was offered a new contract at the start of the season

Proof is what is lacking, so both stories have no substance. Maybe this thread should be moved to the rumour mill?

[Council Juice]

I would put that back and ask with the way you are defending it do you have any proof that he was offered a new contract at the start of the season

Proof is what is lacking, so both stories have no substance. Maybe this thread should be moved to the rumour mill?

Well the topic is kinda based on a story from a statement released by the club wich on BBC sport. Therefore its not a rumour but speculation of a published story. Although to slander anyone (ie Grassa) at this stage is something we have been kindly asked by board admin (ie Scotty) not to do. Unless he (Grassa) is shown to be incompetent then we are not supposed to say otherwise. Although technically we could say the inactivity makes him look totally incompetent. Which it does.

And if a DoF was to take a holiday mid season it reeks of non professionalism. What would we say if a manager or player did likewise.

[stevico1]

I would put that back and ask with the way you are defending it do you have any proof that he was offered a new contract at the start of the season

Proof is what is lacking, so both stories have no substance. Maybe this thread should be moved to the rumour mill?

Yes think you are right doesnt seem to be going anywhere

[Council Juice]

Well it seems on BBC sport Grassa offered Black a contract with Fraser Munro and Cowie in the summer.

In the P&J however black seems t say otherwise.

Either way lets get him signed up pronto please.

[PullMyFinger]

Well it seems on BBC sport Grassa offered Black a contract with Fraser Munro and Cowie in the summer.

In the P&J however black seems t say otherwise.

Either way lets get him signed up pronto please.

Agreed, time to draw a line in the sand.

[Scotty]

And if a DoF was to take a holiday mid season it reeks of non professionalism. What would we say if a manager or player did likewise.

considering Robbo mentioned on Sportsound that "I have Graeme Bennett here with me now" (just before the team ignored him and went to Ibrox), I think the suggestion that he is in Tenerife may be erroneous.

[Reliably_Informed]

Here's a thought for those talking about what finances the club may or may not have available.

When Marius Niculae was sold it was apparently due to the fact that we could not afford his wages.

We then signed Barrowman as a replacement and are paying him a wage which isn't a kick in the butt off what Marius Niculae was getting.

It's this kind of action that would suggest that money/wages only really becomes a huge issue when the club want to make it one. It also makes me wonder just how savvy those making these decisions are when they value Barrowman in the same league as Niculae!!!

What are the forces that are driving these decisions, and can people really say they are in the best interests of ICT?

[PullMyFinger]

Here's a thought for those talking about what finances the club may or may not have available.

When Marius Niculae was sold it was apparently due to the fact that we could not afford his wages.

We then signed Barrowman as a replacement and are paying him a wage which isn't a kick in the butt off what Marius Niculae was getting.

It's this kind of action that would suggest that money/wages only really becomes a huge issue when the club want to make it one. It also makes me wonder just how savvy those making these decisions are when they value Barrowman in the same league as Niculae!!!

What are the forces that are driving these decisions, and can people really say they are in the best interests of ICT?

I thought you were reliably informed, why don't you tell us?

[CaleyD]

I think they just did!!!

[PullMyFinger]

Here's a thought for those talking about what finances the club may or may not have available.

When Marius Niculae was sold it was apparently due to the fact that we could not afford his wages.

We then signed Barrowman as a replacement and are paying him a wage which isn't a kick in the butt off what Marius Niculae was getting.

It's this kind of action that would suggest that money/wages only really becomes a huge issue when the club want to make it one. It also makes me wonder just how savvy those making these decisions are when they value Barrowman in the same league as Niculae!!!

What are the forces that are driving these decisions, and can people really say they are in the best interests of ICT?

Didn't tell me anything.

[CaleyD]

I think your more intelligent than that 5thStand

[PullMyFinger]

I think your more intelligent than that 5thStand :thumb04:

I hope you're not grooming me.

[CaleyD]

Think you've been watching too much Eastenders

[PullMyFinger]

Think you've been watching too much Eastenders

:thumb04:

[gillian black]

I would put that back and ask with the way you are defending it do you have any proof that he was offered a new contract at the start of the season

Proof is what is lacking, so both stories have no substance. Maybe this thread should be moved to the rumour mill?

Well the topic is kinda based on a story from a statement released by the club wich on BBC sport. Therefore its not a rumour but speculation of a published story. Although to slander anyone (ie Grassa) at this stage is something we have been kindly asked by board admin (ie Scotty) not to do. Unless he (Grassa) is shown to be incompetent then we are not supposed to say otherwise. Although technically we could say the inactivity makes him look totally incompetent. Which it does.

And if a DoF was to take a holiday mid season it reeks of non professionalism. What would we say if a manager or player did likewise.

I was being sarcastic when I said Tenerife, but I was not when I said he was away on holisay, the meeting was cancelled because he was away on holiday, dont we have a right to an answer, why dont we just pop down the road, make an appointment with Grassa and ask him, or cant we do a copy or remake of A FEW GOOD MEN, me being Tom Cruise and get our side kicks to check the airline flight tickets, this would be all the proof we need, if anyone can tell me where to go and get the proof, I will do it personally and you are spot on IT DOES REEK OF NON PROFESSIONLISM. All jokes aside, as this is not really funny, we are bad at the moment, so any improvement would be welcome, and I might smile a bit more, if I knew Blackie was tied up for the next 4 years (to us), it would be a start, he has said he wants to stay, so why are we not getting our a**** in gear?

[DALNEIGHCALEY]

Gillian what relation are you to Ian ?