Tokely Offski - to Countski

[RoyalFlash]

All I will say, is that I am not in the habit of making things up and have no reason to do so.

I can think of two reasons, Sandy.

1. You being a disgruntled ex-director of ICT.

2. You actually support Ross County.

Yes, this was an account created entirely for the purpose of making this post. Aren't these forums wonderful in allowing people anonymity.

"You would have got away with it too, if it wasn't for those pesky kids"

[Scotty]

At the end of the day, I am not bothered by the terms offered -- that is between Tokely and Butcher/Club -- and to be frank, a little bit personal to the topic of discussion under our site rules. Whether he is offered 50%, 100% or 200% of his current wages is really none of our business and I am not going to get drawn into that ..... and would politely ask that posters respect some of the more personal aspects of this and other contract details they may hear via gossip or even from players/friends etc during the close season .....

My main point in all of this discussion is about performance, and based on comments made and votes received this season, I firmly believe that Ross Tokely can still do a job for our club in the SPL and he should be offered a contract on that basis and that basis alone.

The secondary point I am making, and its secondary nature may be getting lost in all the chatter .... is that I believe he has shown extreme loyalty to the club in his time here and the aforesaid loyalty should afford him a certain degree of respect from the club in negotiations over a contract.

Call it favouritism if you like, call it treating him differently because of his loyalty if you like ... but the simple fact of the matter is that after 16 years at the club he has earned that right in my personal opinion. We have never had a player stay so long at ICT and probably never will again .. that makes his situation 'special' and one which should be handled appropriately. He will stop playing for ICT at some point, and I would hope that everyone concerned would actually work out an exit strategy for that rather than closing the book abruptly. In sixteen years he has played hundreds of times for thousands of us and many of us have seen both the good and the bad of RT ... but when he goes, the fans and the player should be afforded the courtesy of a proper goodbye .....

I will be hugely disappointed if he is not in the squad next season, and doubly disappointed if the comments already made in this thread prove to be the reason why (and we all know the reasons will surface in the end regardless of any spin that is attempted on either side). I know I will not be alone in that feeling as his exit from ICT - whenever it happens - will truly be the end of an era and it may be a lot more emotional for some than the club, the manager, or even the player realise !

[Yngwie]

Anyone got up to date appearance stats for him?

[Georgeios]

Why isn't this in Rumor thread

[Alex MacLeod]

Because its not a rumour. The discussion is based around an article in local paper

[Scotty]

Anyone got up to date appearance stats for him?

Quick calculation so there is a chance of a mistake ... but I make it as follows

Edited May 18, 2012 by Scotty
added more accurate info

[caleyboy]

Anyone got up to date appearance stats for him?

Quick calculation so there is a chance of a mistake ... but I make it as follows

And he's still regarded as a first team regular!

[Scotty]

might even be appropriate to add this link from our old story during his testimonial year ....

http://caleythistleonline.com/page/index.html/_/archives/news-2009-10/a-tribute-to-tokely-r625

[photos are screwed up as we changed our article system since the article was posted ... but the text works !!!]

[Yngwie]

I really hope we get the chance to celebrate his 100th yellow card for us.

99 yellows at the same club must be a record - although Foran is catching up fast!

[Scotty]

Tokely ... 99 yellows in 589 games .... 1 every 5.95 games. 9 reds - 1 every 65 games

Foran ... 34 yellows in 134 games .... 1 every 3.94 games. 1 red - 1 every 134 games !

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

Bottom line:

"I don't think I have the divine right to start every week but I should definitely get the chance to do that and if not then I'll look to get out and play somewhere else."

[CaleyD]

Don't forget the 36 goals!!!

[Renegade]

It's pretty obvious what's going on here. I've heard from a few places that Butcher's wanted rid of Tokely for a long time and had he had his way, he would've punted him out the door along with Munro and Duncan. What Butcher's trying to do here is simple - he's going to offer Tokely a deal he knows he'll refuse. Then when the deadline is up, Tokely is gone and Butcher can say that it was own fault he's away. Of course, we all know why. If Tokely is offered a rubbish and refuses it and the fans react badly, Butcher can say it was his choice to leave, thus saving Butcher any flack (and damage to his ego), obviously in reaction to what happened with the Grant Munro saga. It's basically the same thing again, just in a different way.

[lukemackay]

It's pretty obvious what's going on here. I've heard from a few places that Butcher's wanted rid of Tokely for a long time and had he had his way, he would've punted him out the door along with Munro and Duncan. What Butcher's trying to do here is simple - he's going to offer Tokely a deal he knows he'll refuse. Then when the deadline is up, Tokely is gone and Butcher can say that it was own fault he's away. Of course, we all know why. If Tokely is offered a rubbish and refuses it and the fans react badly, Butcher can say it was his choice to leave, thus saving Butcher any flack (and damage to his ego), obviously in reaction to what happened with the Grant Munro saga. It's basically the same thing again, just in a different way.

*drifts off to sleep*

It's all obviously a conspiracy against ict fans, and ict players butcher didn't sign. He'll have Christie and shearer out the youth development programme soon aswell.

Give it a rest. It's well documented that spl clubs are making budget cuts. How do you know butcher didn't offer Tokely a perfectly acceptable contract? How do you know that butcher has wanted him out for ages? It's the same garbage you've moaned about all season.

It started with "never should've released Munro" now it "he's planning getting rid of Tokely".

Will anyone get behind butcher on here? He's backed into a corner every year regarding his budget and sometimes players have to take pay cuts. Not butchers fault if Tokely can't accept it.

Butchers brought us through one of our toughest seasons with our spl status intact. Give the guy a break

Edited May 25, 2012 by lukemackay

[Renegade]

More of your "everythings just dandy" stuff. I'll express my view of things how I like. If you don't like that, I don't care.

Edited May 25, 2012 by Renegade

[TheKarl]

Renegade, I swear all you do is complain, or insinuate some form of conspiracy.. and in general just hate, hate, hate.

I'll happilly start to back you when you do better than butcher! You are applying aren't you? You should, you always seem to know every stat, every performance, every off the ball situation, more so that Tel. Go for it.

[ICTPaisley]

If tokelys contract ran out last season would he have got another for this season? No. He'd be off playing for county and instead of 34 games unbeaten they'd have done the full 36. I firmly believe butcher wants a team with his own signings and wants to get rid of players with a huge past at ict before he was there.

[Joonya]

"More of your "everythings just dandy" stuff. I'll express my view of things how I like. If you don't like that, I don't care."

More of your conspiracy theories more like, Renegade. You'll soon have more conspiracy theories than Neil Lennon!!

Luke is absolutely right in the fact that one or two people have constantly ranted about munro and duncan all season. They just cant seem to let go and quite frankly, the record is starting to wear thin. So FFS, can we please now give it a rest with the conspiracy theories and actually start to look at the big picture. IE - Rosscoe has been offered a deal.

I couldn't give a crap if it's a pay as you play deal, matches his current deal or is offered more money. The fact still remains that an offer is on the table and surely to goodness must show that Butcher see's him as part of next years squad?

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

Am I alone in feeling that the main concern here is the "openess" of the "debate" in the public domain. Rosscoe may well be stirring it a bit but there rarely is smoke without fire.

[ICTPaisley]

Has butcher even said why he got rid of Duncan and Munro? I think that's why a few of us are annoyed they left and keep bringing it up. Butcher released two players who lost out to 6th place by a couple points and replaced them with absolute junk. He deserves to be reminded of his massive blunder.

[TheKarl]

He deserves to be reminded of his massive blunder.

I reckon that the practically "blunderous" season that we've just had is a fairly prominent reminder if ever he needed one.

How can we expect to move on or grow as a team if things such as "supporters" feeling a constant need to linger around particular sour situations of the past and jump on the matter whenever possible, in apparently thinking it'll magically change everything.

Edited May 25, 2012 by TheKarl

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

But when you chew on a soor plum you learn a lesson - it is the fact that the lessons, irrespective of the subject matter, have not been learned that is the most annoying.

[Alex MacLeod]

I see no conspiracy whatsoever here. Tokely has been at the club a long time and I'd imagine he's one of our top earners. Nobody knows if he's able, at his age, to complete another full season at full fitness. He's been offered a deal for another year at a reduced wage. How reduced I dont know. This deal has not come about because anyone wants rid of Tokely. Its come about because we cannot afford to keep him at the salary he was on. Look back over the last few years at whats been happening. Every year we have had a 1/4 million shortfall in cash needed to survive. Alan Savage stepped in with that amount. Then a few directors chipped in with a similar amount. A deal was done on the social club to subsidise another season. A consortium comes forward with a similar amount to cover last seasons shortfall. This season the club has said the playing budget is cut. This club is struggling to make ends meet as a full time club in this league. We cant go below a 24 player first team and we also need an U-20 squad. Perhaps the only way to achieve that is to cut wages and find players that'll put themselves in the shop window for a move to a bigger wage elsewhere. That to me seems the only way this club can survive and no amount of bleating is going to put funds in the coffer. At least not unless the jackpot is mine tonight.

[bdu98196]

While I want Rossco to stay, we have to put budgets in place, I have no idea of his salary, his offer or where that sits in the club overall. Sadly he isnt getting any younger and while he is experienced and leads us - if we cant agree a deal within the structure in place he will have to leave. If that money pays for 2 younger players and covers other openings in the squad so be it and we will have to rely on other more senior players to step up and show more passion & leadership.

Sad time and state of affairs but this is Scottish football and how it may be in the future. Look at Hearts who cant keep Black - he has been their best player all season, this is a team who won a cup has a bigger fan base and qualified for European football - cant make a contract offer to a decent Scottish player (not even international level), D Utd are another example of a club where players are leaving year on year. Nobody in Scottish football has money :(

[starchief]

Has butcher even said why he got rid of Duncan and Munro? I think that's why a few of us are annoyed they left and keep bringing it up. Butcher released two players who lost out to 6th place by a couple points and replaced them with absolute junk. He deserves to be reminded of his massive blunder.

I think it was obvious why he got rid of Duncan. He'd lost his place, didn't do anything special when he got time on the park, went to a lesser division, couldn't get a game for them, dropped down more divisions. An ICT legend sure, but just like McBain, Golabeck, Wyness etc etc, eventually the time comes when he's not good enough. He'd reached that time. No blunder there. Or would you like to sign a Ross County over-30 reject who was loaned out to a 3rd division club?

Munro got a lot of criticism from ICT supporters for his hoof-the-ball. I thought he was a decent player and it was a mistake. He was never international class but a decent bottom six defender. A mistake.

Tokely has been criticised all season, with some saying he was fourth, fifth and even sixth choice of central defender. I heard very few shouting Ross should have had a new contract most of the season, except for the last few games. As it is, I hope he does get a new contract as, again, he is a decent but not Earth-shattering bottom six defender. I'd keep him but where are all the critics that have been shouting how he must leave all season?

And who are all those other players that we're losing that are the 'heart and soul' of the club? Picked at random from 2009:

Inverness CT: Esson, Tokely, Mihadjuks, Munro, Djebi-Zadi, Proctor, Black, Duncan, Foran (Hastings 87), Morais (Imrie 62), Rooney (Odhiambo 77)

Couldn't afford: Mihadjuks, Black, Morais, Rooney

Stayed: Esson, Tokely, Foran - both of the latter have been constantly criticised all season

Left controversially: Munro, Duncan - only one of which has managed to play in a lesser division

Other: Djebi-Zadi, Proctor, Hastings, Imrie, Odhiambo - which one of these is the 'heart and soul' that we shouldn't be losing? All of them were being hugely criticised.