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MorayJaggie

This season's refereeing

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Yep, been some crap refereeing. 

Defence has improved soooo much.

Bottom line though, we need to score more goals. End of. 

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I always thought the refereeing in the top league was bad, but in the championship it's just poor performance after poor performance from the officials. I always try to be objective about decisions but this season some of them are mind boggling. When was the last time we got a penalty, when there have been plenty of claims, but all waved away? It looks like Vigures has been hard done by with the second yellow but he needs to cut out the petulance which give refs the opportunity to book him. If we can keep 11 men on the pitch, we can beat any team in this league.

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Some of the poorest refereeing this season has been from the refs who also referee in the Premier league. Let's face it the standard is the poorest it has been for a long long time.

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It is very difficult not to be biased towards our own team but I haven't missed a home match this season and I have really been appalled at the difference between what has been awarded to us and what our opponents have got away with. Week in week out we seem to have had the rough end of the stick. I can sympathise with our players who mouth off at the referees, for as often as not we seem to be penalised when there is a coming together,  if there is a tug at a shirt, a push, obstruction, or virtually any infringement on the field. The number of times Jake has been impeded brought down or pulled back and nothing is  given seems unreal yet when we adopt similar tactics the Ref is reaching in 'his pocket before he even blows the whistle. I get irate watching from the Stand so what it must be like for those players involved on the park I dread to think.

I cant 'help thinking that some sort of retro observation and decision overturning and or punishing must be implemented sometime in the future to get this wonderful game back on an even footing as it is rapidly becoming farcical at times.

Okay you may say dream on, bughtmaster but there needs to be an answer to this and it is time that answer is found.

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Why doesn't the spfl have a way of monitoring referee performances and if found to be poor consistently have some sort of penalisation, accountability. Make the referees think is that the correct decision, rather than whatever I says go because ultimatley if you have a dictatorship like that nothing good comes of it and we are seeng  that in Scottish football by standards dropping.

Edited by MorayJaggie
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32 minutes ago, MorayJaggie said:

Why doesn't the spfl have a way of monitoring referee performances and if found to be poor consistently have some sort of penalisation, accountability. 

Do they not still send referee supervisors to games?

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Tin hat on ready for the red arrows.

Paranoia about biased refs is just silly although I suppose it worked for Alex Ferguson. Do we really want to be like Celtic FC (always cheated, never defeated)?
Who would be a ref? It reminds me of when I was teaching. Some parents never seemed to realise it was a profession that involved years of training - they thought you just made it up as you went along, and picked on whoever you liked.

I deal with refs regularly at Lowland League level as it’s my job to pay their match fee. BTW they are paid about £800 in the Premiership but only £75 in the LL. It’s up to them to make themselves available for a match each week then take what they get. In the case of Stephen Finnie (Category 1) he will take a game any week no matter what he’s offered. Just for the love of the game. We even had Collum one week. But in the average LL fixture we will get a Category 3 or what’s called Category 2 development. The list of refs and categories is on the SFA website.

It’s quite enlightening when you go in and speak to them and hear their side of the story. They go over all the bookings with the assistants right after the game and code them. It’s amazing when your midfielder tells you ‘I never did f**k all’ then you hear the ref saying how many quiet warnings he’s had. Also relatively surprising is how well the players and refs know each other, and that usually they have a pint after the game when things have cooled down. At LL level you can hear the conversations on the park and most refs are encouraging the players and praising them for a good pass etc despite getting sworn at all through the game. Although there are one or two who make it all about them.

The ref at Brechin on Saturday was Gavin Duncan (Category 1) who has handled LL fixtures many times. I thought he handled the game well. I missed the St Mirren game at TCS but when I read the forum I thought the ref had been eating people’s babies or something. Then I saw the highlights and couldn’t understand what all the fuss was about. And yes, even at LL/HL level refs get supervisors checking their progress and development or lack of, as they move/don’t move up the categories. Haven't watched the Livi highlights yet...

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There is no is no point going over decisions after a game if you've already made a bad call. It' not just against Inverness this season refs in Scotland are getting worse their decisions are worse when you watch other leagues on TV the quality difference is staggering. It' people's liveleyhood they are playing with and if they have no accountability it' a poor state of affairs.

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Having been a ref in the lower leagues I do find it difficult to explain decisions to those around me some times but I have to admit it sometimes  also baffles me as to how they have arrived at a decision. I often would have a word with a player on passing if the player takes no heed of the advise given next infringement booking. So we might be missing something which would explain what appears to be a strange decisions.

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Some of the referees have been woeful. Home to st mirren and away to Morton spring to mind. But there’s no conspiracy. The players are the ones constantly diving, pulling shirts, claiming for everything. That’s the way the game is now and when that is happening for 90 minutes In just about every game then referees are going to get things wrong.

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18 hours ago, MorayJaggie said:

Why doesn't the spfl have a way of monitoring referee performances and if found to be poor consistently have some sort of penalisation, accountability. Make the referees think is that the correct decision, rather than whatever I says go because ultimatley if you have a dictatorship like that nothing good comes of it and we are seeng  that in Scottish football by standards dropping.

Take the time to qualify as a Ref (I have), understand the Laws of the beatiful game, Referee some games WITHOUT Assistant Referees' to assist you, take verbals from numpties (who think they are Ronaldo but more like Ronnie Barker) then you will have grounds to pass judgement. 

Failing that, play shinty and mix with men who take things on the chin. :laugh:

Edited by Caman
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Iv'e played shinty and rugby completely different games. Just because I haven' qualified as a referee does not make any difference to being able to see the standards are terrible. Also there is always assistant referees at spfl matches to assist but they don't assist. On Tuesday there were two or three times a decision needed to be made but the officials couldn't decide. And made glaring mistakes where the ball was put behind by a livi player for a corner for ICT but both the linesman and the ref gave a spot kick explain that? The problem is these mistakes are continually being made.

Edited by MorayJaggie
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1 hour ago, MorayJaggie said:

Iv'e played shinty and rugby completely different games. Just because I haven' qualified as a referee does not make any difference to being able to see the standards are terrible. Also there is always assistant referees at spfl matches to assist but they don't assist. On Tuesday there were two or three times a decision needed to be made but the officials couldn't decide. And made glaring mistakes where the ball was put behind by a livi player for a corner for ICT but both the linesman and the ref gave a spot kick explain that? The problem is these mistakes are continually being made.

'Spot kick' - I don't remember any penalty kicks? Were you watching the game or were you eating those 'cream rings' you enjoy in hospitality? Each to their own. :amazed:

Edited by Caman

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Willie Collum is the man in the middle on Saturday  :redcard:

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4 minutes ago, CaleyD said:

Willie Collum is the man in the middle on Saturday  :redcard:

Wonder what the odds of another red are then 😂

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8 minutes ago, old caley girl said:

Wonder what the odds of another red are then 😂

Just the one ? !

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42 minutes ago, Caman said:

'Spot kick' - I don't remember any penalty kicks? Were you watching the game or were you eating those 'cream rings' you enjoy in hospitality? Each to their own. :amazed:

Sorry my mistake goal kick. But you didn't answer the question on how to defend officials making blatant mistakes.

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The standard of refereeing is the same for every team in the league and Robbo needs to take responsibility for failing to have us prepared for it. The likes of Dumbarton, Morton and Livingston are clearly coached to play a physical game which is constantly on the edge of the rules and they apply it with discipline. We try to play more football than those sides, and when our play is thwarted and decisions don't go our way, certain players lose their heads. 

Vigurs' red seems harsh, but he has been the worst culprit throughout the season. Robbo suggests he's got a reputation for being "talkative". If that means aggressively swearing in faces of the officials then it's hardly surprising if they bear a grudge.  

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Robertson is definitely right in that there have been some shocking officiating displays in games involving us especially in recent weeks but it's time we start taking some responsibility for our actions. All of the recent red cards have been justified and we should look at ourselves before lashing out and blaming the referees. All the other sides are having to put up with their shite as well.

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There is no doubt that the standard of officiating is poor but it's the same for our opponents.

It's bad enough when some paranoid posters on this site suggest a particular bias towards us but frankly embarrassing when the manager make a the same suggestion in the media.

Robbo is doing a reasonable job from a standing start and with limited resourses. He does not need to resort to this sort of paranoid nonsense and, I for one, really wish that he wouldn't.

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Not saying there is any bias against us by referees but do think we have been more harshly treated by referees in the games I have seen this season. Other teams appear more streetwise than us (this happened in the Premier league as well) and referees are being conned by this. You could argue that this is the players fault but referees need to be aware of this. The biggest bugbear for me however is the inconsistency of referees and until they can resolve this, and it is in their gift to do this, they will continue to get criticised.

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3 hours ago, MorayJaggie said:

Sorry my mistake goal kick. But you didn't answer the question on how to defend officials making blatant mistakes.

Like you, Referees are human and make mistakes. :amazed:

Not for me to defend Referees and Assistant Referees and their decisions. There is no conspiracy theory. It would appear that some of them are not very good. Hence why they are not officiating in the Premiership.

Lastly, ICT players need to be more 'streetwise' (as said by Huisdean above) in this league and score more goals. Simples. 

Edited by Caman
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I suspect that most of the refs like the teams we play from down south don't like coming to Inverness, or Dungwall for that matter. That seems to have been the situation since we came into the Senior Leagues in 1994. Add to that the standard being poorer when dropping down a level then it's no surprise we are getting a raw deal. Robbo is quite right to demand an explanation for the performance of the ref on Tuesday v Livingston on the Vigurs second yellow incident.

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A huge part of the problem with referees is that they have never kicked a ball in anger, ever. I believe Willie Collum refereed from the age of 15/16 and boy does it show, he is ripe for conning simply because he has never been in the position of a player. I don't know if he is still our top rated ref but is frankly an embarrassment to the profession. The fact he is well paid for such appalling performances in important matches just adds insult to injury.

Where I will defend refs is on the subject of dissent, if you are going to chirp at the ref for 90 minutes or indulge in sarcastic hand clapping at decisions, you will get booked and will be given nothing in the game, they are after all only human, no one likes to be told how to do their job nor receive sarcastic applause for their decisions be they right or wrong.

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