Merged: Racist abuse at TCS.

[caley100]

From the P & J today (not online for some reason-do i cant put a link on)

' A Ross County football fan accused of shouting racist abuse during his teams clash with ICT has been banned by a sheriff from attending his teams historic clash with Celtic.

Liam Watson 23 appeared from custody at Invss Court yesterday afetr being arrested during the match on Tuesday.

He is accused of conducting himself in a disorderly manner,shouting,swearing and repeatedly shouting racial comments '

Sheriff Fleetwood granted bail as long as he did not attend any football matches before trial on 24th June '

Aye aye... wonder what the remarks were.. calling us gypos'???

[Renegade]

I read on the County forum the other day that someone was taken out for calling Butcher an "English C-Word". Probably the same guy.

[ictchris]

From the P & J today (not online for some reason-do i cant put a link on)

' A Ross County football fan accused of shouting racist abuse during his teams clash with ICT has been banned by a sheriff from attending his teams historic clash with Celtic.

Liam Watson 23 appeared from custody at Invss Court yesterday afetr being arrested during the match on Tuesday.

He is accused of conducting himself in a disorderly manner,shouting,swearing and repeatedly shouting racial comments '

Sheriff Fleetwood granted bail as long as he did not attend any football matches before trial on 24th June '

Aye aye... wonder what the remarks were.. calling us gypos'???

The OTB forum mentioned someone getting lifted for calling Butcher an 'English cvnt'.

Hopefully he gets convicted - disgraceful behaviour.

[Yngwie]

"English C-Word"

Conservative?

[CaleyD]

Was more than just one guy making anti-english shouts/chants. I was sitting just behind the home dugout and heard it.

[Joe DiMaggio]

Seems a bit harsh really

[Kirishima]

Seems a bit harsh really

Its ok to use profanities, but you cant categorise people into groups nowadays. Religion, race, nationality, age, etc is a no no.

If someone gets called fatty, baldy, or worse, it's ok, but not to use their nationality in a terse manner. Society is evolving, whether we agree or not. "Banter" is now illegal.

[Scotty]

yup ... adjectives are definitely on the way out !!!

[Kingsmills]

The person concerned has plead not guilty, at least for the time being, so no posts infering guilt please.

[Guest Mahonio]

post edited for the very reason mentioned in the post above !!!!

[PullMyFinger]

I just read in the P and J that a County fan got arrested on Tuesday for .....

That's who this thread is about. Try to keep up or at least read threads before posting.

The person concerned has plead not guilty, at least for the time being, so no posts infering guilt please.

He's a County fan, should that not be enough evidence to hang him?

[Oz647]

I for one will be waiting the outcome of this case as it reminds me of a thread not so long ago.

"English cvnts" "English w0nkers"

Pretty much along the same lines don't you think? If one is found to be racist by the courts then surely the other is? What do you think DornochCaley? The fact the County fan was charged is proof enough for me that it is not acceptable to use these expressions.

[SMEE]

Are people THAT sensitive these days? It appears so...and i for one think it is PATHETIC...sticks and stones and all that! I once got a PM from Don on here...coz someone had taken offence to my use of the word "JAPS". the thing was...if i recall, I was praising them and their attitude to things.

"Racism" is holding a belief that another race is inferior to your own..or discriminating against people based on their race. How is calling someone an English C**t or a Scottish W*nker, or anything else along those lines racist?

To tear it up even more...al wager that the person being accused of this is in fact from the same racial background as the person their comments were directed at.

[PullMyFinger]

I for one will be waiting the outcome of this case as it reminds me of a thread not so long ago.

"English cvnts" "English w0nkers"

Pretty much along the same lines don't you think? If one is found to be racist by the courts then surely the other is? What do you think DornochCaley? The fact the County fan was charged is proof enough for me that it is not acceptable to use these expressions.

Do we really want to dig this up again? I have relatives who are English (I myself have an English grandfather), I have relatives who are gay. It is possible to call someone a poof or English poof without intending malice (banter?).

The fact that someone has been charged does dot prove anything. We do not know what was said and anyone implying it was a comment directed at Terry may be well off the mark (we have Irish players and Eric is also English).

[HumbersideDude]

On P&B Jailender mentions it may have been a guy who "allegedly" has been throwing abuse at black players from a few teams recently. Apparently gave Odihambo a lot of grief in the Dingwall game recently.

[Oz647]

I for one will be waiting the outcome of this case as it reminds me of a thread not so long ago.

"English cvnts" "English w0nkers"

Pretty much along the same lines don't you think? If one is found to be racist by the courts then surely the other is? What do you think DornochCaley? The fact the County fan was charged is proof enough for me that it is not acceptable to use these expressions.

Do we really want to dig this up again? I have relatives who are English (I myself have an English grandfather), I have relatives who are gay. It is possible to call someone a poof or English poof without intending malice (banter?).

The fact that someone has been charged does dot prove anything. We do not know what was said and anyone implying it was a comment directed at Terry may be well off the mark (we have Irish players and Eric is also English).

You are of course correct, it is possible to say these things in a banter like fashion and if so are accepted as that. Unfortunately in the instance I am referring to, this was not the case. Given DC's rather well published views it was obvious that banter was the last thing on his mind.

But as you said maybe it should be left at that so I will not push it further. I just wanted to make my point, my work here is done.

[FoolPhysio]

So is it less a case of what was said and more about the manner in which it was said?

I'm with those who think that sticks and stones are (relatively) harmless, it is all to do with intention. In most cases it is due to a general ignorance and so no amount of complaining will change it. Some of it is gentle ribbing and banter as long as those giving it out are willing to take it back. And some is deliberately set out to insult. So by not getting insulted makes you a better person than they are.

Mind you, calling a player a useless t055er is OK (and in some cases warranted), but there is no need to point out their skin colour since that makes no difference to how talented or capabable they are. Neither is their nationality.

[Caley Stan]

I agree with SMEE.

[thewire]

I think the use of the 'C' word is probably more offensive than the 'E' word.

However, ICT fans by their own admissions on other threads on this forum admit to using the term gypsies against rival fans, with the stewards turning a blind eye (or ear as the case may be).

Is this not double standards?

[kilda]

I think the use of the 'C' word is probably more offensive than the 'E' word.

However, ICT fans by their own admissions on other threads on this forum admit to using the term gypsies against rival fans, with the stewards turning a blind eye (or ear as the case may be).

Is this not double standards?

Of course and your point is?

[DornochCaley]

I for one will be waiting the outcome of this case as it reminds me of a thread not so long ago.

"English cvnts" "English w0nkers"

Pretty much along the same lines don't you think? If one is found to be racist by the courts then surely the other is? What do you think DornochCaley? The fact the County fan was charged is proof enough for me that it is not acceptable to use these expressions.

Do we really want to dig this up again? I have relatives who are English (I myself have an English grandfather), I have relatives who are gay. It is possible to call someone a poof or English poof without intending malice (banter?).

The fact that someone has been charged does dot prove anything. We do not know what was said and anyone implying it was a comment directed at Terry may be well off the mark (we have Irish players and Eric is also English).

You are of course correct, it is possible to say these things in a banter like fashion and if so are accepted as that. Unfortunately in the instance I am referring to, this was not the case. Given DC's rather well published views it was obvious that banter was the last thing on his mind.

But as you said maybe it should be left at that so I will not push it further. I just wanted to make my point, my work here is done.

Do you always have to have digs at me? Pretty pathetic as thats all it is.

But

I was born in England (Though i class myself as Scottish) and my Mother is English. But i don't see what all of you are moaning at if i am being honest. You complain that we are not allowed to call them Gypos, but now moan about some guy calling Butcher an "English ****".

Tea pot and Kettle (Or whatever that saying is)

Banter people. Banter. Its not as if he is saying he wants to kill all the English? Or rubbing the death of English people in Butchers face is it? I also have a wee feeling that when the guy shouted, he probably ment to highlight the word **** more than the English part. End of the day, Butcher is English, and he may well be a ****!

[Iain]

I also have a wee feeling that when the guy shouted, he probably ment to highlight the word **** more than the English part.

While I'm not saying what the guy said was right, I definately agree with this. But statements like this can be interpreted in different ways from person to person.

[TheKnowledge]

A guy that works in an office next to ours was talking to one of my colleagues. He was complaining to my colleague that I was a bit off with him sometimes (the guys a nob so he's picked that up right) and he referred to me as "That c**t from Aberdeen" I got offended for the first time in years. Aberdeen!!!! FFS!!

[PullMyFinger]

That's grounds for a grievance, surely?

[Charles Bannerman]

I just read in the P and J that a County fan got arrested on Tuesday for ......

With reference to Kingsmills' professional and very relevant warning in post number 9, I would suggest that the bold section of the quote above, when taken verbatim, is actually in breach of just what he was talking about.

You just cannot be too careful in this kind of situation.

"Is facing charges of being racist and disorderly" or popping in that old saviour "allegedly" might be OK. Quite frankly, though, if the individual has been charged I would suggest it might be in CTOL's best interests to abandon this topic altogether pending an outcome.