Such is the apathy...

[tm4tj]

...have we all forgotten what day it is.

[lizi]

Can I guess - is this the date Celtic fans forget about? 

[The Mantis]

Is it Monday?

[IBM]

2 hours ago, TheMantis said:

Is it Monday?

No try again  

[+Wanderer]

Normally Charles Bannerbrain's opportunity to teach us how backward we all were...

[CELTIC1CALEY3]

I know......

 

[The Mantis]

59 minutes ago, IBM said:

No try again  

Let me see, 6 more shots…

[The Mantis]

48 minutes ago, Wanderer said:

Normally Charles Bannerbrain's opportunity to teach us how backward we all were...

Maybe he wasn’t there, it was a school night

[+Gringo]

I'm a retired pensioner. Dates are irrelevant 

[CaleyCanary]

We're in another world now right enough - cue Mary Hopkin... 

[Jaggernaut]

They say you can always remember where you were when historical events happen. I was at work, on a sleepover, as I was a support worker, and I could only get updates now and again as to what the score was, and I couldn't believe what I was seeing on Ceefax and folk telling me the score from the radio. It is so many years now, but I can vividly remember it all.

[IBM]

Our best night ever 

[big cherly]

Wonderful, let’s all look back and luxuriate in the glow of past glories. 
 

It is also the point where we can see the start if the slow grinding decline of the club both on and off the park to the place we are now.  
 

Maybe we can put the Jan manager of the month in the calendar for 2024 to celebrate that also - double the joy!

 

[buckett]

2 hours ago, Big cherly said:

It is also the point where we can see the start if the slow grinding decline of the club both on and off the park to the place we are now.  
 

Think that was when we WON the Scottish Cup, a few years later!

[The Mantis]

9 minutes ago, buckett said:

Think that was when we WON the Scottish Cup, a few years later!

Or even more specifically, the following October when Kenny Cameron refused permission for Yogi to speak to DUFC. This was meant as a show of strength but with hindsight was a disaster.

[Scotty]

1 hour ago, TheMantis said:

Or even more specifically, the following October when Kenny Cameron refused permission for Yogi to speak to DUFC. This was meant as a show of strength but with hindsight was a disaster.

It was not his best move, but I don't think one single thing/event started our spiral. It's a combination of factors. There was a deterioration in the relationship with Yogi after that but look at his career and perhaps you might think that was inevitable. He does not stick around too long anywhere. Thats for another discussion. To me, Kenny's biggest mistake was listening to others (including fans) and appointing Richie Foran, who every one of us wanted to succeed, then not being ruthless when it was clear things weren't working.  The change came too late, and we got relegated. I know that cut him to the quick as I was there as his guest on the final day of the season, with my son as mascot on the day he resigned. Lots of things happening to the side and in the background throughout those good times and the bad times.  

For me, the real rot started with the regime that followed. Kenny (and everyone before him) made some poor choices, but always made them with the best interests of the club in mind trying to push us on. He listened to fans and tried to communicate with us. Kenny may have left us relegated but he did leave us in a strong position financially and organisationally (assuming we could bounce back quickly). The next lot were a whole lot more insular and seemed to take the attitude from day one that everyone at the club - staff and volunteers alike - were there for what they could get from the club, not what they could give to the club. Thats a pretty sh***y stance to take when you (have always had to) rely on volunteers, many of whom have served the club for decades in various roles on a matchday. In my humble opinion, perhaps they were looking in the mirror a bit too much. They tore up a load of processes/things that were working, replaced them with more expensive procedures or services that didn't and soon made that strong position a lot weaker. They left behind a mess still being cleaned up now. 

I personally have no axe to grind with the current custodians of the club. They had an almighty mess to clean up. I believe the chairman does have the best interests at heart but I also know that many people have made comment about making suggestions to the club that were ignored or brushed off and that has a touch of the last regime about it. Thats not good, and neither is the communication level from the club. Given our precarious financial position we do seem to be pretty top heavy in terms of (presumably) high earners in non-footballing roles but I am no longer as close as I once was so dont have an idea of the value each of these positions bring to the table. If we are paying our CEO '£X.xx' and he is bringing in '£X.xx' * 3 in revenue or cost savings, then it's worth it. If however, the value is negative then its not. It should be a simple cost/benefit analysis on any financial aspects. The concert debacle also really hurt us I feel. We may be isolated from financial fallout but the whole thing is so murky that we are absolutely 100% affected by the moral fallout and no-one seems to have sought to address that. This is where we fall down BIG-TIME and a club that doesn't seem to care about its fans will soon find itself devoid of fans... which brings us right back to the word apathy in the title of this thread.     

[tm4tj]

Congratulations Scotty, the Guinness Book of Records have just confirmed that this is the longest post ever on a football forum.

[RiG]

6 hours ago, Big cherly said:

It is also the point where we can see the start if the slow grinding decline of the club both on and off the park to the place we are now. 

Yeah we really struggled in the years that followed what with promotion to the old SPL, holding our own there for a number of years, bouncing back at the first attempt after being relegated, appearing in major cup finals and even winning one in addition to minor cup success as well.

[Scotty]

2 hours ago, tm4tj said:

Congratulations Scotty, the Guinness Book of Records have just confirmed that this is the longest post ever on a football forum.

Its alright, with so much apathy around, no-one will read it

[big cherly]

1 hour ago, RiG said:

Yeah we really struggled in the years that followed what with promotion to the old SPL, holding our own there for a number of years, bouncing back at the first attempt after being relegated, appearing in major cup finals and even winning one in addition to minor cup success as well.

It all depends on your viewpoint. You obviously think the record and standard you mention served the club (and fans) well. You are entitled to that view and I respect that. I personally have a different opinion. I believe our club benefits from open opinion and criticism. If you only want to hear and read one side of the argument that’s your right! It’s not mine!!
 

[Satan]

45 minutes ago, Big cherly said:

It all depends on your viewpoint. You obviously think the record and standard you mention served the club (and fans) well. You are entitled to that view and I respect that. I personally have a different opinion. I believe our club benefits from open opinion and criticism. If you only want to hear and read one side of the argument that’s your right! It’s not mine!!
 

You really think February 8th 2000 was the start of a decline...

Forgive my short sightedness but I think I need that one explaining a wee bit.

[RiG]

2 hours ago, Big cherly said:

It all depends on your viewpoint. You obviously think the record and standard you mention served the club (and fans) well. You are entitled to that view and I respect that. I personally have a different opinion. I believe our club benefits from open opinion and criticism. If you only want to hear and read one side of the argument that’s your right! It’s not mine!!

So just to be clear you think Feb 8th 2000 is when ICT peaked? Fair enough if that's what you think but I'm with @Satan here. I don't get that at all and would love to hear your reasoning behind it.

[Robert]

For me we peaked when we finished third in the league and won the cup in 2015.

Our fortunes have certainly changed since then! Two years later we were relegated and we’ve never recovered.

We did not maintain the quality of player in the squad when that team started breaking up. Butcher, for me, attracted players who became a great team. Hughes largely inherited that but his recruitment let us down. Foran was a popular choice to replace him but, as Scotty has eloquently said, it didn’t work and we didn’t make a change quickly enough.

Unforgettable nights like 8 February 2000 were part of the great journey we were on as we climbed the leagues, but I’m with Satan and RiG, they were not when we peaked. 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Robert

[The Mantis]

5 hours ago, Scotty said:

 

It’s hard to disagree with any of that, but here’s the timeline that’s stuck in my brain, and if there’s any of it needing corrected, fairy nuff:

DUFC approach ICT in October
Chairman refuses permission 
Yogi takes the huff
Yogi and the board grudgingly coexist for a spell
Yogi comes out of the huff long enough to sign a new (4 year?) contract
Yogi re-enters the huff and parts company at season’s end, apparently on ‘gardening leave’ and full pay until finding a job at Raith, approx 9 months later
The board appoints Richie for 2016-17 (was he actually the fans’ choice and that of the board, or were we that short of cash that we couldn’t advertise the job, due to paying off Yogi, and attract a high calibre of applicant, being an established premier club?)
The rest is, ehh, history. We know Yogi doesn’t stick around, as you say, but all the more reason to move him on (with compensation) while in a position of strength.

Further to all that, to those of us who went to Alloa in the LC where we went out to a team 2 levels lower, under Richie, it was obvious that we were in trouble, and that was August 9th. Certain others, notably CB, assured us that this wasn’t in fact the worst result in our history, as we had lost heavily before to the likes of Morton and Airdrie. But these were just blips which occasionally happened, even when we had a good side under Pele. 
We were effectively relegated as early as January 31 as anybody who was at the six-pointer in midweek against Hamilton will tell you.

Edited February 9, 2023 by TheMantis

[buckett]

All in all though, it's a very sad story of the rise and fall of our club.

Wonder if we'll rise again.

Or was that it?