Drugs Deaths...whats the answer?

[Johnboy]

Aparently in Glasgow , Dealers are now starting to fill up there drugs with Anthrax

Yeah....

Drug dealers are an evil enough blight on our society as it is, but anyone found guilty of doing something like that should be locked up for the rest of their lives.

[Yngwie]

"Drug deaths......what's the answer?"

Don't take drugs? It's worked for me anyway.

Anyway, a ban on "legal highs" has come into force today. What effect will that have? No doubt these products will be just as available as before, but will the price go up because they are now illegal? Will people who use them just upgrade to the proper stuff? They might as well, surely.

[dougiedanger]

Fair enough I suppose, but then you shouldn't go crawling to government-funded doctors and hospitals for help when it all goes t**s up. The selfishness of any addict leads them to convince themselves that what they do is up to them, and as you say, doesnt "harm anyone else." What about their family, friends, the ones who do all the worrying and grieving and who are left to pick up the pieces of their lives?

I don't want the government worrying about my relationships with my family, friends or anyone else. Plenty of families are split up due to factors that aren't controlled by the state - do you want the government to legislate against everything that could cause a family breakdown? That's the logical conclusion of your argument. The fact is that the prohibition of drugs causes the problems of impoverished addicts, impure drugs and crime. If drugs were legal then the government would also presumably collect taxes on their sale which would contribute to paying for hospitals to treat people.

So people should take drugs to boost government coffers to pay for treatment of drug addicts? FFS. :(

[ictchris]

Fair enough I suppose, but then you shouldn't go crawling to government-funded doctors and hospitals for help when it all goes t**s up. The selfishness of any addict leads them to convince themselves that what they do is up to them, and as you say, doesnt "harm anyone else." What about their family, friends, the ones who do all the worrying and grieving and who are left to pick up the pieces of their lives?

I don't want the government worrying about my relationships with my family, friends or anyone else. Plenty of families are split up due to factors that aren't controlled by the state - do you want the government to legislate against everything that could cause a family breakdown? That's the logical conclusion of your argument. The fact is that the prohibition of drugs causes the problems of impoverished addicts, impure drugs and crime. If drugs were legal then the government would also presumably collect taxes on their sale which would contribute to paying for hospitals to treat people.

So people should take drugs to boost government coffers to pay for treatment of drug addicts? FFS. :(

Well done. You've missed the point so much you've hit the corner flag.

[ictchris]

Good blog post on this subject from the Adam Smith Institute

[Caley Stan]

I don't want the government worrying about my relationships with my family, friends or anyone else. Plenty of families are split up due to factors that aren't controlled by the state - do you want the government to legislate against everything that could cause a family breakdown? That's the logical conclusion of your argument. The fact is that the prohibition of drugs causes the problems of impoverished addicts, impure drugs and crime. If drugs were legal then the government would also presumably collect taxes on their sale which would contribute to paying for hospitals to treat people.

Heroin addicts are pretty much unemployble though, and any move towards legalisation would have to be accompanied by support services for addicts whose lives are compeltely out of control. While i agree with your point about state intrusion, i think dougiedanger's original point about state services clearing up the mess is an important one. If, as a society, we want to address the heroin problem than we have to invest serious money in those services and in educating and employing the increaing percentage of people in this country who find themselves addicted to heroin and living in the kind of misery and poverty that tends to accompany the use of that drug. I'm more than happy for that money to come out of general taxation. The scale of addiction, poverty, and poor education in this country is a problem for every one of us.

[FortressICT]

I read an article a month or two ago that one heroin addict costs the tax payer about 60k a year!

[SMEE]

yeah roscoe.....this is the government figures that among other things tell us that, the Average wage in UK is ?35 000 per year and a prisoner costs tax payers ?2000 per week

[caleykid1994]

In answer to the original question, i have believed(as this was drilled into me by my mum from a young age) thatthis country should adopt and "eye for an eye" attitude towards anything. These drug dealers who are caught, i believe should they be found guilty should have their OWN drugs pumped into them and leave them in a cell without any medicine to help the symptoms. When they learn their lesson the 1st time round(hopefully) they can be released, if they re commit the same offence then they should have a fatal overdose of the drugs injected into them and thus getting rid of said problem of dealers. Suppliers shoud get the same treatment and hopefully they will down the line, peiople will begin to look at the Drug trade as "not worth the money" in the end thus ending the drug problem in britain.

Now to find a place to get rid of all these bodies ?

[PullMyFinger]

I read an article a month or two ago that one heroin addict costs the tax payer about 60k a year!

Give the scrounger a job then!

[ictchris]

I don't want the government worrying about my relationships with my family, friends or anyone else. Plenty of families are split up due to factors that aren't controlled by the state - do you want the government to legislate against everything that could cause a family breakdown? That's the logical conclusion of your argument. The fact is that the prohibition of drugs causes the problems of impoverished addicts, impure drugs and crime. If drugs were legal then the government would also presumably collect taxes on their sale which would contribute to paying for hospitals to treat people.

Heroin addicts are pretty much unemployble though, and any move towards legalisation would have to be accompanied by support services for addicts whose lives are compeltely out of control. While i agree with your point about state intrusion, i think dougiedanger's original point about state services clearing up the mess is an important one. If, as a society, we want to address the heroin problem than we have to invest serious money in those services and in educating and employing the increaing percentage of people in this country who find themselves addicted to heroin and living in the kind of misery and poverty that tends to accompany the use of that drug. I'm more than happy for that money to come out of general taxation. The scale of addiction, poverty, and poor education in this country is a problem for every one of us.

There are actually many employed drug addicts, I have worked with a few people who would probably be classed as dependent on substances. I have certainly worked with people (in the past) who were alcoholics. Most employers are actually bound not to fire people who are alcoholics, unless they can bag them for gross misconduct. Margaret Thatcher's former advisor on NHS reform was a heroin addict. Of course, you can't argue that those addicted to a substance lead a particularly fulfilled life but to criminalise the substance simply transfers the problem down the line. One point in the blog article I posted is illustrating as well, I think -

Drug use would become safer, the scale of drug use could become better monitored and those needing help may be more likely to ask for it

If someone who smoked went to through their employer and asked for help stopping, if they had health insurance or an employee health 'system', then no-one would bat an eyelid. I very much doubt that any heroin addict who is in employment would do something similar now, as the stigma would be too great, their employer would easily have an excuse to fire the employee for gross misconduct and even if they didn't the social pressures would be massive. I tjhink drug legalisation or relaxation of the laws would reduce unemployment among those with substance abuse problems.

Another point against prohibition is that it clearly doesn't work. Drugs are available in every single town, village, probably just about every street in Edinburgh, whether you are in the New Town or Niddrie. You can buy drugs inside maxiumum security prisons and Fettes College. If something plainly doesn't work then perhaps we should try something else?

[ictchris]

In answer to the original question, i have believed(as this was drilled into me by my mum from a young age) thatthis country should adopt and "eye for an eye" attitude towards anything. These drug dealers who are caught, i believe should they be found guilty should have their OWN drugs pumped into them and leave them in a cell without any medicine to help the symptoms. When they learn their lesson the 1st time round(hopefully) they can be released, if they re commit the same offence then they should have a fatal overdose of the drugs injected into them and thus getting rid of said problem of dealers. Suppliers shoud get the same treatment and hopefully they will down the line, peiople will begin to look at the Drug trade as "not worth the money" in the end thus ending the drug problem in britain.

Now to find a place to get rid of all these bodies ?

Many countries execute drug dealers or imprison them for very long jail sentences . Thailand, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Laos are a few examples. What do these countries have in common? They either produce or are used to traffic huge ammounts of illegal drugs, perhaps suggesting that barbarism isn't the answer.

[ictchris]

yeah roscoe.....this is the government figures that among other things tell us that, the Average wage in UK is ?35 000 per year and a prisoner costs tax payers ?2000 per week

Perhaps we should ahve just put Marius in prison and we wouldn't owe him ?200,000 odd?

[Yngwie]

Aparently in Glasgow , Dealers are now starting to fill up there drugs with Anthrax

In some of the tougher schemes there is uproar........that some ****'s been contaminating their anthrax with heroin.

[Renegade]

In answer to the original question, i have believed(as this was drilled into me by my mum from a young age) thatthis country should adopt and "eye for an eye" attitude towards anything. These drug dealers who are caught, i believe should they be found guilty should have their OWN drugs pumped into them and leave them in a cell without any medicine to help the symptoms. When they learn their lesson the 1st time round(hopefully) they can be released, if they re commit the same offence then they should have a fatal overdose of the drugs injected into them and thus getting rid of said problem of dealers. Suppliers shoud get the same treatment and hopefully they will down the line, peiople will begin to look at the Drug trade as "not worth the money" in the end thus ending the drug problem in britain.

Now to find a place to get rid of all these bodies ?

Have you ever thought of moving to Saudi Arabia?

[ICTFCkev]

In the words of Frank.. "Make Povutty Histree, Cheapa Drugs Now!!"

[Guest]

Another heroin user diagnosed with anthrax today, you can't help but wonder if drugs were legal and under strict government control would this happen? Poppy farmers in Afghanistan would become legit and less cash would find it's way into terrorism, back street dealers would have to find something else to peddle and more importantly people with problems would be safer and under the care of properly trained people rather than other junkies too paranoid to call for help.

[Alex MacLeod]

Bad quality drugs coupled with the increased availability of 'harder' drugs such as Heroin and to a lesser extent cocaine. The latter being stupidly easy to OD on having nearly done it myself. Also maybe more dealers from down south are struggling financially in their native territory and are heading up to Inverness as a cash grab?

Only real solution aside from teaching people, not just youngsters, the possible consequences of taking large amounts of drugs is to have police patrols patrolling the A9 and A96 to catch drug runners. A similar approach was taken by Grampian Police Traffic Cops in Aberdeen and from what I hear they catch a good few of them on the A90.

Perth police do the same thing. The problem is knowing who to target. Ordinary people get into a bit of debt and see a one of chance to put things right by doing a run. How do the police stop them? Stop every vehicle on the road and search it? Think most motorists would get a bit p!ssed of at that.

There could be arguement for legalising and controlling quality. Make drugs available from the chemist, at an affordable price, and it would take the trade away from the pusher. The biggest problem is that the supply of those drugs is being led by the self same terrorists and military Junta that we are warring with in places like Columbia and Afghanistan. The only true way to stop supply is to is to cut it of at source. That means world leaders getting together and coming up with a plan. Sadly too much corruption prevents such a thing. The other way is to educate, provide alternatives i.e more for kids to be involved in, and reduce demand.

As I see it none of the above is likely to happen.

[caleykid1994]

In answer to the original question, i have believed(as this was drilled into me by my mum from a young age) thatthis country should adopt and "eye for an eye" attitude towards anything. These drug dealers who are caught, i believe should they be found guilty should have their OWN drugs pumped into them and leave them in a cell without any medicine to help the symptoms. When they learn their lesson the 1st time round(hopefully) they can be released, if they re commit the same offence then they should have a fatal overdose of the drugs injected into them and thus getting rid of said problem of dealers. Suppliers shoud get the same treatment and hopefully they will down the line, peiople will begin to look at the Drug trade as "not worth the money" in the end thus ending the drug problem in britain.

Now to find a place to get rid of all these bodies ? ;)

Have you ever thought of moving to Saudi Arabia?

Kinda hard to do with a passport that is nearly 6 years out of date. have no inclination to go anywhere abroad just now so canna be bothered to renew it.

Anyway, my idea is there as an opinion. Would you run the risk of having this done just to make a quick buck?

[Renegade]

There would be no risk to any dealers if drugs were completely legalised across the board. That'd knock these dealers out of it, whilst at the same time having no need for your dark aged, middle eastern, backwards country style punishments.

Edited March 3, 2010 by Renegade

[Guest]

There would be no risk to any dealers if drugs were completely legalised across the board. That'd knock these dealers out of it.

Dealers would become business men, poppy, coca and cannabis growers would become legitimate farmers then organised crime would lose a huge market, police resources would be freed up to go after serious criminals instead of users, people would be free to choose one of many substances which do little more than put you in a state of near suspended animation rather than the obnoxious, violent marauders which blight our high streets every weekend and most weeknights. Prohibition of alcohol was shown to feed the organised crime syndicates of the USA it does the same now in the 21st century, The cannabis market feeds people trafficking, arms dealing, sex slavery and murder. If you legalised it then a weed which can easily be grown naturally and organically can be used to give people an alternative to alcohol and nicotine the most intoxicating drug and the most addictive drug known to man but raising billions for this country annually.

[Alex MacLeod]

Dont think your far wrong there birdie. Many hard drug addicts have become so by the persuasive techniques of the dealer. They start of on a bit of hash. Maybe the odd snort of cocaine. Goto the dealer for more supplies. Sorry mate none available. Here try this. Its good, got the same effect. In fact you've been a good customer. Have one on the house..........Wam Bang Hooked. Another desperate customer. Legalise the soft stuff and control supply then the need for hard is reduced drastically. With the tax gleaned from the soft drug market set up a system of control of the more addictive drugs. Provide controlled amounts of pure to the addict and slowly wean them off it. Such action would need the cooperation of many countries around the world and would take a long time to achieve positive results but it is possible.

And if nothing can be achieved have a campaign of monthly napalming of the poppy fields.

[TopSix]

Scotland has the highest percentage of users of cocaine in the world relative to population. There was a great documentary on BBC one recently about this. According to the documentary makers, columbian drug barons are targetting Europe due to the laws surrounding dealing and supply being far more lenient than the USA. Apparently they've moved away from the US market due to the huge prison sentences being meted out.